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LDNCatholic
Guest
So is it cool for Catholics in Amsterdam to use it? I believe some nations also allow you to posses small amounts of cocaine for ‘‘recreational use’’, does Church law forbid them to use it?
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Joey1976
Guest
I am not sure if it is allowed in moderation in a country that it is legal or if it is okay to use in a state that allows it for medical purposes. I think by the Catechisms statement on drugs it would be allowed. 2291 The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, except on strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production of and trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute direct co-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contrary to the moral law.
If marijuana is used for medical reasons it would be okay in a state where it is legal, according to this statement. Also, in Amsterdam, marijuana is not a drug, it is legal, so it is just a plant like tobacco. I am not sure in Amsterdam, i think you would have to ask the local authority such as a Bishop or a Priest.
The Church would have to make a statement on it if it became legal widespread. i don’t think the Church would be able to lay silent like they have on cigarettes. There are some theologians that consider cigarette use to be a sin and the Church has not really made a definitive stance on it. I think the Church would have to make a definitive stance on marijuana if it became legal. I have no idea about the cocaine either. I guess in those areas people would have to refer to their local Bishop or Priest and ask them.
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gmags2003
Guest
Slavery was once legal. So people had to abide by civic law, right?
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Joey1976
Guest
No because that goes against God’s Law so no. Just like abortion, it is legal but it goes against God’s law so we must not follow it.
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LDNCatholic
Guest
I don’t remember anywhere in the Bible where slavery is actually condemned. I remember Christ Himself telling the slave that he is subservient to his master.
Disclaimer: I am in no way advocating slavery, merely stating that I don’t think the Bible disagrees with it.
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harrisunt
Guest
I was never big into the drug culture. Yes, I have smoked marijuana. I have seen the effects on people and I still am not persuaded by your argument. There are many studies out there with conflicting information on the effects of marijuana. One day its a medicine, the next one joint is as harmful as a pack of cigarettes.
Perhaps you could further explain what you consider to be such a huge difference in mind altering and mind numbing. I understand there are different effects, but I also get a different effect from a cigarette than I do from a beer. Should one or the other be sinful in God’s eye?
Or is this simply a matter of civil law because the Bible simply does not forbid us from recreational use of natural products. Wine, tobacco, beer… pot… does it fit on the list? I don’t know.
Also, I am not a pot head and I am not trying to justify any of my actions with this debate. It is simply an exercise.
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harrisunt
Guest
Lets stay on topic. We’re talking about marijuana, not slavery and human trafficking.
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Christine_Blake
Guest
I have to completely agree! And to add to it…due to the hallucinatory effects, do not be too sure it is God your are getting closer to…
I have known several people who smoked marijuana for a number of years and here is the result…they have few relationships with people (if any), therefore they are withdrawn from society and the world (God’s world), they are stupid…honestly, I know one man who could not follow two turns on a map that was HIGHLIGHTED…an eight year old had to help him through town, finally, going further into themselves, they are anything but close to God…it creates a fog that blocks people, the world and God out …please, you are being fooled if you think that’s God you’re reaching by using drugs…
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mangy_dog
Guest
The legal aspect is surely a pivotal factor. Now, effects of - lets say, the dose of one joint…one beer…one glass of wine. We are talking effects alone now. And lets talk about just a “buzz”. Two beers? Two glasses of wine? Smoking one cigarette after a week of not smoking? These have the effect of dulling our senses, putting us in a light stupor, relaxing us etc. etc. No one has ever claimed that a couple of beers, glasses of wine or a cigarette had a mind openning, nature connecting, spiritually inspiring effect on them. Now - enter the one joint that has all the above mentioned effects plus…sprirtual awarness,…and I won’t bore you with the other pseudo-spiritual/psychological “clarity” and euphoria. Even if all these conclusion were also reached in a laboratory study, science does not take it beyond the tangible facts.
We are persons of religious experience and at least in my mind I can see the difference. I assure you - there was a time when I made the same comments you’ve made portraying marijuana as being in the same “harmless” and “recreational” light as beer, wine and cigarettes. I could go on and on about the spiritual dangers of marijuana, but until you make the connection on your own…nothing I say will convince you or anybody else that defends the innocence of marijuana use.
I simply pray that someday you will.
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.
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harrisunt
Guest
And I appreciate the prayers. Whatever the effects of marijuana, I won’t be getting near it any time soon. I have too much to do career and life wise to add drug use into the mix. I don’t even drink that much any more . But nevertheless, this is an interesting conversation. Thanks for being civil everyone. 
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Joey1976
Guest
How can you put a generalization like that about just the people you know using it? Do you realize how many people use marijuana regularly and live a normal life? If you think everyone who uses marijuana are these deadbeats who live in their parents basements you are really naive. I know many teachers that use. There are doctors, business people , lawyers, nurses, college professors, etc. You can go on and on with the people that YOU may not expect that would be a user but they do and go through life fine and are educated and have good careers. Also, I don’t think you realize how many older people are using marijuana theses days recreationally, such as retirees. So, the drug definitly does not make people stupid or withdrawn from the world, when there are highly educated people who use and have good careers and are successful in life. However, it does hurt them spiritually because it is a sin. So in that case you are correct it does hurt them.
I think i am done posting on this topic cause it just continues to go in circles. I don not use marijuana and will not because it is a sin, period. Even though the catechism does not have a clear reference to marijuana it is clear it is a sin because at this time it is illegal drug and using illegal drugs are a sin even if you use in moderation, it is a sin regardless. If marijuana is ever legalized i think the Church would have to make a clear statement on marijuana because if it does become legal then that article in the catechism concerning drugs would look to be a bit vague considering it doesn’t mention specific drugs and if marijuana was legal it would not be considered an illegal drug anymore. So for the time being marijuana is a sin no matter who says it is ok for you or not ok for you, it is still a sin.
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Joey1976
Guest
Again, Catholics do not go by Scripture alone.
It doesn’t have to be specifically in the Bible to go against God’s Law. Slavery goes against the dignity of human beings. It’s pretty obvious how that would be against Christianity. The foundational principle of all Catholic Social Teaching is the sanctity of human life and the inherent dignity of the human person.
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Christine_Blake
Guest
Guess what? I am a teacher and I work with teachers who smoke - and guess what? It does affect them physically, mentally as well as spiritually…It is no different than a “functional alcoholic” which I, myself, was for a long time…do you really think those were my best years professionally? I can promise you they were not. Any drug takes a toll on your mind, body and spirit…Why do you think it’s a sin?
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StevenFrancis
Guest
Marijuana is a vegetable matter substance which grows here on our earth. Like all things in nature, it would seem to have a purpose. There are many people who use it for pain, or even more importantly to stimulated appetite in those dying of cancer, aids etc.
Like alcohol, tobacco, etc. it doesn’t take much usage to tip the scale from medicinal use, or occassional celebratory use, to frequent recreational Abuse or even habitual abuse. The only sin in medical, or even minor recreational use during feasts and festivals etc., as a celebratory enhancement, (like wine or beer), is that it is against the law in many places, and whether the law is unjust or not, we are to obey law where we live and be good citizens as Christian people. In some countries, you can continue to petition your government to open this freedom, but if you’re a good Christian, you should not partake of the substance until such time as it becomes legal in your city/state/country etc.
The sin in habitual or excessive use, (aside from violation of the law in many areas), is that if you’re a Christian, you are also maintaining your body as the temple in which God breathed the Holy Spirit, imbuing you with the gift of life. Excessive alcohol, marijuana etc. are unhealthy, and cloud the mind and spirit, damaging communication between man and God.
I can support legalization efforts, (lawfully approached), as a Christian, however as long as I am living in an area where it is not legal, I should not use it while these efforts are still unsuccessful. In addition, if it becomes legal, then I may only use it medicinally, as prescribed, as with any other substance of such character, or, on special occasions and celebration, (such as one might toast the New Year with a glass of champagne). If it is only legalized medically, then I may only use it as legitimately prescribed by my physician and only for the maladies it was prescribed.
In short, I don’t view this substance as any different from alcohol. in the respect that It has it’s legitimate purposes as both a medicine, and occasionally, a mild socially conducive intoxicant. If those purposes are condoned by the society in which you live, and you are of sufficient moral character to use a substance without moving into the ‘excess’ category and thereby hurting yourself spiritually, then, fine.
Peace to all,
Steven
Like alcohol, tobacco, etc. it doesn’t take much usage to tip the scale from medicinal use, or occassional celebratory use, to frequent recreational Abuse or even habitual abuse. The only sin in medical, or even minor recreational use during feasts and festivals etc., as a celebratory enhancement, (like wine or beer), is that it is against the law in many places, and whether the law is unjust or not, we are to obey law where we live and be good citizens as Christian people. In some countries, you can continue to petition your government to open this freedom, but if you’re a good Christian, you should not partake of the substance until such time as it becomes legal in your city/state/country etc.
The sin in habitual or excessive use, (aside from violation of the law in many areas), is that if you’re a Christian, you are also maintaining your body as the temple in which God breathed the Holy Spirit, imbuing you with the gift of life. Excessive alcohol, marijuana etc. are unhealthy, and cloud the mind and spirit, damaging communication between man and God.
I can support legalization efforts, (lawfully approached), as a Christian, however as long as I am living in an area where it is not legal, I should not use it while these efforts are still unsuccessful. In addition, if it becomes legal, then I may only use it medicinally, as prescribed, as with any other substance of such character, or, on special occasions and celebration, (such as one might toast the New Year with a glass of champagne). If it is only legalized medically, then I may only use it as legitimately prescribed by my physician and only for the maladies it was prescribed.
In short, I don’t view this substance as any different from alcohol. in the respect that It has it’s legitimate purposes as both a medicine, and occasionally, a mild socially conducive intoxicant. If those purposes are condoned by the society in which you live, and you are of sufficient moral character to use a substance without moving into the ‘excess’ category and thereby hurting yourself spiritually, then, fine.
Peace to all,
Steven
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StevenFrancis
Guest
I think this says pretty much every thing I just said, except much more succinctly. Well done. I guess I should read more responses before posing my own.
Peace,
Steven
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Jonathan82
Guest
Ok I saw this thread and had to reply because like most people I know we’ve all done Marijuana. I smoke Marijuana or I smoked haven’t in weeks; I smoked it because it helped me with my anxiety and going to sleep at night. I admit you can more easily become tempted. I don’t recommend Marijuana anymore because of that.
Marijuana is dangerous when used for recreational purposes because its not meant for everyone; I believe using it helped me, but I will talk to a priest who’s a friend of mine to see what he thinks. It is true though it is a gateway drug I know a kid, well his no longer a kid but I knew him since he was a little kid I used to babysit him back when I was still in High school; he started on Marijuana then cocaine then he dropped out of high school.
Its like a gun not everyone should have one. Discipline is the key.
Marijuana is dangerous when used for recreational purposes because its not meant for everyone; I believe using it helped me, but I will talk to a priest who’s a friend of mine to see what he thinks. It is true though it is a gateway drug I know a kid, well his no longer a kid but I knew him since he was a little kid I used to babysit him back when I was still in High school; he started on Marijuana then cocaine then he dropped out of high school.
Its like a gun not everyone should have one. Discipline is the key.
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CapaxDei
Guest
Actually, marijuana = stupid.
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thesearch
Guest
To be quite honest, I started of just like you, my friends handed me a joint and we were off to the races. At first it was occasional. I’ve now smoked pot everyday for the last 5 years. I recently quit about 2 weeks ago. Yay for me! Anyway, it does mess with your head. It does lower your brain function in that you get really lazy, no motivation at all. And don’t believe a word of what anyone tells you, it is addictive and you will get withdrawls. I’m going through them now, eradict sleep, nightmares, lack of appetite, lack of focus, increase in depression. I’m sure it will pass soon but its no fun at all. I’m not one to tell you that its sinful, but I will tell you that its no good. I was an “honour roll” student that just coasted through college. I got decent grades (70% average) but I could’ve done WAY BETTER without the pot.
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Mark_Robert
Guest
If used for medicinal purposes such as alleviating nausea due to chemotherapy treatments then it is legitimate. If you are using it for recreational purposes in violation of U.S. drug laws then it is sinful.
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Jonathan82
Guest
Marijuana is a plant that promotes peace and its illegal. Alcohol promotes violence and its legal. Wine has alcohol but if you take moderate amounts of it your good. Jesus drank wine. Marijuana in moderate amounts is acceptable in my opinion.
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