LDS Marriage

[Truth_Faith13]

Hubbie is an atheist. I converted years after we were married.

My hubby is an atheist too! Were you LDS when you married or was that in the gap between leaving the Church and becoming Catholic?

Oh and Im sorry for your loss!!

Ive been thinking about my brothers friend who was killed in a head on collision with a Lorry on Sunday. He was 19years old certainly makes you think!

 

[Truth_Faith13]

I know, it’s completely illogical. I knew you weren’t trying to get the upper hand in anything. Your posts are always informative and convey your knowledge of both the Catholic Church and the LDS.

I’m not married and haven’t been for 25+ years and the idea that I have zero ability to go to heaven without a human man to take me there is beyond comprehension. I truly have to wonder how young women who are not married yet, or maybe left by an abusive or indifferent husband deal with this issue. Like you, I see nothing loving or honoring toward women in this view.

The LDS believe that a single person CAN go to heaven (ie be saved), its exaltation marriage is required for and I know it doesnt change the meaning but its the same for a man…they have to be married too so Im struggling to see it as an abuse against women who need a man. The men need a woman!

 

[Marie5890]

I’m just going to say, for the record, that one of my uncles died this morning. That dread alzheimers. My aunts and uncles are numerous, coming from a large Mormon family. This is the third death this year of an aunt or uncle. The old folks are dying off.

The mere idea, that any one of them might have the possibility of having to make a choice to leave their beloved for another, is not helpful at these kind of moments.

I hope they are all in heaven, and believe they lived good lives, served others with love and devotion to God. I pray for their souls and the Church that is my adopted home, prays with me.

God is merciful.

Prayers for the repose of his soul, and peace to your entire family
My step-father died of Alzheimers. Back in Jan '14. And I just lost my mother end of Sept. She had missed him so much. The idea of them being together again is something that makes my sister and I smile thru our tears of grief.

The idea of having to be sealed to be a “family forever” is what lead me out of Mormonism. It flies in the face of God’s love and mercy. It’s so…clinical, legalistic.

 

[Marie5890]

My hubby is an atheist too! Were you LDS when you married or was that in the gap between leaving the Church and becoming Catholic?

Oh and Im sorry for your loss!!

Ive been thinking about my brothers friend who was killed in a head on collision with a Lorry on Sunday. He was 19years old certainly makes you think!

Praying for your brother’s friend. SO very young. God’s peace to his family and friends.

 

[Horton]

The LDS believe that a single person CAN go to heaven (ie be saved), its exaltation marriage is required for and I know it doesnt change the meaning but its the same for a man…they have to be married too so Im struggling to see it as an abuse against women who need a man. The men need a woman!

With this whole layered system idea of heaven the LDS have portrayed there is lack of care or concern for women generally.

This is how it looks to many non-LDS. A woman is unable to be exalted, that is for men alone. Therefore a woman must either be married to an exalted man, or ditch the unexalted husband she has to go off with one who is exalted.

Here is a scenario: A couple are married in the temple and have children. The husband appears outwardly to be a good & faithful Mormon. However in the home he less than a perfect man. He is abusive to his wife & children, he withdraws care from them, and often leaves his wife to run around. All the while he is keeping a good appearance for the church, pays his 10%, goes to the temple, serves as a leader in services, all the things to make him appear to be a good man and keep his place.

His wife decides she can’t take it anymore and gets a divorce. Now she is stuck. She is sealed to this man who the LDS leaders believe to be perfect and in good standing, well on his way to being exalted. She wants the marriage unsealed but is refused because women just can’t get that done. He remarries and is sealed to another woman.

Now this wife is a true believer. She absolutely believes that she needs to be married to an exalted man to be in the highest layer. She knows her kids will go to her husband at that layer. She can’t remarry to a good man and be sealed to him as a woman can not be sealed to two men at a time, only men can be sealed to more than one partner.

So what is her fate?

 

[zaffiroborant]

The LDS believe that a single person CAN go to heaven (ie be saved), its exaltation marriage is required for and I know it doesnt change the meaning but its the same for a man…they have to be married too so Im struggling to see it as an abuse against women who need a man. The men need a woman!

I disagree that the so called lower kingdoms are heaven in any real sense. They strike me as something more akin to limbo than heaven. How can it be called “saved” when God the Father is not present and wants nothing to do with you, when your loved ones are not there?

 

[jane_doe]

I disagree that the so called lower kingdoms are heaven in any real sense. They strike me as something more akin to limbo than heaven. How can it be called “saved” when God the Father is not present and wants nothing to do with you, when your loved ones are not there?

The telestrail kingdom is happiness beyond imagination for eternity, hanging out with the Holy Spirit. The terrestrial kingdom is happiness beyond beyond imagination for eternity, hanging out with the Holy Spirit & Christ. Yes, loved ones will be there, but as singles, not families. That doesn’t sound nice?

How can it be called “saved” when God the Father… wants nothing to do with you, when your loved ones are not there?

This is not LDS theology.

 

[zaffiroborant]

With this whole layered system idea of heaven the LDS have portrayed there is lack of care or concern for women generally.

This is how it looks to many non-LDS. A woman is unable to be exalted, that is for men alone. Therefore a woman must either be married to an exalted man, or ditch the unexalted husband she has to go off with one who is exalted.

Here is a scenario: A couple are married in the temple and have children. The husband appears outwardly to be a good & faithful Mormon. However in the home he less than a perfect man. He is abusive to his wife & children, he withdraws care from them, and often leaves his wife to run around. All the while he is keeping a good appearance for the church, pays his 10%, goes to the temple, serves as a leader in services, all the things to make him appear to be a good man and keep his place.

His wife decides she can’t take it anymore and gets a divorce. Now she is stuck. She is sealed to this man who the LDS leaders believe to be perfect and in good standing, well on his way to being exalted. She wants the marriage unsealed but is refused because women just can’t get that done. He remarries and is sealed to another woman.

Now this wife is a true believer. She absolutely believes that she needs to be married to an exalted man to be in the highest layer. She knows her kids will go to her husband at that layer. She can’t remarry to a good man and be sealed to him as a woman can not be sealed to two men at a time, only men can be sealed to more than one partner.

So what is her fate?

And that of her children?

Another scenario, a woman is married to a good man one she loves dearly, they have a couple/few kids and 11 years after the wedding the husband is killed. She later remarries to another good man and like her first husband cherishes and loves him dearly. The woman and her second husband have a couple/few kids and live out their lives together. Why should she have to choose one of the men she loves for eternity, and since children in the LDS church are NOT sealed to a parent but to a parent couple which dad loses their children to the other?

 

[zaffiroborant]

The telestrail kingdom is happiness beyond imagination for eternity, hanging out with the Holy Spirit. The terrestrial kingdom is happiness beyond beyond imagination for eternity, hanging out with the Holy Spirit & Christ. Yes, loved ones will be there, but as singles, not families. That doesn’t sound nice?

Sounds like limbo and it doesn’t include those in the other “kingdoms” so just some of your loved ones will be there.

This is not LDS theology.

Lower kingdoms no God the Father, no people from the other kingdoms.

 

[Stephen168]

Lower kingdoms no God the Father, no people from the other kingdoms.

This is heaven in Mormon theology?

 

[RebeccaJ]

My hubby is an atheist too! Were you LDS when you married or was that in the gap between leaving the Church and becoming Catholic?

Oh and Im sorry for your loss!!

Ive been thinking about my brothers friend who was killed in a head on collision with a Lorry on Sunday. He was 19years old certainly makes you think!

So sad and so young. I’m sorry for the loss of a friend.

I was attending Mormon sacrament meeting at the time we married, for the sake of my parents (they asked me to). After we were married, and we moved into a new place, I stopped all contact with the Mormon church. Though, for a decade or so they sent visiting teachers around now and then. I never resigned, as people do today, because such a thing was unknown to me. By the time I heard about resigning, I figured, what’s the point of jumping through the hoops of an organization that I have had nothing to do with for so many years? Which means I’m still counted on their roles as a “member”.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Prayers for the repose of his soul, and peace to your entire family
My step-father died of Alzheimers. Back in Jan '14. And I just lost my mother end of Sept. She had missed him so much. The idea of them being together again is something that makes my sister and I smile thru our tears of grief.

The idea of having to be sealed to be a “family forever” is what lead me out of Mormonism. It flies in the face of God’s love and mercy. It’s so…clinical, legalistic.

Thank you.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I disagree that the so called lower kingdoms are heaven in any real sense. They strike me as something more akin to limbo than heaven. How can it be called “saved” when God the Father is not present and wants nothing to do with you, when your loved ones are not there?

This also to me is a division of the Holy Trinity, into having three designs rather the one of unity of purpose.

 

[RebeccaJ]

And that of her children?

Another scenario, a woman is married to a good man one she loves dearly, they have a couple/few kids and 11 years after the wedding the husband is killed. She later remarries to another good man and like her first husband cherishes and loves him dearly. The woman and her second husband have a couple/few kids and live out their lives together. Why should she have to choose one of the men she loves for eternity, and since children in the LDS church are NOT sealed to a parent but to a parent couple which dad loses their children to the other?

The children must also choose who to be sealed to.

In real life, this life, I know adult children who have chosen to be sealed to their step-parent, because of the mere fact the step-parent are active LDS and their own parent is not.

 

[Son_of_Niall]

The terrestrial kingdom is happiness beyond beyond imagination for eternity, hanging out with the Holy Spirit & Christ. Yes, loved ones will be there, but as singles, not families. That doesn’t sound nice?

This is not LDS theology.

“Hanging out” with the Holy Spirit and Jesus?
Your idea of Heaven is “hanging out”?
Seriously?

 

[Horton]

And that of her children?

Another scenario, a woman is married to a good man one she loves dearly, they have a couple/few kids and 11 years after the wedding the husband is killed. She later remarries to another good man and like her first husband cherishes and loves him dearly. The woman and her second husband have a couple/few kids and live out their lives together. Why should she have to choose one of the men she loves for eternity, and since children in the LDS church are NOT sealed to a parent but to a parent couple which dad loses their children to the other?

Questions like this are the ones that never seem to get answered.

 

[zaffiroborant]

And that of her children?

Another scenario, a woman is married to a good man one she loves dearly, they have a couple/few kids and 11 years after the wedding the husband is killed. She later remarries to another good man and like her first husband cherishes and loves him dearly. The woman and her second husband have a couple/few kids and live out their lives together. Why should she have to choose one of the men she loves for eternity, and since children in the LDS church are NOT sealed to a parent but to a parent couple which dad loses their children to the other?

Questions like this are the ones that never seem to get answered.

Or my question about people who died unmarried, are they resurrected and then it’s a big singles event during the millennium?

 

[Marie5890]

Questions like this are the ones that never seem to get answered.

It’s things like this that made Mormonism fall like a house of cards for me. At first thought and feeling, the idea of being “sealed for all time and eternity” can be romantic for, yet when one steps back and thinks it through, it leaves decent questions unanswered.

Yes, it is possible for a woman to experience great love in this life with more than just one man in her life time.

But she is forced to choose if she wants to be “exhaulted”

 

[gazelam]

With this whole layered system idea of heaven the LDS have portrayed there is lack of care or concern for women generally.

When you say “layered system”, are you referring to the multiple heavens referred to in the Bible and LDS scripture?

This is how it looks to many non-LDS.

How many non-LDS are even looking closely at this?

A woman is unable to be exalted, that is for men alone.

That is an incorrect understanding. Both men and women are able to be exalted. However, this does require being married to an exalted spouse. 1 Corinthians 11:11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

Therefore a woman must either be married to an exalted man, or ditch the unexalted husband she has to go off with one who is exalted.

The “ditching” process in the next life hasn’t been revealed. We just believe that God will make everything right in the end. You must realize that someone who is exalted is worthy to partake of Eternal Life, whereas one who does not qualify for exaltation won’t be partaking of Eternal Life and would be uncomfortable in the presence of God. The unexalted husband may possibly bow out (this is pure speculation in my part) since he would still have a few favorite sins he’s unwilling to give up.

Here is a scenario: A couple are married in the temple and have children. The husband appears outwardly to be a good & faithful Mormon. However in the home he less than a perfect man. He is abusive to his wife & children, he withdraws care from them, and often leaves his wife to run around. All the while he is keeping a good appearance for the church, pays his 10%, goes to the temple, serves as a leader in services, all the things to make him appear to be a good man and keep his place. His wife decides she can’t take it anymore and gets a divorce.

A very sad situation

Now she is stuck. She is sealed to this man who the LDS leaders believe to be perfect and in good standing, well on his way to being exalted. She wants the marriage unsealed but is refused because women just can’t get that done. He remarries and is sealed to another woman.

There is a process for a woman to request that her sealing be cancelled. The woman can share her side of the story as part of the process. It’s done all the time, unfortunately, since we live in a fallen world.

Matthew 18:18 Amen, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Now this wife is a true believer. She absolutely believes that she needs to be married to an exalted man to be in the highest layer. She knows her kids will go to her husband at that layer.

The husband you describe is unrighteous. He made sacred covenants in the temple, but did not keep them. He will NOT be exalted and won’t get the kids. (This does not mean he and the kids won’t have contact in the afterlife.) She knows that unrighteous individuals will not be exalted because God will NOT be mocked. (Galatians 6:7)

She can’t remarry to a good man and be sealed to him as a woman can not be sealed to two men at a time, only men can be sealed to more than one partner.

As I stated before there is a process for remarriage.

So what is her fate?

Her fate is Eternal Life since she is a righteous woman. I hope this helps…

 

[zaffiroborant]

The unexalted husband may possibly bow out (this is pure speculation in my part) since he would still have a few favorite sins he’s unwilling to give up.

Here we have another difference and something that shows how warped comparison of the lower “kingdoms” is to the Christian concept of heaven. The LDS lower kingdoms are NOT salvation, or heaven and the comparison is insulting.