Lawyer set to challenge Vatican status

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Lawyer set to challenge Vatican status

By NICOLE WINFIELD
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/dayart/aponline/41822.11VATICAN-POPE-SUED.sff.jpg Daniel Shea, a US lawyer from Houston,who is suing Pope Benedict XVI in Texas for allegedly covering up the sexual abuse of children by a seminarian, attends a press conference in Rome, Wednesday, Aug. 17, 2005. Shea said he would challenge the US diplomatic recognition of the Vatican if the pope is given immunity in the case. (AP Photo/Alessandra Tarantino)

ROME – The lawyer who is suing Pope Benedict XVI in Texas for allegedly covering up the sexual abuse of children by a seminarian said Wednesday he would challenge the U.S. diplomatic recognition of the Vatican if the pope is given immunity in the case.

The pope’s lawyers have already asked President Bush to certify Benedict’s immunity from liability in the civil lawsuit since he is a head of state - the Vatican city-state.

Attorney Daniel Shea, who is representing one of three boys suing the pope, told a news conference Wednesday that Bush could abstain from confirming Benedict’s immunity. In that case, the judge handling the case, Judge Lee Rosenthal of the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Texas in Houston, would decide how to proceed, he said.

But if Bush grants the immunity, Shea said he would challenge the constitutionality of the U.S. diplomatic recognition of the Holy See as a sovereign state on First Amendment grounds.

“The Holy See is a church,” Shea said.

Joseph Ratzinger - Benedict’s former name - is named as a defendant in the civil lawsuit, accused of conspiring with the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston to cover up the abuse of three boys during the mid-1990s. The suit is seeking unspecified monetary damages.

The three boys, identified in court documents as John Does I, II and III, allege that a Colombian-born seminarian on assignment at St. Francis de Sales church in Houston, Juan Carlos Patino-Arango, molested them during counseling sessions in the church in the mid-1990s.

Patino-Arango has been indicted in a criminal case by a Harris County, Texas, grand jury and is a fugitive from justice, the lawsuit says.

Shea has argued in civil court documents that a May 18, 2001, letter Ratzinger wrote to bishops around the world was evidence that he was involved in a conspiracy to hide Patino-Arango’s crimes and to help him escape prosecution.

The letter, written when Ratzinger was still prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, explains that “grave” crimes such as the sexual abuse of minors would be handled by his congregation and that the proceedings of special church tribunals handling the cases were subject to “pontifical secret.”

While international experts say the pope can certainly claim immunity in the case and that ultimately Shea’s suit won’t succeed, lawyers for church sex abuse victims say the case is significant because it has gone further than other recent attempts to implicate the Vatican and high-ranking church officials in the sex scandal.

Shea acknowledged that a previous court challenge to the U.S. diplomatic recognition of the Holy See failed, but said it was because the plaintiffs - a lobbying group seeking further separation of church and state - didn’t have standing, meaning they weren’t affected by the issue.

“John Doe I, II and III have got standing and then some,” he said.

He said Bush may also choose to abstain from the case because of the political implications it may have.

“The Evangelical community has been horrified at what they’ve seen in these cases, and I don’t think his political base can stand him in effect providing cover for Ratzinger. But that’s a political question,” he said.

The State Department has said the pope already is considered a head of state and automatically has diplomatic immunity. Spokeswoman Gerry Keener said Tuesday that Benedict doesn’t have to ask for immunity and Bush doesn’t have to grant it.

The Vatican spokesman and Ratzinger’s lawyers have declined to comment on the case.

seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/apeurope_story.asp?category=1103&slug=Vatican%20Pope%20Sued
 
how low will some of your country men stoop for a dollar? this makes you look terrible in the international community, if he wins his bid to sue the pope and challenge the vatican status then you will be the most reviled nation on earth, i sometimes wonder with these massive lawsuits that your god is not the dollar
 
This lawyer is lookig for the deepest pockets to sue. The Vatican is a sovereign state its form of govt. is irelevant. The Pope as its sovereign has diplomatic immunity.THats it.
 
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cainem:
how low will some of your country men stoop for a dollar? this makes you look terrible in the international community, if he wins his bid to sue the pope and challenge the vatican status then you will be the most reviled nation on earth, i sometimes wonder with these massive lawsuits that your god is not the dollar
There’s plenty who hate us already. Perhaps it will cause some sympathy for the Vatican in Europe and more will listen to it.
 
He is a lawyer and suppose to follow the law. If he wants to take away the diplomatic recognition of the Vatican, then he ought to run for elected office and try to change US policy.

Other than that, his motives are both political, financial, and probably anti-Catholic.

How about removing our diplomatic recognition of the United Kingdom? The head of state there is the head of the Church of England (official title: “Supreme Governor of the Church of England”).

None of what he wants has any standing in current law.
 
I love the United Kingdom. If Bush does nothing to help the Pontiff, I am 100% sure of my decision to immigrate to the UK.

God Save the Queen! Long Live the Pope! Call a Crusade, Benedict!
 
There have been too many scandals in the Church these days. Newsweek magazine had an article about a boy who committed suicide and later on the newspapers reported that this was not an isolated case. There was a Catholic priest from the Boston area who was offering encouragement and support to an organisation called the North American Man Boy Love Association. He remained a priest for several years until finally he was locked up as a child pervert. According to a book by Michael Rose, the seminaries are filled with homosexuals. There was a seminary in Austria in the news where scandals broke out, and the head of the seminary said it was a joke. Some people who have been hurt don’t think that these things are jokes and want to be taken seriously.
 
This is not the first time radically dissident “Catholics” have attempted to undermine the international legal status of the Holy See. The last attempt was made by the bogus group, “Catholics” for a Free Choice, when in 1999, they launched a postcard campaign to have the Holy See delegation ousted from the UN. The presence and prestige of the Vatican diplomatic corps at international conferences such as those on population at Cairo and Beijing have long been a thorn in the side of groups working to promote abortion and sterilization.

lifesite.net/ldn/2005/aug/05081906.html
 
Just another reason why Catholics need to stand up against judicial tyranny, the ACLU, and money-hungry lawyers.
 
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stanley123:
There have been too many scandals in the Church these days. Newsweek magazine had an article about a boy who committed suicide and later on the newspapers reported that this was not an isolated case. There was a Catholic priest from the Boston area who was offering encouragement and support to an organisation called the North American Man Boy Love Association. He remained a priest for several years until finally he was locked up as a child pervert. According to a book by Michael Rose, the seminaries are filled with homosexuals. There was a seminary in Austria in the news where scandals broke out, and the head of the seminary said it was a joke. Some people who have been hurt don’t think that these things are jokes and want to be taken seriously.
You must find it very strange the the Church is actually made up of sinful men, we are all sinful men.

As for the Rose book. That seems to be Gospel of those who love to attack the Church. It is not a scholarly work, it is at best a journalist look at a handful of seminaries using very anecdotal infromation from ex-seminarians who either left or were asked to leave.

In one of the cases I know a priest who attended one of the seminaries in question and he disputes what Rose wrote about.

None of this changes the fact Vatican City is a sovereign nation that the Holy Father is the Head of State for.
 
The devil will stop at nothing to undermine the Church. All the more reason to pray for Mary’s intercession.
 
I do not know who the Mr. Shea is - but I believe this is nothing more than a way for him to get a little free publicity. This will go nowhere. His 15 minutes will be up soon.
 
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cainem:
how low will some of your country men stoop for a dollar? this makes you look terrible in the international community, if he wins his bid to sue the pope and challenge the vatican status then you will be the most reviled nation on earth, i sometimes wonder with these massive lawsuits that your god is not the dollar
I agree that some Americans really embarass me. I don’t understand how getting a big, fat check will help heal the wounds of abuse.
 
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ByzCath:
As for the Rose book. That seems to be Gospel of those who love to attack the Church. It is not a scholarly work, it is at best a journalist look at a handful of seminaries using very anecdotal infromation from ex-seminarians who either left or were asked to leave.

In one of the cases I know a priest who attended one of the seminaries in question and he disputes what Rose wrote about.
And what does this priest dispute? And what other evidence do you have that refutes anything that Rose documents? And do you really disbelieve that seminarians were not kicked out/kept out of seminaries and/or persecuted by pro-homosexual priests?
 
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ByzCath:
You must find it very strange the the Church is actually made up of sinful men, we are all sinful men.
.
Should people be held accountable for their actions, or can we simply blame them on society, the culture, the movies, best selling novels, etc. The point here is that if a priest is going to offer support and encourgement to organisations such as the North American Man Boy Love Association, and then turn around and have sex with young boys on Church properties, then that priest should be held accountable for these crimes and not simply transferred from Boston to San Bernadino. How many years was it, before these outrageous activities were finally put to a stop? And how many lives were ruined in the process? And, by the way was this an isolated case? I read that there was an individual in LA who protested the 172 suicides that have taken place because of child molesting by Catholic priests, but that Cardinal Mahony called the plice to have him taken away and locked up for demonstrating in favor of these innocent victims. In my personal opinion, it is a good idea to protect innocent children from sexual predators, and not go around whining about how sinful we all are. Yes, I do find it very strange that people are going around whining about how sinful we all are, while at the same time locking people up who are trying to protect innocent children from perverts.
 
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UtahMaggie:
I agree that some Americans really embarass me. I don’t understand how getting a big, fat check will help heal the wounds of abuse.
Most lawsuits of this type (not ones where the only money asked for is to pay for medical bills, or compensation of wages, or the cost of damages) are nothing more than revenge. Only one thing can heal the wounds of abuse- forgiveness.
 
I wonder what would happen if every person using Microsoft Windows that experienced a virus on the computer sued Bill Gates? After all, isn’t Gates personally responsible for creating the operating system that had vulnerable points which led to a virus.

Maybe we can sue those politicians that we didn’t personally vote for, and those judges we had no say in appointing, that have enacted policies which we find offensive and that hinder our right to the “pursuit of happiness?”

When will this all end? I know…when dirt is thrown upon the coffin of the last spoiled rotten liberal activist baby-boomer ever to live.

Come quickly Lord Jesus!
 
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Brad:
And what does this priest dispute? And what other evidence do you have that refutes anything that Rose documents? And do you really disbelieve that seminarians were not kicked out/kept out of seminaries and/or persecuted by pro-homosexual priests?
This priest, who was a seminarian at one of the seminaries that Rose talks about says that nothing covered in the book happened.

Do you have any evidence to prove what is in the book?

Someone who is asked to leave the seminary may be someone who the seminary and bishop have decided are not right for the priesthood.

I would also say that when you only take reports from possibly disgruntled individuals with an axe to grind you may not get the truth but then when the reports are very sensational, as these are, more people are apt to believe them. Heck we all know that most priests and bishops are gay don’t we. At least that seems to be the view of many people out there today.

(of topic) Which is why many men are not answering the call today. (back to the topic)
 
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ByzCath:
Do you have any evidence to prove what is in the book?

Someone who is asked to leave the seminary may be someone who the seminary and bishop have decided are not right for the priesthood.
)
The scandals are in the news. For example, in todays news:
clarin.com/diario/2005/08/20/sociedad/s-05801.htm
If these stories are not true, then why is this bishop resigning?
"Un nuevo escándalo sexual salpica a la Iglesia. A menos de tres años de que el arzobispo de Santa Fe, monseñor Edgardo Storni, renunciara ante las acusaciones de haber acosado sexualmente a un seminarista, el obispo de Santiago del Estero, monseñor Juan Carlos Maccarone, dimitió luego de haber admitido ante sus superiores una relación homosexual con un joven mayor de edad."
 
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