Leaving the Democrats

[estesbob]

Richardols:

Exactly so. A consistent pro-life position should include opposition to both abortion and the death penalty.

Altough I agree with you the Church does not. Church doctrine allows for the death Penalty in some case-the same can not be said for abortion.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Richardols:

Exactly so. A consistent pro-life position should include opposition to both abortion and the death penalty.

Did you read her post?

I did research on that question, and found that the distinction is that abortion is an “intrinsic” evil, and the death penalty for criminals is not. It’s in the Cathechism.

 

[miguel]

“Son of a bitch” is a descriptive term, too – but I wouldn’t advise you to describe someone that way while standing within arm’s length of them!http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

“Loudmouth” is a perjorative term. It is disrespectful and not properly used in gentlemanly debate.

Shall I send you the membership list of the Stone County Right to Life Committee? Shall we talk about those who work in things like Project Rachael. Or people who adopt the “unadoptables?”

Are we playing “I’m holier than you are?”

The question before the house is, can a Catholic support a political party which openly supports abortion on demand? Until that plank in the Democratic Party Platform is eliminated, we will continue to kill a million plus babies a year – and all the picketing and adoptions in the world won’t stop it.

You have to admit it is kind of frustrating for people out there on the front line picketing these clinics, while their brothers and sisters are voting for the very people who keep all this going (including by jailing the picketers).

 

[manualman]

Voted for a Bush presidency three times now. Not always enthusiastically, but hopeful that more Clarence Thomases and fewer David Souters will be appointed. Desperately wanting more Ruth Ginsbergs to NOT be appointed.

Prayed and demonstrated at abortion clinic four blocks away from my parish years ago. (It’s gone now!) Lifechain, donations to crisis pregnancy centers, teen chastity talks.

I would agree that we ALL need to work to change the culture in America or it will be a disaster if/when the court is shuffled to acheive an overturn of RoevWade. If the public has not embraced the sanctity of life at conception, a legal decision will put the pro-aborts right back in the election drivers seat.

I also agree that Roe will NEVER be undone if the likes of Clinton, Gore, Kerry, Dean, etc keep holding getting good numbers of catholic votes.

We’re so close on the court count. At close to a MILLION babies murdered every year, how can anyone believe that welfare, homeless shelters, tax policy and a justifiable (if dubiously motivated) war outweigh this??

 

[marvin]

Richardols:

Exactly so. A consistent pro-life position should include opposition to both abortion and the death penalty.

…and euthanasia. And yes, I suppose Jeb Bush could have sent in the National Guard. What a cop out. Must have something to do with his “#%$& Catholic” beliefs.

 

[vern_humphrey]

miguel:

You have to admit it is kind of frustrating for people out there on the front line picketing these clinics, while their brothers and sisters are voting for the very people who keep all this going (including by jailing the picketers).

You bet it is!

One characteristic of the pro-abortion line is that freedom of speech is for them, not for those who oppose them. And those who support the political party that follows this line must accept responsibility for it.

 

[miguel]

vern humphrey:

You bet it is!

One characteristic of the pro-abortion line is that freedom of speech is for them, not for those who oppose them. And those who support the political party that follows this line must accept responsibility for it.

It’s the last thing I want to be accused of on judgement day.

 

[Richardols]

marvin:

…and euthanasia. And yes, I suppose Jeb Bush could have sent in the National Guard. What a cop out. Must have something to do with his “#%$& Catholic” beliefs.

No, with his cowardice. He didn’t need the Guard, he could have sent the State Police to take Mrs. Schiavo into custody. But, he copped out. Nothing extra-legal, you know. “Wouldn’t be prudent” as his Dad might have said.

His courage would have saved her, and he would have gotten a Contempt of Court citation out of it. Big deal, who would have enforced it? What jury in Florida would have convicted him of such a petty-ante charge?

BTW, re-read my post. #%$& didn’t modify the adjective “Catholic.” His actions were ANYTHING but Catholic.

 

[miguel]

Richardols:

No, with his cowardice. He didn’t need the Guard, he could have sent the State Police to take Mrs. Schiavo into custody. But, he copped out. Nothing extra-legal, you know. “Wouldn’t be prudent” as his Dad might have said.

His courage would have saved her, and he would have gotten a Contempt of Court citation out of it. Big deal, who would have enforced it? What jury in Florida would have convicted him of such a petty-ante charge?

Here you definitely have a point. I believe the only way we’re going to pull ourselves out from the state of judicial tyranny we’re in is for the other two branches of government to start standing up to it. And that will take courage. Otherwise kiss democracy goodbye.

 

[Richardols]

miguel:

Here you definitely have a point. I believe the only way we’re going to pull ourselves out from the state of judicial tyranny we’re in is for the other two branches of government to start standing up to it. And that will take courage.

Judge Greer did things exactly legally. But, it was one of those times that we didn’t need legal action by other branches of government, just action by one man who was willing to do “what was right,” not just what was legal. J Bush turned out to be made of clay, not iron.

 

[miguel]

Richardols:

Judge Greer did things exactly legally. But, it was one of those times that we didn’t need legal action by other branches of government, just action by one man who was willing to do “what was right,” not just what was legal. J Bush turned out to be made of clay, not iron.

We have laws against murder. Ordering a defenseless handicapped woman to be starved to death hardly strikes me as legal. What strikes me as illegal, is judges who put themselves above the law. And that is how Bush should have justified a decision to act.

 

[Richardols]

miguel:

What strikes me as illegal, is judges who put themselves above the law.

Unfortunately, Judge Greer ruled entirely within the rules. He didn’t put himself above the law.

And that is how Bush should have justified a decision to act.

He’s the one who, in that instant, should have placed himself above the state law and followed a higher law.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Richardols:

Judge Greer did things exactly legally. But, it was one of those times that we didn’t need legal action by other branches of government, just action by one man who was willing to do “what was right,” not just what was legal. J Bush turned out to be made of clay, not iron.

What should he have done? Should he have taken her by force of arms, killing anyone who opposed him?

 

[Richardols]

vern humphrey:

What should he have done? Should he have taken her by force of arms, killing anyone who opposed him?

The local cops would not have started a shootout with the State Police. Local police don’t put their lives into danger over something like a custody case. And, if you’re not sure about that, then they certainly wouldn’t have done anything if even a small unit from the National Guard showed up.

Discretion is the better part of valor, it is said.

 

[rlg94086]

Richardols:

He’s the one who, in that instant, should have placed himself above the state law and followed a higher law.

Interesting. So, you would favor a governor shutting down all abortion clinics within his state by executive order and then enforcing it with State Police?

 

[miguel]

rlg94086:

Interesting. So, you would favor a governor shutting down all abortion clinics within his state by executive order and then enforcing it with State Police?

In a heartbeat. It’s no different than what these judges are doing. Except the judges are acting to kill lives. And the governor would be acting to save lives. And I would add arresting any judge who gets in the way to the list.

 

[rlg94086]

miguel:

In a heartbeat. It’s no different than what these judges are doing. And I would add arresting any judge who gets in the way to the list.

Richard,

Do you agree? It looks like you and Miguel could find some common ground.

Robert

 

[vern_humphrey]

Richardols:

The local cops would not have started a shootout with the State Police. Local police don’t put their lives into danger over something like a custody case. And, if you’re not sure about that, then they certainly wouldn’t have done anything if even a small unit from the National Guard showed up.

Discretion is the better part of valor, it is said.

You know for sure that if you had two parties confronting each other with drawn guns, nobody would have fired? You have written guarentees from both sides?

And you think it’s a good idea for the Governor of a state to use the State Police in that manner? Huie Long did it.

Or to call out the National Guard in cases where the law is on the other side? Orville Faubus did that.

 

[Richardols]

rlg94086:

Interesting. So, you would favor a governor shutting down all abortion clinics within his state by executive order and then enforcing it with State Police?

No. The Schiavo case was unique. Your example would have been one of contempt of federal court.

BTW, your premise is, unless I’m mistaken, the one the Constitutional Party candidate proposed.

 

[Richardols]

vern humphrey:

You know for sure that if you had two parties confronting each other with drawn guns, nobody would have fired? You have written guarentees from both sides?

And you think it’s a good idea for the Governor of a state to use the State Police in that manner? Huie Long did it.

How many were killed in the shootout?

Or to call out the National Guard in cases where the law is on the other side? Orville Faubus did that.

How many were killed in the shootout?