Many people are MISSING the boat

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Sounds so familiar…
Several times familiar.
Such a persistent reference …
 
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“The structure [of 1970] is the same as the previous breviaries.”

Matins gutted from a norm of 3 nocturns on most days to no nocturns. That’s just one glaring structural change. Matins, in fact, no longer exists; it has been replaced by a novel “Office of Readings” that can used at any hour.

Comparisons, incidentally, to the Monastic Breviary are irrelevant in Roman Breviary discussions. We are talking about the Roman Office, not the Monastic, or the Dominican, or the Carmelite…the Roman.
 
KMG said:
Matins, in fact, no longer exists; it has been replaced by a novel “Office of Readings” that can used at any hour.
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But that still can be, and is used in many communities, as Matins.

Moreover, Matins in the old Breviary was often anticipated the previous evening as well, and often the old Breviary was prayed in one sitting to “get it out of the way”, something expressly forbidden in the LOTH which requires that the verity of the hour be respected to end this abuse.

Sorry but your argument doesn’t fly with the reality of praxis. There is a reason the Breviary was reformed.
 
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The Office of Readings can be anticipated too. There’s nothing wrong with anticipation.
 
And thanks to Pope Benedict for clarifying things, any Roman Rite cleric can use the old Breviary freely, with no permission, exclusively, and ignore the Liturgy of the Hours entirely.
 
Eddie, you know we’ve been over this before.
The Church no longer uses the Baltimore Catechism as an official catechism.
We have a new Catechism of the Catholic Church now and not everything in it is the same as the old Baltimore Catechism. (Example: the teaching on Limbo)

I enjoy reading the old Baltimore Catechism because I was raised with it, but I don’t refer people, especially new Catholics, to it because some of the stuff it says is now presented in a different way by the official Church catechism.

Be careful about confusing people by referencing these extremely old books.
 
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Eddie18 said:
It’s one thing to come to a better understanding of a doctrine.
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And “better understanding” is exactly what people have been telling you, while you try to drown them out by repeating “No, no, no.”
 
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Baltimore Catechism, and no reason not to recommend it without reservation to any Catholic.
 
KMG said:
The Office of Readings can be anticipated too. There’s nothing wrong with anticipation.
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Of course there’s nothing wrong with it, I do it myself sometimes, though I prefer Matins (or Vigils as it’s called in the monastic world) early in the morning (5:30).

My point is that flexibility for this Office, regardless of what it’s called, is not an innovation of the LOTH. It was permitted in the old Breviary as well. It was just extended in the LOTH. That would in fact be an example of “organic” development in the LOTH. As would the placement of the hymn at Lauds and Vespers, which was standardized to the practice of the other Hours, and not in itself an innovation. Nor is reducing the number of psalms per week an innovation. The tradition is to pray the psalter over a specific time period. For the desert fathers, it was one day. For St. Benedict, one week. For the LOTH, 4 weeks. Mind you I concede that eliminating the imprecatory psalms and verses is an innovation (which Bl. Paul VI insisted on).

Moreover the General Instructions of the Monastic LOTH allows Benedictines the use of the secular LOTH for just cause, but strongly recommends a two week distribution of the psalms of the Office of Readings for Vigils which I use, in two Nocturns, when I am compelled to use the LOTH instead of the monastic Breviary when I’m too busy.

Sometimes a bit of flexibility is a good thing.

Yes pope emeritus Benedict does allow the use of the older Breviary, but he didn’t require it. I think you’ll find that the realities of modern clergy are such that most prefer the LOTH. For instance, in my area 4 parishes were merged into one pastoral unit with only one priest, one deacon, and a retired priest who helps out. The monastic Breviary I use is 150 psalms per week. It’s tough enough for a retired oblate like me especially in summer when I’m busier. For a priest having to cover 4 churches and administer them, it must be particularly difficult.
 
Having reached the bottom of this thread, I wish it had instead contained a rule in which you must reference boats at all times while carrying on this conversation.
 
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KMG said:
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Baltimore Catechism, and no reason not to recommend it without reservation to any Catholic.
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It’s out of date. If you grew up with it, you can see which sections were changed for the new Catechism. If you did not grow up with it, and are a new Catholic, you may get a wrong idea or confusion from some of the teachings.

The official Catechism of the Catholic Church, which is the CCC, is the one the Church uses, promotes, and sells itself in its churches (I bought my copy there from the book rack).

If you continue to deny this, you are just making yourself look like a fool.
 
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DisorientingSneeze said:
Having reached the bottom of this thread, I wish it had instead contained a rule in which you must reference boats at all times while carrying on this conversation.
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Is this the boat we supposedly missed? Because a lot of people seem to have been gone for about the last 50 years and just got back.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
If not for the courage of the fearless crew, the thread would be lost.
 
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A few of us on this thread are really intent on rocking the boat! 🚢


Don’t rock the boat, baby
 
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