Machine gun fire into Las Vegas crowd at Route 91 music Festival

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The whole insurance thing is really a way to administratively ban legal ownership of firearms. No insurance company will open themselves up to the liability of something like the Las Vegas shooting, so nobody will offer insurance, so nobody will be allowed to legally own firearms. It’s a backdoor gun ban.
I don’t think so. I think that most gun owners are responsible and do things they should like keeping their weapon in safes and continuously training. I believe their cost would be fairly small. On the other hand, people who have high powered weapons and are generally irresponsible (for example, the mother of the Newtown shooter) would have to be a higher rate of insurance.
 
yes, i remember reading those. I was responding more to the administrative backdoor ban part of ucfengr’s post, which is what i had not considered.
 
I do not ignore what did happen. I’m only pointing out that it could have been far worse and likely came very close to it. And ignoring the potential for which Paddock was evidently prepared is in no way justified. In fact, it points out that there are very serious vulnerabilities we have in this society and that they are not going to be removed by restricting firearm ownership by honest citizens.
So, there have been dozens of mass shootings since Oklahoma City, so let’s solve the Oklahoma City problem. That makes sense.
 
On the other hand, people who have high powered weapons and are generally irresponsible (for example, the mother of the Newtown shooter) would have to be a higher rate of insurance.
people who make statements like these generally don’t know what they are talking about.
 
With the growth of population all crimes have the potential to happen more often. A lot of the mass shootings we’ve experienced are an immigration problem. Others may be a psychiatric drug problem. Why should honest, law abiding Americans have their rights taken away when the solutions to the actual problem aren’t tried?
What solutions are you suggesting? I missed that. Please update us with your ideas.
 
owning a particular type of gun does not make a person any less responsible. you are making that up to justify your position.
 
It’s about all citizens having equal restrictions because we cannot tell who will use these weapons to kill massive amounts of people.
We can’t tell who will use a car to kill people. We can’t tell who will use a frying pan to kill people. So we need to ban everything then. Anything less isn’t right to those who are killed.
What solutions are you suggesting? I missed that. Please update us with your ideas.
An immigration ban on people from certain regions of the world. Institutionalizing people with certain psychiatric disorders.
 
owning a particular type of gun does not make a person any less responsible. you are making that up to justify your position.
No, owning a particular type of gun doesn’t make any person less responsible. I didn’t mean to imply that. I do think the costs would be higher for higher power weapons and I do think the costs will be higher for those that don’t properly secure their weapons from their mentally-ill children. Like the mother of the Newtown shooter.
 
An immigration ban on people from certain regions of the world. Institutionalizing people with certain psychiatric disorders.
I’m not sure how either helps in the Las Vegas case.

And, in the latter case, how do you reconcile that with the Constitution and the right to free movement and property?
 
We need smarter regulations on firearms. People can still be able to possess a gun to hunt or protect themselves with restrictions and a means to enforce those restrictions.

Deal with the first and greatest means that thousands of people are being killed, then deal with the next thing. Don’t use the fact that people can use other ways to kill as a means to allow them to kill with anything.

Giving up some ease of owning a gun should be a small sacrifice in order to save more lives
 
No, owning a particular type of gun doesn’t make any person less responsible. I didn’t mean to imply that.
you did not just imply it, you outright claimed it. how is “people who have high powered weapons and are generally irresponsible” supposed to be taken except for the plain meaning of what you said?
 
you did not just imply it, you outright claimed it. how is “people who have high powered weapons and are generally irresponsible” supposed to be taken except for the plain meaning of what you said?
And I admit that the wording could lead one to that conclusion, so I apologize. I meant people who have higher powered weapons would have to expect to pay more in insurance similarly to those that own high powered cars. Also, those that are irresponsible with their weapon and do not properly train themselves or secure their weapon would also have to expect to pay more for insurance.
 
Save more lives by banning abortion. More than one million per year in the United States.
 
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ucfengr:
The whole insurance thing is really a way to administratively ban legal ownership of firearms. No insurance company will open themselves up to the liability of something like the Las Vegas shooting, so nobody will offer insurance, so nobody will be allowed to legally own firearms. It’s a backdoor gun ban.
I don’t think so. I think that most gun owners are responsible and do things they should like keeping their weapon in safes and continuously training. I believe their cost would be fairly small. On the other hand, people who have high powered weapons and are generally irresponsible (for example, the mother of the Newtown shooter) would have to be a higher rate of insurance.
How is an insurance company going to know how I store my firearms or how much time I spend at the range? Without that information how are they going to accurately assess risk? Even if they could monitor that information, a single event like Las Vegas or Newtowne could easily bankrupt an insurance company. What insurance company would be willing to take on that financial risk? The obvious answer is none, which is why insurance mandates for firearms ownership is really a backdoor ban. I suspect you know this is true, which is why you support it. For all the talk about “reasonable gun control”, the real goal of the gun control movement is banning the private ownership of firearms. 2nd amendment supporters have caught on to this which is why our instinct is to be skeptical of any new laws.
 
Lots of things kill far more people than firearms every year. Government monitoring and control of our diets and exercise would save far more lives every year than even a total gun ban. Would you be willing to make that “small” sacrifice to save lives, or do you only support sacrifice for other people?
 
So, there have been dozens of mass shootings since Oklahoma City, so let’s solve the Oklahoma City problem. That makes sense.
911 and Oklahoma City together killed more people than all the gun shootings combined. More recently, the BAstille Day murders by truck greatly outnumbered the Paddock killings. Why ignore the obvious fact that mass killings are becoming a commonplace, and assume that restricting the gun rights of honest citizens is somehow the answer.

But I think most here understand that what the left wants is just a gun ban for its own sake, having nothing to do with seriously addressing what has become a significant societal hazard.
 
I’m not sure how either helps in the Las Vegas case.

And, in the latter case, how do you reconcile that with the Constitution and the right to free movement and property?
It doesn’t. I don’t think you can stop cases like this guy. That is why I am not floundering for a solution. If anyone really thinks they can solve evil let me know.

Immigrants don’t have a right to come to the US. It is funny some think non citizens have a right to come here but citizens don’t have a right to firearms which are specifically protected in our constitution.
Deal with the first and greatest means that thousands of people are being killed, then deal with the next thing. Don’t use the fact that people can use other ways to kill as a means to allow them to kill with anything.

Giving up some ease of owning a gun should be a small sacrifice in order to save more lives
But most people don’t think taking away the tool stops the problem. The person will just find another tool. So we’d have to eradicate all tools.

How about banning large gatherings so this can’t happen. That is a small sacrifice to save lives, right?
 
Ok, I suppose I’ll stop buying junk food since people are committing mass murder with saturated fats.
 
I’m surprised it took this long. Usually the “but abortion!” response comes much earlier in a thread.

It is, of course, an admission that the poster has nothing in the way of refutation of the opposing argument.
 
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