Living with a Jehovah witness

[6857g]

Isn’t there a verse that says something about not praying like some pagan people did uttering their gods names a bunch of times? Isn’t that what they are doing? I’m not even sure there is such verses please help me out here guys

 

[6857g]

This helps a lot I can show my husband and I’m sure he’ll look into it. Good thing is we have a bunch of the recent translation at home so if they come up with a new one I can still show him. Isn’t it bad to be changing scripture?

 

[adf417]

This helps a lot I can show my husband and I’m sure he’ll look into it. Good thing is we have a bunch of the recent translation at home so if they come up with a new one I can still show him. Isn’t it bad to be changing scripture?

Yes it is but they will usually have an excuse. For instance the NWT has removed the first 11 verses in John chapter 8. Their reason: because it is not found in the earliest manuscripts. The problem with this logic is we dont have original manuscripts and the “earliest manuscripts” don’t necessarily mean the “most reliable”. Others here might expand on this for details.

Peace!!!

 

[Vico]

Isn’t there a verse that says something about not praying like some pagan people did uttering their gods names a bunch of times? Isn’t that what they are doing? I’m not even sure there is such verses please help me out here guys

Matthew 6

5 And when ye pray, you shall not be as the hypocrites, that love to stand and pray in the synagogues and corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men: Amen I say to you, they have received their reward. 6 But thou when thou shalt pray, enter into thy chamber, and having shut the door, pray to thy Father in secret: and thy Father who seeth in secret will repay thee.

7 And when you are praying, speak not much, as the heathens. For they think that in their much speaking they may be heard. 8 Be not you therefore like to them, for your Father knoweth what is needful for you, before you ask him. 9 Thus therefore shall you pray:

Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name.
10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our supersubstantial bread.
12 And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation. But deliver us from evil. Amen.

14 For if you will forgive men their offences, your heavenly Father will forgive you also your offences. 15 But if you will not forgive men, neither will your Father forgive you your offences.

 

[6857g]

Hey adf417,
So I was talking to my sons and they asked me a question that I told them I would find the answer to but have not been able to find.
•he asked if God knew that the tree of good and evil was bad then why did he put it in the garden, why make it at all?
Later they told me that my husband told them that saying bless you is bad. That it’ was and is used to expel demons. I was in a aw to this that was my face. Is this so and what can I tell my sons about the manners (that i assume we’re good) I shown them since infants?
Please help me out and anyone that can help me get answers for my sons are welcome

 

[TomMartin1]

misstherese, personally I like more the view of the Jehovah’s Witnesses and some other denominations on hell than the view of Catholics and Orthodox and most Protestant denominations. After all, if there is eternal suffering in hell, wouldn’t that make God be very cruel and sadistic? It would make more sense for God, if God exists, to just exterminate the evil people in the afterlife, rather than torment them forever in hell. That way they would cease to exist. And it seems to make more sense biblically too, since for example John 3:16 says the choice is between eternal life and perishing. So the evil people would perish for ever, that would be the eternal punishment for them. I certainly don’t want to perish forever, I want eternal good life. So that can deter people from being evil. Though some people can’t be deterred no matter what. Plenty of people believe in eternal suffering in hell, and yet they are still evil. There have even been evil popes. And presumably they believed in eternal suffering, not eternal perishing.

 

[TomMartin1]

Concering the tree of good and evil, I did not find a good answer from Catholics or Jehovah’s Witnesses or other denominations, though I found a somewhat better answer from the Mormons, they state that God had actually intended for the fall of Adam and Eve to happen, since otherwise they would have had no children, so we would not have existed. This comes from the Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 2:22-26, in the Mormon numbering of the verses. So then all the denominations which consider the Book of Mormon to be scripture, have this belief, including such sizable denominations as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, the Community of Christ, the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, the Church of Jesus Christ (Bickertonite), as well as various small denominations. So then in order that Adam and Eve would fall, and so we would exist, and so have a chance for salvation, then God had planted the tree of good and evil in the garden, to tempt them. So the Fall was very good, but since we are fallen, we need salvation.
But as far as Catholics, or Jehovah’s Witnesses, or Baptists, etc., I don’t see the benefit of the tree of good and evil. With Adam not sinning, they could have had children, and the children would all be in the garden, and very happy. We would all be happy forever, no need for salvation. That would be wonderful.
Considering the other issue of saying ‘bless you’, well, I hope demons don’t exist, but if they do, and saying ‘bless you’ expels them, wouldn’t that be good?

 

[adf417]

Maybe the story about the tree of good and evil is an allegory or metaphor. If God is going to give us free will he would also assume we would use it and the story of the tree of good and evil is a good story describing how man has a tendency to not obey.

I dont know how saying bless you could ever be bad unless the intent was from the evil one. That is up to him to prove. I do recall a passage, and im sure there are more, how Simeon raised up the child Jesus and blessed God - Lk chapter 2. Dont know how this blessing from a human could be considered bad.

Peace!!!

 

[misstherese]

This is a great question. It would seem natural reasoning would be for the bad to perish after death and not suffer. However, this would mean the soul is mortal, which would contradict the Bible.
The Bible mentions the soul approximately 200 times, and it can be seen to have very different meanings according to the context of each passage. This tract will simply demonstrate that the soul is immortal according to Scripture.

Perhaps the strongest contradiction of the JW doctrine is seen in Christ’s descent to Hades. In 1 Peter 3:19, the apostle tells his audience how Jesus “preached to the spirits in prison.” If the dead were aware of nothing, then his preaching would have been futile. In the OT, the prophet Isaiah speaks of the condition of the dead, "Sheol underneath has become agitated at you in order to meet you on coming in . . . all of them speak up and say. . . . Those seeing you will gaze even at you, saying . . . " (Is. 14:9-11). These verses indicate clearly that the dead are conscious, and the NT tells the same story. To be absent from the body is not to be unconscious, but rather it enables one to be home with the Lord, according to Paul (2 Cor. 5:8, Phil. 1:23). The body is just a tent, or tabernacle that does not last (2 Cor. 5:1-4; 2 Pet. 1:13), while man cannot kill the soul (Matt. 10:28). In fact, the souls live past the death of the bodies, since John "saw . . . the souls of those slaughtered . . . and they cried with a loud voice, saying . . . and they were told . . . " (Rev. 6:9-11). Because the soul does not die with the flesh, those in heaven are able to offer our prayers to God (Rev. 5:8), and live in happiness (Rev. 14:13).
God created us without the intention of death. We were meant to live forever happily. However, sin was introduced and by mans own actions. So those who sinned against God had to pay for his actions or be punished justifully. It makes me wonder why those on earth desire murderers to face the death penalty or to stay in prison for life, but deny justice when the topic concerns God, the one who created justice.

 

[misstherese]

You have some great points. Unfortunately I’m not a theology expert or know the Bible front to back but I can give some of my Catholic knowledge.
Yes you would be correct; you can interpret the Bible anyway. This is why it would be more important to learn the history of certain religions and why and how they formed and where they came from. Do their beliefs bear good fruit? Are they bringing about good, holy people? Have they always been consistent with their teachings? This is crucial. That would indicate if their interpretation is correct or not.
Some parts of the Bible are metaphorical and some are literal. This is why it is also important to have an established interpretation to fully understand it. I don’t believe God would inspire John to write such a metaphorical book as Revelation and leave it at that for the people to scratch their heads at. Those are just my thoughts though.

 

[StarMapp]

“in the last two thousand years, 100 people have left the church for what it actually stands for, the rest leave based on what they think it stands for even if they are wrong about the truth”

The late A.B. Msgr Fulton Sheen.

 

[pacloc]

St. John of Damascus (who gathered these ideas from St. Gregory the Theologian) says this about the tree of the knowledge of good and evil:

“In its midst God planted the tree of life and the tree of knowledge. Genesis 2:9 The tree of knowledge was for trial, and proof, and exercise of man’s obedience and disobedience: and hence it was named the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, or else it was because to those who partook of it was given power to know their own nature. Now this is a good thing for those who are mature, but an evil thing for the immature and those whose appetites are too strong , being like solid food to tender babes still in need of milk. For our Creator, God, did not intend us to be burdened with care and troubled about many things, nor to take thought about, or make provision for, our own life. But this at length was Adam’s fate: for he tasted and knew that he was naked and made a girdle round about him: for he took fig-leaves and girded himself about. But before they took of the fruit, They were both naked, Adam and Eve, and were not ashamed. Genesis 2:25 For God meant that we should be thus free from passion, and this is indeed the mark of a mind absolutely void of passion. Yea, He meant us further to be free from care and to have but one work to perform, to sing as do the angels, without ceasing or intermission, the praises of the Creator, and to delight in contemplation of Him and to cast all our care on Him. This is what the Prophet David proclaimed to us when He said, Cast your burden on the Lord, and He will sustain you. And, again, in the Gospels, Christ taught His disciples saying, Take no thought for your life what you shall eat, nor for your body what you shall put on. Matthew 6:25 And further, Seek ye first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you. And to Martha He said, Martha, Martha, you are careful and troubled about many things: but one thing is needful: and Mary has chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her Luke 10:41-42, meaning, clearly, sitting at His feet and listening to His words.”

it is taken from here in Ch. 11:

http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/33042.htm

 

[pacloc]

As for the bless you part. JWs like to be different and make up all kinds of things about origins of customs. From what I have learned, the practice of saying bless you came during the time of a deadly flu plague or something. Beginning to sneeze could mean that you were next to get the flu and die, so all would give God’s blessing to those that sneezed that they not suffer death. And it is a nice thing that in a world that ignores God, somehow people still wish God’s blessing on each other whenever they sneeze.

 

[6857g]

Pacloc thank you because your responses are short and to the point.
About the bless you, that’s what my mom had mentioned she said that that’s what her grandmother told her when she was a kid because her grandma lived in or near that time.
Also thank you to everyone else that has put in their knowledge to help me understand I really appreciate it

 

[jcrichton]

they have inserted the name Jehovah into the New Testament 237 times, when they know that there is no reason to do so. The New Testament was inspired by God and yet the writers were not inspired to mention the name Jehovah or Yahweh, yet the Watchtower has felt it necessary. And Christ himself never mentions the name that they think is vital to being in the right religion, but instead emphasizes His own name, Jesus Christ.

Hi, Pacloc!

…not only that but they refuse to accept Scriptures when they declare that:

4:10 then I am glad to tell you all, and would indeed be glad to tell the whole people of Israel, that it was by the name of Jesus Christ the Nazarene, the one you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by this name and by no other that this man is able to stand up perfectly healthy, here in your presence, today. 4:11 This is the stone rejected by you the builders, but which has proved to be the keystone. 4:12 For of all the names in the world given to men, this is the only one by which we can be saved.’ (Acts)

17:3 And eternal life is this: to know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent. 17:4 I have glorified you on earth and finished the work that you gave me to do. 17:5 Now, Father, it is time for you to glorify me with that glory I had with you before ever the world was. 17:6 I have made your name known to the men you took from the world to give me. They were yours and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. (St. John)

So it is the Name of Jesus Christ not Yahweh that has been Revealed, because to Know the Father is to Know the Son and this is Salvation: to Believe in the Name of Jesus Christ!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Hi!

…nor do they clarify that it is a derivative of Yahweh meshed with Adonai and that a Catholic Monk was the first to introduce it in the early 1300’s.

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Hi!

The tree nor the fruit was bad.

What was bad was Adam’s and Eve’s disobedience as they rejected God’s Command to no eat of the fruit while accepting the creature’s (Satan) assurance that they would not suffer any consequences that instead they would become as God, having the knowledge of good and evil.

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Hi, Tom!

Your eisegesis rejects every passage that state that hell is a place of eternal fire and torment… even at Judgment it is stated that:

21:8 But the legacy for cowards, for those who break their word, or worship obscenities, for murderers and fornicators, and for fortune-tellers, idolaters or any other sort of liars, is the second death in the burning lake of sulphur.’ (Apocalypse [Revelation])

9:47 And if your eye should cause you to sin, tear it out; it is better for you to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell 9:48 where their worm does not die nor their fire go out. (St. Mark)

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Hi, Tom!

…again, we do not know what would have happened since it did not happen–that’s just an ‘what if’ proposition.

Consider that their theology has them elevating to gods who will populate the universe and fill the planets with their offspring.

They got both interpretation from the same source, didn’t they?

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Hi, Tom!

Sadly, Christianity is divided because of man’s determination to follow man’s teachings and ways.

However, when confronted with this issue Jesus clearly explained it:

12:26 Now about the dead rising again, have you never read in the Book of Moses, in the passage about the Bush, how God spoke to him and said: I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob? 12:27 He is God, not of the dead, but of the living. You are very much mistaken.’ (St. Mark)

…as for interpretations, you are correct when man bases his belief on interpretation he misses what God has Revealed and declared:

4:24 God is spirit, and those who worship must worship in spirit and truth.’ (St. John)

10:28 ‘Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; fear him rather who can destroy both body and soul in hell. (St. Matthew)

2:7 Yahweh God fashioned man of dust from the soil. Then he breathed into his nostrils a breath of life, and thus man became a living being. (Genesis)

Maran atha!

Angel