JPII now baptised by proxy by LDS

[Zooey]

It gives him the opportunity to accept it in the next life if he chooses to.
zerinus

Oh, yeah…Sure, I can see it all now…There JP2 is, in Heaven with the Lord, & Mormons are going to offer him–what??

The only reason why it might offend you would be if you were not sure of your own religion.

On the contrary! It is the faithful who the most offended, because the implication is that Mormons are the arbiters of everyone’s salvation. Which is, by the by, blasphemous.

You can go and baptize as many deceased Mormons as you like. Let me assure you that we will not be offended one little bit.

zerinus No thank you. Why go through some nonsensical ceremony that is :whacky: enough when done by people who actually believe in it…

And let me state for you that if you reject Joseph Smith as a true prophet of God, and the divine messege he received from God, and do not repent of it in this life, you will be damned.
zerinus

Really?? Really??? OK, Joseph Smith was no prophet, at all. !I reject Joseph Smith, the devil, & all his works.
His “message” was a piece of fiction that doesn’t even come up to L Ron Hubbard standards. He was a liar, a fraud, & a con man, and of dubious morals besides.

Does that mean you guys are going to stop tracking in mud on my porch, & bugging me to buy your books??*** Please***???

Sheeesh!!! Get a grip on yourself, Z. You are not going to find any takers. Not around these parts!!

 

[Eden]

No my friend, I forgot nothing. You are the one who forgot this verse: “But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven” (Matthew 19:14). Little children are already “in the kingdom of heaven”. They don’t need to be “born again” to get there. The “born again” bit applies to those who aren’t already there.

zerinus

Funny, because we as Catholics use that verse to emphasize the fact that Jesus intended baptism to be for everyone, even the little children.

 

[Eden]

His “message” was a piece of fiction that doesn’t even come up to L Ron Hubbard standards. He was a liar, a fraud, & a con man, and of dubious morals besides.

Add to that, God is and was always God. We do not become “gods” of our own planets. Jesus and Lucifer were never brothers. And there is no such thing as the planet Kolob.

 

[zerinus]

Funny, because we as Catholics use that verse to emphasize the fact that Jesus intended baptism to be for everyone, even the little children.

Well that is not what I read into it. Jesus never baptized little children, nor commanded that they should be baptized. He just laid hands on them, prayed for them, and returned them to their mothers. He said that “of such is the kingdom of God”. That means that they are already citizens of that kingdom. They don’t need to do anything else to go there.

zerinus

 

[Milliardo]

Well that is not what I read into it. Jesus never baptized little children, nor commanded that they should be baptized.

He certainly didn’t baptize children, but neither did He specifically disallowed it. In fact, if anything, the event highlights the fact that He would rather have children come to Him than not at all, which would in essence then show that there is basis for baptizing infants.

 

[zerinus]

He certainly didn’t baptize children, but neither did He specifically disallowed it.

In essence He did. When He said that “of such is the kingdom of God,” that means that they are already saved, therefore nothing more need to be done to save them.

In fact, if anything, the event highlights the fact that He would rather have children come to Him than not at all, . . .

Yes, but what did it mean for them to “come to Him”? They were brought to Him so He could touch them and bless them, not baptize them; which is what He did. Big difference between the two.

. . . which would in essence then show that there is basis for baptizing infants.

The scriptures make it unmistakably clear that baptism is unto repentance for the remission of sins:

Matthew 3:

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come

8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

Mark 1:

4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

Luke 3:

3 And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

Acts 13:

24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel.

1 Peter 3:

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Little children cannot fulfil any of these requirenents for baptism. They can neither sin nor can they repent. I particularly like Peter’s expression, “answer a good conscience before God”. How can a six month old baby repent, sin, “bring forth fruit meet for repentance,” or “answer a good conscience before God”? Obviously he cannot. Hence little children are already saved, as Jesus said, “for of such is the kingdom of God”. Therefore little children have no need to be baptized.

zerinus

 

[tequilamac]

Add to that, God is and was always God. We do not become “gods” of our own planets. Jesus and Lucifer were never brothers. And there is no such thing as the planet Kolob.

Well let’s not be hasty. The planet Kolob may just be waiting to be discovered by some enterprising young scientist. And apparently it will be populated by Mormons and baptised dead people.

 

[zerinus]

Well let’s not be hasty. The planet Kolob may just be waiting to be discovered by some enterprising young scientist. And apparently it will be populated by Mormons and baptised dead people.

Thou hypocrite! The discussion is about baptism, not about “Kolob” nor “gods”.

zerinus

 

[tequilamac]

Thou hypocrite! The discussion is about baptism, not about “Kolob” nor “gods”.

zerinus

If you are claiming I am discussing the wrong thing, perhaps your exclamation should not be “Thou hypocrite!”. I think according to your description “Thou illiterate!” would have been a more appropriate insult toward me, don’t you? Or maybe the problem is I don’t read reformed reformed Egyptian.

 

[Karin]

Thou hypocrite! The discussion is about baptism, not about “Kolob” nor “gods”.

zerinus

so now baptised dead people are GODS
WOW … .

 

[Karin]

If you are claiming I am discussing the wrong thing, perhaps your exclamation should not be “Thou hypocrite!”. I think according to your description “Thou illiterate!” would have been a more appropriate insult toward me, don’t you? Or maybe the problem is I don’t read reformed reformed Egyptian.

May I join the chorus of laughter

 

[dosdog]

Just as KOLOB is surrounded by a spirit world, Mormon Theologians imagine that the Earth, too, is surrounded by a spirit world. The earth’s spirit world is the home of dead people, in limbo for now, who await transport back to KOLOB, (via some other stops along the way (diagram).

nowscape.com/mormon/kolob1.gif

 

[zerinus]

If you are claiming I am discussing the wrong thing, perhaps your exclamation should not be “Thou hypocrite!”. I think according to your description “Thou illiterate!” would have been a more appropriate insult toward me, don’t you? Or maybe the problem is I don’t read reformed reformed Egyptian.

When you have no answers to give, change the subject, sneer, deride and ridicule the other side–anything to avoid the appearance of having lost the argument. That is called hypocracy, not iliteracy. I suppose you have to be pretty iliterate not to realize that, so perhaps it means both.

zerinus

 

[Karin]

Just as KOLOB is surrounded by a spirit world, Mormon Theologians imagine that the Earth, too, is surrounded by a spirit world. The earth’s spirit world is the home of dead people, in limbo for now, who await transport back to KOLOB, (via some other stops along the way (diagram).

nowscape.com/mormon/kolob1.gif

OH MAN that is a hoot…the diagram is L-O-V-E-L-Y

 

[Karin]

When you have no answers to give, change the subject, sneer, deride and ridicule the other side–anything to avoid the appearance of having lost the argument. That is called hypocracy, not iliteracy. I suppose you have to be pretty iliterate not to realize that, so perhaps it means both.

zerinus

Look at this…the pot calling the kettle black…

the actual meaning of hypocrisy is*: a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; especially : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion*
m-w.com/dictionary/hypocrisy

 

[zerinus]

Look at this…the pot calling the kettle black…

the actual meaning of hypocrisy is*: a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; especially* : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion
m-w.com/dictionary/hypocrisy

The biblical definition of hypocrisy is synonymous with deception. A deceptive individual is a “hypocrite” in biblical terms.

zerinus

 

[Karin]

The biblical definition of hypocrisy is synonymous with deception. A deceptive individual is a “hypocrite” in biblical terms.

zerinus

now a hyporcite is : *a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he or she does not hold in order to conceal his or her real feelings or motives *

what you have described in your post is not hypocrisy or a hypocrite

When you have no answers to give, change the subject, sneer, deride and ridicule the other side–anything to avoid the appearance of having lost the argument. That is called hypocracy,

 

[Eden]

Well that is not what I read into it. Jesus never baptized little children, nor commanded that they should be baptized. He just laid hands on them, prayed for them, and returned them to their mothers. He said that “of such is the kingdom of God”. That means that they are already citizens of that kingdom. They don’t need to do anything else to go there.

zerinus

How can you say the children were already saved in this instance? When Jesus walked the earth, His mission was not yet complete. It took His death and Resurrection for any of us to be saved. After His death and Resurrection, the apostles baptised entire households. That includes children under the age of 8.

 

[tequilamac]

When you have no answers to give, change the subject, sneer, deride and ridicule the other side–anything to avoid the appearance of having lost the argument. That is called hypocracy, not iliteracy. I suppose you have to be pretty iliterate not to realize that, so perhaps it means both.

zerinus

Eureka! I knew it! you are speaking in reformed egyptian!
I suppose you have to be pretty “iliterate” to know that “hypocracy” is not a word. At least not a word in English.
So were you meaning to say “Thou hypocrit!” in English or were tyring I mean tiring I mean trying to say “Thou Hypocrat!” in reformed reformed Egyptian?

 

[zerinus]

now a hyporcite is : *a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he or she does not hold in order to conceal his or her real feelings or motives *

what you have described in your post is not hypocrisy or a hypocrite

You are going out of your mind!

zerinus