Life as a Catholic single. A rant. (PG-13)

[Xantippe]

Come to think of it, a lot of single young guys nowadays have full beards.

If that’s working for you, great!

However, there is a possibility that it is scaring off women. Beards can have the following issues:

–itchy to be close to
–food trap
–too Taliban
–could be hiding secret weak chin
–partially hides facial expression, making face less animated and interesting

Again, you could be genuinely good looking with a beard (there’s at least one really sharp-dressing tweedy guy in a beard at church), but it could also be holding you back.

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

That happens a lot in the U.S. as well.
People feel like they have to approve of their children’s *choices *and their friends children’s choices NO MATTER WHAT.

Been there, done that. Didn’t like it, don’t want the t-shirt.
I’ve seen things I can’t unsee in people’s homes. But of course I have to keep my mouth shut and pretend it’s all good.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

There’s more to it than WHERE.

I hesitate to give any advice, without knowing what the guy looks like, his level of grooming and hygiene, his body language, whether he interrupts a lot, corners women, monologues, etc., etc.
…

No lie. I was just asked out by someone a few hours ago while out in town. I just met the guy. I was not interested at all, tried to give signals that I wasn’t. ** How he went about it was not executed very well at all.**

Now I feel sick about it, and I’m sure he does too- maybe even hating me under his breath because I turned him down. It was not pleasant.

 

[dangerousdyls]

I hear ya man, you’re clearly not alone with your thoughts. As others have related to you, so can I. I’m 30 year old male, single, and really struggle with anger towards “the world” and what it is shoving at us 24-7. We need sex, and preferrably with a beautiful woman, otherwise we’re outside of the norm.

In reality though, sex isn’t a need. That’s the hard truth we have to swallow. If it was, me and you would be dead. It helps me think in terms of what the Enemy would want. That bitterness can turn to worse things. I hope you find peace with yourself.

 

[NM505StKate]

The world is shoving it in our face? How? Everything I have seen is pretty tame. You have to go searching for the hardcore stuff. I am almost 35 and still single. It is a bummer sometimes but I have friends who I do stuff with. I go hang out or play Magic or just read. I saw on another thread that talked about masturbation not being a sin and I have to agree.

 

[PhiloMed]

Correction: 45

Correction correction: over 45 and your name is Tom Selleck

 

[Xantippe]

Correction correction: over 45 and your name is Tom Selleck

Not a Johnny Depp fan?

 

[Xantippe]

Burt Reynolds?

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I used to think that way… but now, I feel if you meet the ‘right one’, that whole chastity rule is going to go out the window…

If the whole purpose of marriage is to share yourself sexually with one other person, and if that other person is* the right one*, I have a hunch that keeping the two of them apart for very long is nearly impossible. I also think if you were to keep apart for very long, things could very well fizzle too… you may still love that person, but the passion has been squelched. Why would that be good if marriage is in your future??? I don’t believe in this idea that sexual passion is ‘bad’. That’s like some puritan belief that you can’t really find in the Bible. Read Song of Songs!

And I think a marriage should be that way- that there is that strong pull, strong desire and bond and I just don’t mean in lust- I mean that the whole package is there- sexual desire, friendship, mutual respect, shared ideals and goals, kinship, ect.

I believe that the right one (not talking soulmate stuff here as I believe there can be more than one person that you share this type of bond with) you are going to have a very difficult time remaining chaste. By saying this I"m not saying it doesn’t matter if they give in, but that its going to be extremely difficult…

… Hence, I despise all this delay on marriage where you have to have this and that to get started… I think it goes against nature. In the Bible, there are couples who meet and marry days later. There is no discussion on how independent and financially well off they are or how ‘ready’ they are to create a baby. These days, people co-habitate for years before they get married just because of this modern day concept… which as Xantippe pointed out so perfectly is a serious concern in that raising a family these days takes a lot of financial stability. Responsible people don’t want to be irresponsible, but time ticks away and no one is ever promised that financial stability will get better. Sometimes it gets worse.

I kind of feel that the reason why we are seeing the majority of couples live together for years isn’t because they are trying to be immoral, its because they are trying to make things work, they are trying to live life. Its sad. I actually hate it, hate seeing it, and hate it when people tell me they are living together, but I understand it.

I think part of the problem is that these days, the culture says that one must be independent and do everything themselves, whereas I believe in times past- like in Biblical days- the WHOLE family and village helped out. It wasn’t such that EVERYTHING was riding on your back alone.

I met the right one, and I don’t deny that the desire was there. However, the desire to please Christ and live up to God’s commandments was stronger in both of us.

Deepening one’s prayer life helpa avoid even near occasions. It is very possible to remain chaste,

 

[Kay_Cee]

I am not clear on where you’re disagreeing with me.

I note that you mention “both” kids, which suggests two. Most practicing Catholic newlyweds (and this is especially true if they start young) can expect to have a much larger family.

There’s also the issue of the economic changes since you were raising a family–stuff like clothes and toys are now much less expensive, while stuff like school, medicine, and housing is more expensive. Hence, trimming consumer expenses is now a less effective way to economize than it was when your kids were small–clothes and toys can be handed down or gotten second hand, but ER visits and college tuition can’t be. To give another example, the median home in TX has now gone over $150k–and Texas is considered an inexpensive state. The median home value in NJ is now $286k. In California the median home now costs in the neighborhood of $450k.

A very large percentage of contemporary young adults are still living at home at an age where you were married and had two kids. If those young adults were to get married, they would find themselves raising a family in their mom’s basement for the foreseeable future.

My point is that you mentioned just a loss of salary if the wife is a SAHM. You didn’t point out all the ways she adds to the family’s finances. For one thing, day care is not necessary. For another, she can help cut expenses.

It’s not just a matter of losing a salary. When I was pregnant with our first child, my husband and I crunched the numbers and discovered I would have to work four days out of five just to pay for the expenses incurred by my going to work and placing our baby in day care. The difference for us was just one day’s income per week, and frankly, I did not want to work five days for a net of four days’ salary. But because I managed to lower our expenses, we broke even. Once we had two children, we saved the expense of day care for two. It then became cheaper (for us, at least) for me to stay at home.

And except for our mortgage, we did all that without any debt whatsoever. Yes, we did without my salary, but I didn’t feel deprived. We just plain managed on what my husband made. And, lest you think he must have been making a lot, he worked for the federal government. We still managed to pay tuition for both kids at a Catholic elementary school. My kids did without the Nikes and Adidas that most children seem to think they’ve absolutely got to have. We did without the nice two story house with the swimming pool. We did without the better cars, the better cuts of meat in the grocery store, the nicer things. But my kids got their Mom at home, and that made it all worthwhile.

 

[Xantippe]

My point is that you mentioned just a loss of salary if the wife is a SAHM. You didn’t point out all the ways she adds to the family’s finances. For one thing, day care is not necessary. For another, she can help cut expenses.

It’s not just a matter of losing a salary. When I was pregnant with our first child, my husband and I crunched the numbers and discovered I would have to work four days out of five just to pay for the expenses incurred by my going to work and placing our baby in day care. The difference for us was just one day’s income per week, and frankly, I did not want to work five days for a net of four days’ salary. But because I managed to lower our expenses, we broke even. Once we had two children, we saved the expense of day care for two. It then became cheaper (for us, at least) for me to stay at home.

And except for our mortgage, we did all that without any debt whatsoever. Yes, we did without my salary, but I didn’t feel deprived. We just plain managed on what my husband made. And, lest you think he must have been making a lot, he worked for the federal government. We still managed to pay tuition for both kids at a Catholic elementary school. My kids did without the Nikes and Adidas that most children seem to think they’ve absolutely got to have. We did without the nice two story house with the swimming pool. We did without the better cars, the better cuts of meat in the grocery store, the nicer things. But my kids got their Mom at home, and that made it all worthwhile.

People in most of the country would kill for a federal job.

You are describing a very solidly middle class lifestyle. In fact, these days it would be better than middle middle class–only 10% of US school children are in private school.

The young people and couples we have been talking about would not be able to afford the lifestyle you describe if they got married young–a lot of them would find themselves doubled up with their parents or their in-laws, using lousy daycares and sending kids to bad public schools.

That’s why they’re not getting married and having kids–because they don’t want to do that stuff. In fact, a lot of middle class people are waiting to marry and have children precisely because they want to have a parent at home.

For the record, people today spend much less on clothing than when you were raising a family. You can get some interesting info here:

visualeconomics.creditloan.com/100-years-of-consumer-spending/

In 1950, Americans spent 12% of household income on apparel. In 2002-3, that number dropped to 4%. So, we can’t really blame “Nikes and Adidas” for young couples’ financial woes.

 

[Xantippe]

The really expensive stuff these days is not clothes or toys or gadgets, but housing in “nice” neighborhoods with good public schools (even very modest housing), daycare, medical care, and tuition (private school and college).

Just college alone has been increasing in cost at about 5% a year–and families do NOT get 5% a year income increases.

 

[Kay_Cee]

People in most of the country would kill for a federal job.

You are describing a very solidly middle class lifestyle. In fact, these days it would be better than middle middle class–only 10% of US school children are in private school.

The young people and couples we have been talking about would not be able to afford the lifestyle you describe if they got married young–a lot of them would find themselves doubled up with their parents or their in-laws, using lousy daycares and sending kids to bad public schools.

That’s why they’re not getting married and having kids–because they don’t want to do that stuff. In fact, a lot of middle class people are waiting to marry and have children precisely because they want to have a parent at home.

For the record, people today spend much less on clothing than when you were raising a family. You can get some interesting info here:

visualeconomics.creditloan.com/100-years-of-consumer-spending/

In 1950, Americans spent 12% of household income on apparel. In 2002-3, that number dropped to 4%. So, we can’t really blame “Nikes and Adidas” for young couples’ financial woes.

The only way my husband and I are “middle class” is that we are middle lower class. We are the poor relations our snooty siblings give their used furniture to.

You’re still missing my point, which is that a SAHM contributes! Why won’t you acknowledge that?

 

[AnneElizabeth]

I met the right one, and I don’t deny that the desire was there. However, the desire to please Christ and live up to God’s commandments was stronger in both of us.

Deepening one’s prayer life helpa avoid even near occasions. It is very possible to remain chaste,

I’m glad that you had that grace. I should have been more specific in my post… I didn’t mean to say that it was impossible, only that it can be extremely difficult and is for many couples it is…(these days at least- probably because there isn’t much as far as role models go with this subject) I am very glad that there are those who remain chaste.

I honestly have never met a man that wants to wait or is willing to wait Always wanted that type, but never found it. Frankly I’m with you in that I find a man who doesn’t care about chastity instantly unattractive. The older I get, the more the issue of chastity seems to be like some sort of joke to these guys. It seems to be something that when younger- like in your early 20’s- is attainable. The older folks seem (mostly) to be adverse to the idea.

 

[Xantippe]

The only way my husband and I are “middle class” is that we are middle lower class. We are the poor relations our snooty siblings give their used furniture to.

You’re still missing my point, which is that a SAHM contributes! Why won’t you acknowledge that?

I’m a SAHM–I totally believe SAHMs contribute.

We even send kids to private school and like it.

However, I don’t think you understand how out-of-reach the lifestyle you describe is for the majority of young Americans today.

 

[dangerousdyls]

The world is shoving it in our face? How? Everything I have seen is pretty tame. You have to go searching for the hardcore stuff. I am almost 35 and still single. It is a bummer sometimes but I have friends who I do stuff with. I go hang out or play Magic or just read. I saw on another thread that talked about masturbation not being a sin and I have to agree.

On masturbation --so you disagree with the Catechism (paragraph 2352)?

By the world shoving it in our faces…I guess you’re not exposed to some of the media I am…which is good…but I mean to say that mainstream secular media has become overtly sexy. Not just the media. Another example, if you go to a professional sports game (a “family event”, you would think), you’re likely to see some “cheerleaders” wearing not much clothing at all and dancing provocatively. If you’re a sports fan and trying to guard your purity, it’s frustrating.

 

[edwest2]

The world is shoving it in our face? How? Everything I have seen is pretty tame. You have to go searching for the hardcore stuff. I am almost 35 and still single. It is a bummer sometimes but I have friends who I do stuff with. I go hang out or play Magic or just read. I saw on another thread that talked about masturbation not being a sin and I have to agree.

Only the hardcore stuff is bad? I watched the gradual decline of morality in the media starting in the late 1960s and gradually getting worse as the years and decades passed. Slowly poisoning people in the West. Some good is still out there but the plan is to make people insensitive. Or indifferent.

Now it’s on 24/7.

Ed

 

[AnneElizabeth]

Only the hardcore stuff is bad? I watched the gradual decline of morality in the media starting in the late 1960s and gradually getting worse as the years and decades passed. Slowly poisoning people in the West. Some good is still out there but the plan is to make people insensitive. Or indifferent.

Now it’s on 24/7.

Ed

Totally agree with this, and yet I was born in the late 1970’s. I’d say in the last 20 years its really started to go quickly. I’m amazed myself at the decline of morality. I feel sorry for the young ones who never knew a more softer gentler culture… and I say that having grown up in the notorious 80’s … ( I was quite sheltered from it though).

The plan is definitely without a doubt to make people insensitive… they keep pushing agenda after agenda… and sadly its working. Even among those who wish to remain faithful.

 

[CompSciGuy]

32 year old male, still single. I find that I seem to be out of options for meeting single Catholic women my own age.
I have had a dubious background before my conversion and feel too profane for Church going women and too pius for the non-Churchgoer. I am stuck in a crack. On top of things, chastity is becoming a heavier and heavier cross and ever more difficult to maintain. The world tells me “No one is having sex with you? What is wring with you?” The Church tells me “Absolutely no intentional venerial arousal outside of marriage, don’t look, don’t touch, don’t even think about it.” I’m surrounded by nudity and sexuallity everywhere in society. I feel like a starving wolf being shown a piece of meat. No marriage prospects, seems like everyone in the world is having sex (intentional hyperbole) but me. I feel so…unfulfilled and unloved. Why is God’s love not enough? My faith is becoming a source of torment. I can have God’s love which I cannot feel, or sex and have an imitation of love that I can feel. The loneliness is agony, and so is separation from grace. I. Want. To. Have. Sex. I want to feel loved. So badly I want to put my head through a wall. I have become bitter. God gives me natural inclinations but provides no outlet, no companionship, no spouse. I am angry with Him, I admit. I go to mass and occasionally do see a few happy young couples, some of which have a new baby, a family. I find myself praying rather full of gaul, “Lord in your infinite love for me could ya maybe tell someone to show your love to me? Do ya think you stop letting me be isolated? Because yes, you, my Invisible Friend, should be enough, but apparently I’m a jerk.” as I grip the pew in front of me tightly. I have very little joy in my spiritual life and i am angry in my prayer life. And society says “If you have value, you’ll be having sex, therefore valued as a person, acceptable”. Thanks, society, so much, for screwing me up. I am such an ungrateful jerk.

So don’t listen to society. I know, society mocks virgins and those who are celibate. I remember how in the high school locker rooms the term “virgin” was actually used as an insult. Well I call bull. True, faith was the most important reason I was a virgin, but I remember thinking in a way that being chaste and virgin in the 21st century was sort of my way of lifting a metaphorical middle finger to society (pardon the vulgar analogy) saying “My worth, my manhood, has nothing to do with sexual conquest. It is found in my character. And all of you can take your perverted propaganda and stick it in your ear.”

The society you are talking about is pathetic. On the one hand we are taught to worship sex, that we can’t live without it, and yet on the other hand we are taught that it is no big deal. Oh, and it also has nothing to do with having babies… go figure. As men we are taught that sex should be all we think about or live for. And women are taught from the time that they are four feet tall that all of their worth is in their sex appeal, and that they can’t be beautiful unless they have a two-inch waist and big breasts and tons of makeup and revealing clothing. That is what your society is telling you. Do you really want to listen to them? To heck with society.

One more thing. Sex isn’t everything. True, it is a very intimate experience shared between two people. But you need to know that you can live, and even be happy, without it. This is coming from a married man. My now wife was also my first girlfriend. I was 26 when we met. We remained chaste and celibate before our wedding night. We had both talked about it at the beginning of our relationship and agreed that this was the way we wanted to go. I remember our dating years as some of the happiest years of my life. Being married has been great too, in spite of all the stresses. Not to mention the stresses of parenthood. When you’re married, there are still times you have to be celibate, especially if you use NFP. My son is eight weeks old and my wife and I haven’t done it since before he was born because she is still sore from giving birth (he was a 9 lb baby!). And that is OK. As far as I know, I have not burst into flames or shriveled up or had my eyes explode inside of my head.

What I will say for you is that you need to come to a place where you love God more than sex. You need to also work on yourself. I have always said that the mark of someone who is ready for marriage is that they desire virtue more than they desire a soul mate. Don’t obsess so much over finding “the one” that you lose sight of who you are, and how you relate to God. Your life shouldn’t be defined by your need to find a spouse.

 

[Xantippe]

So don’t listen to society. I know, society mocks virgins and those who are celibate. I remember how in the high school locker rooms the term “virgin” was actually used as an insult. Well I call bull. True, faith was the most important reason I was a virgin, but I remember thinking in a way that being chaste and virgin in the 21st century was sort of my way of lifting a metaphorical middle finger to society (pardon the vulgar analogy) saying “My worth, my manhood, has nothing to do with sexual conquest. It is found in my character. And all of you can take your perverted propaganda and stick it in your ear.”

The society you are talking about is pathetic. On the one hand we are taught to worship sex, that we can’t live without it, and yet on the other hand we are taught that it is no big deal. Oh, and it also has nothing to do with having babies… go figure. As men we are taught that sex should be all we think about or live for. And women are taught from the time that they are four feet tall that all of their worth is in their sex appeal, and that they can’t be beautiful unless they have a two-inch waist and big breasts and tons of makeup and revealing clothing. That is what your society is telling you. Do you really want to listen to them? To heck with society.

One more thing. Sex isn’t everything. True, it is a very intimate experience shared between two people. But you need to know that you can live, and even be happy, without it. This is coming from a married man. My now wife was also my first girlfriend. I was 26 when we met. We remained chaste and celibate before our wedding night. We had both talked about it at the beginning of our relationship and agreed that this was the way we wanted to go. I remember our dating years as some of the happiest years of my life. Being married has been great too, in spite of all the stresses. Not to mention the stresses of parenthood. When you’re married, there are still times you have to be celibate, especially if you use NFP. My son is eight weeks old and my wife and I haven’t done it since before he was born because she is still sore from giving birth (he was a 9 lb baby!). And that is OK. As far as I know, I have not burst into flames or shriveled up or had my eyes explode inside of my head.

What I will say for you is that you need to come to a place where you love God more than sex. You need to also work on yourself. I have always said that the mark of someone who is ready for marriage is that they desire virtue more than they desire a soul mate. Don’t obsess so much over finding “the one” that you lose sight of who you are, and how you relate to God. Your life shouldn’t be defined by your need to find a spouse.

CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP

That was very inspiring.