Let's be real about the shortage of priests

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noun, plural truths [trooth z, trooths] Show IPA.

the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.
conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement.
a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like: mathematical truths.
the state or character of being true.
actuality or actual existence.
an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
(often initial capital letter) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and transcending perceived experience: the basic truths of life.
agreement with a standard or original.
accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
Archaic. fidelity or constancy.
 
I believe it is because of the family structure is in deep trouble. People are told stupid things like it is ok to be gay…
The best thing we can do is to pray, pray, pray. Go to confession and do penance and be a good example for others. I don’t know what all this craziness will lead to. Look back at history, the devils evil doings and manipulating peoples lives have been going on for a long time. Just don’t give up, pray.
“You understand, venerable brethren, that We speak of that sect of men who, under various and almost barbarous names, are called socialists, communists, or nihilists, and who, spread over all the world, and bound together by the closest ties in a wicked confederacy, no longer seek the shelter of secret meetings, but, openly and boldly marching forth in the light of day, strive to bring to a head what they have long been planning - the overthrow of all civil society whatsoever.”
Pope Leo XIII - Dec. 28, 1878
 
And once again I say look at diocese Catholic priestly organizations where vocations are doing well like the FSSP, and try to duplicate what they are doing would be a good first step. Can we agree here that Modernism is a heresy and doesn’t belong in the Catholic Church?

If so, and it’s a tragedy that there has to be an ‘if’ involved, we should rip Modernism out of our seminaries, theology etc. There should probably be a laicization of Modernist clergy to prevent them from indoctrinating any more with their heresies of indifferentism, racism, materialism, etal.
 
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QwertyGirl said:
The Church is not accepting of someone who discards that which they don’t believe or subscribe to.
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Hmmn. Not so sure about this one. Depends who we mean by “Church” I suppose.
I tend to think of God mediated by frail and fallible followers. Jesus’s wasn’t accepted either, at least not by all and not even by most of those who loved him at the time it counted. Can all or nothing truth seekers expect much different even in God’s all too human Church!
 
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SuperLuigi said:
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QwertyGirl:
There are varying definitions of truth, which is what I was referring to.
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“There aren’t any versions of the Truth”

Malcolm, The Lost World
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For crying out loud…we all know what QG is saying…
We all perceive truth in different ways obviously.
Who is to say your understanding of God, the Bible, the Papal Encyclicals etc is a better version of reality than mine?

So while truth is objective there is really no objective standard for judging whose accounting of it is “right” - whatever that may mean.

All fairly obvious really.

Galileo being a very clear example if one was needed.
 
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Do come back when you have a well thought out or reasoned argument…
 
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Wretched_1 said:
And once again I say look at diocese Catholic priestly organizations where vocations are doing well like the FSSP, and try to duplicate what they are doing would be a good first step. Can we agree here that Modernism is a heresy and doesn’t belong in the Catholic Church?

If so, and it’s a tragedy that there has to be an ‘if’ involved, we should rip Modernism out of our seminaries, theology etc. There should probably be a laicization of Modernist clergy to prevent them from indoctrinating any more with their heresies of indifferentism, racism, materialism, etal.
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OK. The actions you suggest are good. Any suggestions you might add, that is actions by laity (most of the posters and readers on thread) to help bring about these actions would be useful.

For instance, you can help publicize the FSSP, and similar orders, in any parish or other Catholic group you have access to. If you have specific documentation that a specific seminary teacher is teaching heresy, you can write a short letter to the president of the seminary. If that teacher is visiting a parish or school to give a talk, you might write to the parish expressing your concerns (even better if you find out they are considering inviting him and write in advance).
 
SuperLuigi said:
If you think this argument is limited to that, you’re wrong.
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SuperLuigi, you seem to be upset by something I wrote. I was providing responses to the other poster who was asking me a lot of questions, out of what I perceived to be genuine curiosity. I am sorry if I offended you. Clearly we have differing beliefs. It is never my intention to upset anyone here.
 
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The Marine Corps has no problem getting the recruits they need. Treat the priesthood like the elite force it is, find some way to restore it’s prestige, and our problems will be solved.
 
You just implicitly admitted that you have no objective standard to determine whether your epistemology is correct. Therefore your worldview undercuts itself and cannot be true.
 
I wish I knew. For example, I’m guessing smarter folks than me have correctly tried to get a certain Fr. James Martin SJ laicized. Seeing that the Holy Father appointed him as what, head communications officer of the Vatican, I’m guessing he’s probably not going to get laicized during this Pontificate, so…
 
The last USMC recruiting commercial I remember showed the Marine climbing a mountain, pulling a sword from a stone, and killing a dragon. It did not talk about the nice healthcare plan or the death gratuity.
 
starshiptrooper said:
You just implicitly admitted that you have no objective standard to determine whether your epistemology is correct. Therefore your worldview undercuts itself and cannot be true.
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OK, you say Catholicism has the truth, someone else says Buddhism does.
Different perceptions.

Tell me what objective criteria are available to the two parties for definitively deciding the matter?

Noone denies there are possible objective critera (eg discovery after death) - unfortunately they are often practically unavailable to the parties of concern in their lifetimes. for a variety of reasons.
 
starshiptrooper said:
The last USMC recruiting commercial I remember showed the Marine climbing a mountain, pulling a sword from a stone, and killing a dragon. It did not talk about the nice healthcare plan or the death gratuity.
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Come for the dragons, stay for Tricare.
 
It would depend on the specific point in dispute. We have reason, we have logic, those tools can used to determine the truth. An incorrect worldview is at odds with reality and inevitably leads to contradiction, impracticality, and/or a blatant disregard of the obvious.
 
The obvious point that everybody recognises is that “reason” and “logic” cannot convincingly decide the matter either way because reason is weak and life is so complex that nobody’s observations re Buddhists or Catholics are so accurate as to be always and everywhere agreed.

Nobody really knows what happens after death - that is why there are different faiths.

And so, many “truths”.
Nobody said they are all correct. But how would one know?
One cannot definitively answer such questions this side of the grave.
 
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