S
SonofAdam
Guest
The words below, from me, were intended at Cachonga’s statements (above).
Cachonga,
Cachonga,
- Status
V
Vile_Servant
Guest
Dear SonofAdam,
Jesus himself has said that he is the Son of God.
Matthew 16:15-17
He said to them, ‘But who do you say that I am?’
Simon Peter answered, ‘You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.’
And Jesus answered him, ‘Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah!
For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father in heaven.
John 10:36-38
can you say that the one whom the Father has sanctified and sent into the world is blaspheming because I said, “I am God’s Son”?
If I am not doing the works of my Father, then do not believe me.
But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father.’
Mark 14:61-63
But he was silent and did not answer. Again the high priest asked him, ‘Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?’
Jesus said, ‘I am; and “you will see the Son of Man
seated at the right hand of the Power”,
and “coming with the clouds of heaven.” ’
Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, ‘Why do we still need witnesses?
Luke 22:67-71
They said, ‘If you are the Messiah, tell us.’
He replied, ‘If I tell you, you will not believe;
and if I question you, you will not answer.
But from now on the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the power of God.’
All of them asked, ‘Are you, then, the Son of God?’
He said to them, ‘You say that I am.’
Then they said, ‘What further testimony do we need?
We have heard it ourselves from his own lips!’
Blessings and peace.
Jesus himself has said that he is the Son of God.
Matthew 16:15-17
He said to them, ‘But who do you say that I am?’
Simon Peter answered, ‘You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.’
And Jesus answered him, ‘Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah!
For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father in heaven.
John 10:36-38
can you say that the one whom the Father has sanctified and sent into the world is blaspheming because I said, “I am God’s Son”?
If I am not doing the works of my Father, then do not believe me.
But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father.’
Mark 14:61-63
But he was silent and did not answer. Again the high priest asked him, ‘Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?’
Jesus said, ‘I am; and “you will see the Son of Man
seated at the right hand of the Power”,
and “coming with the clouds of heaven.” ’
Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, ‘Why do we still need witnesses?
Luke 22:67-71
They said, ‘If you are the Messiah, tell us.’
He replied, ‘If I tell you, you will not believe;
and if I question you, you will not answer.
But from now on the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the power of God.’
All of them asked, ‘Are you, then, the Son of God?’
He said to them, ‘You say that I am.’
Then they said, ‘What further testimony do we need?
We have heard it ourselves from his own lips!’
Blessings and peace.
C
Coder
Guest
People can seek an aspect of a Scripture to present an appearance of what they personally want to say. We should humble ourselves to what God is saying.
Is the point of this Scripture that Jesus in not God? No. The point is that to know Him is life eternal! He is God!
Is the point of this Scripture that Jesus in not God? No. The point is that we should love Him and rejoice that He is reuniting with His Father after His mission as God becoming like one of us for our sake. Why should we love Him? Because He is God. He said you shall love the Lord your God.
Is the point of this Scripture that Jesus in not God? No. The point is that if we love each other God lives in us even though we do not have the full spiritual vision of God. This full spiritual vision of God and union with Him is called the Beatific Vision.
In fact that very Chapter of 1 John says this:
“…every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus does not belong to God. This is the spirit of the antichrist,…”.
V
Vile_Servant
Guest
Further testimony that Jesus is the Son of God
Luke 1.35:
The angel said to her, ‘The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be holy; he will be called Son of God.
Mark 3.11:
Whenever the unclean spirits saw him, they fell down before him and shouted,
‘You are the Son of God!’
Luke 4.41:
Demons also came out of many, shouting, ‘You are the Son of God!’ But he rebuked them and would not allow them to speak, because they knew that he was the Messiah.
Matthew 27.54:
Now when the centurion and those with him, who were keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were terrified and said, ‘Truly this man was God’s Son!’
John 1.34:
And I myself have seen and have testified that this is the Son of God.
John 1.49:
Nathanael replied, ‘Rabbi, you are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!’
Acts of the Apostles 9.20:
and immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues,
saying, ‘He is the Son of God.’
Luke 1.35:
The angel said to her, ‘The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be holy; he will be called Son of God.
Mark 3.11:
Whenever the unclean spirits saw him, they fell down before him and shouted,
‘You are the Son of God!’
Luke 4.41:
Demons also came out of many, shouting, ‘You are the Son of God!’ But he rebuked them and would not allow them to speak, because they knew that he was the Messiah.
Matthew 27.54:
Now when the centurion and those with him, who were keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were terrified and said, ‘Truly this man was God’s Son!’
John 1.34:
And I myself have seen and have testified that this is the Son of God.
John 1.49:
Nathanael replied, ‘Rabbi, you are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!’
Acts of the Apostles 9.20:
and immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues,
saying, ‘He is the Son of God.’
T
Timothy17
Guest
M
Mailman
Guest
It’s not a translation issue. The DR says in Matthew 24:36: "But of that day and hour no one knoweth: no, not the angels of heaven, but the Father alone (Greek, monos, meaning sole or single; alone, only - Strong’s). Jesus not mentioning the Holy Spirit could mean God is not composed of three Persons [not a Trinity] or the Holy Spirit is not some Person/Being. That’s a possibility, right?
C
Coder
Guest
It’s not a possibility because the Church declared these Scriptures to be canonical and the Church also teaches that the Son is God. In the context the disciples are asking Jesus to tell them about a sign of when the end will be. So he tells them much information about signs of the end but He does not reveal the day or the hour. He indicates that the Father alone knows this. In the context, perhaps ‘alone’ can be interpreted to mean God ‘alone’. When Jesus says “nor the Son” it may also be considered in the context that He is saying that the Son also will not reveal this even though He has just revealed many signs of the end. By saying “nor the Son” Jesus may be indicating that although they are speaking with the Son, He is not going to reveal this. I.e. nor the Son as messenger.
A
adstrinity
Guest
It may be a translation issue. We are discussing the Gospel of Mark, not Matthew and in the OP, there is the passage we are discussing. In one translation it says only the Father alone knows, and in this, an earlier translation, it doesn’t add the word, “alone” or “only.”
E
erikd
Guest
Mailman, perhaps the best way to explain this question is by explaining the following verse:
*8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where are you?
10 And he said, I heard your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
11 And he said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded you that you should not eat?
12 And the man said, The woman whom you gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that you have done? And the woman said, The serpent misled me, and I did eat. *
Genesis 3:8-13
In the previous verses we see that God the Father, the all knowing creator of all is asking 4 questions. Do you believe that He did not know the answers to these questions? You have to remember how in order to understand God, at times the Holy Writ has to “humanize” this Divine nature of which you and I cannot understand. It is obvious that God the Father knew the answers to the questions He Himself was asking, yet for the benefit of Adam, Eve, and the readers of the Book of Genesis, the questions had to be asked.
In much the same way, Jesus, having both natures asks where Lazarus is buried:
34 And said, Where have all of you laid him? They said unto him, Lord, come and see.
St. John 11:34
If one believes that Jesus really did not know than one must believe that Jesus is not all knowing, or that He is not really God. Yet we know that He is God (John 1:1, 8:19, 8:58, etc.). The only way to reconcile this lack of knowledge, is by the fact that Jesus did in fact take on both a human and a Divine nature. He was both man and God but with two distinct natures. Right after Jesus was born His Divine nature knew everything, yet His human nature still had to learn how to speak, walk, etc. Two distinct natures in one Person, both human and Divine.
M
Mailman
Guest
Can you show me where in the OT the Trinity is revealed?
The Jewish people, whose Scriptures are our OT today, believed for centuries that there was only one God because that was what they saw in the writings of their holy prophets. When Jesus appeared to them and claimed to be the Son of God, they were ready to stone Him for blasphemy (John 10:33). If Jesus’ claims were accepted, then they thought their belief would be no different from that of the polytheistic pagans around them whom the God of their fathers condemned. So, to get around the problem of a plurality in the Godhead, the Jews simply rejected Jesus.
The very few who accepted Jesus’ claims, chief of which were His disciples, must have understood [through Jesus’ personal teaching] how He could be the Son of God, yet maintaining the truth of Moses’ declaration, “Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one Lord” (Deut. 6:4).
To admit that it took 300 years to develop the doctrine of the Trinity [how God could be one with Jesus being God as well] is to acknowledge that Christ’s disciples had no knowledge about the nature of God and the place of Jesus in the Godhead. But that is not possible. The disciples must have understood these things because Jesus personally taught them and they were willing to die for their faith. In fact, this had to be the one truth they had to know because the “new” religion they were preaching to their fellow Jews centered on Jesus being the Son of God and the promised Messiah, yet still acknowledging the authority of the Jews’ sacred Scriptures.
The apostle John in fact revealed the truth for all to see in the prologue to his gospel. He says: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God….”
E
erikd
Guest
Son of Adam, thank you for your interesting questions and perspective on this discussion. While I agree that this discussion has gone off course, it seems that the oneness of God, which has been to some degree questioned here, may be worthy of address. We, as Catholic Christians, believe just as you do that there is only one God, the creator of heaven and earth. Just as the name Allah actually interprets into “one Deity” so the name God means one God:
7 And I will take you to me for a people, and I will be to you a God: and all of you shall know that I am the LORD your God, which brings you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.
Exodus 6:7
I think on that one part we can all agree. Now, can we also agree on one other part: “God is beyond all comprehension.” (CallingIslam.com) On this I think we can all agree.
If we do agree on the above two points, than one cannot say, with any certainly, that God, though one Being, cannot be three persons within one being since God is beyond all comprehension. Right?
14 And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, "Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ "
Exodus 3:14
God Himself gave Himself a name that people would recognize only with God. Strangely enough, Jesus, whom Islam considers a great Prophet, used the same name:
57 Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”
58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”
59 Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
John 8:57-59
If Jesus was a great Prophet, why would He equate Himself to God? After all, that’s why they took up stones to throw at him after He proclaimed Himself as “I AM.”
4 Jesus therefore, knowing all things that would come upon Him, went forward and said to them, “Whom are you seeking?”
5 They answered Him, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus said to them, “I am He.” And Judas, who betrayed Him, also stood with them.
6 Now when He said to them, “I am He,” they drew back and fell to the ground.
John 18:4-6
Why do you think the soldiers fell to the ground after Jesus’ answer? If this was His answer, and He equated Himself to God, would He still be considered a great Prophet? What if Jesus equated Himself to God by forgiving sins?
*5 When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven you.”
6 And some of the scribes were sitting there and reasoning in their hearts,
7 “Why does this Man speak blasphemies like this? Who can forgive sins but God alone?”
8 But immediately, when Jesus perceived in His spirit that they reasoned thus within themselves, He said to them, "Why do you reason about these things in your hearts?
9 "Which is easier, to say to the paralytic, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Arise, take up your bed and walk’?
10 “But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins”-He said to the paralytic,
11 “I say to you, arise, take up your bed, and go to your house.” *
Mark 2:5-11
Here, we see Jesus equating Himself to God by having the power to forgive sins, not just heal illnesses. and the people he was speaking with understood this to be blasphemy. If Jesus was just a Prophet, what kind of Prophet would He be if He equated Himself to God?
You see, we cannot fully understand the mysteries of God, yet some of them are revealed to us in small ways. I just gave you a snapshot of this reveal. If you believe, as Islam does, that Jesus was a great Prophet, perhaps you ought to read the Gospels which speak of Jesus and many of the things He did. Compare the Gospels to the Old Testament and you may see many similarities. We also believe in one God, but, just as you believe He cannot be fully explained or understood, so we believe that He can be one God within three Divine Persons.
E
erikd
Guest
I wanted to point out another issue with the Islamic understanding of the Trinity:
When God says, ‘Jesus, son of Mary, did you say to people, “Take me and my mother as two gods alongside God”?’ he will say, 'May You be exalted! I would never say what I had no right to say…
Qur’an Verse 5:116
The above mentioned verse may be an indication of a misunderstanding between early Christianity and early Islam. Here, the writer indicates that Mary would, in some strange custom, be exalted as a god. This, of course, is not the view of Catholicism or any Christian sect around the world, nor has it ever been. When the Qur’an was written in the early 7th century, Christianity widely accepted Mary’s role in the economy of man’s salvation. She was the first Christian, the first to accept and follow Christ, right unto His death, and her prayers are sought after, for many Christians throughout the world. She was never, however, portrayed as a god, the God, divine, or anything other than human. While she became the ideal human, she was still human. If I am interpreting this misunderstanding correctly, than this displays just one of many problems due to misunderstandings and misintepretations. Hopefully we can correct these and set the record straight.
B
BerhaneSelassie
Guest
Allow me to post from my website on this verse. Jesus as God always was and is all knowing, anyone who denies this is not Christian, even if they believe He was ignorant for a single moment. Jesus as a man is the only way He can be ignorant, since omniscience is not natural to humans. Before I paste I would also like to mention, some believe Jesus here is referring to the time when the house will be completed, according to the one claim, The father whose son was married, but not cohabiting with his wife was building a home for his wife to live with, only the Father could tell the Son when the house was ready for the wife to move in. I do not necessarily believe that since i have not been able to verify it.
Here is my commentaries on Mark 13:32, the Chruch always said Jesus was all knowing.
“These things being so, come let us now examine into ‘But of that day and that hour knows no man, neither the Angels of God, nor the Son ;’[Mark 13:32] for being in great ignorance as regards these words, and being stupefied about them, they think they have in them an important argument for their heresy. But I, when the heretics allege it and prepare themselves with it, see in them the giants again fighting against God. For the Lord of heaven and earth, by whom all things were made, has to litigate before them about day and hour; and the Word who knows all things is accused by them of ignorance about a day; and the Son who knows the Father is said to be ignorant of an hour of a day; now what can be spoken more contrary to sense, or what madness can be likened to this? Through the Word all things have been made, times and seasons and night and day and the whole creation; and is the Framer of all said to be ignorant of His work? And the very context of the lection shows that the Son of God knows that hour and that day, though the Arians fall headlong in their ignorance. For after saying, ‘nor the Son,’ He relates to the disciples what precedes the day, saying, ‘This and that shall be, and then the end.’ But He who speaks of what precedes the day, knows certainly the day also, which shall be manifested subsequently to the things foretold. But if He had not known the hour, He had not signified the events before it, as not knowing when it should be. And as any one, who, by way of pointing out a house or city to those who were ignorant of it, gave an account of what comes before the house or city, and having described all, said, ‘Then immediately comes the city or the house,’ would know of course where the house or the city was (for had he not known, he had not described what comes before lest from ignorance he should throw his hearers far out of the way, or in speaking he should unawares go beyond the object), so the Lord saying what precedes that day and that hour, knows exactly, nor is ignorant, when the hour and the day are at hand….Now why it was that, though He knew, He did not tell His disciples plainly at that time, no one may be curious where He has been silent; for ‘Who has known the mind of the Lord, or who has been His counsellor [Romans 11:34] ?’ but why, though He knew, He said, ‘no, not the Son knows,’ this I think none of the faithful is ignorant, viz. that He made this as those other declarations as man by reason of the flesh. For this as before is not the Word’s deficiency , but of that human nature whose property it is to be ignorant….[continues in arguing]”—St Athanasius, Discourse 3 Against the Arians Chapter 28, c. AD 370
"Certainly when He says in the Gospel concerning Himself in His human character, ‘Father, the hour is come, glorify Your Son ,’[John 17:1] it is plain that He knows also the hour of the end of all things, as the Word, though as man He is ignorant of it, for ignorance is proper to man, and especially ignorance of these things. Moreover this is proper to the Savior’s love of man; for since He was made man, He is not ashamed, because of the flesh which is ignorant , to say ‘I know not,’ that He may show that knowing as God, He is but ignorant according to the flesh . And therefore He said not, ‘no, not the Son of God knows,’ lest the Godhead should seem ignorant, but simply, ‘no, not the Son,’[Mark 13:32] that the ignorance might be the Son’s as born from among men." --St Athanasius, Discourse 3 Against the Arians Chapter 43, c. AD 370
TBC
Here is my commentaries on Mark 13:32, the Chruch always said Jesus was all knowing.
“These things being so, come let us now examine into ‘But of that day and that hour knows no man, neither the Angels of God, nor the Son ;’[Mark 13:32] for being in great ignorance as regards these words, and being stupefied about them, they think they have in them an important argument for their heresy. But I, when the heretics allege it and prepare themselves with it, see in them the giants again fighting against God. For the Lord of heaven and earth, by whom all things were made, has to litigate before them about day and hour; and the Word who knows all things is accused by them of ignorance about a day; and the Son who knows the Father is said to be ignorant of an hour of a day; now what can be spoken more contrary to sense, or what madness can be likened to this? Through the Word all things have been made, times and seasons and night and day and the whole creation; and is the Framer of all said to be ignorant of His work? And the very context of the lection shows that the Son of God knows that hour and that day, though the Arians fall headlong in their ignorance. For after saying, ‘nor the Son,’ He relates to the disciples what precedes the day, saying, ‘This and that shall be, and then the end.’ But He who speaks of what precedes the day, knows certainly the day also, which shall be manifested subsequently to the things foretold. But if He had not known the hour, He had not signified the events before it, as not knowing when it should be. And as any one, who, by way of pointing out a house or city to those who were ignorant of it, gave an account of what comes before the house or city, and having described all, said, ‘Then immediately comes the city or the house,’ would know of course where the house or the city was (for had he not known, he had not described what comes before lest from ignorance he should throw his hearers far out of the way, or in speaking he should unawares go beyond the object), so the Lord saying what precedes that day and that hour, knows exactly, nor is ignorant, when the hour and the day are at hand….Now why it was that, though He knew, He did not tell His disciples plainly at that time, no one may be curious where He has been silent; for ‘Who has known the mind of the Lord, or who has been His counsellor [Romans 11:34] ?’ but why, though He knew, He said, ‘no, not the Son knows,’ this I think none of the faithful is ignorant, viz. that He made this as those other declarations as man by reason of the flesh. For this as before is not the Word’s deficiency , but of that human nature whose property it is to be ignorant….[continues in arguing]”—St Athanasius, Discourse 3 Against the Arians Chapter 28, c. AD 370
"Certainly when He says in the Gospel concerning Himself in His human character, ‘Father, the hour is come, glorify Your Son ,’[John 17:1] it is plain that He knows also the hour of the end of all things, as the Word, though as man He is ignorant of it, for ignorance is proper to man, and especially ignorance of these things. Moreover this is proper to the Savior’s love of man; for since He was made man, He is not ashamed, because of the flesh which is ignorant , to say ‘I know not,’ that He may show that knowing as God, He is but ignorant according to the flesh . And therefore He said not, ‘no, not the Son of God knows,’ lest the Godhead should seem ignorant, but simply, ‘no, not the Son,’[Mark 13:32] that the ignorance might be the Son’s as born from among men." --St Athanasius, Discourse 3 Against the Arians Chapter 43, c. AD 370
TBC
B
BerhaneSelassie
Guest
“Their tenth objection is the objection, and the statement that of the last ‘day and hour knows no man, not even the Son Himself, but the Father.’[Mark 13:32] And yet how can Wisdom be ignorant of anything? …How then can you say that all things before that hour He knows accurately, and all things that are to happen about the time of the end, but the hour itself He is ignorant? ** For such a thing would be like a riddle, as if one were to say that he knew accurately all that was in front of the wall, but did not know the wall itself; or that, knowing the end of the day, he did not the beginning of night–where knowledge of the one neccessarily brings in the other.** Thus everyone must see He knows as God, and knows not as man,–if one may separate visible from that which discerned by thought alone.”–St Gregory Nazianzen, On the Holy Spirit, Chapter 30:15 ca. AD 370
“The Son is ignorant, then, of nothing which the Father knows, nor does it follow because the Father alone knows, that the Son does not know. Father and Son abide in unity of nature, and the ignorance of the Son belongs to the divine Plan of silence, seeing that in Him are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. This the Lord Himself testified, when He answered the question of the Apostles concerning the times, “It is not yours to know times or moments, which the Father has set within His own authority” [Acts 1:7] . The knowledge is denied them, and not only that, but the anxiety to learn is forbidden, because it is not theirs to know these times. Yet now that He is risen, they ask again, though their question on the former occasion had been met with the reply, that not even the Son knew. They cannot possibly have understood literally that the Son did not know, for they ask Him again as though He did know. They perceived in the mystery of His ignorance a divine Plan of silence, and now, after His resurrection, they renew the question, thinking that the time has come to speak. And the Son no longer denies that He knows, but tells them that it is not theirs to know, because the Father has set it within His own authority…We must not therefore think, because He said He did not know the day and the moment, that the Son did not know. As man He wept, and slept, and sorrowed, but God is incapable of tears, or fear, or sleep. According to the weakness of His flesh He shed tears, slept, hungered, thirsted, was weary, and feared, yet without impairing the reality of His Only-begotten nature; equally so must we refer to His human nature, the words that He knew not the day or the hour[Mark 13:32].”— St Hilary of Poiters (doctor of the Church) On the Trinity Book IX paragraph 74
I can post more later, for more and the whole wholes see my website on The Omniscience of Christ, freewebs.com/orthodoxcatholic/allknowing.htm
“The Son is ignorant, then, of nothing which the Father knows, nor does it follow because the Father alone knows, that the Son does not know. Father and Son abide in unity of nature, and the ignorance of the Son belongs to the divine Plan of silence, seeing that in Him are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. This the Lord Himself testified, when He answered the question of the Apostles concerning the times, “It is not yours to know times or moments, which the Father has set within His own authority” [Acts 1:7] . The knowledge is denied them, and not only that, but the anxiety to learn is forbidden, because it is not theirs to know these times. Yet now that He is risen, they ask again, though their question on the former occasion had been met with the reply, that not even the Son knew. They cannot possibly have understood literally that the Son did not know, for they ask Him again as though He did know. They perceived in the mystery of His ignorance a divine Plan of silence, and now, after His resurrection, they renew the question, thinking that the time has come to speak. And the Son no longer denies that He knows, but tells them that it is not theirs to know, because the Father has set it within His own authority…We must not therefore think, because He said He did not know the day and the moment, that the Son did not know. As man He wept, and slept, and sorrowed, but God is incapable of tears, or fear, or sleep. According to the weakness of His flesh He shed tears, slept, hungered, thirsted, was weary, and feared, yet without impairing the reality of His Only-begotten nature; equally so must we refer to His human nature, the words that He knew not the day or the hour[Mark 13:32].”— St Hilary of Poiters (doctor of the Church) On the Trinity Book IX paragraph 74
I can post more later, for more and the whole wholes see my website on The Omniscience of Christ, freewebs.com/orthodoxcatholic/allknowing.htm
B
BerhaneSelassie
Guest
Yes now read the next two verses–Jesus asks His Father to GLORIFY HIM with the Glory He had before the World was.
Yes, Jesus, holy is His Name, said this as a MAN, Jesus, Holy is His name, is both a MAN and GOD, bless is He. As a man Jesus, Holy is His Name, is inferior to God, the Holy one, since as a man He is a creation.
Jesus was “veiled” He came in “human appearance” Phil 2. .
The king probably though daniel was some form of lesser god, not the almighty God
We have the Scriptures where Jesus says He is God, and He was before the world and where people PRAYED to Jesus to receive his spirit Acts 7:59, and Jesus says “without ME you can do nothing”
N
NotWorthy
Guest
First of all, before I do, do you admit that many of the Jews of the first century converted to Christianity, proclaiming that Jesus was God? And they did this long before John’s Gospel was written?
And the points in the Old Testament I will allude to will be there, only because we know the ending of the movie. It’s like watching an Alfred Hitchcock thriller. After you know who did it, you recognize the clues that you ignored the first time you watched the movie.
M
Michael_Francis
Guest
Having departed from topic, this thread is now closed.
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