Justified by Faith Alone cf. James 2:24

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You answered my question while I was responding. Thanks for that. So there is no clear way for a Catholic to know if one will be in Heaven at death? You have to work hard and hope for the best?

And further, since you assert that assurance of salvation is a “false doctrine”, John assures his audience in his first letter they have eternal life. You would disagree with him?
Assuming you’re referring to 1 John 5:13. Note what 5:13a says…I write this to you…what did he write? The first 4 chapters of the letter have 21 IF’'s in them.
Read chapter 2…

A Catholic can have a moral certainty. If they know they have no unconfessed mortal sin (are in a state of grace)…but we cannot have absolute certainty because we don’t know the future. Work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Only God knows. I don’t sense any fear and trembling in my Protestant friends who have already judged themselves saved.
 
No I haven’t, just trying to prove that the scripture in Hebrews could not possible mean what Catholic interpretation is.

I continue to ask for definitive answers to my question and they continued to be ignored. Why? Because the Catholic view does not give one a sense of peace with God. Joy is unattainable because the Catholic is taught that Jesus’ sacrifice was not complete and if you sin too much, you will lose your salvation. This is not a Biblical view. So, I will ask one more time.
Your assertions about the Catholic Church are farther from the Truth at best. There is no condemnation for those who ARE in Christ. But one must REMAIN in Christ and unite with Him. If we die with Him, we’ll live with Him. If we endure with Him, we’ll reign with Him. But if we deny Him, He’ll deny us. If we are unfaithful, He remains faithful; He cannot deny who He is. God desires the salvation of all, but he grants it only to those who respond in faith and continue in His kindness.
 
RC, thanks for the direct answers. It was very refreshing.

Thanks to James248 and others for the spirited debate. God bless you my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I appreciate you all.
 
RC, thanks for the direct answers. It was very refreshing.

Thanks to James248 and others for the spirited debate. God bless you my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I appreciate you all.
Thanks for sharing. God bless you too.

Being unjustified before Him should frighten us to the core! Yet somehow, it’s tempting to disobey.

I do know that His love can save me! How can I say this, without the Spirit who is giving salvation to my soul already?

One of the dearest passages which gives hope to me, when my heart is heavy, is from 1 John 3
Code:
 Little children, let us not love in word or speech but in deed and in truth. By this we shall know that we are of the truth, and reassure our hearts before him*whenever our hearts condemn us; for God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.*Beloved, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God;**and we receive from him whatever we ask, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him.
 
We can only be assured of our present state. Simple.
I am a Protestant–traditional Anglican in my beliefs–and I do believe that those in saving grace can fall away (hence the genuine warnings throughout Scripture of falling away). However, the Scriptures also teach that we can and should have firm or full assurance not only of our present salvation, but especially of our final Salvation (even as we flee dangerous presumption):

2 Peter 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Psalm 73:23 Nevertheless I am continually with thee: thou hast holden me by my right hand. 24 Thou shalt guide me with thy counsel, and afterward receive me to glory.

Psalm 23:6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord for ever.

While I don’t agree with everything in the Westminster Confession, I believe it’s highly nuanced statement on “infallible assurance” is one that fits nicely with Scripture:
reformed.org/documents/wcf_with_proofs/index.html?body=/documents/wcf_with_proofs/ch_XVIII.html

God Bless.
 
Dear Protestant brothers and sisters,

“You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.” James 2:24 NKJV

Many of you ascribe your beliefs regarding justification to the view of being justified by faith alone and NOT by works. How would you reconcile your beliefs in light of the aforementioned Scripture verse?

With love,

Your Catholic brother 🙂
I believe the fuller quote is important:

*James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.*

As a Protestant, who believes in the historic doctrine of sola fide, I believe that my fellow Protestants often twist themselves in exegetical knots trying to make James only speak of the “evidence” of justification. While the passage does speak of works as providing evidence of faith, it seems clear to me that he is giving works a substantive role in “justification” itself. James makes clear that works “justify” inasmuch as without them faith is a dead and useless instrument for the purpose of justification. Paul says the same, “faith which worketh (or, “is effectual”) by love” Galatians 5:6.

Paul makes clear that faith alone is the instrument by which we stand justified before God. However, this faith is necessarily and always accompanied by love/good works. Luther himself notes the following on Galatians 5:6 in his Commentary on Galatians:
Galatians 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but faith which worketh by love.
Faith must of course be sincere. It must be a faith that performs good works through love. If faith lacks love it is not true faith. Thus the Apostle bars the way of hypocrites to the kingdom of Christ on all sides. He declares on the one hand, “In Christ Jesus circumcision availeth nothing,” i.e., works avail nothing, but faith alone, and that without any merit whatever, avails before God. On the other hand, the Apostle declares that without fruits faith serves no purpose. To think, “If faith justifies without works, let us work nothing,” is to despise the grace of God. Idle faith is not justifying faith.

studylight.org/commentaries/mlg/galatians-5.html

The traditional Anglican treatment on Justification by Faith Alone (Book of Homilies I, Homily on Justification) likewise notes how after justification, living contrary to Christ causes apostasy from our salvation in Christ:
“Our office is not to pass the time of this present life unfruitfully and idly after we are baptized or justified, not caring how few good works we do to the glory of God and profit of our neighbors. Much less is it our office, after that we be once made Christ’s members,
to live contrary to the same, making our selves members of the devil, walking after his incitements, and after the suggestions of the world and the flesh, whereby we know that we do serve the world and the devil, and not GOD.” anglicanlibrary.org/homilies/bk1hom03.htm

Or, as the Anglican reformer Latimer affirms the necessity of the justified walking in obedience vs. disobedience:
"I put the case, Joseph had not resisted the temptations of his master’s wife, but had followed her, and fulfilled the act of lechery with her ; had weighed the matter after a worldly fashion, thinking, “I have my mistress’s favour already, and so by that mean I shall have my master’s favour too ; nobody knowing of it.”…And that man or woman that committeth such an act, loseth the Holy Ghost and the remission of sins ; and so becometh the child of the devil, being before the child of God. For a regenerate man or woman, that believeth, ought to have dominion over sin ; but as soon as sin hath rule over him, he is gone: for she leadeth him to delectation of it, and from delectation to consenting, and so from consenting to the act itself. Now he that is led so with sin, he is in the state of damnation, and sinneth damnably. And so ye may perceive which be they that sin deadly, and what is the deadly sin; namely, that he sinneth deadly that wittingly falleth in sin: therefore it is a perilous thing to be in such an estate, to be in the state of damnation and everlasting perdition.”[THE SIXTH SERMON, PREACHED ON THE FIRST SUNDAY IN ADVENT, 1552, BY MASTER HUGH LATIMER]

Luther likewise states:
“29. Therefore, saints must, by a vigorous and unceasing warfare, subdue their sinful lusts if they would not lose God’s grace and their faith. Paul says in Romans 8, 13: “If ye live after the flesh, ye must die; but if by the Spirit ye put to death the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” In order, then, to retain the Spirit and the incipient divine life, the Christian must contend against himself.”
orlutheran.com/html/mlseco31.html

Luther unfortunately embraced a popular scholarly opinion of the day shared by his primary Catholic opponent, Cardinal Cajetan–namely that James was not a fully canonical book. Consequently, he allowed his dislike of James’ terminology to obscure the substantive agreement he had with the teaching of the Book of James.
 
So there is no clear way for a Catholic to know if one will be in Heaven at death? You have to work hard and hope for the best?
Just as scripture teaches, and the Church has taught now for 2000 years, Catholic’s have hopeful confidence, not infallible certitude.

Just as St. Paul says. God is his judge, he does not judge himself…

Once saved, always saved is a heretical doctrine, not found in Christian history until John Calvin. He had no authority. Even Father Luther disagreed with him on this point.

DrBlank, using your criteria, can you cite an apostolic father who agreed with your interpretation of scripture on this point?

Or anyone else in the subsequent 1000 years?

if you can’t cite anyone in those 1000+ years what does it say?

I’ll answer: It’s a new gospel, and new gospels need to be rejected.
 
Paul makes clear that faith alone is the instrument by which we stand justified before God. However, this faith is necessarily and always accompanied by love/good works.
Are love and good works synonymous in your view? It seems like up until the moment of justification, faith is not yet accompanied by good works, making the “always accompanied” statement inaccurate.
The traditional Anglican treatment on Justification by Faith Alone (Book of Homilies I, Homily on Justification) likewise notes how after justification, living contrary to Christ causes apostasy from our salvation in Christ
If evil deeds can cause a loss of salvation, then it seems like you don’t actually believe in Faith Alone. This is why the Calvinist/Reformed believe salvation cannot be lost, because if it’s by faith alone, then what we do wont affect our salvation.

So those Protestants who say “faith alone” but also believe we can lose our salvation don’t seem to be consistent in their theology, and in fact it sounds a lot closer to Catholicism.
 
Ok then. If I’m understanding you correctly, if the man in my hypothetical is one of the elect it doesn’t matter how he lives? Because no amount of sin can separate him from God? Or loose his place in heaven? Not even adultery/fornication or whatever you might call this man’s sin?

What about nothing unholy being able to enter into the Presence of God? Does this man merely by virtue of his death become holy?

So then the list of sins in Galatians 5:19-21 and 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 that clearly states one “shall not obtain the kingdom of God” only apply to the non-elect? Or doesn’t it really matter…cause the non-elect aren’t going to heaven anyway? I’m confused.
**God bless Debbie Kono and every readers of the CAF.
**

I know some Catholics believe; Once Saved, Always Saved/Salvation of the Elect is a heretical doctrine.

Yet the Fullness of the Truth is, the Once Saved, Always Saved/Salvation of the Elect is a DE FIDE Dogma of the Catholic Church as it is follows:

**The Catholic Church affirms predestination as a *DE FIDE *Dogma (the highest level of binding theological certainty).

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA

THE CATHOLIC DOGMA. – The predestination of the elect.**

Consequently, the whole future membership of heaven, down to its minutest details, has

been IRREVOCABLY FIXED FROM ALL ETERNITY. Nor could it be otherwise. For if it

were possible that a predestined individual should after all be CAST INTO HELL or that

one not predestined should in the end REACH HEAVEN, then God would have been

MISTAKEN in his foreknowledge of future events; He would NO LONGER be omniscient.

God’s unerring foreknowledge and foreordaining is designated in the Bible by the beautiful

figure of the “Book of Life” (liber vitæ, to biblion tes zoes). This book of life is a list which

contains the names of ALL THE ELECT and admits NEITHER ADDITIONS NO ERASURES.

(2) The second quality of predestination, the DEFINITENESS of the number of the elect,

follows NATURALLY from the first. For if the eternal counsel of God regarding the

predestined is UNCHANGEABLE, then the number of the predestined must likewise be

UNCHANGEABLE and DEFINITE, subject NEITHER to ADDITIONS nor to

CANCELLATIONS. Anything indefinite in the number would eo ipso imply a lack of

certitude in God’s knowledge and would DESTROY His omniscience.

**THE THEORY OF PREDESTINATION prævisa merita

THIS THEORY, CHAMPIONED BY all Thomists and a few Molinists (as Bellarmine, Francisco Suárez, Francis de Lugo):**

Asserts that God, by an absolute decree and without regard to any future supernatural merits, predestined from all eternity certain men to the glory of heaven, and then, in consequence of this decree, decided to give them all the graces necessary for its accomplishment. End quote.

The above teachings of the Catholic Church based on the following Bible verses:

Rom.8:28-30; Rom.11:29; John 5:24; John 6:44; John 6:47; John 6:51; John 6:54; Rom.6:23; Phil.1:29; Acts 13:48; John 10:26; 2 Tim.1:9; Eph.1:11; etc.

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ONLY GOD’S ELECT CHOSEN TO SALVATION AND EVERLASTING LIFE.

God desire is that everyone saved in Christ, and to grant His Gift of Formed Faith to everyone.


Because of the reprobates rejection of God and His grace, **God didn’t grant them His gift of Formed Faith. **

God’s gifts and His call are IRREVACABLE, as they are irrevocable and for other reasons, God couldn’t give His gifts to the reprobates or to call the reprobates into His service. – Rom.11:29.

So, for their rejection, they cannot come to Christ, or to believe in Christ or His Word, of course as the results of their rejection, they can never be saved.

Because God has granted only His elect to believe, the reprobates don’t believe. – They may have a short time an Intellectual Faith which is not enough for salvation.

The elect has everlasting life.

The Father draws only His elect to Christ.

The Father has granted only His elect to go to Christ.

The Father has granted only to His elect to believe in Christ and to suffer for Christ.

The elect don’t go to judgment. – Only their works will be judged (1 Cor.3:12-15).

At their initial justification, the elect has passed from death to life, they received God’s gift of Salvation/Everlasting Life and God’s special grace His Gift of Final Perseverance, which is an Eternal Protection of their Salvation/Everlasting Life.

Without God’s special grace, His Gift of Final Perseverance, every elect would end up in hell.** – Only God can and keeps His elect on the narrow road.** – Infallible teachings.

John 6:44; No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent me draws them.

John 6:65; … no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.

Phil.1:29; For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe in him, but also to suffer for him.

Acts 13:48; When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed. – As we see; ONLY the elect appointed to eternal life and ONLY the elect believed.

John 10:26; But you do not believe because you are not my sheep. – Only the elect believe and only the elect are Christ’s sheep, NO ONE ELSE!!!

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John 5:24;
“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears my word and believes him who sent me, HAS EVERLASTING LIFE; he does NOT come into judgment, but has passed FROM DEATH to LIFE.”

Christ did not say; Those who believes has** periodical life and death,** Christ said; they have eternal life, the matter is settled!!! – “Christ has spoken (ETERNAL LIFE); The case is closed.”

John 12:48; (AMP)
Whoever rejects Me and refuses to accept My teachings, has one who judges him; the VERY word that I spoke * (ETERNAL LIFE*) will judge and condemn him on the last day. – In the brackets added for the believers of periodical life and death. 🙂

If an elect could lose eternal life, he would have periodical life and death.

For an elect to lose his sonship and God’s gift of eternal life is OUTRIGHT contradicts Christ’s promise of the eternal life of the elect (only the elect believe Christ, and the Scripture NO ONE ELSE). – So, can NEVER happen that an elect lose his sonship or everlasting life.

God called His chosen sons and daughters/elect to be His sons and daughters, this call and their gift of ETERNAL life can NEVER be revoked.

At their initial justification, God has given to His sons and daughters His gift of everlasting life for ETERNITY. – God doesn’t make the mistake to give it to a wrong person.

God’s sons and daughters/elect, can NEVER be any position when they are not God’s sons and daughters and they don’t have God’s IRREVOCABLE gift of everlasting life.

If their sonship and their everlasting life could be revoked, they could die in this position and they would end up in hell and God would lose His omniscience. – DE FIDE Dogma.

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WITH AN ABSOLUTE DECREE GOD PREDESTINED HIS CHOSEN SONS AND DAUGHTERS/ELECT TO HEAVEN

For the fulfillment of God’s absolute decree God MAKES His elect to cooperate with His grace without violating their free will.

For an elect to lose his SALVATION/EVERLASTING LIFE and end up in hell, that would be God’s failure and God would lose His omniscience. – DE FIDE Dogma.

GOD IS THE ONE WHO SAVES HIS CHILDREN

John 15:16; “You did not chose Me, but I chose you …”

2 Tim.1:9; “God who saved us and called us with holy calling, NOT ACCORDING TO OUR WORKS, but ACCORDING TO HIS OWN PURPOSE …”

Eph.1:11; “… being predestined ACCORDING TO THE PURPOSE of Him …”

John 6:44 … NO ONE can come to Me unless the Father DRAWS him.

In other words, when God commands, He capacitates the hearer to respond.

Yet the ability to respond is also His gift.

Aquinas said, “God changes the will without forcing it.
But he can change the will from the fact that He himself operates in the will as He does in nature,” De Veritatis 22:9.

Similarly, the Council of Orange Canon 25 states, “In every good work, it is not we who begin … but He (God) first inspires us.” (#329.2)

ST. AUGUSTINE ON GRACE AND PREDESTINATION

De gratia Christi 25, 26:

“For not only has God given us our ability and helps it, but He even works [brings about] willing and acting in us; not that we do not will or that we do not act, but that without His help we neither will anything good nor do it.”

De gratia et libero arbitrio 16, 32:
“It is certain that we will when we will; but He brings it about that we will good. . . . It is certain that we act when we act, but He brings it about that we act, PROVIDING MOST EFFECTIVE POWERS TO THE WILL.”

Phil.2:13; “For it is God who works in you BOTH TO WILL and TO ACT for His good pleasure.”

CCC 2022; “The divine initiative in the work of grace PRECEDES,PREPARES, and ELICITS the free response of man. …”

The salvation of God’s children/elect always based on God’s initiative.

Phil.1:6; (Ignatius Catholic Study Bible)
And I am sure, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

Rom.8:38-39; “For I am convinced that… nothing in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.” – If an elect would be separated for any reason and would end up in hell, God would lose His omniscience. – DE FIDE Dogma.

SUMMARY

God’s chosen sons and daughters/elect
CAN NEVER be in a position when they are not God’s sons and daughters.

Furthermore, God’s chosen sons and daughters/elect CAN NEVER be in a position when they don’t have their God’s gift of everlasting life.

If God’s chosen sons and daughters/elect would be in a position, which position they are not God’s sons and daughters and their everlasting life revoked, they could die in this position and they would end up in hell and God would lose his omniscience. – DE FIDE Dogma. – The highest level of binding theological certainty.

If we are elect, our state is our PAST, PRESENT, FUTURE and FINAL state, because we cannot lose our salvation. – DE FIDE Dogma.

**If we are reprobates, **our state is also our PAST, PRESENT, FUTURE and FINAL state, **because we never had and we will never have salvation. **

As we see; it is far from the truth that the Once Saved, Always Saved, with other words; Salvation of the Elect is a heretical doctrine, in fact it is a DE FIDE Dogma of the Catholic Church, an important part of our Beautiful Catholic Faith, our Fullness of the Truth.

God bless Debbie Kono and every readers of the CAF.

LatinRight
 
Paul makes clear that faith alone is the instrument by which we stand justified before God. However, this faith is necessarily and always accompanied by love/good works. Luther himself notes the following on Galatians 5:6 in his Commentary on Galatians: .
JustaSinner, as long as one professes that we are saved by Grace, through Faith, Working in Love, Catholic’s say Amen. Faith is never separated from works of Charity. I think you are saying this above. That’s why of Faith, Hope and Love, the greatest is Love. Every time scripture speaks of our standing before God, including St. Paul, we are judged by our works. Hence, James says we are saved by Works, NOT by Faith Alone (the only time in the bible those two words are ever used).
Paul makes clear that faith alone is the instrument by which we stand justified before God
I would ask you to cite who in 1500 years of Christian history before Father Luther first espoused this interpretation of St. Paul?
 
Are love and good works synonymous in your view? It seems like up until the moment of justification, faith is not yet accompanied by good works, making the “always accompanied” statement inaccurate.

If evil deeds can cause a loss of salvation, then it seems like you don’t actually believe in Faith Alone. This is why the Calvinist/Reformed believe salvation cannot be lost, because if it’s by faith alone, then what we do wont affect our salvation.

So those Protestants who say “faith alone” but also believe we can lose our salvation don’t seem to be consistent in their theology, and in fact it sounds a lot closer to Catholicism.
It depends on what sense the term “good works” or “love” is being used. “Good works” in the narrowest sense only includes charitable outward acts which of course can only follow the moment of faith. On the other hand, in the broadest sense of the term “good works”, all inward and outward obedience to God are included, even the inward action of faith itself (and the Scripture at times speaks of good works so broadly as to encompass faith–e.g. John 6:29). Normally, however, as in the writings of James and Paul, “works” encompass all good, loving, obedient acts, except for faith, which is set apart or distinguished from the other good works or acts of obedience to God’s Holy Law. I am using the term good works in this sense when I say faith is necessarily “always accompanied” by good works.

“Love” is the origin and summation of all good works, and even the act of faith itself is an act of love (e.g. 1 Corinthians 13:7). Because of the similar function in relation to faith that “love” holds for Paul (Galatians 5:6) and “works” hold for James (James–2:26) it appears that Paul and James are using the terms love and works in at least an overlapping sense and possibly in a synonymous sense in their respective discussions.

[As a side note: the “works of the Law” in Paul include the “works” spoken of in James inasmuch as Paul includes the moral law/works of love (e.g. Romans 7:7 “thou shalt not covet”) under works of the Law.]

Faith alone and the question of whether we can apostasize are completely separate matters for the reformers. While Calvin did believe that we cannot fall from grace, many if not most of the reformers (including Luther) believed that genuine apostasy from faith and salvation is possible. They believed that saving, justifying faith cannot coexist with a deadly state of sin (or “dominion of sin” as Luther frequently terms it)–e.g. in the reformers’ Apology of Augsburg:
Wherefore 22] it cannot exist in those who live according to the flesh who are delighted by their own lusts and obey them. Accordingly, Paul says, Rom. 8:1: There is, therefore, now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. So, too, Rom 8:12-13: We are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die; but if ye, through the Spirit, do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 23] Wherefore, the faith which receives remission of sins in a heart terrified and fleeing from sin does not remain in those who obey their desires, neither does it coexist with mortal sin.

Of course, like Augustine, Anselm, Bernard of Clairvaux, Aquinas, Bradwardine, etc. the reformers believed that those whom God had elected from all eternity received the gift of perseverance to the end and therefore would infallibly persevere in the end (even as the non-elect show themselves to be not of God’s predestined number by failing to persevere to the end).
 
Okay, so a Catholic dies and arrives at the pearly gates, and St. Peter says, show me your works so I can let you into heaven.

A Protestant dies and arrives at the pearly gates, and St. Peter says, show me your works that prove you have saving faith.

What is the difference?
 
Okay, so a Catholic dies and arrives at the pearly gates, and St. Peter says, show me your works so I can let you into heaven.

A Protestant dies and arrives at the pearly gates, and St. Peter says, show me your works that prove you have saving faith.

What is the difference?
#1, Peter won’t be there to meet us (Catholic or Protestant). Jesus will. 😃

The difference is this:

The Catholic says “Hello dearest Jesus. I have worked hard and done the best I could. I believed in Your sacrifice. Did I do enough to get in?” Just trying to glean what you believe. May not be accurate at all. 🙂

Protestant view: Jesus says, “You were selected and called by the Father. You believed and trusted Me. Your faith has saved you. You tripped and stumbled at times, but My Father completed His work in you. Well done. Now let’s talk about how you contributed to the Kingdom and see what Heavenly rewards you will be given.”
 
Faith alone and the question of whether we can apostasize are completely separate matters for the reformers. While Calvin did believe that we cannot fall from grace, many if not most of the reformers (including Luther) believed that genuine apostasy from faith and salvation is possible. They believed that saving, justifying faith cannot coexist with a deadly state of sin
How can you speak of salvation by faith alone if your works play a role in your salvation, in this case the possibility of losing salvation?
 
#1, Peter won’t be there to meet us (Catholic or Protestant). Jesus will. 😃

The difference is this:

The Catholic says “Hello dearest Jesus. I have worked hard and done the best I could. I believed in Your sacrifice. Did I do enough to get in?” Just trying to glean what you believe. May not be accurate at all. 🙂

Protestant view: Jesus says, “You were selected and called by the Father. You believed and trusted Me. Your faith has saved you. You tripped and stumbled at times, but My Father completed His work in you. Well done. Now let’s talk about how you contributed to the Kingdom and see what Heavenly rewards you will be given.”
Actually catholic’s do not think that way. The good works we do is God doing His work through us. its all and well to have faith but if you do nothing with it and just say I have faith what good is that anyone can say that. Doing good works or deeds is not about getting something in return but doing it out of love for God so if one had faith one does good works or deeds because they want to. In all of the Gospels Jesus is always saying do for those as you want done to yourself. Also Jesus said if you do it for the least of my brothers you did it for me. sounds like one is to do good works nut say that have faith.
 
#1, Peter won’t be there to meet us (Catholic or Protestant). Jesus will. 😃

The difference is this:

The Catholic says “Hello dearest Jesus. I have worked hard and done the best I could. I believed in Your sacrifice. Did I do enough to get in?” Just trying to glean what you believe. May not be accurate at all. 🙂

Protestant view: Jesus says, “You were selected and called by the Father. You believed and trusted Me. Your faith has saved you. You tripped and stumbled at times, but My Father completed His work in you. Well done. Now let’s talk about how you contributed to the Kingdom and see what Heavenly rewards you will be given.”
You’re correct, it won’t be St Peter–I was using a popular image to be graphic. However, that does not alter the question.

Yes, your characterization of the Catholic is typical of the Protestant view, which we will accept for purposes of demonstration.

But your characterization of the Protestant evades the point of my question. I’ll explain. Okay, so I am to understand that authentic, saving faith is always accompanied by works, that is, one’s works demonstrate that their faith is saving? Right? And that one’s saving faith is their entrance to heaven? True?

We’ll try this again.

The Catholic dies and arrives at the entrance to heaven, and Jesus says, if you have enough works I can let you in. So show me your works.

The Protestant dies and arrives at the entrance to heaven, and Jesus says, if you have saving faith I can let you in. So show me your works that prove you have saving faith.

Again. What’s the difference?

(By the way, your characterization of the Protestant at the entrance to heaven applies to the Catholic as well. No Catholic would disagree with it.)
 
You’re correct, it won’t be St Peter–I was using a popular image to be graphic. However, that does not alter the question.

Yes, your characterization of the Catholic is typical of the Protestant view, which we will accept for purposes of demonstration.

But your characterization of the Protestant evades the point of my question. I’ll explain. Okay, so I am to understand that authentic, saving faith is always accompanied by works, that is, one’s works demonstrate that their faith is saving? Right? And that one’s saving faith is their entrance to heaven? True?

We’ll try this again.

The Catholic dies and arrives at the entrance to heaven, and Jesus says, if you have enough works I can let you in. So show me your works.

The Protestant dies and arrives at the entrance to heaven, and Jesus says, if you have saving faith I can let you in. So show me your works that prove you have saving faith.

Again. What’s the difference?

(By the way, your characterization of the Protestant at the entrance to heaven applies to the Catholic as well. No Catholic would disagree with it.)
The fact Catholics believe my scenarios pleases me!!! Others on this forum have indicated otherwise.

There is no difference but Protestant don’t believe that will be said to them. Jesus will say “YOU HAVE SAVING FAITH. PLEASE COME IN.”

The proof James speaks of is for our understanding that works are a result of authentic faith. Works are a natural fruit of saving faith.
 
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