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Hahahaha! 
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Bob4BVM
Guest
djdave:
Had a similar discussion on another site, with more scripture-thrashing than even here.
I need to say the same thing to you I did to him :
Dave, you may wonder why we continue to pound away at this with you.
It is because we who have a veritable feast before us are greatly saddened by a world where so many have gone so far adrift, that they won’t even sit down and eat with us, tho they are obviously starving.
…“taste, and see.”
Had a similar discussion on another site, with more scripture-thrashing than even here.
I need to say the same thing to you I did to him :
Dave, you may wonder why we continue to pound away at this with you.
It is because we who have a veritable feast before us are greatly saddened by a world where so many have gone so far adrift, that they won’t even sit down and eat with us, tho they are obviously starving.
…“taste, and see.”
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Barry_Gabriel
Guest
OK… what songbooks?
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dj_dave
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JeanneH
Guest
If Adam had not sinned we would all have heaven on earth. Right?
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newhope75
Guest
YES!
I’m living proof of this. I have yet to post my conversion story anywhere and it’d take too long to do so at the moment, but here’s an entire list of conversion stories of JWs who converted to Catholicism:
catholicxjw.com/conversions.html
Many of them were JW Elders, Pioneers and Bethelites*, too, NOT just those who were weak in the JW faith. I myself was once a JW pioneer for many years, and now I hope to be a member of the 2010 Tiber Swim Team. So please keep trying, even though it IS hard. You’re not that far off with your last comment there, sadly. But, yes, it IS possible.
*For those unfamiliar with these terms: JW Elders are the ones who lead the congregations, a Pioneer is a full time door-to-door minister, and a Bethelite is one who lives and works at the JW headquarters in New York or branch offices around the world. All of these are voluntary, unpaid positions, so these are some of the ones most faithful and dedicated to the JWs. And many of them have converted. So please keep trying. It IS working.
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dj_dave
Guest
Actually, earth would be earth and heaven would be heaven
Ps.115:16
The expression “heavens of the heavens” is considered to refer to the highest heavens and would embrace the complete extent of the physical heavens, however vast, since the heavens extend out from the earth in all directions.—De 10:14; Ne 9:6.
Solomon, the constructor of the temple at Jerusalem, stated that the “heavens, yes, the heaven of the heavens” cannot contain God. (1Ki 8:27) As the Creator of the heavens, Jehovah’s position is far above them all, and “his name alone is unreachably high. His dignity is above earth and heaven.” (Ps 148:13) Jehovah measures the physical heavens as easily as a man would measure an object by spreading his fingers so that the object lies between the tips of the thumb and the little finger. (Isa 40:12)
Solomon’s statement does not mean that God has no specific place of residence. Nor does it mean that he is omnipresent in the sense of being literally everywhere and in everything. This can be seen from the fact that Solomon also spoke of Jehovah as hearing “from the heavens, your established place of dwelling,” that is, the heavens of the spirit realm.—1Ki 8:30,*39.
The spiritual heavens are also the “proper dwelling place” of God’s spirit sons. (Jude 6; Ge 28:12,13; Mt 18:10; 24:36) The expression “army of the heavens,” often applied to the stellar creation, sometimes describes these angelic sons of God. (1Ki 22:19; compare Ps 103:20, 21; Da 7:10; Lu 2:13; Re 19:14.) So, too, “the heavens” are personified as representing this angelic organization, “the congregation of the holy ones.”—Ps 89:5-7; compare Lu 15:7,10; Re 12:12.
The earth?..Like all other created things, the earth was brought into existence because of Jehovah’s will (“pleasure,” KJ). (Re 4:11) It was created to remain forever. (Ps 78:69; 104:5; 119:90; Ec 1:4) God speaks of himself as a God of purpose and declares that his purposes are certain to come to fruition. (Isa 46:10; 55:11) He made his purpose for the earth very clear when he said to the first human pair: “Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth.” (Ge 1:28)
There were no flaws in earth or the things on it. Having created all necessary things, Jehovah saw that they were “very good” and “proceeded to rest” or desist from other earthly creative works.—Ge 1:31–2:2.
Man’s habitation on earth is also permanent. When God gave man the law regarding the tree of the knowledge of good and bad, he implied that man could live on earth forever. (Ge 2:17) We are assured by Jehovah’s own words that “all the days the earth continues, seed sowing and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night, will never cease” (Ge 8:22) and that he will never destroy all flesh again by a flood. (Ge 9:12-16) Jehovah says that he did not make the earth for nothing but, rather, that he has given it to men as a home and that death will eventually be done away with. God’s purpose, therefore, is for the earth to be the habitation of man in perfection and happiness with eternal life.—Ps 37:11; 115:16; Isa 45:18; Re 21:3, 4.
That this is the purpose of Jehovah God, sacred to him and not to be thwarted, is indicated when the Bible says: “And by the seventh day God came to the completion of his work that he had made . . . And God proceeded to bless the seventh day and make it sacred, because on it he has been resting from all his work that God has created for the purpose of making.” (Ge 2:2, 3) The seventh, or rest, day is not shown in the Genesis account as ending, as in the case of the other six days.
The apostle Paul explained that the rest day of God had been continuous right through Israelite history down to his own time and had not yet ended. (Heb 3:7-11; 4:3-9) God says the seventh day was set aside as sacred to him. He would carry out his purpose toward the earth; it would be fully accomplished during that day, with no necessity of further creative works toward the earth during that time.
So then why is there a heavenly calling now? HEB 3:1
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dj_dave
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Because, like you my friend, they refuse to take the time to learn the truth of what the Catholic faith is really all about.
The difference between us is this :
When Catholics take the trouble to really dig in and learn the truth about their faith, they stay forever…
When JW’s really dig in and learn the truth about their faith, they leave in droves…
Be true to thyself.
The truth is still the truth even if nobody believes it, and a lie is still a lie, even if everybody believes it. Fulton Sheen
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dj_dave
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Bob4BVM
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adelore
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To those people who are “Hung Up” on the fact that that the Bible doesn’t have the word “Trinity” in it. You are right it doesn’t have the word “Trinity” in it…but the Trinity is taught.
Second…the word “Bible” is not in the Bible either.
Third… “Sole Scripture” is not found in the Bible, (for those people who only want to refer to the “Printed Words” of the Bible. Before the Bible was made into a “Book” please remember Jesus…taught by Oral and Tradition…teaching. For Years there was no Bible for every person to use…
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yellowbird
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[/QUOTE]
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Javl
Guest
Many Catholics and Protestants become JWs because they are either weak in their faith
or know nothing about their faith. For if the bothered to find out, i can assure you that they would have not become JWs.
PAX DOMINI
Shalom Aleichem
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Javl
Guest
If you were a Catholic for 30 years and ask about the immortal soul, then you really did not take time to learn about Catholicism. For if you did you would still be Catholic today.
Your post has shown me that you have sucumbed totaly to the erroneous teachings of the Watchtower bible and Tract Society. My friend I say all this not to deride you, but say it in all charity. I have studied with the JWs and only after thoroughly researching their doctrines and teachings and comparing them with that of the early Church Fathers and
the teachings and traditions of Jesus and His Apostles did I learn that the WBTS teaches that which is only to its benefit to capture and hold the unwitting. The WTBS has
mutilated the scriptures to fit its brand of “theology”. For instance John 1:1-3. The WTBTS says that Jesus is only a god. (This violates the first commandment. ) If you believe that the Word is Jesus, and that nothing was made that He didn’t make, then how could Jesus have made Himself? Also, have you read Isaih 44:24 ? What is your answer to that one?
Have you read the true history of the WBTS? Not the purgated one by them.
PAX DOMINI
Shalom Aleichem
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dj_dave
Guest
Would you be willing to become a Witness?
Actually, the word “soul” is in the Scriptures over 856 times and of the 856 instances of the Hebrew word for SOUL [NEPHESH] and the Greek equivalent [PSYKHE] that I looked at, only the New world Translation translated it SOUL every time. THIS IS THE KEY TO UNDERSTANDING THE BIBLES TEACHING OF THE SOUL…
The New American Standard Bible (considered to be the most literal Bible) only did so 297 times.
Other version are as follows:
Darby Bible: 575 times
Douay Bible: 551 times
King James Bible: 534 times
Young’s Literal Version: 533 times
English Revised Version: 504 times
American Standard Version: 503 times
Rotherham Bible: 493 times
Revised Standard Version: 242 times
New International Version: 138 times
this is just a small example of the overall view of the inaccuracies of the translating of this word.
THE following may surprise you.
At Gen 2:7, man “came to be a living soul”; hence man was a soul, he did not have a soul as something immaterial, invisible, and intangible residing inside him. The apostle Paul shows that the Christian teaching did not differ from the earlier Hebrew teaching, for he quotes Genesis 2:7 in saying: “It is even so written: ‘The first man Adam became a living soul [psy•khen´ zo´san].’ . . . The first man is out of the earth and made of dust.”—1Co 15:45-47.
The Genesis account shows that a living soul results from the combination of the earthly body with the breath of life. The expression “breath of the force of life [literally, breath of the spirit, or active force (ru´ach), of life]” (Ge 7:22) indicates that it is by breathing air (with its oxygen) that the life-force, or “spirit,” in all creatures, man and animals, is sustained. This life-force is found in every cell of the creature’s body…
Since the term **ne´phesh **refers to the creature itself, we should expect to find the normal physical functions or characteristics of fleshly creatures attributed to it. This is exactly the case. Ne´phesh (soul) is spoken of as eating flesh, fat, blood, or similar material things (Le 7:18, 20, 25, 27; 17:10, 12, 15; De 23:24); being hungry for or craving food and drink (De 12:15, 20, 21; Ps 107:9; Pr 19:15; 27:7; Isa 29:8; 32:6; Mic 7:1); being made fat (Pr 11:25); fasting (Ps 35:13); touching unclean things, such as a dead body (Le 5:2; 7:21; 17:15; 22:6; Nu 19:13); being ‘seized as a pledge’ or being ‘kidnapped’ (De 24:6, 7); doing work (Le 23:30); being refreshed by cold water when tired (Pr 25:25); being purchased (Le 22:11; Eze 27:13); being given as a vow offering (Le 27:2); being put in irons (Ps 105:18); being sleepless (Ps 119:28); and struggling for breath (Jer 15:9).
It may be noted that in many texts reference is made to “my soul,” “his [or her] soul,” “your soul,” and so forth. This is because ne´phesh and psy•khe´ can mean one’s own self as a soul. The sense of the term can therefore often be expressed in English by use of personal pronouns. Thus Lexicon in Veteris Testamenti Libros (p. 627) shows that “my ne´phesh” means “I” (Ge 27:4, 25; Isa 1:14); “your [singular] ne´phesh” means “thou” or “you” (Ge 27:19, 31; Isa 43:4; 51:23); “his ne´phesh” means “he, himself” (Nu 30:2; Isa 53:10); “her ne´phesh” means “she, herself” (Nu 30:5-12), and so forth.
The Greek term psy·khe′ is used similarly. Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 4, p. 54) says it may be used as “the equivalent of the personal pronoun, used for emphasis and effect:—1st person, John 10:24 (‘us’); Heb. 10:38; cp. [compare] Gen. 12:13; Num. 23:10; Jud. 16:30; Ps. 120:2 (‘me’); 2nd person, 2*Cor. 12:15; Heb. 13:17,” and many more.
(John 10:24) Therefore the Jews encircled him and began to say to him: “How long are you to keep our souls in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us outspokenly.”
(Hebrews 10:38) “But my righteous one will live by reason of faith,” and, “if he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.”
(Genesis 12:13) Please say you are my sister, in order that it may go well with me on your account, and my soul will be certain to live due to you.”
(Numbers 23:10)* Who has numbered the dust particles of Jacob, And who has counted the fourth part of Israel? Let my soul die the death of the upright ones, And let my end turn out afterward like theirs.”*
(Judges 16:30) And Samson proceeded to say: “Let my soul die with the Phi·lis′tines.” Then he bent himself with power, and the house went falling upon the axis lords and upon all the people that were in it, so that the dead that he put to death in his own death came to be more than those he had put to death during his lifetime.
(Psalm 120:2) O Jehovah, do deliver my soul from false lips, From the tricky tongue.
Both ne′phesh and psy·khe′ are also used to mean life—not merely as an abstract force or principle—but life as a creature, human or animal.
also there is this: gnmagazine.org/issues/gn23/immortalsoul.htm
cont.
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dj_dave
Guest
Both ne´phesh and psy•khe´ are also used to mean life—not merely as an abstract force or principle—but life as a creature, human or animal.
Thus when Rachel was giving birth to Benjamin, her ne´phesh (“soul,” or life as a creature) went out from her and she died. (Ge 35:16-19) She ceased to be a living creature. Similarly, when the prophet Elijah performed a miracle regarding the dead son of the widow of Zarephath, the child’s ne´phesh (“soul,” or life as a creature) came back into him and “he came to life,” was again a living creature.—1Ki 17:17-23.
Because the creature’s life is so inseparably connected with and dependent on blood (shed blood standing for the life of the person or creature [Ge 4:10; 2Ki 9:26; Ps 9:12; Isa 26:21]), the Scriptures speak of the ne´phesh (soul) as being “in the blood.” (Ge 9:4; Le 17:11, 14; De 12:23) This is, obviously, not meant literally, inasmuch as the Scriptures also speak of the “blood of your souls” (Ge 9:5; compare Jer 2:34) and the many references already considered could not reasonably be applied solely to the blood or its life-supporting qualities.
Ne´phesh (soul) is not used with reference to the creation of vegetable life on the third creative “day” (Ge 1:11-13) or thereafter, since vegetation is bloodless.
Examples of the use of the Greek psy•khe´ to mean “life as a creature” may be found at Matthew 6:25; 10:39; 16:25, 26; Luke 12:20; John 10:11, 15; 13:37, 38; 15:13; Acts 20:10. Since God’s servants have the hope of a resurrection in the event of death, they have the hope of living again as “souls,” or living creatures.
For that reason Jesus could say that “whoever loses his soul [his life as a creature] for the sake of me and the good news will save it. Really, of what benefit is it for a man to gain the whole world and to forfeit his soul? What, really, would a man give in exchange for his soul?” (Mr 8:35-37) Similarly, he stated: “He that is fond of his soul destroys it, but he that hates his soul in this world will safeguard it for everlasting life.” (Joh 12:25)
These texts, and others like them, show the correct understanding of Jesus’ words at Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” While men can kill the body, they cannot kill the person for all time, inasmuch as he lives in God’s purpose (compare Lu 20:37, 38) and God can and will restore such faithful one to life as a creature by means of a resurrection. For God’s servants, the loss of their “soul,” or life as a creature, is only temporary, not permanent.—Compare Re 12:11.
Now, your other Question: Where does the Bible teach that God’s name is JEHOVAH ?
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dj_dave
Guest
Now, your other Question: Where does the Bible teach that God’s name is JEHOVAH ?
God’s name appears eight times in the original Ten Commandments. (Exodus 20:1-17) Thus God himself has revealed his name to man both verbally and in writing. So, what is that name?
In the Hebrew language it is written יהוה. These four letters, called the Tetragrammaton, are read from right to left in Hebrew and can be represented in many modern languages as YHWH or JHVH. God’s name, represented by these four consonants, appears almost 7,000 times in the original “Old Testament,” or Hebrew Scriptures.
The name is a form of a Hebrew verb ha•wah′ (הוה), meaning “to become,” and actually signifies “He Causes to Become.” Thus, God’s name identifies him as the One who progressively fulfills his promises and unfailingly realizes his purposes. Only the true God could bear such a meaningful name.
The truth is, nobody knows for sure how the name of God was originally pronounced. Why not? Well, as we all know, the first language used in writing the Bible was Hebrew, and when the Hebrew language was written down, the writers wrote only consonants—not vowels. Hence, when the inspired writers wrote God’s name, they naturally did the same thing and wrote only the consonants.
While ancient Hebrew was an everyday spoken language, this presented no problem. The pronunciation of the Name was familiar to the Israelites and when they saw it in writing they supplied the vowels without thinking (just as, for an English reader, the abbreviation “Ltd.” represents “Limited” and “bldg.” represents “building”).
Two things happened to change this situation. First, a superstitious idea arose among the Jews that it was wrong to say the divine name out loud; so when they came to it in their Bible reading they uttered the Hebrew word ’Adho•nai′ (“Sovereign Lord”). Further, as time went by, the ancient Hebrew language itself ceased to be spoken in everyday conversation, and in this way the original Hebrew pronunciation of God’s name was eventually forgotten.
In order to ensure that the pronunciation of the Hebrew language as a whole would not be lost, Jewish scholars of the second half of the first millennium C.E. invented a system of points to represent the missing vowels, and they placed these around the consonants in the Hebrew Bible. Thus, both vowels and consonants were written down, and the pronunciation as it was at that time was preserved.
When it came to God’s name, instead of putting the proper vowel signs around it, in most cases they put other vowel signs to remind the reader that he should say ’Adho•nai′. From this came the spelling Iehouah, and, eventually, Jehovah became the accepted pronunciation of the divine name in English. This retains the essential elements of God’s name from the Hebrew original.
Cont.
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dj_dave
Guest
Where, though, did pronunciations like Yahweh come from? These are forms that have been suggested by modern scholars trying to deduce the original pronunciation of God’s name. Some—though not all—feel that the Israelites before the time of Jesus probably pronounced God’s name Yahweh. But no one can be sure. Perhaps they pronounced it that way, perhaps not.
Nevertheless, many prefer the pronunciation Jehovah. Why? Because it has a currency and familiarity that Yahweh does not have. Would it not, though, be better to use the form that might be closer to the original pronunciation? Not really, for that is not the custom with Bible names.
To take the most prominent example, consider the name of Jesus. **Do you know how Jesus’ family and friends addressed him in day-to-day conversation while he was growing up in Nazareth? **The truth is, no human knows for certain, although it may have been something like Yeshua (or perhaps Yehoshua). It certainly was not Jesus.
However, when the accounts of his life were written in the Greek language, the inspired writers did not try to preserve that original Hebrew pronunciation. Rather, they rendered the name in Greek, I•e•sous′. Today, it is rendered differently according to the language of the reader of the Bible. Spanish Bible readers encounter Jesús (pronounced Hes•soos′). Italians spell it Gesù (pronounced Djay•zoo′). And Germans spell it Jesus (pronounced Yay′soos).
SHOULD we stop using the name of Jesus because most of us, or even all of us, do not really know its original pronunciation? So far, no translator has suggested this. We like to use the name, for it identifies the beloved Son of God, Jesus Christ, who gave his lifeblood for us. Would it be showing honor to Jesus to remove all mention of his name in the Bible and replace it with a mere title like “Teacher,” or “Mediator”? Of course not! We can relate to Jesus when we use his name the way it is commonly pronounced in our language.
Similar comments could be made regarding all the names we read in the Bible.
We pronounce them in our own language and do not try to imitate the original pronunciation. Thus we say “Jeremiah,” not Yir•meya′hu. Similarly we say Isaiah, although in his own day this prophet likely was known as Yesha‛•ya′hu. Even scholars who are aware of the original pronunciation of these names use the modern pronunciation, not the ancient, when speaking about them.
And the same is true with the name Jehovah. Even though the modern pronunciation Jehovah might not be exactly the way it was pronounced originally, this in no way detracts from the importance of the name. It identifies the Creator, the living God, the Most High to whom Jesus said: “Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.”—Matthew 6:9. See also, John 17:5,26
Gotta run.
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dj_dave
Guest
Javl; For instance John 1:1-3. The WTBTS says that Jesus is only a god. (This violates the first commandment. ) If you believe that the Word is Jesus, and that nothing was made that He didn’t make, then how could Jesus have made Himself? Also, have you read Isaih 44:24 ? What is your answer to that one?
. Who was with me?
(
That is a very good question…to answer this we MUST understand the context first
During the days of Isaiah, images are widely worshiped. In the chapter 44 of Isaiah’s prophetic book, how futile image worship is shown to be! Yet, God’s own people have fallen into the trap of worshiping idols. Hence, as seen in previous chapters of Isaiah, the Israelites are in line for strong discipline.
Lovingly, though, Jehovah offers the nation reassurance that although he will allow the Babylonians to take his people into captivity, he will deliver them in his own due time. The fulfillment of the prophecies of deliverance from captivity and of restoration of pure worship will prove beyond doubt that Jehovah alone is the true God, to the shame of all who worship the lifeless gods of the nations.
**
Your reasoning in asking about Isa. 44:24 is in error due to the fact of what is written at Job 38:3-7) …Gird up your loins, please, like an able-bodied man, And let me question you, and you inform me. 4 Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. 5 Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? 6 Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?
The whole point about Isaiah mentioning vs 24 is to show how the True God is completely real as opposed to the false god’s of Isaiah’s day**
Notice how Chapter 44 begins on a positive note with a reminder that Israel has been chosen by God, separated from the surrounding nations to become his servant. The prophecy says: “Now listen, O Jacob my servant, and you, O Israel, whom I have chosen. This is what Jehovah has said, your Maker and your Former, who kept helping you even from the belly, ‘Do not be afraid, O my servant Jacob, and you, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.’” (Isaiah 44:1, 2) Jehovah has cared for Israel from its mother’s womb, as it were, ever since Israel became a nation after coming out of Egypt. He calls his people collectively “Jeshurun,” meaning “Upright One,” a title expressing affection and tenderness. The name is also a reminder that the Israelites must remain upright, which they have often failed to do.
Under the Mosaic Law, a repurchaser—normally a male next of kin—could buy a person out of bondage. (Leviticus 25:47-54; Ruth 2:20) Jehovah now identifies himself as Israel’s Repurchaser—the one who will redeem the nation, to the embarrassment of Babylon and all her gods. (Jeremiah 50:34) He confronts the false gods and their worshipers, saying:”—Isaiah 44:6-8.
Jehovah challenges the gods to present their case. Can they call the things that are not as if they are, predicting future events with such accuracy that it appears as if they are already happening? Only ‘the first and the last,’ who existed before all the false gods were thought of and will still be there when they are long forgotten, can do such a thing. His people need not fear to bear witness to this truth, since they have the support of Jehovah, who is as firm and stable as a massive rock!—Deuteronomy 32:4; 2 Samuel 22:31, 32.
Jehovah’s challenge to the false gods brings to mind the second of the Ten Commandments. That commandment clearly stated: “You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or that is on the earth underneath or that is in the waters under the earth. You must not bow down to them nor be induced to serve them.” (Exodus 20:4, 5)
Your question is answered in context of Isaiah’s proclamation and WHY he has been sent to give it.
Jehovah now brings his legal argument to a powerful climax. He is about to present his own answer to the severest test of Godship—the ability to foretell the future accurately.
(Isaiah 44:25-28) 25*** frustrating the signs of the empty talkers, and * the One **that makes diviners themselves act crazily; the One turning wise men backwards, and the One that turns even their knowledge into foolishness; 26 the One making the word of his servant come true, and the One that carries out completely the counsel of his own messengers; the One saying of Jerusalem, ‘She will be inhabited,’ and of the cities of Judah, ‘They will be rebuilt, and her desolated places I shall raise up’; 27 the One saying to the watery deep, ‘Be evaporated; and all your rivers I shall dry up’; 28 the One saying of Cyrus, ‘He is my shepherd, and all that I delight in he will completely carry out’; even in [my] saying of Jerusalem, ‘She will be rebuilt,’ and of the temple, ‘You will have your foundation laid.’”
Now, your next question…"If you believe that the Word is Jesus, and that nothing was made that He didn’t make, then how could Jesus have made Himself? Cont.*
. Who was with me?
(
That is a very good question…to answer this we MUST understand the context first
During the days of Isaiah, images are widely worshiped. In the chapter 44 of Isaiah’s prophetic book, how futile image worship is shown to be! Yet, God’s own people have fallen into the trap of worshiping idols. Hence, as seen in previous chapters of Isaiah, the Israelites are in line for strong discipline.
Lovingly, though, Jehovah offers the nation reassurance that although he will allow the Babylonians to take his people into captivity, he will deliver them in his own due time. The fulfillment of the prophecies of deliverance from captivity and of restoration of pure worship will prove beyond doubt that Jehovah alone is the true God, to the shame of all who worship the lifeless gods of the nations.
**
Your reasoning in asking about Isa. 44:24 is in error due to the fact of what is written at Job 38:3-7) …Gird up your loins, please, like an able-bodied man, And let me question you, and you inform me. 4 Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. 5 Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? 6 Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?
The whole point about Isaiah mentioning vs 24 is to show how the True God is completely real as opposed to the false god’s of Isaiah’s day**
Notice how Chapter 44 begins on a positive note with a reminder that Israel has been chosen by God, separated from the surrounding nations to become his servant. The prophecy says: “Now listen, O Jacob my servant, and you, O Israel, whom I have chosen. This is what Jehovah has said, your Maker and your Former, who kept helping you even from the belly, ‘Do not be afraid, O my servant Jacob, and you, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.’” (Isaiah 44:1, 2) Jehovah has cared for Israel from its mother’s womb, as it were, ever since Israel became a nation after coming out of Egypt. He calls his people collectively “Jeshurun,” meaning “Upright One,” a title expressing affection and tenderness. The name is also a reminder that the Israelites must remain upright, which they have often failed to do.
Under the Mosaic Law, a repurchaser—normally a male next of kin—could buy a person out of bondage. (Leviticus 25:47-54; Ruth 2:20) Jehovah now identifies himself as Israel’s Repurchaser—the one who will redeem the nation, to the embarrassment of Babylon and all her gods. (Jeremiah 50:34) He confronts the false gods and their worshipers, saying:”—Isaiah 44:6-8.
Jehovah challenges the gods to present their case. Can they call the things that are not as if they are, predicting future events with such accuracy that it appears as if they are already happening? Only ‘the first and the last,’ who existed before all the false gods were thought of and will still be there when they are long forgotten, can do such a thing. His people need not fear to bear witness to this truth, since they have the support of Jehovah, who is as firm and stable as a massive rock!—Deuteronomy 32:4; 2 Samuel 22:31, 32.
Jehovah’s challenge to the false gods brings to mind the second of the Ten Commandments. That commandment clearly stated: “You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or that is on the earth underneath or that is in the waters under the earth. You must not bow down to them nor be induced to serve them.” (Exodus 20:4, 5)
Your question is answered in context of Isaiah’s proclamation and WHY he has been sent to give it.
Jehovah now brings his legal argument to a powerful climax. He is about to present his own answer to the severest test of Godship—the ability to foretell the future accurately.
(Isaiah 44:25-28) 25*** frustrating the signs of the empty talkers, and * the One **that makes diviners themselves act crazily; the One turning wise men backwards, and the One that turns even their knowledge into foolishness; 26 the One making the word of his servant come true, and the One that carries out completely the counsel of his own messengers; the One saying of Jerusalem, ‘She will be inhabited,’ and of the cities of Judah, ‘They will be rebuilt, and her desolated places I shall raise up’; 27 the One saying to the watery deep, ‘Be evaporated; and all your rivers I shall dry up’; 28 the One saying of Cyrus, ‘He is my shepherd, and all that I delight in he will completely carry out’; even in [my] saying of Jerusalem, ‘She will be rebuilt,’ and of the temple, ‘You will have your foundation laid.’”
Now, your next question…"If you believe that the Word is Jesus, and that nothing was made that He didn’t make, then how could Jesus have made Himself? Cont.*
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