Judgemental Protestants

[Peter_J]

Your answer here echoes my experience completely.

Not that I don’t believe you, but this statement needs elaboration: are you talking about experiences with a local Catholic parish, or with a blog/forum/etc on the Internet? Because I believe that it is very rare for a parish to be like that (not counting the SSPX etc).

 

[Catholic_farmer]

First of all, family is family, so there will always be a stronger level of emotions when someone goes against the family belief system. Especially in families where all the social events center around their Church. For all the drama and tears, know that the heart of it all is coming from love and fear of losing you.

As far as people being angry and even lashing out at those who leave their faith, I don’t see this issue as unique to certain denominations, nor do I see it as absent in the Catholic Church. However, I think there are some key differences which make it less common in the Catholic tradition and more common in evangelical settings.

As Catholics, we have a strong hierarchical system in which the primary responsibility of laypeople is not to go after the lost sheep or correct those who we feel are misguided. A perfect example is watching how some people have complained bitterly about the bishops not saying enough, or even, saying too much when it comes to important issues. We tend to wait for them to speak for the Church because we respect their authority and wisdom and we trust that they are being guided by the Holy Spirit.

We are also less evangelical in nature (although some might be more brave) and tend to be more reserved about sharing our beliefs than our brothers and sisters in Christ. Our Church also emphasizes showing people who we are by our actions.

In contrast to our hierarchical organization, most non-Catholics are organized in a more decentralized way and each individual church can be more independent (with some notable exceptions which tend to be the denominations closest to the Catholic faith). I think there is more of a sense of rivalry between non-Catholic churches and a much stronger push to bring in new people. I think this atmosphere sets up some Christians to feel that they can verbally go after other Christians turning away from their path. This is encouraged by some preachers and pastors. Some point to how St. Paul spoke in his letters and encourage people to be more like him in their faith (for us, St. Paul was a bishop, and therefore, more at liberty to scold his flock).

With this is mind, I can see why the things your former congregation are saying would feel like bullying. Try to understand that they are not alone in their misconceptions about our Church. Welcome to a minority group that has suffered a certain level of discrimination since the beginning of the first English colonies!

Work on forgiving and moving on. If you see them again, show them who you are by your actions. Your RCIA classes will give you the basics, but study apologetics and keep learning after RCIA is finished so you can (gently) rebuff their attacks on the Church.

I have been Catholic now for 2 1/2 years and still have to defend my decision from family and friends. The struggle has been a great way to ensure that I keep studying and learning all that I can. It has also only strengthened my faith. I am now a Catechist and I sub at a Catholic school. Perhaps these challenges you are facing are preparing you for a larger role within the Church.

 

[rcwitness]

If you live in a very Catholic town and you attended this judgemental and hateful church for 11 years I find it interesting you never picked up bad vibes earlier on.

That’s a very good point. I am suprised it would not have been foreseen also. These kind of believers don’t just one day go off on anti-Catholic sentiments. It’s something that will be evident in their preaching and fellowship. Though, it may not be personally experienced in such an “in your face” sort of way.

Anyway, my experience was overall not bad. I converted as a young adult (23 yrs) and I was actually invited by a friend, who was involved in the Evangelical Free youth group, to help as a leader! I did this for 3 yrs. I always respected staying within the teachings of their tradition. Eventually, I privately confronted the youth pastor over a couple concerns I had (OSAS was taught, and I never knew of any of the children being Baptized, even though many would accept Jesus as their savior). To me, it was not monumental, and could have been worked through, maybe. But it was the start of realizing that I needed to offer my work and devotion to my own Parish. I did appreciate much of the ministry there. And now, that friend, who invited me, said it would never happen again, just because things are quite a bit different. I think that church has become more formal.

I even had a strong disagreement with that friend who was engaged with a man who had been married and divorced. I genuinely cared enough for this friend to admonish this decision. It caused a division between us. I am a little upset with her leaders for approving this, but I no longer know if they were married or not.

Anyways, one of the worst and only negative sentiments I received was from my mother who, after I told my parents of my decision to be Baptized and join the Catholic Church, said, “But we raised you Christian!” Since then, there has not been much of anything like that.

 

[TC3033]

I think it largely is a matter of what counts as anti-Catholic. If you discuss that question with two people, one a traditionalist Catholic and one a Protestant (whatever denomination) you’ll get very different responses.

This is true. I’m you could get two different responses from two different Catholics…Protestants…etc…as well.

Not that I don’t believe you, but this statement needs elaboration: are you talking about experiences with a local Catholic parish, or with a blog/forum/etc on the Internet? Because I believe that it is very rare for a parish to be like that (not counting the SSPX etc).

I know that this question isn’t for me, but I personally have had the experience / been “informed” both online and at a local Parrish.

 

[Peter_J]

I know that this question isn’t for me, but I personally have had the experience / been “informed” both online and at a local Parrish.

Yes, I believe you when you talk about the anti-Protestant parish in you town. But I think that’s the rare exception.

 

[Widlast]

So, I’ve recently made the decision to return to Catholicism after 15 years of being away. I’ve spent the last 11 years in a non-denominational church. My decision to return to Catholicism has been met with such hateful judgement that literally has left me feeling sick.
I can’t believe a church would be so adamantly hateful towards brothers and sisters inChrist.
Has anyone else encountered such opposition?
I feel such peace since I decided to return but am so sick of the people who are against me.

Oh my goodness, many times. What you are seeing is the reality of their inner selves brought out into the daylight. They could not possibly imagine that anyone else could know Christ and DISAGREE ON DOCTRINE. How dare you? (I’m joking here)
Take it with a grain of salt and stick to the faith.

 

[Peter_J]

They could not possibly imagine that anyone else could know Christ and DISAGREE ON DOCTRINE.

To be fair, I got all my beliefs through brain-injections, but I imagine someone who gets them a different way might innocently get confused on this or that point.

 

[po18guy]

I respectfully disagree. My husband and his family are non-denoms and they are very kind and loving and acceptant of my faith. They don’t want to become catholic, but they don’t put me down for it.

Now the Baptists (in my experience) are a whole nother issue.

Thank you for respectfully disagreeing! To clarify, I shall henceforth use the term “Self-Proclaimed Bible Christian” (SPBC) to describe this particularly virulant and angry sub-sub-set of what might loosely be termed Christianity. Clearly, none of them follows James 3.

 

[Wannano]

Not that I don’t believe you, but this statement needs elaboration: are you talking about experiences with a local Catholic parish, or with a blog/forum/etc on the Internet? Because I believe that it is very rare for a parish to be like that (not counting the SSPX etc).

Your right I should have made it clearer. I was referring to some posters right here on Caf not on a local parish basis.

 

[Wannano]

Yeah, i wonder about that with Protestants too. How much else is false?

I am certainly willing to state that you will find some fallacy within Protestantism. Is that also possibly true in Catholicism?

 

[rcwitness]

I am certainly willing to state that you will find some fallacy within Protestantism. Is that also possibly true in Catholicism?

Not in the Mass or the Catechism

 

[Peter_J]

I am certainly willing to state that you will find some fallacy within Protestantism. Is that also possibly true in Catholicism?

Yes. We believe that infallibility exists, but it is by no means ubiquitous – on the contrary, it is really rare. (See discussions of Papal Infallibility and the infallibility of Ecumenical Councils.)

In concrete terms, I hope to live to see the day when Protestants no longer treat every statement made on a discussion forum like it’s infallible.

 

[rcwitness]

Yes. We believe that infallibility exists, but it is by no means ubiquitous – on the contrary, it is really rare. (See discussions of Papal Infallibility and the infallibility of Ecumenical Councils.)

Is there fallacy in the Mass or Catechism?

 

[Peter_J]

Is there fallacy in the Mass or Catechism?

See:

Not in the Mass or the Catechism

 

[rcwitness]

See:

That’s what I believe. Do you not?

 

[po18guy]

I am certainly willing to state that you will find some fallacy within Protestantism. Is that also possibly true in Catholicism?

Well, no, actually. Christ promised that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church into all truth. He specifically told Peter that the gates of hell would not prevail against it. I believe Christ explicitly and implicitly. How can there be a second way while believing Christ?

Catholic teachings are hard to accept solely because Christ’s teachings are hard for man to accept. No way around that. “Deny yourself.” “Take up your cross.” “Follow Me.”

Not easy.

 

[goout]

Yes. We believe that infallibility exists, but it is by no means ubiquitous – on the contrary, it is really rare. (See discussions of Papal Infallibility and the infallibility of Ecumenical Councils.)

In concrete terms, I hope to live to see the day when Protestants no longer treat every statement made on a discussion forum like it’s infallible.

Is this a better way to say it?:
There are objective realities involved in the Mass that occur nowhere else.

The Catechism is the fullest expression of our faith. It is the sure norm for the Catholic faith.
The Catechism, as a statement from the Magisterium, asks for the assent of the faithful.

Infallibility is just as much understood as “Inspiration” and Inerrancy".
Infallible addresses specific statements by specific people. It can also indicate the deposit of divine revelation itself, as expressed by the Church. So you can’t really say infallibility is “rare”. Specific infallible statements are rare, as exercised by Peter, but infallibility is also a gift that permeates Christ’s Church.

 

[Wannano]

Yes. We believe that infallibility exists, but it is by no means ubiquitous – on the contrary, it is really rare. (See discussions of Papal Infallibility and the infallibility of Ecumenical Councils.)

In concrete terms, I hope to live to see the day when Protestants no longer treat every statement made on a discussion forum like it’s infallible.

The thing is though, if I have to make a judgement between what Catholic A and Catholic B states when they both belong to the one and only true church how do I decide who knows what they are talking about? Or are you saying the forum should only be a source of entertainment?!

 

[rcwitness]

The thing is though, if I have to make a judgement between what Catholic A and Catholic B states when they both belong to the one and only true church how do I decide who knows what they are talking about? Or are you saying the forum should only be a source of entertainment?!

You have the Holy Spirit, right? You listen to Him guide you within the knowledge you have of Scripture, Tradition and Church Teaching. We are trying to explain how we understand the harmony of these. Sometimes we need correction.

 

[goout]

The thing is though, if I have to make a judgement between what Catholic A and Catholic B states when they both belong to the one and only true church how do I decide who knows what they are talking about? Or are you saying the forum should only be a source of entertainment?!

What do you do any other time you have conlficting points of view on the same subject?

Thinking
thinking
thinking

Find an authoritative opinion !

Where is that?
Catechism
Church documents like
Papal encyclicals
etc…