Man Hating

[Charlemagne]

coeyannie:

I am 65 years old and almost, mind you, got caught up in the man-bashing era. The plain, simple truth of the matter is, women want to be men, and act like men, and do everything men do, even when it is physically impossible, and then they want to be treated with utmost gentleness, blah, blah, blah. It is disgusting. When I get e-mails bashing men, I delete them. Women have bull dozed their way into Men’s clubs, changed the golf times around to accomodate them, razed havoc in the schools, and in the work place. They bull doze their way around the altar in our churches and now, want to be priests. They are arrogant and full of hate. Strong words, yes. But, look at our children. Women can’t stay home and take care of their children because they are afraid they will miss a promotion, or a man may get ahead of them financially. We live in a total upside down world. I am glad I stayed at home and took care of my children. I am not patting myself on the back. I wouldn’t take my kids to any daycare place if I had to eat dirt three times a day.

God gave us a good plan. Why do we have to mess it up.

God Bless you! You can pat yourself on the back if you want too. I commend you for what you did - take seriously the responsibility to raise and educate your children. Both men and women will have to answer to God for how their children turned out.

 

[JimG]

Bill Buck:

…During the course of our lunch, as the meandering nature of lunchtime conversations often do, the direction changed. The poor guys were now being bludgeoned by gripes about their faults both real and imaginary. …

…“Some body has to defend your poor husbands.” I said. So the conversation again turned, this time to how we can poison our attitudes towards those whom we love by griping about them.

Bill’s post reminded me of my own days at the office. It always amazed me what some women would say about their husbands. Nothing—not even the most intimate details—was off limits for discussion and adverse comments. While this might be entertaining at times, it was also sad for what it said about their marriages. And I was always secretly thankful to be secure in the knowledge that my own wife never discussed personal matters with others. Not only that, she always had only good things to say about me! And I only had good things to say about her. Never in conversations with male friends did I ever disparage my wife in any way. So I guess we were blessed in that respect. When each party has only the good of the other in view, things can go very well. She is gone now, died at age 48, but I’ll always be grateful that the happy memories are not marred by any past hurtful words. And in her own group of women friends, I never heard of any of the group disparaging their husbands. They would talk about their concerns, but never denigrate their spouses. I guess when it comes to married couples, it’s a question of whether it’s more important to be right than to be happy.

JimG

 

[Fortiterinre]

Disclaimer: I am a guy. I agree with the above that a lot of this is good-natured kidding around and “venting,” but I also think even jokes have a true target most of the time. Have you watched the TV show “Everyone Loves Raymond Except His Shrill Wife”? (Kidding, I don’t watch often, Deborah is wonderful). In reparation I will say that us guys bring some of this on ourselves. Women are typically a lot better than men at ANTICIPATING UNEXPRESSED needs, and men tend to wait for the needs to be expressed…and expressed…and expressed…

 

[Miss_Piggy]

I think this is a very interesting topic. I think it is a bigger problem than we realize. Out of curiousity, I bought Dr. Laura’s book The Proper Care and Feeding of Men that Jennifer J. mentions and I’ve found it very interesting and think that it perhaps contains more truth than I care to admit. I would like to hear anyone else’s comments on what she has to say. I might start another thread. You really need to read the whole book before you can make a judgment. Better yet, have your husband read the book and see what he thinks. I don’t think she expresses a Catholic view of marriage, but I don’t think she’s entirely off base either. I’ve read two other books that reminded me of Dr. Laura’s. They were Fascinating Womanhood by Helen Andelin and How to Change Your Husband by “A Friend of Medjugorje”. They both addressed the needs of a man versus a woman and the great power a woman has to inspire her husband to be the man God has called him to be. As I watched President Reagan’s funeral, the thing that struck me over and over was how much they loved each other and how happy they seemed. I thought at the time that Mrs. Reagan could write a book on how to get a man to love you like that! What did they know that so many other divorced couples these days don’t seem to know?! I suspect if a generation back tried to tell most of us today, we would scoff at them. Since Satan would like to break up the family, it would seem logical that he would start by dividing the husband and wife. It’s worth considering.

 

[Jennifer_J]

sullivansoul:

what is dh?

Why oh why didn’t I learn this stuff in school!?!

Dear Husband or Darling Husband (I’ve heard other d’s referred to, also!)

 

[Tom]

kjvail:

Men are dirty
Men are slobs
Men are uncouth and unrefined
Men cold and/or brutish
Men are ignorant and/or stupid

Well, yeah o.k. I am… so what’s your point… lol

 

[karisue]

milimac:

I think in many cases it’s probably just good-natured kidding around, but I’m of the mind that even jokes have a certain element of seriousness in them. If there isn’t some balance in the comments (Do these women also praise their husbands or men in general from time to time?) then I think it could have a gradual negative effect as you said.

IME, most women do not make a point of mentioning the good points – thinking about it right now, I can’t think of very many unsolicited complimentary comments made to me about husbands.

As a former husband-basher, I shudder at some of the things I’ve said about my husband to girlfriends. It is very difficult to resist the temptation to share the things my husband does that makes me crazy … but I have found that it is far better in the long run to offer it up instead. I am concerned about the crumbling marriages I observe b/c I see a connection btn the husband-bashing and the marital problems.

I also think it’s interesting to note that in our little circles of friends, most men do not say negative things about their wives to other men. Even in “good humored fun.”

I must add the disclaimer that my experience is clearly anecdotal.

 

[Trinitatem]

I stay at home, (a blessing and sacrifice I’m thankful for) and am “CEO of household affairs,” which includes our children. Part of my job is to build up my husband, whether that is to cook him a hearty meal after a hard day at the job, or to just listen to him about his terrible week. This does not lessen my importance or make me a servant to my spouse. This is what I offer with no expectation about something in return. However, I do receive much, for love given is love received. I think, and I notice the man/husband-bashing as well, it may make women feel better to “have an outlet” they may not at home and a support group for their complaints (women listen to women). But it has a counter-effect. Talking negative about your spouse (and embellishing at that) promotes a more negative image of the husband each time it is done, working to unravel marriage rather than build it up. That is why gossip is a sin. Male-bashing is evil as well, aren’t we supposed to “love our neighbor?”

 

[ktm]

This is a very interesting thread. I was watching a speech given by Michael Peroutka (presidential candidate) about this very issue. He was talking about how fatherhood in general is under attack in this country. Watch any sitcom and husbands/fathers are depicted as stupid, lazy morons who can’t do anything right. Perhaps this is a symptom of our feminized culture. I never thought about it before.

 

[Black_Jaque]

Part of it is that men are the last segment of society that you can poke fun of without being lambasted for non-political correctness.

I like to think it’s because we have broad shoulders and can take it.

However, I do have limits. I finally had to refuse to read any more Berenstein Bears books because the Papa bear was always such an idiotic fool. Not worthy of much respect.

Some of the early Berenstein Bears books were good. But now its the same old tired schtick.

I think humor has become the weenies way of saying what they really think. Phrase it as a jest, then whenever someone calls you to task - you can always back out by saying, “I was just kidding! Jeez lighten up.”

 

[Bonnie]

Before I was married, I worked in an office where husband-bashing was a regular topic. One woman described cutting short the honeymoon & returning home not speaking. She had a list a yard long of all the nasty, horrible things her dh said & did. I was so concerned about her being on the brink of divorce, that I asked how long they had been married. 15 years & 2 chidren! Apparently, they loved to hate each other.

I decided then & there to NEVER say negative things about my husband in public. I married a couple of years later & I’ve kept my promise. He isn’t perfect, but neither am I.

 

[Ham1]

sullivansoul:

what is dh?

Why oh why didn’t I learn this stuff in school!?!

DH stands for “designated hitter.”

This whole thread reminds me of a T-shirt that I saw once.

It said:

ALL MEN ARE IDIOTS…

AND MY HUSBAND IS THEIR KING!

I actually always wanted to get one of these for my wife, because I like the idea of being considered king of something.

 

[Detroit_Sue]

sullivansoul:

what is dh?

Why oh why didn’t I learn this stuff in school!?!

DH = Dear husband
DW = Dear Wife,
etc.

Speaking from experience, I worked in a big company with 150 women in my department. You could cut the bitterness with a knife. Well, I joined in, and you know what? It carried over to my personal life. I was absolutely horrendous to my poor husband. With my conversion and career change, I have come to realize how much I hurt him, even when he didn’t know how I was acting.

It is **not **cute, it is not ‘just a joke.’ It’s mean and hateful, and you know what? I don’t do it anymore, and it has made my marriage better than I could have ever imagined.

Funny thing, I never met a guy who talked that way about his wife.

 

[cmom]

Jokes are usually a safe way to make a point.

If you ask all those complaining women what kinds of relationship they had with their fathers, you would probably find it was pretty bad.

Girls learn to relate well to their husbands, if they first were loved and cherished and related well to their fathers.

The sins of the parents are visited on the children.

 

[Maddalena]

My mom and her friends will get together and gripe about their husbands ( My parents weren’t Catholic when they married.). It seems like such an awful thing to do. I often think that if I get married, I would never badmouth my poor husband. Am I just not being realistic? lol I’m only 17. x_x;;

 

[Smoke_Boy]

Great topic! I think the modern feminist movement has been one of the most destructive movements in history. How’s that for openers?

The egalitarian mentality (we are all the same-not just equal) has blurred the complimentary roles God has created for us. Someone on this thread suggested that each gender should learn to be more like the other. This is simply absurd. Again, God made us complimentary not the same.

The modern feminist movement has made woman resent her complimentary God-given role. It’s adherents have taken control of influential institutions (schools) to propogate their pernicious agenda through Women’s studies courses, diversity classes and the like. The media are willing accomplices. This is a poison we need to fight hard and pray to defeat.

As far as books go. My wife read How to Get Your Husband to Talk to You, sold in most catholic bookstores and written by two christian (not sure if catholic women) I heard one of them interviewed on catholic radio .

 

[Elizabeth_B]

Detroit Sue:

It is **not **cute, it is not ‘just a joke.’ It’s mean and hateful, and you know what? I don’t do it anymore, and it has made my marriage better than I could have ever imagined.

I agree completely.

Too many of us have lowered our view of covental marriage to the level portrayed on network sitcoms.

I vowed to love, honor and cherish my husband. Insulting him and betraying confidences in the name of humor is contrary to my vows.

I’ve learned over the years that men and women are different. My husband expresses his deep love differently than I do. He confronts problems and communicates differently than I do. Recognizing and honoring these differences have only improved our marriage more than I ever dreamed

 

[DaveBj]

Detroit Sue:

DH = Dear husband
DW = Dear Wife,

Sometime you will also see SU = spousal unit (not to be confused with SO = significant other).

DaveBj

 

[milimac]

Chaffa55:

On the other hand, (unlike women) I don’t think most men have gained much new insight about female behavior during the past generation; in the home, they have generally resisted taking on traditionally female roles. In the workplace, men sometimes tend to view women as they would other male competitors. In my opinion, this dichotomy of understanding and insight might be the cause for male-female disconnects, and the man-hating.

While not disagreeing with your carefully-qualified post, I think some may disagree whether men taking on traditionally female roles is a good solution. Generally speaking, I believe men are better at some things than women, and women are better at some things than men. I think a marriage is best when it takes advantage of both spouses’ strengths and abilities while appropriately dividing tasks.

As a simple example – since I’m taller and stronger than my wife (men are generally stronger and taller than women) it’s easier and more efficient for me to change the lightbulbs around the house (looky what I can do!) since I can do many of them by hand whereas my wife would have to drag a heavy ladder up and down the stairs.

Another important point: while your analysis might describe a valid cause for the man-hating, and while it may even be justified from time to time, it should be made clear that it’s not an excuse for it.

 

[ecs_220]

karisue:

…And I’m not talking about NARAL style feminists – I mean that even my very devout Catholic (and Protestant) friends love to talk about their disappointment in their husbands (and other men)…

I call it “Trickle-Down Bigotry”.

In America, economic power is determined not by who earns the money, but by who spends the money. Men do earn more* – due in very large part to the fact that they work longer hours (according to the Labor Dept., this includes about 11% longer hours inside the home * too, ladies). In the average family women make roughly 80% of the buying decisions – that’s a lot of economic power, and is the main reason why the Big-Business-owned-and-controlled “mainstream” media pander to the prejudices of those who control the bucks. Ergo: in television-land, Men are Idiots – and could barely tie their own shoes were it not for smart, savvy Wymyn.

The best way to combat these giant corporations, and the hate they sell, is by a thousand little acts of kindness – as well as cancelling subscriptions, turning off the TV, and refusing to buy products from advertisers who sell this nonsense.

*By the way, when you hear the latest rant about the gender/earnings gap (you know: about how women supposedly only earn X cents for every dollar that a man earns), remember these two factors: 1) Women who work at the same jobs for the same employers *with the same amount of seniority * earn the same (it’s required by law), and 2) the Anti-Male Brigade cleverly includes in their figures ALL men and ALL women – knowing that there are more male than female billionaires. Including the Bill Gateses and Warren Buffets of the world along with all other income-earners conveniently skews the so-called “statistics” in their favor. Since the overwhelming majority of us will never see a billion dollars, any charge of supposed “inequity” that includes billion-earners is meaningless.