Mary worship? I don’t think so

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Anesti33 said:
Please don’t muddy the waters. The modern usage of “worship” is to denote latria only.
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No, Merrriam-Webster, to worship
1 : to honor or show reverence for as a divine being or supernatural power
2 : to regard with great or extravagant respect, honor, or devotion
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Also note that Modern Catholic Dictionary source I gave before is modern.
 
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I don’t know of anyone who views the Blessed Virgin Mary as their Creator.

As for praying to the saints, will we not be allowed to talk to anyone else when we get to heaven, just talk to God alone? Do we believe in the Communion of te Saints?
 
we do NOT worship our Blessed Mother!!! we pray to her seeking help on our path to Jesus. suppose you wanted to meet the president and you had a distant relative or friend that was in his circle. wouldn’t you call that person getting a much better chance of actually meeting the president?? Our Blessed Mother is who helps us get our spiritual life together to be worthy of our Lord, our advocate, mediatrix, our mother beyond all mothers with her love for us and to help us. Yes, of course we go to and worship Jesus and the holy trinity above all and Mary would be the first to tell us that. we honor her and praise her for her complete and total dedication to God as she helps us get to that area of complete love and trust in God. Mary would and doesn’t want us to worship her as her life has shown us but she is there to take us by the hand so to speak and say no…not that way, it’s this way to God. and we ask her in every prayer to her …“to pray for us”.
i hope and pray that you will see that the daughter, mother, and spouse of the Holy Trinity is there waiting for you with all kinds of help and prayers for you. she’s probably praying for you already.
read up on some of the saints that saw more than we about Blessed Mary.
 
srobi said:
… Yes, of course we go to and worship Jesus and the holy trinity above all and Mary would be the first to tell us that. we honor her and praise her for her complete and total dedication to God as she helps us get to that area of complete love and trust in God. …
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The OP said: “we as Catholics are accused of worshiping and idolizing Mary above God”.
Now we do worship the saints (veneration) but it is not adoration worship which is reserved for God, so it is not worship above God.
 
BabyWitch said:
I understand the Christian theology surrounding Mary, but I’m speaking from an outside perspective.
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Your rhetoric about Mary is highly insulting to Catholics. We are on Catholic forum, you are effectively, according to the law of God and in turn, the Magisterium, in the employ of satan, the great adversary of God, being a self professed practitioner of witchcraft.

Please be respectful of my religion and not attempt to appropriate it for those ends
 
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Prayers and intercessions

Let us glorify our Savior, who chose the Virgin Mary for his mother. Let us ask him:

– May your mother intercede for us, Lord.

Eternal Word, you chose Mary as the uncorrupted ark of your dwelling-place:

free us from the corruption of sin.

– May your mother intercede for us, Lord.

You are our redeemer, who made the immaculate Virgin Mary your purest home and the sanctuary of the Holy Spirit:

make us temples of your Spirit for ever.

– May your mother intercede for us, Lord.

King of kings, you lifted up your mother, body and soul, into heaven:

help us to fix our thoughts on things above.

– May your mother intercede for us, Lord.

Lord of heaven and earth, you crowned Mary and set her at your right hand as queen:

make us worthy to share this glory.

– May your mother intercede for us, Lord.

Let us pray
Almighty, ever-living God,

you have taken the mother of your Son,

the immaculate Virgin Mary,

body and soul into the glory where you dwell.

Keep our hearts set on heaven

so that, with her, we may share in your glory.

Through our Lord Jesus Christ, your Son,

who lives and reigns with you in the unity of the Holy Spirit,

one God, for ever and ever.

Amen.
 
srobi said:
… suppose you wanted to meet the president and you had a distant relative or friend that was in his circle. wouldn’t you call that person getting a much better chance of actually meeting the president??
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What if they president said, if you need or want anything call me, here’s my number. Wouldn’t you call him directly yourself, especially if the president told you it was okay call him anytime, 24/7 I am at your beck and call… no matter what… call me direct.

John 14:13 - I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
 
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if the president took calls i’d say he probably wasn’t the president.😂
of course we all go to Jesus first and foremost, but are lack of humility often times
interferes and our Blessed Mother is there to help us, make our prayers better, guides us.
 
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annad347 said:
Wouldn’t you call him directly yourself, especially if the president told you it was okay call him anytime, 24/7 I am at your beck and call… no matter what… call me direct.
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Well it depends. I have dear friends I can rely on to help me, but that doesn’t mean I can just waltz into town unannounced and ask to stay at their place, or call them up at 2 AM for a chat. In the case of your President example, I may want to speak with his assistant first, who would know his schedule and be able to warn me if he’s in a bad mood. She helps me with timing and presenting my request because just because I have 24/7 access to the President, I don’t want to be presumptuous with our relationship and respect him.

Mary is like the Assistant.
 
annad347 said:
What about the Holy Spirit?
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The Holy Spirit helps, but He’s also God. And Mary knows Him very well too: the Holy Spirit came down upon her for the conception of Jesus, upon her cousin Elizabeth during the Visitation, and once again at Pentecost. Presidents of human companies aren’t Trinitarian in nature, but the same respect should apply to the Holy Spirit since He is just as equally much God as Jesus is.
 
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srobi said:
if the president took calls i’d say he probably wasn’t the president.😂
of course we all go to Jesus first and foremost, but are lack of humility often times
interferes and our Blessed Mother is there to help us, make our prayers better, guides us.
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Say, that reminds me…
Our Lord is our advocate and Mediator of redemption with God the Father. It is through Him that we ought to pray, in union with the whole Church, Triumphant, and Militant. It is through Him that we have access to the Majesty of the Father, before whom we ought never to appear except sustained and clothed with the merits of His Son, just as the young Jacob came before his father Isaac in the skins of the kids to receive his blessing.

Of all the truths which I have been explaining with regard to our Blessed Lady and her children and servants, the Holy Ghost gives us an admirable figure in the Scripture (Gen. 27). It is in the story of Jacob, who received the blessing of his father Isaac through the skill and pains of his mother Rebecca. This is the story the Holy Ghost relates it. I will afterward add the explanation of it.

Rebecca promptly informed Jacob of what had passed, and ordered him to go and take two kids from the flock. When he had given them to his mother, she prepared for Isaac what she knew he liked. She clothed Jacob in the garments of Esau, which she kept, and covered his hands and neck with the skin of the kids, so that his father, who was blind, even though he heard Jacob’s voice, might think by touching the skin of his hands that it was Esau.
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St Louis de Montford, True Devotion to Mary
 
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When a person asks for the intercession of saints, they go with us before God. We don’t go to them instead of God.
 
Fauken said:
… Presidents of human companies aren’t Trinitarian in nature, but the same respect should apply to the Holy Spirit since He is just as equally much God as Jesus is.
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the President is human, but he was used as an example as to what to do if you can’t go directly to the source, a CEO of a company was also used as an example…

I meant the Holy Spirit is what you said Mary is.

Yes the Holy Spirit is equal to God because the Holy Spirit is God… He was given to us to help us with everything, including interceding with our prayers. Romans 8:26-27

Basically if we are using examples of wanting to talk to the President or the CEO of a major company, you would call an assistant to make an appoint, or make sure they’re in a good, mood or not too busy. The Holy Spirit would be the red phone giving you direct access. He will know it’s you, no obstacles would be in your way.

Pick up, boom, direct line, done. :phone:
 
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Suppose that you wanted to call God ‘directly’. God being God, and having chosen as God, has chosen to be absolutely, totally, completely united to His chosen ones. Therefore any person who wishes to ‘call’ directly is also addressing Mary and the saints among others. They are so completely and fully united to God that all their actions originate with God and they are perfectly conformed to His will in every way.

So in essence you’re saying, “I just want to talk to God, and I assume He is in some place ‘all alone’ while Mary and the others are in some place, or some ‘state’ whereby they hear absolutely nothing that God hears, see absolutely nothing God sees, and are totally separate from Him.”

Well, that just isn’t possible. Since God has chosen to unite so completely with Mary and the saints in heaven, it’s not only good manners to acknowledge that they are part of Him, it also helps us to expand our own knowledge of the completeness of God, and to follow more perfectly the second of the two great commandments, to love our neighbors as ourselves, as our neighbors are united with God in Heaven above, just as we wish ourselves to be upon our death.
 
Anesti33 said:
I am sorry that you consider your brothers and sisters in Christ to be obstacles to God.
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I didn’t say anyone was an obstacle… I was just replying to obstacles mentioned by @Fauken in post 110. The obstacles of schedules issues, bad moods, bad timing… and it was about the President, I think not God.
 
annad347 said:
Basically if we are using examples of wanting to talk to the President or the CEO of a major company, you would call an assistant to make an appoint, or make sure they’re in a good, mood or not too busy. The Holy Spirit would be the red phone giving you direct access. He will know it’s you, no obstacles would be in your way.
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By this you implied that the assistant is an obstacle to your access to the President/CEO. And by President/CEO you mean God, and by “the red phone” you mean praying to the Holy Spirit without “obstacles” such as saints.

Do you not see how this would be construed as we parse your analogy? You’ve already insisted that you don’t pray to saints in Heaven, why deny it now?
 
You guys are funny…

Okay fine, God knows my mind, heart and words. God knows who I address when I pray. That is all that matters… analyze that any way you wish.

If Mary, saints, my parents, grand parents and brothers want to listen in on my prayers to God… go for it.

I pray to the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit despite who’s listening. 😉
 
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