marian apparitions demonic?

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I have a rosary that changed to “gold color.” Actually I have 2, one I buried in the hands of my mother. I’ve never been to Medjugorje, but I believe the Mother of God is appearing there. So do several priests I know and Bishops who’ve journeyed there. 'Never been there myself, and my life is changed for the better because of Medjugorje.

You don’t need to go to Medjugorje for a rosary to change. Try praying the Rosary every day. One of the promises is “Signal Graces.” My Rosaries were signals.

Is mine “true gold” like you write? Who cares! They are brilliantly yellow! Actually, I can pull a bead back, and see underneath that it is still silver-toned. So, the brilliant gold color is like it has been applied!

They are “brilliant” gold colored.

Thank you, Holy Mother, for my Signal Graces. I Love you.***

MeMaw…why all the anger?
I am NOT angry, seems to me you are because I don’t agree with you. WHY so defensive? Like Fr. John Hardon S.J. said, "God does not do phony miracles. .I do pray the Rosary, my time worn Rosary.Still the same ole color as always. I have belonged to the Blue Army, World Apostolate of Fatima, for many, many years. I believe Fatima is the TRUE apparition of our day and I believe Pope John Paul felt the same, as he spoke of it so many times, it is in his writings, he was there at least twice and gave Our Lady of Fatima credit for saving his life when he was shot. Revealed the 3rd Secret and Beautified the two small children, Jacenta and Francisco. Several Popes have spoke of Fatima. I have read much of what Pope John Paul wrote and said but I have NEVER found where he mentioned Medjugorje. In spite of all the rumors claiming he did.
 
Homily of Bishop Ratko Peric of Medjugorje - June 15, 2006
The text of the June 15, 2006 homily of Bishop Ratko Peric was just sent to me, and after confirming authenticity via the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno website, where it is posted in Croatian, English, and Italian, I am going to post it here, in its entirety.

The website for Mostar-Duvno is built with some kind of frames that do not allow me to link directly to a specific statement, unless someone can explain how after visiting the site. I will provide the diocesan site at the conclusion, but it will be easiest to read it here, then I will provide a roadmap on how to get it at the bishop’s site.

This will be a very long post as it is the entire homily. The setting is Confirmation at the Parish of St. James in Medjugorje. He addresses the candidates in the first part, then moves on to discuss Medjugorje in the second part. I know you may be tempted to jump forward, but please read what this man has to say about confirmation itself. It is very rich.

Photo Source and related article. You will need to scroll down to find it. Note that there is no mention of the critical 2nd half of the homily. This kind of selective coverage is deceptive to say the least. I speak limited Croatian and attempted to watch the Real Video, but nothing happened when I clicked it.

As for the second half, I know this will hurt or anger some people who are very close to Medjugorje. But, what we must keep in mind is that this man is the apostolic successor of the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno and we owe him respect as such. At the very least, his words should be read and reflected upon, not ignored. I pray that Medjugorje websites will offer these words to you, as well, but since that is not likely, I will provide them here.

I believe this will be seen in Catholic media in the coming hours, weeks, and months.

SOLEMNITY OF THE MOST HOLY BODY AND BLOOD OF CHRIST
MEDJUGORJE, 15 - VI - 2006

Dear brothers and sisters,

Dear candidates for Confirmation, I am happy to be with you and your families here today for the conferring of the sacrament of Confirmation. Through the required instruction and the sacrament of Reconciliation you have prepared yourselves to faithfully receive the seven gifts of the Holy Spirit. The gifts of wisdom, understanding, knowledge and counsel, are concerned with our minds, with the enlightening of our use of reason; while the gifts of fortitude, piety and fear of the Lord, regard our hearts and the strengthening of our free will. These are not fleeting gifts that you will joyfully receive today as candidates for Confirmation and which will be gone tomorrow. This is the seal of the gift of the Holy Spirit. Once sealed you always remain sealed with the Holy Spirit! However, each of these gifts requires your efforts in conformity with your growth in knowledge and witnessing through a life of faith.

I. - GIFTS OF THE SPIRIT. Hence, be not afraid young friends, to be wise in God’s eyes, even if it means appearing foolish in the eyes of people. God’s “foolishness” is wiser and more prudent than the wisest of people.

Do not fear to be strong in God before people, even though the world may consider you cowards and backward. Christ the Lord, God’s Truth, teaches us: "Everyone who acknowledges me before others, I also will acknowledge before my Father in heaven (Mt 10:32).

Do not be ashamed to be fearful of the Lord and pious, full of awe towards God and his holiness, even though this passing world may ridicule and mock you. The world has no fear of, nor sense of shame in transgressing God’s commandments. We on the other hand, are believers and worshipers of God, who adore him in spirit and truth.

The world counsels on how you can most easily lose yourself in fleeting passions, but the Holy Spirit counsels us on how we can most easily reach eternal life. Whoever then takes truthful counsel, is lead by the Spirit on the right path.

The world tempts you and invites you to behave according to its perverted fantasies and passions, yet the Holy Spirit lets you learn and discern by acquiring unending knowledge that leads to the Father’s house. Today, do not allow yourself to just receive the seal on your forehead and then continue living as if you do not possess the Holy Spirit within you.

II. - SOLEMNITY OF THE MOST HOLY BODY AND BLOOD OF CHRIST.

The Church celebrates today the Solemnity of the Most Holy Body and Blood of Christ. We Catholics believe that the historical event of Jesus’ Last Supper, described in each of the four Gospels, is one of the greatest mysteries of our holy faith. During that evening, the Lord Jesus, while he ate with his disciples, took bread, blessed it, broke the bread and gave it to them saying: “Take; this is my body”. He then took the cup, gave thanks and gave it to them. And all drank from it. “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many” (Mk 14:22-23).

Eucharistic sacrifice. The mystery of the Lord’s Supper is first of all a sign of Jesus’ sacrifice through his death on the cross and resurrection to new life, which he offers us as a divine gift. Why is this at the very core of Christian faith? Because this is what God desired and accomplished! If the all-wise God decided on this path of salvation, then his entire divine intervention is nothing else than wisdom and goodness. We become wise and prudent when we accept this sacrifice as an expression of God’s grace and love. The sacrifice can only be understood and accepted in the context of love. Sacrifice is the most convincing demonstration and evidence of love. God is Love. Therefore, the Eucharistic sacrifice is an expression of God’s love towards us. In a specific historical moment on Calvary, Jesus offered the sacrifice of himself to his Father, as a testimony of his complete Love of God and of humanity. We through our own efforts of piety of heart and mind, participate in the liturgical celebrations and daily offerings of ourselves to God.

Eucharistic banquet. This mystery of Jesus’ love is not only his divine sacrifice for us weak people, but it is also our spiritual food for our journey towards eternal life. There is no health, nor life without bread. Mankind does not know all the ingredients of bread and wine, yet he still eats and drinks of them with joy and moderation. Are we even aware of the process of how wheat and grapevines grow? How does a seed sprout or a grape mature? How is the seed transformed into bread, or the grapes into wine? Do we know how bread and wine are then transformed in our living organisms? Despite our lack of knowledge, this does not lessen the strength of bread nor wine to sustain our lives in good health through their nourishment.

Something similar occurs with our spiritual health. We cannot understand what the Holy Eucharist is, but we accept it with faith and partake of it with the greatest respect of heart for our eternal salvation. Jesus said to us: “Whoever eats of this bread will live forever” (Jn 6:51). While our earthly bread and wine serve for this life, so too Jesus’ Body and Blood serve for spiritual and eternal life. None of us are worthy of this for we are all sinners: in our thoughts, words and actions, as well as through our omissions in doing the good that we should do. Whoever unworthily eats and drinks of this Sacrament, that is, while in sin, in disorder, in obstinacy, that person is guilty of sinning against the Body and Blood. However, those who confess and repent for their sins, God grants them forgiveness and feeds them with the Body and Blood of Christ. Let us give thanks to God who first of all sets us free from our sins in the sacrament of Confession and who nourishes us with his Eucharistic Body. The Mass is therefore the center of our personal and communal lives. This is the will of our heavenly Father, established by the Son of God, which happens through the power of the Holy Spirit. We believe in the words of Christ, for his words “are spirit and life” (Jn 6:63).

In memory of him. The Lord Jesus left us a great divine truth and mystery: “This is my Body”. “This is my Blood”. These words were spoken by Christ himself. From the very beginning, the Church has always literally understood this holy text and message from Jesus’ Last Supper. Not even a single letter has ever been changed, nor have they been understood according to other symbolic meanings in order to make them more acceptable to people. Jesus said these words once and forever! He also commanded that this be done in memory of him! In memory of God’s great works of salvation. We acknowledge and believe in what has been communicated to us! We celebrate the liturgy in the same fashion as we have received it. Let us give thanks to God for the immeasurable gift of Jesus’ Most Holy Body and Blood. This act and mystery contain the past: “Christ has died”; the present of Christ’s resurrection: “Christ has risen”; and the future: “Christ will come again”, when he shall come and prepare a place for us so that we may be where he is (Jn 14:3).

III. – “APPARITIONS”. First of all, the fact that a person makes a humble Confession and receives Holy Communion in this parish church and that this person feels spiritually well due to God’s forgiveness, each and every believer will recognize and give due praise to God for this, who is the source of all graces. At the same time, this person will take care not to proceed from this state of grace towards an illogical and inconsistent conclusion: “I made a Confession. I feel good and now I am converted. Therefore the Madonna is appearing in Medjugorje!” This type of believer and penitent is nonetheless obliged to go to confession, receive the other sacraments, observe the Commandments, whether any private apparitions are recognized or not.

Secondly, I would be an irresponsible minister of the Mystery of the Body and Blood of Christ, if today I were not to publicly advise, from this place and on this occasion as well, to all those interested throughout the world, that in this local Church of Mostar-Duvno, there exists something similar to a schism. A number of priests that have been expelled from the Franciscan OFM Order by the Generalate of the Order, due to their disobedience to the Holy Father, for years now have been forcefully keeping a few parish churches and rectories along with church inventory. They have not only been illegally active in these parishes, but they have also administered the sacraments profanely, while others invalidly, such as Confession and Confirmation, or they have assisted at invalid marriages. This type of anti-ecclesial behaviour is shocking to all of us. At the same time, this scandal of sacrilegiously administering the sacraments, especially of the Most Holy Body of Christ, must shock all the faithful as well who invalidly confess their sins to these priests and participate in sacrilegious liturgies. We pray to the Lord that this scandal and schism be uprooted as soon as possible from our midst.

Thirdly, I am truly grateful to the Holy Father the Pope, to John Paul II of blessed memory and to the reigning Benedict XVI, who have always respected the judgements of the bishops of Mostar-Duvno, of the previous as well as the current bishop, regarding the so-called “apparitions” and “messages” of Medjugorje, all the while recognizing the Holy Father’s right to give a final decision on these events. The judgements of the bishops, after all the canonical investigations made thus far, can be summarized in these following points.

Part 1
 
Part 2,

Homily of Bishop Ratko Peric , Continued,

1 - Medjugorje is a catholic parish in which liturgical and pastoral activities are carried out, just as in all the other parishes of this diocese of Mostar-Duvno. No-one except the official Church authorities is then authorized to attribute the formal title of “shrine” to this place.

2 - On the basis of Church investigations of the events of Medjugorje, it cannot be determined that these events involve supernatural apparitions or revelations. This means that till now the Church has not accepted, neither as supernatural nor as Marian, any of the apparitions.

3 - Priests who canonically administer this parish of Medjugorje or those who come as visitors, are not authorised to express their private views contrary to the official position of the Church on the so-called “apparitions” and “messages”, during celebrations of the sacraments, neither during other common acts of piety, nor in the Catholic media.

4 - The Catholic faithful are not only free from any obligation to believe in the authenticity of the “apparitions” but they must also know that church pilgrimages are not allowed, whether official or private, individual or group, or from other parishes, if they presuppose the authenticity of the “apparitions” or if by undertaking them attempt to certify these “apparitions”.

5 - As the local Bishop, I maintain that regarding the events of Medjugorje, on the basis of the investigations and experience gained thus far, throughout these last 25 years, the Church has not confirmed a single “apparition” as authentically being the Madonna. The fact that during these 25 years there has been talk of tens of thousands of “apparitions” does not contribute any authenticity to these events, which according to the words of our current Pope, who I encountered during an audience on 24 February this year, commented that at the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith they always questioned how all these “apparitions” could be considered authentic for the Catholic faithful. They particularly do not seem to be authentic when it is known beforehand that these so-called “apparitions” will occur:

To one of the “seers” on the 18th of March every year, but along with this she will also receive an “apparition” on the 2nd of each month, with “messages” which you can expect, according to the established procedures;

The second will receive an apparition on every day of the year, and if this were not enough, an added special “apparition” on the 25th of each month along with a type of press release, which once again you can foresee and expect;

The third will receive an “apparition” on the 25th of December, on Christmas day, along with a message similar to the ones already mentioned;

The fourth will receive an “apparition” on the 8th of September every year along with a specific message;

The remaining two will receive the same, every day along with “messages” that can be anticipated since they are variations on the same theme. This fact and the flood of so-called apparitions, messages, secrets and signs, do not strengthen the faith, but rather further convince us that in all of this there is nothing neither authentic nor established as truthful.

Therefore I responsibly call upon those who claim themselves to be “seers”, as well as those persons behind the “messages”, to demonstrate ecclesiastical obedience and to cease with these public manifestations and messages in this parish. In this fashion they shall show their necessary adherence to the Church, by neither placing private “apparitions” nor private sayings before the official position of the Church. Our faith is a serious and responsible matter. The Church is also a serious and responsible institution!

Through the intercession of the Blessed Virgin Mary, the greatest possessor of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, who through the same Holy Spirit conceived in her body and gave birth to the Second person of the Trinity, Jesus Christ, who gives us his Most Holy Body and Blood for eternal life, may He - who is the Way, the Truth and the Life – help us so that the truth of the Blessed Virgin, his Mother and Mother of the Church, Seat of Wisdom and Mirror of Justice, may shine forth in brightness in this parish and diocese, without even a hint of incredibility, yet all in accord with the constant teachings and practice of the Church. Amen.

Ratko Perić, bishop
 
Every authentic modern apparition of Mary, from La Salette to Lourdes to Fatima to Beauraing, has been a source of controversy and polemic while the phenomenon itself was in progress. Such is today the case with Medjugorje, which has been buffeted by waves of rumors and fabrications and malicious attacks. Lost in the din is the perspective of the universal Church. In Denis Nolan’s book you will find shocking new revelations about the Catholic Church’s true position on Medjugorje.

Did you know that for the first time in Church history the Vatican removed the jurisdiction over an apparition from the local Ordinary when the investigation into Medjugorje was taken away from the then-bishop of Mostar, Bishop Zanic?

Did you know that the Vatican’s current Secretary of State Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone wrote an official letter confirming that pilgrimages to Medjugorje are permitted and that the opinions on Medjugorje of Bishop Ratko Peric, the current Bishop of Mostar, are to be treated strictly “as his personal opinion” with no authority?

Did you know that the Vatican responded with an implicit rebuke of Bishop Peric’s widely publicized June 15, 2006, condemnation of Medjugorje when Cardinal Vinko Puljic, president of the Bosnia and Hercegovina Bishops Conference and Archbishop of Sarajevo, announced on July 15, 2006, that “The Catholic Church is starting a new commission that will look into the Medjugorje events” thus reiterating the Vatican’s position that the apparition does not fall under Bishop Peric’s jurisdiction?

Did you know that in his own hand Pope John Paul II wrote, “I thank Sophia for everything concerning Medjugorje. I, too, go there everyday as a pilgrim in my prayers”?

Did you know that Blessed Mother Teresa, again in her own hand, wrote: “We are all praying one Hail Mary before Holy Mass to Our Lady of Medjugorje!”?

Did you know that the world’s foremost exorcist, Fr. Gabriele Amorth, official exorcist of the Diocese of Rome who has performed more than 30,000 exorcisms, wrote, “Medjugorje is a fortress against Satan. Satan hates Medjugorje because it is a place of conversion, of prayer, of transformation of life”?

In Medjugorje and the Church you will find the truths that have been suppressed by the traditionalists and the liberals. Numerous bishops and cardinals have expressed appreciation for this book. For example, Cardinal Francis Arinze has written from the Vatican: “May God Bless you for the great diligence put into producing this well documented work which I shall read with great interest.”

medjugorje.org/newitems.htm
Medjugorje and the Church
by: Denis Nolan
 
I heard the Church has condemned Medjugorje. Is this true?

A big NO!!! This is one of the most frequent questions/accusations I receive. It is simply not true. The Holy See has affirmed its position a number of times over the years. I think it is best if I start from the beginning and briefly give you a rundown of the facts.

Let me first say that the Holy See, former Pope John Paul II, and Pope Benedict XVI have kept, and are keeping, a close watch on the messages of Medjugorje over the last 25 years. They have not found anything that contradicts scripture or the Church. If they had, Medjugorje would have been condemned years ago. Our Lady’s message in Medjugorje calls us to: Daily prayer of the rosary, monthly Confession, daily reading of Scripture, fasting on Wednedays and Fridays on bread and water, and attending Holy Mass as often as possible. This is a simple message meant to help us in the lifelong process of conversion.

Bishop Pavao Žanic originally visited Medjugorje five times in the first two months of the apparitions in 1981 and performed a thorough investigation. Afterwards he came only to confer the sacrament of Confirmations to the faithful. In front of over 3000 people at Holy Mass, he declared:
Code:
"I am deeply convinced that no child who says that they have seen Our Lady, has been talked into doing so. If we were speaking about one child only, one might say he could be stubborn and that not even the police could make the child renounce what he said. But six innocent, simple children in the space of half an hour, would, if they were pushed, admit all. None of the priests, I guarantee, had any idea of putting the children up to something.... I am also convinced that the children are not lying. The children are only speaking out what's in their hearts... It is certain: the children are not lying". (From a sermon given on the feast of St. James, the patron saint of Medjugorje, on the 25th of July 1981)

In "Glas Koncila", the Croatian national catholic newspaper, 16th of August 1981, he stated; "It is definite that the children were not incited by anyone, and especially not by the church, to lie."
It is unclear why in the months to follow that Bishop Zanic changed his mind. Some say it was due to threats and pressure by the Communist government of imprisonment of both Fr. Jozo and the Bishop if the apparitions did not cease. We all know that Fr. Jozo served 18 months of harsh (name removed by moderator)risonment for refusing to denounce Medjugorje. Others say that a reported comment from Our Lady regarding a wrong judgement the Bishop had made with a Franciscan priest infuriated the Bishop. But regardless the ultimate outcome was that the Bishop turned against Medjugorje.

Then in 1984, a commission of 14 people was formed by Bishop Zanic that consisted mainly of members that had already declared themselves to be against the alleged events. They made two statements which basicly said that they agreed with the Holy See that a decision should not be rushed. Then in 1987 Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger entrusted the investigation into the hands of the Yugoslavian bishops’ conference. After three years of study the former Bishops’ Conference of Yugoslavia on April 10, 1991 published their declaration in which among other things it states:
Code:
"On the basis of investigations up till now it cannot be established that one is dealing with supernatural apparitions and revelations."
This statement does not mean that it has been proven that no supernatural basis exists, but only that it is not yet established or proven. This means the matter is open to further investigation. This finding was really a compromise between the position of Bishop Zanic and the good fruits, which the events of Medjugorje were producing. The commission for pastoral life in the parish of Medjugorje decided to meet again on June 27, 1991. However, one day before, Serbia attacked Slovenia and the war broke out that put the last nails in the corpse that was called Yugoslavia. With the dissolution of the state of Yugoslavia, the Bishops Conference of Yugoslavia was also dissolved.

After the commission findings were made public in 1991, Pope John Paul II retired Bishop Zanic of his duties and handed over the responsibility to investigate and render a final decision on Medjugorje to a hand picked commission of Bishops. It is the current belief that this commission will not issue a final decision or continue its investigation until the apparitions have ceased. But of great importance is the last statement that they rendered in 1993 which states:
Code:
"We bishops, after a three-year-long commission study accept Medjugorje as a holy place, as a shrine. This means that we have nothing against it if someone venerates the Mother of God in a manner also in agreement with the teaching and belief of the Church. . . Therefore, we are leaving that to further study. The Church does not hurry." (Glas Koncila, August 15, 1993).
The replacement for Bishop Zanic was Bishop Ratko Peric. Bishop Ratko worked closely with Bishop Zanic for years, and it was no surprise that he held, and still holds the same negative opinion of Medjugorje. Bishop Ratko is reported to have never investigated Medjugorje, never spoken with or interviewed the visionaries, and visits Medjugorje only rarely for Confirmations and official functions. The important issue is that Bishop Ratko Peric does not have authority over the final decision on Medjugorje. This responsibility still rests with the commission of Bishops. The local Bishop’s negative comments about Medjugorje were addressed directly in 1998 by the Holy See in a letter to his Excellency Mons. Gilbert Aubry, Bishop of Saint-Denis de la Reunion. The letter states that Bishop Peric’s position on Medjugorje is his personal opinion, which he is entitled to as local Bishop, but remains his personal opinion. The URL for this letter is Newletter.htm

Lastly is Pope John Paul II himself. Our beloved former Pope was very much a supporter of Medjugorje (although unofficially, which he had to be until Medjugorje was approved). Please take a look at our document Pope John Paul II’s Comments, which list numerous quotes as reported by priests, bishops and cardinals over the years. Most recently, in August 2002, Pope John Paul II wrote a personal note to Fr. Jozo Zovko thanking him for his ministry, and giving him his blessing. Fr. Jozo Letter. Pope Benedict has not made any verified statements that we are aware of regarding Medjugorje.

The Holy See has also stated and confirmed on numerous occasions over the years that traveling to Medjugorje is permitted. The only restriction is a pilgrimage can not be organized by the Church (which would indicate authentication by the Church). It is perfectly ok for priests, bishops, and cardinals to travel to Medjugorje alone or with groups. And to date almost 500,000 priests, bishops, and cardinals have visited Medjugorje.

Please also refer to our page “All About Medjugorje” for a tremendous amount of information and documents specifically about “Medjugorje and the Church”.

I heard the local bishop is against Medjugorje.

True! It is important to first state that the priests serving in Medjugorje are appointed by the bishop and that they are all under obedience. With that said, the replacement for Bishop Zanic, who was in power at the time the apparitions began, was Bishop Ratko Peric. Bishop Ratko worked closely with Bishop Zanic for years, and it was no surprise that he held, and still holds, the same negative opinion of Medjugorje. In a conversation that Fr. John Chisholm had with Bishop Ratko Peric, Fr. John asked the bishop if he believed in Lourdes. The bishop slammed his fist on the table and yelled “NO”. Fr. John asked the bishop if he believed in Fatima, and received the same answer. With this information, it would seem unlikely that the bishop would believe in Our Lady’s apparitions in his own diocese. The Bishop is reported to have never investigated Medjugorje, never spoken with or interviewed the visionaries, and visits Medjugorje only rarely for Confirmations and official functions. But with this said, the important issue is that Bishop Ratko Peric does not have authority over the Churchs decision on Medjugorje. In a recent interview the bishop acknowledged this fact when he said: “while recognizing the Holy Father’s right to give a final decision” on the validity of the reported apparitions… This responsibility still rests with the commission of Bishops. The local Bishop’s negative comments about Medjugorje were addressed directly in 1998 by the Holy See in a letter to his Excellency Mons. Gilbert Aubry, Bishop of Saint-Denis de la Reunion. The letter states that Bishop Peric’s position on Medjugorje is his personal opinion, which he is entitled to as local Bishop, but remains his personal opinion. The URL for this letter is Newletter.htm

I heard the Pope is against Medjugorje.

False! Pope John Paul II was very much a supporter of Medjugorje (although unofficially, which he had to be because Medjugorje was not yet approved). Please take a look at our document Pope John Paul II’s Comments, which list numerous quotes as reported by priests, bishops and cardinals over the years. Most recently, in August 2002, Pope John Paul II wrote a personal note to Fr. Jozo Zovko thanking him for his ministry, and giving him his blessing. Fr. Jozo Letter. Pope Benedict has not made any verified statements that we are aware of regarding Medjugorje.

Read More FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS HERE:

medjugorje.org/faq.htm
 
I am NOT angry, seems to me you are because I don’t agree with you. WHY so defensive? Like Fr. John Hardon S.J. said, "God does not do phony miracles. .I do pray the Rosary, my time worn Rosary.Still the same ole color as always. I have belonged to the Blue Army, World Apostolate of Fatima, for many, many years. I believe Fatima is the TRUE apparition of our day and I believe Pope John Paul felt the same, as he spoke of it so many times, it is in his writings, he was there at least twice and gave Our Lady of Fatima credit for saving his life when he was shot. Revealed the 3rd Secret and Beautified the two small children, Jacenta and Francisco. Several Popes have spoke of Fatima. I have read much of what Pope John Paul wrote and said but I have NEVER found where he mentioned Medjugorje. In spite of all the rumors claiming he did.
Do you hate Medjugorje, MeMaw?
I post links to my sources…what are yours? It is good to realize the source of postings—so one can consider the source in reading what is written.
Look, I’ve come across many like you on the Web who bash Medjugorje daily. I am not going to pick apart your posts.
I am getting to the point that I’m like Fr. Corapi…I’m not going to argue with you, but for the benefit of anyone else who may be reading this thread, I post(ed) what I did, complete with my source(s), when it wasn’t in my own handwriting/opinion.

+MIR
 
While it appears he, (the devil) is drawing you closer to God, in reality, he is actually drawing you away from the TRUTH and I have talked to many devotees of MedJugorje and there was NO reasoning with them. They had their minds made up and ,“not even the Church was going to change them.” Some had already made several trips over there and claimed to have seen, “miracles.”, their rosary turned to gold, host in the sun, etc, Not one of the rosaries were ever proven to be true gold. Fr,. Hardon said,"God doesn’t do phony “miacles.” One lady friend even offered to “pay” my way over there if I would go, but I wouldn’t. I said,"You can pay my way to Fatima iif you want, and she said, “NO, I don’t care about that one,” “That One” has been approved by the Church, visited by several Popes, and spoke of by Pope John Paul II on many occasions. He had received a true miracle, himself when She saved his life after being shot.but she didn’t care about that one. Thats division.
Sounds “angry” to me.
 
It isn’t strange that you so often find sectarians attacking Marian Apparitions.
That’s because to admit these are from God would blow away their whole theology, so they have to say “They are from the devil.”

Do you not know that this was precisely the charge that the pharisees made against Jesus - that His healing power came from the devil?

Jesus says this:
Mark3 25-26 "If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come."

In all the approved Marian appearances She calls for prayer and repentance, and for people to follow Jesus. As Jesus teaches, Satan cannot do this.

How else are we told in the Bible to discern whether things are of God or not?

1 Cor 12.3: You know when you were pagans somehow or other you were influenced by and led astray to mute idols. Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says “Jesus be cursed”. and no one can say Jesus is Lord" except by the Holy Spirit."

At Guadeloupe Mary proclaimed Her Son, Jesus, as Lord. At Fatima, She gave the Children a new prayer: ** “Oh my Jesus, forgive us, save us from the fire of hell. Lead all souls to heaven, especially those who are most in need**.”
The Apparitions of Mary proclaim Jesus as Lord, they urge repentance, obedience to God, and prayer.

So using the scriptural reference for discernment, we prove that these apparitions of Mary cannot be from Satan. They must therefore be of God.
 
Do you hate Medjugorje, MeMaw?
I post links to my sources…what are yours? It is good to realize the source of postings—so one can consider the source in reading what is written.
Look, I’ve come across many like you on the Web who bash Medjugorje daily. I am not going to pick apart your posts.
I am getting to the point that I’m like Fr. Corapi…I’m not going to argue with you, but for the benefit of anyone else who may be reading this thread, I post(ed) what I did, complete with my source(s), when it wasn’t in my own handwriting/opinion.

+MIR
Why are you bringing Fr. Corapi in on this, do you think thats going to give you credibility??? I have heard him say very strongly, not to get to involved in unapproved apparitions before the Church makes a final decision. Think what you want. There is no reasoning with Medj. fans, and I am perfectly willing to wait.
One of my sources is Fr. John Hardon S.J. ever heard of him?? It was a private conversation and I can’t prove it but he told me Medj. would never be found worthy of belief. Why do you think EWTN dropped it so fast a few years back? Not a word about is since. I have heard most of these stories for many years, you blame everyone else for not agreeing with you or you say we are angry, when you are the ones that get upset if we don’t see it your way. I
don’t hate anything, but I only want to follow the truth. I have a very deep devotion to Our Lady, I have belonged to the Blue Army, World Apostolate of Fatima, for many, many years and I have made the St. Louis de Montfort Consecration.
 
It isn’t strange that you so often find sectarians attacking Marian Apparitions.
That’s because to admit these are from God would blow away their whole theology, so they have to say “They are from the devil.”

Do you not know that this was precisely the charge that the pharisees made against Jesus - that His healing power came from the devil?

Jesus says this:
Mark3 25-26 "If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come."

In all the approved Marian appearances She calls for prayer and repentance, and for people to follow Jesus. As Jesus teaches, Satan cannot do this.

How else are we told in the Bible to discern whether things are of God or not?

1 Cor 12.3: You know when you were pagans somehow or other you were influenced by and led astray to mute idols. Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says “Jesus be cursed”. and no one can say Jesus is Lord" except by the Holy Spirit."

At Guadeloupe Mary proclaimed Her Son, Jesus, as Lord. At Fatima, She gave the Children a new prayer: ** “Oh my Jesus, forgive us, save us from the fire of hell. Lead all souls to heaven, especially those who are most in need**.”
The Apparitions of Mary proclaim Jesus as Lord, they urge repentance, obedience to God, and prayer.

So using the scriptural reference for discernment, we prove that these apparitions of Mary cannot be from Satan. They must therefore be of God.
ONLY the Catholic Church has the authority to say if an apparition is “Worth of Belief.” This division caused over Medj. is NOT coming from God. Jesus, himself, called Satan the “Father of Lies.” Very few, so called marian apparitions have ever been found “Worthy of Belief” by the Catholic Church. Those that have been found “Worthy of Belief” I love, Lourdes, Fatima, Guadalupe etc.
 
Why are you bringing Fr. Corapi in on this, do you think thats going to give you credibility??? I have heard him say very strongly, not to get to involved in unapproved apparitions before the Church makes a final decision. Think what you want. There is no reasoning with Medj. fans, and I am perfectly willing to wait.
One of my sources is Fr. John Hardon S.J. ever heard of him?? It was a private conversation and I can’t prove it but he told me Medj. would never be found worthy of belief. Why do you think EWTN dropped it so fast a few years back? Not a word about is since. I have heard most of these stories for many years, you blame everyone else for not agreeing with you or you say we are angry, when you are the ones that get upset if we don’t see it your way. I
don’t hate anything, but I only want to follow the truth. I have a very deep devotion to Our Lady, I have belonged to the Blue Army, World Apostolate of Fatima, for many, many years and I have made the St. Louis de Montfort Consecration.
Well, you sure told me, didn’t you?

I can see you are a very holy person indeed!

👍
 
ONLY the Catholic Church has the authority to say if an apparition is “Worth of Belief.” This division caused over Medj. is NOT coming from God. Jesus, himself, called Satan the “Father of Lies.” Very few, so called marian apparitions have ever been found “Worthy of Belief” by the Catholic Church. Those that have been found “Worthy of Belief” I love, Lourdes, Fatima, Guadalupe etc.
The division caused over Medjugorje is because of people like you.

Why can’t people like you give it a rest?

Leave the rest of us in peace, and go your way, and leave it in the Church’s hands? hmmm?
 
It isn’t strange that you so often find sectarians attacking Marian Apparitions.
That’s because to admit these are from God would blow away their whole theology, so they have to say “They are from the devil.”

Do you not know that this was precisely the charge that the pharisees made against Jesus - that His healing power came from the devil?

Jesus says this:
Mark3 25-26 "If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come."

In all the approved Marian appearances She calls for prayer and repentance, and for people to follow Jesus. As Jesus teaches, Satan cannot do this.

How else are we told in the Bible to discern whether things are of God or not?

1 Cor 12.3: You know when you were pagans somehow or other you were influenced by and led astray to mute idols. Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says “Jesus be cursed”. and no one can say Jesus is Lord" except by the Holy Spirit."

At Guadeloupe Mary proclaimed Her Son, Jesus, as Lord. At Fatima, She gave the Children a new prayer: ** “Oh my Jesus, forgive us, save us from the fire of hell. Lead all souls to heaven, especially those who are most in need**.”
The Apparitions of Mary proclaim Jesus as Lord, they urge repentance, obedience to God, and prayer.

So using the scriptural reference for discernment, we prove that these apparitions of Mary cannot be from Satan. They must therefore be of God.
So far, so good, Axion.

So far, the Church hasn’t found anything contrary to our Faith. Otherwise, the Church would condemn the purported apparitions.

You are correct.
 
Quite a controversy. It is obvious that whenever much unrest occurs over something which once was proclaimed to be beneficial to many, you can rest assured that the devil is involved. My advice, is to believe in Medjugorje if you want, and if you don’t, then back off. Wait and see what happens because in my opinion you will not have long to wait. Many lives have been changed and improved through the messages of Medjugorje. I personally know a lady who had a real miracle attributed through the “Lady of Medjugorje”. I am talking about bent and deformed bones being made normal. How can we explain things like this? Go there (Medjugorge) and see for yourself before you make a judgement based on what someone else says.
Allegations against this place do not bother me in the slightest for I saw much evidence of the Holy Spirit there, miraculous evidence of the supernatural, and the power of prayer. Also the sun does “strange” things there for which I cannot explain. It is a place of peace, hope, and holiness. Depending on who you speak with some will say that it is false, and others will claim that it is real. Go there and decide for yourself!
 
Quite a controversy. It is obvious that whenever much unrest occurs over something which once was proclaimed to be beneficial to many, you can rest assured that the devil is involved. My advice, is to believe in Medjugorje if you want, and if you don’t, then back off. Wait and see what happens because in my opinion you will not have long to wait. Many lives have been changed and improved through the messages of Medjugorje. I personally know a lady who had a real miracle attributed through the “Lady of Medjugorje”. I am talking about bent and deformed bones being made normal. How can we explain things like this? Go there (Medjugorge) and see for yourself before you make a judgement based on what someone else says.
Allegations against this place do not bother me in the slightest for I saw much evidence of the Holy Spirit there, miraculous evidence of the supernatural, and the power of prayer. Also the sun does “strange” things there for which I cannot explain. It is a place of peace, hope, and holiness. Depending on who you speak with some will say that it is false, and others will claim that it is real. Go there and decide for yourself!
Alverno…MeMaw said she wouldn’t accept a free trip to Medjugorje when someone offered it to her.

The Church hasn’t condemned Medjugorje, yet she has.

If she continues to spread such (as she has here), and Medjugorje is authentic? I certainly wouldn’t want to be in her shoes, that’s for sure! Not for all the tea in China!

Yet, she said she believes in Garabandal. Now, there’s another purported apparition that the Church never approved, nor condemned.

In my opinion, Garabandal is a continuation of Fatima, since the 3rd secret wasn’t made public by 1960. And, in my opinion, Medjugorje is a continuation of Garabandal.

We will see. If nothing else, we should know at the Warning. …That is, if Garabandal is authentic!

+MIR
 
Hey guys…

Let’s get off the discussion and promotion of these unapproved private revelations before the thread gets closed or pulled by the Mods.

If you take a look at the Banned Topics you’ll find the following…
  1. Promoting unapproved apparitions and revelations (those not approved by the Church for private or public devotion) or alleged private locutions.
 
It isn’t strange that you so often find sectarians attacking Marian Apparitions.

… …

So using the scriptural reference for discernment, we prove that these apparitions of Mary cannot be from Satan. They must therefore be of God.
Axion, I want to tell you “THANK YOU!” On another board I have someone pointing me to some video that claims to show that the apparition at Fatima is demonic because Fatima is the name of one of Mohammed’s daughters, and asking me to comment. With your permission, I’m going to copy the bulk of your post in my reply to her. THANKS, again! 👍

<><
 
  1. Promoting unapproved apparitions and revelations (those not approved by the Church for private or public devotion) or alleged private locutions
I am not sure whom you refer to in your post but I am not promoting unapproved apparitions. I am merely stating what my experience has been. I encourage others to make their opinions based on an actual visit rather than by believing what someone else says. It is pretty difficult to ignore something which has been visited by fifty million people, and over a half million priests, bishops, cardinals, and clergy. It is normal and natural for people to desire information about such phenomenon. We are sharing opinions. I never said that by going there one would experience something wonderful or miraculous. That would be promoting it. I merely relate my opinion based on my experience. Whatever is finally decided by the Magisterium I will be obediant to, but it is doubtful that any formal investigation would begin until the alleged visitations cease or announcement has been made that they have ceased.
 
Alverno…MeMaw said she wouldn’t accept a free trip to Medjugorje when someone offered it to her.

The Church hasn’t condemned Medjugorje, yet she has.

If she continues to spread such (as she has here), and Medjugorje is authentic? I certainly wouldn’t want to be in her shoes, that’s for sure! Not for all the tea in China!

Yet, she said she believes in Garabandal. Now, there’s another purported apparition that the Church never approved, nor condemned.

In my opinion, Garabandal is a continuation of Fatima, since the 3rd secret wasn’t made public by 1960. And, in my opinion, Medjugorje is a continuation of Garabandal.

We will see. If nothing else, we should know at the Warning. …That is, if Garabandal is authentic!

+MIR
I haven’t condemned anything, I don’t do that!! I would rather be patient and wait for the Church and follow Her, than to jump out ahead of the Church and look like a fool for so avidly promoting something that may be false. I call that wisdom. If and when the Church does find an apparition “Worthy of Belief”, I will be first in line to accept it NO MATTER what I thought beforehand.

Show me where I have ever said I approve of Garabandal l!!! I feel the same about that as I do any unapproved apparition.
Have you ever noticed that Lourdes and Fatima have never attached themselves to any other unapproved apparition. They don’t need to, they have credibility of their own. BUT Medjugorje and Garabandal both have tried to attach and or compare themselves to Fatima. The BIG difference is, Fatima has been found "Worthy of Belief:, but they haven’t.
I don’t mind being in my shoes at all, I am not chasing everything that comes along, I am at peace with the Church. And myself.
 
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