Legionaries of Christ acknowledge founder’s ‘inappropriate’ behavior

[Toni]

Let us not forget about those ex-Legionaries that leave with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (and no assistance from the Legion).

I know many and they left on their own free will. What is the Legion responsible for finding them a job because they left. Post Traumatic Stress a bit much don;t you think? Let’s take a look at maybe Mother Teresa when she left her order to start another. Her previous order did nothing to help her.and she did not seem to suffer from Post Traumatic stress because of it… If you are not called to an order you need to trust God to guide you where you belong.

 

[MartyMcFly]

Perhaps you may want to look at the Legion website before making this statement.
The Legion of Christ has **many **apostolates my sons were involved with many and only have wonderful things to say about the Legionaries of Christ.

Yes, but perhaps if they lived inside they would see the “behind the scenes” of the Legion. If they never formally joined they didn’t experience the Legion as such. I recommend some of the articles on www.regainnetwork.org

I am not saying the Legionaries are totally bad. Of course there are good things about them, that’s why people are attracted to them. Maybe even there are people who lived with them for years who never experienced anything strange. But the amount of testimonies of those who did is overwhelming and it cannot be ignored.

They built their house on sand when they canonized their founder while he was still alive.

I was never in the Legion, but I was in a group similar to the Legion (which for fear of lawsuits I will avoid mentioning the name) with similar problems and which is now under investigation by Church authorities. The Legion, like the group I was in, in direct and indirect ways tells possible recruits that their salvation absolutely depends on being in the group.

What does one do when almost a decade later they realize that their vocation was based on a lie? (They told me my salvation depended on being in the group, I didn’t realize this was against Church teaching until YEARS later). When I left the group I got ZERO financial help from the group, the diocese they were approved in, or my diocese.

Maybe it didn’t happen to your sons, but it does happen; in the Legion and in other groups.

What people don’t realize is the Legion is only ONE group in the Church. Many others have similar problems.

 

[CoolRich59]

Their main apostolates are FUNDRAISING and RECRUITING!

Perhaps you may want to look at the Legion website before making this statement.

No, Marty is right. I was involved with Regnum Christi for several years and, at the end of the day, that’s what apostolates were all about: how many new members were you recruiting and how much money were you raising.

 

[MartyMcFly]

Some thoughts (some disconnected )

I just want to state that I am not trying to “trash” the Legion, I know there are good people in it and people have benefited from them spiritually.
I go to daily Mass and would consider myself a faithful Catholic. I am not out to “trash” Catholic religious orders.

I am not saying any ONE Legionary is at fault. All Legionaries join with the best of intentions. The problem is they are all part of a larger system, a sick one at that.

However, I am out to raise my voice against groups that I are harming people and that need to be disciplined by the Church.

But as I said I was adversely affected by a similar group. Some day info about that group will come out, but for now it will remain confidential. Yes the Legion is doing good, but what about the people that leave that are HARMED by the Legion? What about them?

Just because a group is orthodox, doesn’t mean that can’t be a cult on the psychological level. Just believing the right things and having a nice liturgy does not make a group good, there’s more to it than that.

The Legionaries mainly became popular because they answered a need. Everyone knows what the state of the Church was like in the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. Is it any wonder people would be attracted to the Legionaries at a time when “Fr Bubblebath” was singing kumbaya and breaking every liturgical rubric at the local parish?

Even Papal approval is not a “magic wand” that makes a group perfect. Additionally, the Pope can only approve what he knows about. If Maciel had a child over the years the question is, who knew about it? Who helped cover it up?

 

[Toni]

I am not saying the Legionaries are totally bad. Of course there are good things about them, that’s why people are attracted to them. Maybe even there are people who lived with them for years who never experienced anything strange.

I am glad to hear you do not believe that we are all bad. I have been in Regnum Christi for 20 years and have not seen anything stranger than the Franciscan’s, Dominican’s Sister’s of the Holy Cross, Opus Dei and many of the other good orders. All good orders have their norms. If Father Maciel is guilty then he will answer to God not all the people here who just want to slam him. We are all human and all have the ability to make mistakes. Since I have made many mistakes I am just grateful that we have a loving and forgiving God, and that I do not have to sit and be judged by all of you.
MartyMcfly476727:

They built their house on sand when they canonized their founder while he was still alive.

This is a new one. We all prayed when Father Maciel died. There was far more people who prayed than set out to cannonize him. We are aware of the fact only the Church can cannonize. Yes we did and still do love Father Maciel, but again cannonize not the thousands of Legionaries I know.
MartyMcFly476727:

What does one do when almost a decade later they realize that their vocation was based on a lie? (They told me my salvation depended on being in the group, I didn’t realize this was against Church teaching until YEARS later). When I left the group I got ZERO financial help from the group, the diocese they were approved in, or my diocese.

I am at a loss for words on this one why would the order have to help support you after you have left? No order does this at least none that I know of.
MartyMcFly476727:

What people don’t realize is the Legion is only ONE group in the Church. Many others have similar problems.

This is very true since where there is God the devil always comes knocking. We just always have to be prepared and even the greatest sometimes are not. Again I have fallen enough times to know where God is the devil is not far behind. So as Christ said stay on guard.

 

[MartyMcFly]

I know many and they left on their own free will. What is the Legion responsible for finding them a job because they left. Post Traumatic Stress a bit much don;t you think? Let’s take a look at maybe Mother Teresa when she left her order to start another. Her previous order did nothing to help her.and she did not seem to suffer from Post Traumatic stress because of it… If you are not called to an order you need to trust God to guide you where you belong.

Just call one of the dozen or so people listed on the “Regain Network” page.
They were in the Legion, they can tell you what it was like first hand.

There are several people, even diocesan priests (ex-LCs), who have volunteered to help Legionary and RC members. They are very courageous to list their phone numbers on the web like that, when almost two years ago Regain was sued by the Legion.

regainnetwork.org/

 

[CoolRich59]

One final thought. Although the Legion’s response so far has been pretty lame. (Ed Peters put it well when he said on his blog: “Is Legion leadership really going to continue talking to the Catholic world as if it were inhabited by idiot children?”) While I largely agree with Dr. Peters’ sentiments, I think the Legion really has no choice.

If the Legion was to say, “yeah, our founder was a pedophile and a womanizer”, it would be over. They might as well shut down all their operations the same day.

As it is now, it may be the end for them anyway. Regardless of how one felt about the Legion before this latest development, the reality is that it will be very difficult – probably impossible – for the Legion to recover from this.

Face it. If you had a son or daughter considering a vocation and they said they were considering the Legionaries of Christ, someone – a family member, a friend, an acquaintance at church – is going to confront you and say something to the effect: “you’re not seriously considering allowing your child to go to the Legion are you??”

As far as the Legion goes, the best response I’ve seen is Patrick Madrid’s suggestion on his blog that the Legion dissolve the order and start over again. Personally, I think that is a great idea. While I had a negative experience with Regnum Christi, I still met many wonderful people during the time I was involved. I would like to think that all their time, effort, dedication and love for Christ and His Church could be salvaged if the organization was resurrected in a new form.

 

[Toni]

Some thoughts (some disconnected )

I just want to state that I am not trying to “trash” the Legion, I know there are good people in it and people have benefited from them spiritually.
I go to daily Mass and would consider myself a faithful Catholic. I am not out to “trash” Catholic religious orders.

That is wonderful please pray for all of us .
MartyFireFly:

The Legionaries mainly became popular because they answered a need. Everyone knows what the state of the Church was like in the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. Is it any wonder people would be attracted to the Legionaries at a time when “Fr Bubblebath” was singing kumbaya and breaking every liturgical rubric at the local parish?

LOL this is true since the Legionaries brought the faith back to many and still continue to do so. We are not sick people we help to build the Church to the best of our abilities.
The many apostolates that have been started by the Legion are wonderful apostolates that help to build the Church. I have never been asked to go find money or recruit whatever I have done I have done on my own free will.

 

[MartyMcFly]

I
I am at a loss for words on this one why would the order have to help support you after you have left? No order does this at least none that I know of.

Can. 702 §1. Those who depart from a religious institute legitimately or have been dismissed from it legitimately can request nothing from the institute for any work done in it.

---

§2. Nevertheless, the institute is to observe equity and the charity of the gospel toward a member who is separated from it.***

 

[Toni]

As it is now, it may be the end for them anyway. Regardless of how one felt about the Legion before this latest development, the reality is that it will be very difficult – probably impossible – for the Legion to recover from this.

You don’t know the Legion very well. The Legion will continue to grow because the fruit that it has produced is good. As I stated before one bad apple does not make a rotten bushel.
Rich59 4767737:

Face it. If you had a son or daughter considering a vocation and they said they were considering the Legionaries of Christ, someone – a family member, a friend, an acquaintance at church – is going to confront you and say something to the effect: “you’re not seriously considering allowing your child to go to the Legion are you??”

My sons would not go to another order. When my son comes home from Afghanistan he will go see his friend the Legionarie priest. With no money in hand yet will be accepted and have a great confession and a great talk with a Legionarie Priest.

As far as the Legion goes, the best response I’ve seen is Patrick Madrid’s Interesting since Patrick Madrid has a xLegionarie brother.

 

[CoolRich59]

You don’t know the Legion very well. The Legion will continue to grow because the fruit that it has produced is good. As I stated before one bad apple does not make a rotten bushel.

You don’t know me so you have no way of knowing how well I know the Legion.

Regardless, I’m not looking to debate this. Time will tell what “fruit” gets produced by the Legion.

However, we’re talking about “Nuestra Padre”, the founder; the issue here isn’t “one bad apple”, the tree the apple’s came from was rotten.

 

[Toni]

Just call one of the dozen or so people listed on the “Regain Network” page.
They were in the Legion, they can tell you what it was like first hand.

There are several people, even diocesan priests (ex-LCs), who have volunteered to help Legionary and RC members. They are very courageous to list their phone numbers on the web like that, when almost two years ago Regain was sued by the Legion.

regainnetwork.org/

Just for the record I have been to regain quite a few times and the funny thing is they will not let anyone post unless you hate the Legion. I was not allowed to post at all. Interesting a hate website full of people who have manged to lose God in their lives because their hearts are cold. It just tells me that Thank God they did not stay with the Legion. The website is all hate and destruction. Sad that people have nothing better to do then continue to fill their hearts with hate. If you truly loved Christ you would put your hand to the plow and go forward. We have all been hurt in our lifetime. I could sit on a pitty pot about many things in my life if I wanted to and bring down all my relatives who have ever hurt me. But I made a choice to go forward. The people at regain sit on their pitypot and never go forward. To me this shows no faith, hope, or charity.

 

[barryschoedel]

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Don’t you people get it? God works through sinners. St. Peter denied Christ three times! Nobody but God knows this priest’s heart and his interior struggle with sin. I have not met a person yet who is without sin. God saves us despite our sin and he comes to us through it.

I am not an apologist for the LC but I think the tone from some that is being taken is unfortunate. We are asked to forgive and trust in the Lord. It is pretty simple really. We know what the Church teaches, are job is to be obedient to the Church and confess where we fall short. Which every one of us does if we are honest with Our Lord.

Also, let the LC have some privacy about this. They have disclosed what is relevant publicly, to ask for more is nothing more than curiosity. Surely the muck-rakers will soon enough do their work anyway.

 

[Toni]

You don’t know me so you have no way of knowing how well I know the Legion.

Regardless, I’m not looking to debate this. Time will tell what “fruit” gets produced by the Legion.

However, we’re talking about “Nuestra Padre”, the founder; the issue here isn’t “one bad apple”, the tree the apple’s came from was rotten.

Wow that is pretty harsh I hope that God does not judge you or me the same way. Since I have managed to raise a family and woe my daughter is pregnant does that make the tree rotten or a piece of fruit. Please let me know so I can fix my rotten tree.

 

[Toni]

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Don’t you people get it? God works through sinners. St. Peter denied Christ three times! Nobody but God knows this priest’s heart and his interior struggle with sin. I have not met a person yet who is without sin. God saves us despite our sin and he comes to us through it.

Thank you, You have said it well. Christ did and still does amazing works through sinners.Since I happen to fall in this category I will testify to that. I forget sometimes that this site has so many saints posting. As for me I am a sinner and daily ask God’s forgiveness.

 

[napad]

Perhaps you may want to look at the Legion website before making this statement.
The Legion of Christ has **many **apostolates my sons were involved with many and only have wonderful things to say about the Legionaries of Christ.

So they never ask you for money or tried to recruit your sons to be in LCs?

 

[barryschoedel]

However, we’re talking about “Nuestra Padre”, the founder; the issue here isn’t “one bad apple”, the tree the apple’s came from was rotten.

How many pope’s have we had that have fathered illegitimate children, had mistresses etc?

What about Peter denying Christ? Or Saul’s persecution of Christians? How many saints struggled deeply, and failed often with temptation?

By your logic, the tree’s fruit depends upon man, not God. This is an ancient heresy.

 

[barryschoedel]

Thank you

Your welcome.

 

[napad]

Let us not forget about those ex-Legionaries that leave with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (and no assistance from the Legion).

As a matter of fact these ex-LCs were being sued by LC!! The gall! Where is Christian charity there?

 

[Michael_Neal]

I have nothing but good things to say about LC priests I have met.

There seems to be a lot going on here. There is obviously some bias against them to begin with by left leaning Catholics due to their orthodoxy, but at the same time there a a lot of questions. There shouldn’t be too much rush to judgement here against the entire organization.