Let's stop using the word "abortion"

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Otar_Mendes said:
First you have to change all the dictionaries definitions. . 😃 What we can find in women’s wombs within the first XX weeks is not a baby. Just a bunch of cells. And that’s a natural fact.
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The offspring of your parents - you - was, is and will remain a bunch of cells throughout your existence. That description is age invariant. “Baby” describes our age. It’s not clear to me why killing one of us because we are really young is ok, and when we get a little older, it becomes a hanging offence.
 
ChrisGriffin said:
My thoughts…

**Ye shall not afflict any widow, or fatherless child.
If thou afflict them in any wise, and they cry at all unto me, I will surely hear their cry;
And my wrath shall wax hot, and I will kill you with the sword; and your wives shall be widows, and your children fatherless. **Exodus 22:22-24

Abortion is the same sin as Satan and the same sin as Judas and the same sin as Cain all at the same time.

Pope Francis should be the world’s foremost defender of the unborn. Tragically he is far, far from that.
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Careful, Chris. Pope Francis has been anointed by someone who has been anointed by [snip 2000 years] someone who has been anointed by Christ.

So I would be more judicious about how you talk about God’s anointed.
St. John Chrysostom said that abortion is so bad that there isn’t even a name for it.
 
Pope Francis has spoken about the “grave evil of abortion.”
He has also spoken about the importance of mercy.
The loss of a child to a mother is unfathomable. He related in one of his press conferences the inconsolable grief of a mother of triplets. One was stillborn. Although she still had two living children, she could not stop crying because of the loss of the one.

Don’t overlook how often he has spoken on this matter.
 
mathematoons said:
Let’s call it what it is: baby-killing. The fact that we use another word shows that we don’t really think of the two as morally equivalent.
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The whole reason why they use the word abortion is precisely due to the fact that they don’t
see it as killing a living “person”. There is no evidence of consciousness or sentience, And so as far as they are concerned they are not actually killing a person. They are simply killing an embryo that if left to full term will become a sentient being or what people tend to identify as having a personal nature; which is why people don’t kill infants.

The reason why the Catholic church says its wrong is because a fetus has a personal soul for which there is no evidence. Its a belief accepted on faith.

So this idea that we should say that abortionists are killing “people” isn’t gonna fly in a court of law.
 
ChrisGriffin said:
In my opinion the pope is AWOL on abortion. He makes a few comments about abortion once in a while just to keep the pro-lifers happy. Remember he started out saying not to obsess about abortion. His speeches during his trip here never mentioned abortion. He recently hailed the Italian abortion queen as a great person, a previous post shows him recently using the term “termination of pregnancy” instead of the word abortion, which is the same terminology that pro-choicers use etc…etc…etc…

As I said he should be THE worlds defender of the unborn and he fails that tragically.
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Talking about abortion is probably not a useful thing to do unless we judge that what is said will have a positive effect. Sometimes what is an inherently good thing - such as telling the truth with good intention - can be anticipated to causes more harm that good. So contemplated acts must by assessed as to their prudence, and sometimes, the right course of action is inaction. I imagine if you are Pope, there are many things to do, and finite hours in the day (and years in your life remaining) - it must be challenging to choose where to ration your effort.
 
The Pope has described the Church several times as a field hospital.
The Church has a long standing healing ministry for those who have been harmed by the abortion industry, who have had abortions called Project Rachel.
It is about mercy and reconciliation.
 
ChrisGriffin said:
Rau - Your last sentences implies that the Pope has better things to do than stopping women from committing murder and stop babies from being murdered.???

DebChris - I am a loss for words when the Pope does virtually nothing to stop babies from being murdered but he sure is nice to the murdering mothers.
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The Pope has done a great deal to stop babies from being aborted.

And he should be nice to post abortive mothers. You don’t think so?
 
ChrisGriffin said:
DebChris - I am a loss for words when the Pope does virtually nothing to stop babies from being murdered but he sure is nice to the murdering mothers.
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How come nobody’s after all these CAF members who criticize us for calling baby-killing what it is but won’t say a word against the murderers? The Pope, at least, has to consider prudence in what he says.

If I wanted to be part of a group that defends murderers, I’d join a Nazi board. You hypocrites make me sick. But at least you’ve helped me decide to leave, so thanks for that.
 
ChrisGriffin said:
Rau - Your last sentences implies that the Pope has better things to do than stopping women from committing murder and stop babies from being murdered.???

DebChris - I am a loss for words when the Pope does virtually nothing to stop babies from being murdered but he sure is nice to the murdering mothers.
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lifesitenews.com/blogs/pope-francis-praises-pro-life-cause-there-is-no-more-important-work

[SIGN]Pope Francis recently called the pro-life cause the most important work on earth.

During the papal General Audience on April 12, Pope Francis met with members of Croatia’s 40 Days for Life campaign. Dalia, one of the mothers helped to choose life for her child, was there with her daughter Nika and both received a blessing from the Pope[/SIGN].
 
ChrisGriffin said:
Rau - Your last sentences implies that the Pope has better things to do than stopping women from committing murder and stop babies from being murdered.???.
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Your statement implies he need only speak and abortions will stop. Do you believe that?
 
Rau said:
Your statement implies he need only speak and abortions will stop. Do you believe that?
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And imagine how this applies to our Savior.

Christ spoke out about a lot of things and yet was unable to eliminate these sins.

(In fact, Christ spoke not a word about abortion–so using Deb’s logic, Christ was woefully inadequate as a leader of Catholicism).
 
Jesus actually DID speak about abortion.

"You know the commandments: ‘Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not bear false witness, honor your father and mother.’”
 
Lion_IRC said:
Jesus actually DID speak about abortion.

"You know the commandments: ‘Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not bear false witness, honor your father and mother.’”
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Well, if you count that as speaking out against abortion, then you’ll have to count a whole bunch of other things Pope Francis has said as also speaking out against abortion.
 
In calling a spade a spade, we ought to also make sure we include the words “on demand” when we refer to folks as pro-abortion.

They will say…nobody is PRO abortion.

But they cannot deny that they are pro abortion-on-demand.
 
Well, abortion is the name of the procedure. Same with euthanasia.

This can be said for another procedures, there is a name for it, we don’t simply say “I want you to cut me open and remove my uterus!” do we?
 
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