Lila Rose leads crowd decrying abortionist privileges at Colorado Catholic hospital

[Chrysotom]

Lila Rose leads crowd decrying abortionist privileges at Colorado Catholic hospital
BY JEREMY KRYN
Wed Aug 10, 2011 16:07 ESTComments (3)Tags: Lifeguard, Lila Rose, Live Action, Richard Grossman

Lila Rose at the 2010 Walk for Life West Coast
DURANGO, Colorado, August 10, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) – Last Thursday, more than 70 people attended a protest at Mercy Regional Medical Center to expose the relationship of abortionist Richard Grossman with the Catholic hospital located in Durango.

Grossman is the longest-serving physician at the hospital, which was founded by the Sisters of Mercy in 1882 and is owned by Catholic Health Initiatives. The abortionist does abortions on Fridays at Planned Parenthood of Durango.

“The reason I perform abortions is because I’m a Christian,” said the Quaker abortionist amid a similar protest last year.

The pro-life organization LifeGuard organized the protest on public property in front of the Catholic hospital. Lila Rose, the founder of Live Action Films, led the protest. Joe Scheidler, of the Pro-Life Action League, who led last year’s protest, has encouraged Catholics to sign a petition against the scandal.

lifesitenews.com/news/lila-rose-leads-crowd-decrying-abortionist-privileges-at-colorado-catholic

 

[manualman]

“The reason I perform abortions is because I’m a Christian,” said the Quaker abortionist amid a similar protest last year.

If anybody doubts the fact that sin darkens the intellect, here’s your proof.

I always marvel at stories like this. How does an abortionist get any OTHER sort of business? Even if you are “pro-choice” do you REALLY want a doctor who spends much of his time tearing limbs off tiny babies, crushing their skulls and vacuuming their remains out of women caring for YOUR unborn child? Wouldn’t your skin crawl just being near him?

 

[comrade1789]

If anybody doubts the fact that sin darkens the intellect, here’s your proof.

I always marvel at stories like this. How does an abortionist get any OTHER sort of business? Even if you are “pro-choice” do you REALLY want a doctor who spends much of his time tearing limbs off tiny babies, crushing their skulls and vacuuming their remains out of women caring for YOUR unborn child? Wouldn’t your skin crawl just being near him?

Quaker, figures. I went to apply to work at a homeless shelter run by Quakers and I saw all the pro-sodomy, pro-feminist, radical literature and knew these guys were not Christian. I went home that day scandalized, and I sat out on my back porch asking God how could people profess to love Him and believe in Him and yet have such views? No sooner had I thought this than a branch broke off a tree and came crashing to the ground in my back yard. I had received my answer.

 

[manualman]

And yet the Quakers saw the evils of chattel slavery and made decisive stands against it morally while American catholics as a whole played very little direct role in ending slavery in this country. Yes, we were a despised minority back then (maybe still are), but there surely were more catholics than Quakers. Given that the rationalization behind slavery is the SAME one behind abortion it is hard to comprehend how people miss it. (It’s not fully human, so my rights supercede any obligations I might owe that subhuman being).

Culture has an amazing power to enable rationalizing. We’re not immune to it any more than the Quakers are. We just have the advantage of the Holy Spirit’s bottom line guarantee against the Church formally teaching error. That’s a gift we received, not something we can be proud of achieving.

 

[comrade1789]

And yet the Quakers saw the evils of chattel slavery and made decisive stands against it morally while American catholics as a whole played very little direct role in ending slavery in this country. Yes, we were a despised minority back then (maybe still are), but there surely were more catholics than Quakers. Given that the rationalization behind slavery is the SAME one behind abortion it is hard to comprehend how people miss it. (It’s not fully human, so my rights supercede any obligations I might owe that subhuman being).

Culture has an amazing power to enable rationalizing. We’re not immune to it any more than the Quakers are. We just have the advantage of the Holy Spirit’s bottom line guarantee against the Church formally teaching error. That’s a gift we received, not something we can be proud of achieving.

Well said.

 

[Rence]

I always marvel at stories like this. How does an abortionist get any OTHER sort of business? Even if you are “pro-choice” do you REALLY want a doctor who spends much of his time tearing limbs off tiny babies, crushing their skulls and vacuuming their remains out of women caring for YOUR unborn child? Wouldn’t your skin crawl just being near him?

A lot of OB-GYN physicians perform abortions in their office or at the hospitals. Abortion clinics aren’t the only place in which abortions take place. No, it doesn’t make my skin crawl to be near my doctor. I don’t go to her for those services.

 

[Chrysotom]

A lot of OB-GYN physicians perform abortions in their office or at the hospitals. Abortion clinics aren’t the only place in which abortions take place. No, it doesn’t make my skin crawl to be near my doctor. I don’t go to her for those services.

It does mine.I would not want the hands of a murderer touching me or my children.If any OB-GYN physicians perform abortions anywhere and work at Catholic Hospitals they should be expelled or the hospitals should be protested and shamed into expelling the murderer(s).I’m sure Dr.Mengele had a fine bedside manner with non-Jews but so what?He was still a Nazi butcher.

“The ultimate test of a moral society is the kind of world that it leaves to its children.”
— Dietrich Bonhoeffer

“We have been silent witnesses of evil deeds; we have been drenched by many storms; we have learnt the arts of equivocation and pretence; experience has made us suspicious of others and kept us from being truthful and open; intolerable conflicts have worn us down and even made us cynical. Are we still of any use? What we shall need is not geniuses, or cynics, or misanthropes, or clever tacticians, but plain, honest, and straightforward men. Will our inward power of resistance be strong enough, and our honesty with ourselves remorseless enough, for us to find our way back to simplicity and straightforwardness?”
— Dietrich Bonhoeffer (Letters and Papers from Prison)

 

[Rence]

It does mine.I would not want the hands of a murderer touching me or my children.If any OB-GYN physicians perform abortions anywhere and work at Catholic Hospitals they should be expelled or the hospitals should be protested and shamed into expelling the murderer(s).I’m sure Dr.Mengele had a fine bedside manner with non-Jews but so what?

You, as a patient, can choose to go to whomever you like. You have that freedom. And really, it’s the patients that drive the available services. Hospitals don’t have the luxury of denying priviledges to every doctor who does procedures contrary to Catholic teachings. Their services would be very limited and they wouldn’t be able to compete with other hospitals for those same services. Doctors aren’t employees of the hospital, and one doctor can have priviledges for many facilities, not just one. If the Catholic hospital threatens a physician because they provides services elsewhere, the physician is not going to eliminate all his/her other privelidges and only keep the Catholic one. The opposite will happen.

This is what I said on another related post:
I don’t know how things are done all over the country, but what I came to know when I have worked in hospitals is this: the hospitals rented space to physicians, and these physicians may or may not have had privelidges to practice in that hospital. What I mean by “priviledges”, I don’t mean, “gee, it’s a priviledge to be here”. What I mean is simply that the physcian in question has the right to practice medicine in affiliation with the hospital. That means that they are ‘on staff’ at that hospital. So someone with ‘privileges’ can admit someone to the hospital, give orders for tests and/or procedures, etc. But that doesn’t mean they are employees. They are not employees. The only physican “employed” by the hospitals were hospitalists.

A doctor can have “privelidges” at one or more hospitals. So, a physician may have privelidges at a Catholic hospital, but might also have privelidges in one or more other hospitals or clinics, including secular ones. The range of services available ranged depending on where the physician admitted his/her patients, or where he/she arranged to have procedures and/or testing done. This is a fact of life and an old one.

So…in all the hospitals I have worked in, the hospitals rented out office space to doctors. That didn’t usually affect what the doctor did outside the hospital itself, even if the office space rented was on hospital property. For example, one of the doctors on staff was a urologist. He used to perform sterilizations in a neighboring secular hospital. But he did not perform such procedures in the Catholic hospital.

There are many doctors who are affiliated with Catholic and secular institutions at the same time. They will send their patients to the Catholic hospital when appropriate, and they will send their patients that require non-Catholic services (such as the sterilizations) to the secular hospitals. This is not new and this is not unique. I have no idea why this one protest is taking place, or why these people have targeted this particular hospital or doctor…but this is common and old news…

It will be interesting to see how this situation in Colorado turns out. But if they start with this one doctor, there will be a trickle effect to other doctors as well. And this will limit the availability of services and physicians to this Catholic hospital and the patients in the area. Instead of having ten doctors for a particular specialty, they may end up with one or two. While the secular hospital will continue to have more services and physicians available…

 

[Chrysotom]

You can’t qualify Truth.Period.Right is right and wrong is wrong.Christ did not accommodate sin and nor should we.Nor should we as a Catholics be indulging in that kind of apologia or rationalization.Are you really a Catholic?I mean no disrespect but I find your posts on this subject to be quite at odds with your declared affiliation.

“We have been silent witnesses of evil deeds; we have been drenched by many storms; we have learnt the arts of equivocation and pretence; experience has made us suspicious of others and kept us from being truthful and open; intolerable conflicts have worn us down and even made us cynical. Are we still of any use? What we shall need is not geniuses, or cynics, or misanthropes, or clever tacticians, but plain, honest, and straightforward men. Will our inward power of resistance be strong enough, and our honesty with ourselves remorseless enough, for us to find our way back to simplicity and straightforwardness?”
— Dietrich Bonhoeffer (Letters and Papers from Prison)

 

[Rence]

okay…

 

[Chrysotom]

 

[Rence]

You can’t qualify Truth.Period.Right is right and wrong is wrong.Christ did not accommodate sin and nor should we.Nor should we as a Catholics be indulging in that kind of apologia or rationalization.Are you really a Catholic?I mean no disrespect but I find your posts on this subject to be quite at odds with your declared affiliation.

Well, I’m sorry you feel that way. Sorry, but, it’s a fact of life that physicians have priviledges at multiple hospitals. It’s a fact of life that they provide certain services in one that they may not provide in another. It has nothing to do with my affiliation to state the obvious fact that if Catholic hospitals denied priviledges to physicians because of their activies outside of that Catholic facility, it would impact the services they provide. I understand you don’t get that. But that’s a fact. Don’t kill the messenger. It has nothing to do with me. Another painful fact is that as long as women seek out these services, there will be a provider of such services.

You’d be better off spending your energy trying to get someone to not have an abortion by counseling them on their many other options. That would be more productive…

 

[Chrysotom]

You’d be better off unequivocably condemning abortion and it’s participants instead of rationalizing.You CAN’T be Catholic and support abortion-nor ACCOMMODATE it in ANY form.

“First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists, but I was neither, so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out. And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.”

Dietrich Bonhoeffer-Martyr

 

[Chrysotom]

Well, I’m sorry you feel that way. Sorry, but, it’s a fact of life that physicians have priviledges at multiple hospitals. It’s a fact of life that they provide certain services in one that they may not provide in another. It has nothing to do with my affiliation to state the obvious fact that if Catholic hospitals denied priviledges to physicians because of their activies outside of that Catholic facility, it would impact the services they provide. I understand you don’t get that. But that’s a fact. Don’t kill the messenger. It has nothing to do with me. Another painful fact is that as long as women seek out these services, there will be a provider of such services.

You’d be better off spending your energy trying to get someone to not have an abortion by counseling them on their many other options. That would be more productive…

More productive than correcting you?A Catholic who should know better?Please.

 

[Elizabeth502]

You’d be better off unequivocably condemning abortion and it’s participants instead of rationalizing.You CAN’T be Catholic and support abortion-nor ACCOMMODATE it in ANY form.

She’s not supporting it. She’s explaining the way market forces work (that medicine, just like commerce) responds to the services demanded by the consumer (or patient).

Let’s take a different field: Law. Many attorneys now choose not to engage in litigation, for many reasons (the unpleasantness of it; the length of time/commitment involved which impacts their personal lives, etc.). They may feel they make a sufficient amount of money staying out of court, and it brings greater peace in their lives. However, their client base will be limited to those who do not need to (or choose to) initiate or defend a lawsuit.

 

[Rence]

You’d be better off unequivocably condemning abortion and it’s participants instead of rationalizing.You CAN’T be Catholic and support abortion-nor ACCOMMODATE it in ANY form.

I don’t support abortion, nor accomodate it by stating the simple facts regarding this case. The fact that physicians have priviledges at multiple hospitals doesn’t have anything to do with me. Just because I understand that it’s not economically feasible for Catholic hospitals to make unreasonable demands about what physicians do outside the Catholic hospital doesn’t mean I am supporting or accomodating abortion in any form. The physicians are not employees, and can take their patients anywhere. That’s a fact, and it has nothing to do with me. Really, you’re barking up the wrong tree. You’re better off actually working with someone who is considering abortion and making a real difference.

 

[Rence]

More productive than correcting you?A Catholic who should know better?Please.

Yes, more productive than correcting me I don’t have abortions, I don’t take part in abortions, I don’t enable those who seek or perform abortions, I don’t lobby for abortion rights, and I have nothing to do with abortions. You’d be more productive working with someone considering the above things, rather than someone explaining to you that physicians are not employees of the hospitals. Hospitals don’t own physicians. Physicians utilize more than one hospital for their patients, depending on the patient and the service the patient requires. If one hospital doesn’t want him, he will just go to the next one.

 

[Chrysotom]

I don’t support abortion, nor accomodate it by stating the simple facts regarding this case. The fact that physicians have priviledges at multiple hospitals doesn’t have anything to do with me. Just because I understand that it’s not economically feasible for Catholic hospitals to make unreasonable demands about what physicians do outside the Catholic hospital doesn’t mean I am supporting or accomodating abortion in any form. The physicians are not employees, and can take their patients anywhere. That’s a fact, and it has nothing to do with me. Really, you’re barking up the wrong tree. You’re better off actually working with someone who is considering abortion and making a real difference.

I’ll decide on the tree thanks.You have no idea of the extent of my involvement in Pro-Life activity.My girlfriend is a nurse in a Catholic hospital in Missouri and they do NOT have abortionists on staff or perform operations or medical procedures contrary to the Catholic Faith.No Catholic especially one who works in the Health Care system should be soft on abortion.They have a special responsibility of being the hands and face of Christ in said system.Part of my responsibility as a Catholic is afflicting the comfortable in their complacency.I’ve read your other posts on this subject and find them disturbingly ambivalant.Apparently so do others.

 

[Rence]

I’ll decide on the tree thanks.

We all do

You have no idea of the extent of my involvement in Pro-Life activity.My girlfriend is a nurse in a Catholic hospital in Missouri and they do NOT have abortionists on staff or perform operations or medical procedures contrary to the Catholic Faith.No Catholic especially one who works in the Health Care system should be soft on abortion.They have a special responsibility of being the hands and face of Christ in said system.

Well, I personally think it’s fortunate that your friend is a nurse in a hospital that has enough staff that never does anything contrary to the Catholic faith. I’m just pointing out that this is not always the case, and is in fact the most common senario, and has been that way for a while. I’ve worked in Catholic hospitals too. The fact is, physicians bring their non-Catholic patients for non-Catholic-approved procedures to the secular hospital, and save procedures that are approved by the Church for the Catholic hospitals. When there are many secular hospitals in the area, the physicians are not limited in their choices.

Part of my responsibility as a Catholic is afflicting the comfortable in their complacency.I’ve read your other posts on this subject and find them disturbingly ambivalant.Apparently so do others.

Well, if you think that’s useful and productive, and most of all, effective, then go for it

 

[Chrysotom]

Thanks for your approval.(Wags tail.)