KJV only Baptist tried to save my soul today

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So this was interesting – I am at work and this co-worker whom everyone knows because of his strong belief in KJV Baptist evangelization says he needs to ask me a question that he has been meaning to ask for a while. I see he is on his way out the door, but on his desk he has a New testament and his phone with several scriptures on it.

So he starts leading up to it --and i interrupt and say are you going to ask me if I’m “saved”. And he says well yeah are you saved? I say yes I believe so…i believe I’m saved and as St. Paul says I’m being saved. It’s a process.

Then he starts in with the “how do you get saved” stuff. And I say well, you trust in the Lord first and foremost. And before I can get to anything else he wants to know If I think I have to do anything to get saved. And I say no, you trust in the Lord but after your conversion things are expected of you, like works. Then he goes on about the thief on the cross and i said yes, he had perfect contrition. His heart was contrite and no works were necessary for him. Jesus gives us a clean robe when we get “saved” whether you believe that happens at Baptism or asking Jesus as your Lord and savior is irrelevant. We are expected to try and keep our robes clean. Then he goes on about us not being able to keep the commandments and do I think we can keep them. I say no, not perfectly because of our sin nature but we are expected to try and keep them and try and get better and to say otherwise is just laziness.

So we go around in circles and shows me John 10, the famous verse OSAS believers love to quote…nobody can pluck them from my Father’s hand. He really thinks he’s got me on that one. I said yes but that doesn’t say you cant jump out of the Father’s hand yourself. Just means no other person can affect your own salvation which is between you and God.

The conversation lasted about 15 minutes. He seemed offended some that I said I was a protestant Christian like you for many years and in my examination of Church history, the Church has always been more Catholic/Orthodox than it was protestant. I am a Catholic convert who once believed more like you do. He says I am not a protestant Christian. We come from the anabaptist who always existed. He says there has always been a group of Christians who believed like him since the early Church. I said oh really, is there any historical evidence of that? He says yes I just saw a video about it last week. I said ok can you show me like one of their church buildings from the 8th century or something? Because according to what I have seen anabaptist started emerging in the 14th century at the earliest(probably more like 16th) —silence–

part 1
 
All in all the conversation comes to a standstill because I’m not a ignorant, sitting duck Catholic who doesn’t know my faith. I told him I usually don’t do this stuff at work because things can get kinda ugly but offered to sit down with him sometime outside of work and show him other scriptures besides what he quoted --and right away he cuts me off and it says if the scriptures say anything to do with works he wont even entertain it lol. What’s funny is while quoting scripture he says this is not about interpretation. But in actuality it is -his vs mine. Because the bible consists of many verse and you cant make doctrines out of a few verses and ignore a whole host of others. And that is exactly what they do.

Anyone else ever experience these KJV only guys? BTW, he gave me his card and his church is linked to the infamous Steven Anderson, the notorious Catholic basher.
 
I have family members who read the KJV, but none of them were evangelicals or would hassle someone at work about the Bible.

I’m glad you were able to practice your apologetics on this person, but I don’t think he should be bringing this up at work.
 
Thank you both. I also feel it is a tad inappropriate to proselytize at work. People have been asking me for months if he has attempted to ‘share the gospel’ with me yet – so I have been sort of expecting it.

He does not want to meet up and discuss it further, of course. But gives me his card of his Church and tells me to watch his pastor’s youtube videos. Initially i just threw it in the trash – then i subsequently pulled it out and wrote down 4 scripture passages on it that refute OSAS and his theology, imo. I am placing it somewhere where i know he will see it.

From there, I’m leaving it alone unless he continues. It seems his objective is to “soul win” and get you into his KJVO Church. And if he cant convince you maybe his pastor and Church elders can gang up on you and get the job done.

Normally, I wouldn’t even do all that, but keep in mind he is affiliated with this bigoted man, Steven Anderson, who takes every opportunity he can to jab the Catholic Church. For those of you who are not familiar, this is his cult leader. His church branched out from the Faithful Word baptist:
 
Lenten_ashes said:
Anyone else ever experience these KJV only guys? BTW, he gave me his card and his church is linked to the infamous Steven Anderson, the notorious Catholic basher.
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Tell him, God opening up Heaven for mankind was a free gift, but your level of glory in Heaven is determined by your good works.
 
I think the argument that there have been continual expressions of belief over the century that coincide with some protestant beliefs has something going for it. Many ‘heresies’, early and later, had beliefs that coincided with modern protestant beliefs. In general these heresies were terminated by physical oppression by state forces allied with the Catholic Church. This is not an argument about the persistence of the Church as an institution but given the Church’s actions, and recent relevant papal apologies, it seems to me good that Catholics acknowledge some of this in discussions with other Christians.
 
No doubt there have been heretics since the book of ACTS, imo.

But this idea that there was this subdued group of Baptists hiding out in caves – who actually originated from John the Baptist— and preserved ‘true Christianity’ despite Rome (and it’s supposed insidious Pope) for 1500 years is utterly absurd to me and has no historical backing.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
No doubt there have been heretics since the book of ACTS, imo.

But this idea that there was this subdued group of Baptists hiding out in caves – who actually originated from John the Baptist— and preserved ‘true Christianity’ despite Rome (and it’s supposed insidious Pope) for 1500 years is utterly absurd to me and has no historical backing.
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Clearly not. But the continual appearance of similar ideas should be accepted and noted as giving strength to their argument. They do not claim some form of apostolic succession, and it does not promote rational debate to argue from that point of view. They claim the continual working of the Holy Spirit.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
I also feel it is a tad inappropriate to proselytize at work
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More than “a tad.” Possibly a violation of company policy. And if you’re in the U.S., someone could file a complaint against him for creating a hostile work environment.
If he tries again, I’d tell him so.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
I said oh really, is there any historical evidence of that? He says yes I just saw a video about it last week.
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I’m happy to say that nothing like this has ever happened to me. Hare Krishnas at the traffic lights once or twice, back in the days, but nothing worse than that. In this case, I’d be tempted to say something like, “Well, as soon as you find documentary evidence of that dating back to the reign of Constantine or earlier, come and show me, and we’ll talk about it. But not until then, okay?”
 
I think you did very well, Lenten Ashes. As a few others have mentioned, the only advice I would give is to not engage in these discussions at work but offer — as you did — to discuss outside of work, if he is really interested. I once had a zealous coworker who was always trying to evangelize others in the company break room. Only problem was sometimes he lost track of time and went way over his allotted break time while “witnessing” and got into trouble with his supervisor, which wasn’t a good witness to his faith or Christianity as a whole, and also got others in trouble who were the subjects of his conversion efforts.
 
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Tell him ‘Well if you’re right, I’m saved from when I was a Protestant anyway. And joining the Catholic Church can’t pluck me out of Gods hand’.
 
The problem is, these guys are so rigid that they believe a lot of Protestants are also going to hell – especially those who use NIV bibles because they contain deleted verses.
 
Thanks Tommy.

I think it’s great he wants to tell people about Jesus so I don’t want to steal his thunder. Everyone needs Jesus.

But yeah, these are discussions they can get us both in trouble for obvious reasons at work.
 
I’ve dealt with a similar situation, not with a co worker, but with a very good friend. One comment by him turned into a debate that lasted over two years. The great thing about it, I learned more history than I’d ever imagine I would, but even greater, I read more Scripture than ever before as well. Here is my absolute favorite OSAS myth buster…

James 5:19-20 “My brethren, if any one among you wanders from the truth and some one brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.”

Hmmm, no doubt about what this Scripture tells us. You should ask him if a person in the truth is saved, when he says “yes,” then ask what happens when the person in the truth falls into sin and wanders from the truth. There is no escape from this passage. Both parties were in the truth, aka believers in Christ. By false Baptist standards they should have both already been saved once and for all, yet this passage makes it clear a person can fall away from the truth through sin. It also makes it clear that a soul can be saved from death by works, the work of bringing a person back from sin.

The Gospel is not one verse of Scripture, it’s ALL if it, if the Word of God is truth, and it is, then this Scripture passage annihilates OSAS, because how can a person be in the truth without accepting Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior? And if they are already saved, how can they be brought back and the soul be saved from death a second time. It’s wonderful to be a Catholic I tell you, where we have the fullness of truth and do not have to dance around Scripture!!!
 
That’s a excellent OSAS busting passage that I had forgotten about. Thanks.

I did point out something about that – backsliders living in sin as clear as day and claim to be believers. He points out King David doing horrible stuff and still being saved.

I sorta subscribe to the Mere Christianity movement. If you can read and affirm the ancient creeds then you are a Christian. So I feel like I can talk to anyone from any denomination or branch. The key is to be respectful because faith is precious to people.

The problem is that this particular group is very rigid. KJVO is their thing and apparently everybody went to hell before the KJV bible existed or something. And you click on their website and it’s Church members holding guns and stuff. This just does not look like anything but a dangerous cult to me.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
Anyone else ever experience these KJV only guys?
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Not KJV only, but I have plenty of anti-Catholic relatives who have tried to convince me of one thing or another. If they want a serious conversation, they will get one from me, but I find they just want to bash Catholics and don’t tolerate any push back.
 
Fortunately, this kind of thing is rare here in the UK. No one at work has every tried to proselytise me. I do know of two men at work who belong to Evangelical Christian ecclesial communities but am not aware of them ever trying to proselytise. I do know one liked to ask interview candidates for roles in our biology department what their views on evolution were. He was instructed to stop doing this.

I fail to understand that Protestant belief that all we need to do is be saved. I know they get confused and think we can achieve our salvation simply be doing pious things. However, why do not comprehend their view you simply have to accept Jesus into your life. Surely, once you do this you need to work at your salvation.
 
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