Men's purity - What can women do about it?

[Ana]

kev7:

Why does it bother women so much when their husband masterbates?.

There is always a consequence to sin, not only to ourselves but to those close to us and on a larger scale, the Body of Christ and society at large. Ever hear of the “ripple effect?”

Marital sex is the UNION of man and wife. Masterbation leaves out a very important part of the equation … the spouse. And if there is pornography involved or fantasy of another, it is not only leaving out the spouse but bringing in a third party! It would take a saint not to take it personal.

kev7:

If I had a wife that did such a thing I would pray for her and try to help her in a gentle way, but I would never let such a thing get to my head…

You HOPE that you would, but so often we fall short not only of God’s standards, but even our own. As I said previously, it would take a saint not to take it personal. Thank God for the Sacrament of Marriage. God uses eachothers crosses to make us Saints!!

kev7:

Everyone has a 'Sin" that they have to work on. Your sin might not be the same as your husbands, but you are not perfect either. .

That’s why we must be patient with those learning to be patient.

kev7:

Women also have to understand that it can be very difficult for a man do go without masterbating. It can drive him nuts and force him to lose concentration. I’m not saying that it should be something that is acceptable. I’m just saying that it is a cross that all men have to carry…

You mean to attain purity it takes (gasp!) … GRACE?

kev7:

And as a loving wife it is important to be kind and understanding.

Of course, and as a loving husband it is important to be kind and understanding of the wife struggling to respond to the husband’s sin of masturbation in a non-sinful way..

 

[space_ghost]

…continue to be a shinning example of what a woman of God should be…

…the only thing i know holier than a woman is a child…

…from woman all life springs, and to let herself be reduced to something other than what God designed her to be is a crime against herself and God…

…man follows her lead… Adam followed Eve’s lead… Jesus was raised by his mother, even God asked for Mary’s approval… he did not have to do that…

…men want and expect, if not demand a wife’s purity, even though some don’t think it works both ways…

…you should not only expect, but demand the same of your spouse or intended spouse…

…the ball is definitely in your hands… we are waiting to follow, just lead…

Peace…

http://micrografix.ca/GHOST.jpg

 

[Black_Jaque]

Sometimes you just have to do it to keep your mind away from impure thoughts.

Nope you don’t have to do it.

Sometimes you just have to do it to keep your mind away from impure thoughts.

Difficult but not impossible.

Why does it bother women so much when their husband masterbates?

Well, for one thing, if the woman loves her husband, she should be bothered if he is taking a path to Hell. Interestingly, I know of some instances where the women have told the husbands to masterbate, just because they didn’t want to be bothered with his “needs”. What kind of challenge do you suppose that puts on the husbands to stay pure? This is almost the feminist mantra - if the woman doesn’t feel like it, he should just take care of himself.

In a way, it seems a little foolish to tell your husband “I have a headache”, then turn around and get upset if you catch him taking care of himself. Duh! But that’s probably better than not caring at all.

 

[Ana]

kev7:

The more that women refuse us in marriage the more likely we are to commit an impure act.

The more one commits an impure act, the more likely the other spouse feels degraded and more likely to “refuse.” No one likes to be used.

 

[dulcissima]

Black Jaque:

Well, for one thing, if the woman loves her husband, she should be bothered if he is taking a path to Hell. Interestingly, I know of some instances where the women have told the husbands to masterbate, just because they didn’t want to be bothered with his “needs”. What kind of challenge do you suppose that puts on the husbands to stay pure? This is almost the feminist mantra - if the woman doesn’t feel like it, he should just take care of himself.

In a way, it seems a little foolish to tell your husband “I have a headache”, then turn around and get upset if you catch him taking care of himself. Duh! But that’s probably better than not caring at all.

Exactly. As wives, shouldn’t we want to help our husbands get to heaven? As was pointed out on another thread in the Family Life section, when a spouse consistently denies the other spouse the “marital right”, they share in the culpability of that spouse when the rejected spouse then takes the matter into their own hands, so to speak, or someone elses. I have never heard the “feminist mantra” that you refer to, but it is very wrong for the wife to suggest that the husband should commit a mortal sin, just because she doesn’t want to give of herself. I have read a little bit from the Theology of the Body, which suggests that the unitive nature of the marriage act prepares the husband and wife for union with God. It seems like out and out sacrelige to choose a mortal sin over what God intended.

 

[Black_Jaque]

The more that women refuse us in marriage the more likely we are to commit an impure act.

The more one commits an impure act, the more likely the other spouse feels degraded and the be more likely to “refuse.” No one likes to be used.

There’s the vortex. Now begins the finger pointing as both get sucked into hell.

So the thread topic isn’t what can the man do, it’s what can the woman do to stop the cycle?

 

[Black_Jaque]

I have never heard the “feminist mantra” that you refer to, but it is very wrong for the wife to suggest that the husband should commit a mortal sin, just because she doesn’t want to give of herself.

There are people out there who define rape as anytime the woman didn’t particularly feel like it. Her “no” is supposed to be final - even within a marriage, and she should never be made to feel like she has to do it. It’s part of the woman’s right to her own body, or so the thinking goes.

 

[Ana]

Black Jaque:

There’s the vortex. Now begins the finger pointing as both get sucked into hell.

So the thread topic isn’t what can the man do, it’s what can the woman do to stop the cycle?

Yup, you’re right, Black Jaque!! Let’s not go there, Kev.

Just wondering if any of my other posts made it through? I know that not every post gets replied to, but this is the fifth or sixth post I’ve nade on this thread, and I have been all but ignored! Nobody loves me, or is even getting mad at me!:crying: .

 

[dulcissima]

Ana:

Just wondering if any of my other posts made it through? I know that not every post gets replied to, but this is the fifth or sixth post I’ve nade on this thread, and I have been all but ignored! Nobody loves me, or is even getting mad at me!:crying: .

Sorry, BTW, thanks for your prayers. They’re very much appreciated.

 

[Pug]

Black Jaque:

So is there any insight from you men and women on what has worked and what has failed? What have wives done that they found really helped their man struggling with purity? What have they done that made the problem worse? What can mothers do to assure the purity of their sons?

[Wives] Do not call him a pervert and rip up at him. Maintain respect and honor. Appreciate what he does. Do not get in the way of healthy interaction with other males. Frequent the sacraments yourself. Invite him along as seems appropriate. Pray. Things like this won’t exacerbate the problem.

If he is a sex addict, regular sex with the wife can be irrelevant. It does not satisfy the urge. He can go directly from the bedroom to an adult bookstore. They are two separate things in many ways. However, I do not advocate being a cold fish.

Actually, I think fathers have more influence over how the son reacts to pornography than the mother, sorry! The dad should give the straight scoop to the son, and if he won’t, improvise, but it won’t be as good.

 

[rayne89]

Pug:

Actually, I think fathers have more influence over how the son reacts to pornography than the mother, sorry! The dad should give the straight scoop to the son, and if he won’t, improvise, but it won’t be as good.

I agree. In my husbands house the porn tapes were right in the video cabinet. And immoral books were in the parents bedroom (but easy enough for a curious child to find.) His dad even had a book on “How to masturbate” which my husband jokes about, like you need a book to figure that out. The had a “black box” with their cable so they got all the channels.

 

[Black_Jaque]

Just wondering if any of my other posts made it through? I know that not every post gets replied to, but this is the fifth or sixth post I’ve nade on this thread, and I have been all but ignored! Nobody loves me, or is even getting mad at me!:crying: .

Yes they’re getting through. I didn’t think I needed to respond since my responses will probably show up in a dream of yours.:bigyikes:

Actually you’ve been too darn agreeable. I enjoyed the “zit-popping” anecdote.

I was a bit perplexed by your psychoanalysis of the unchallenged silverback - but responding to that would have been thread drift.

There’s a song that goes, “Ya don’t tug on Superman’s cape, ya don’t spit into the wind, ya don’t pull the mask off the ol’ Lone Ranger and ya don’t mess around with Jim… Mmmhmmm mmhmm…”

 

[Black_Jaque]

Actually, I think fathers have more influence over how the son reacts to pornography than the mother, sorry!

Sure, but does that mean mothers have no influence. The topic isn’t about what fathers/husbands can do, it’s about what wives/mothers can do.

Blameless = Helpless.

Is there any reason why a wife can just make it a blanket policy to burn any improper material she finds? Just wait until he goes to work and light it up. He may find better hiding spots. But better hiding spots may mean less risk that children will find it. Also, sends a message to children who do find it that it isn’t acceptable. Those children may then grow up a little more able to conquer the problem. I.e. the boy grows to be a husband, looks at porn, his wife confronts him, now since he knows his mother never tolerated it he may be less likely to fight with his wife over it. Instead he submissively admits that it’s wrong and maybe even gets help.

Or he does a really good job at hiding it. His kids grow up and never even find out he had such an aweful habit. His kids then never develop the habit.

I certainly would burn any smut-novels that cross my property boundary, I wouldn’t care if they belonged to the library or not. Never had to though.

 

[Pug]

rayne89:

I agree. In my husbands house the porn tapes were right in the video cabinet. And immoral books were in the parents bedroom (but easy enough for a curious child to find.) His dad even had a book on “How to masturbate” which my husband jokes about, like you need a book to figure that out. The had a “black box” with their cable so they got all the channels.

I wonder what it would be like to grow up unexposed to the stuff? I agree, kids go everywhere. If it is in a closet or attic somewhere, the kid will find it, and at that young age when they tend to hide in closets.

Is it acceptable to throw out something that you absolutely know your spouse does not want thrown out? I don’t mean some left over fast food wrappers, but something they regularly use and want. You both have to live in the house. Maybe kids change the picture…I don’t have any. I could see it leading to the house being a war zone of property fights and an escalating fight for control.

 

[Black_Jaque]

I could see it leading to the house being a war zone of property fights and an escalating fight for control.

That’s the beauty of being Catholic - we’re not pacifists. We believe in a just war.

 

[rayne89]

Pug:

I don’t mean some left over fast food wrappers, but something they regularly use and want. You both have to live in the house. Maybe kids change the picture…I don’t have any. I could see it leading to the house being a war zone of property fights and an escalating fight for control.

You’d have to be more specific and some people will different opinions on this, I can only give you mine.
Illegal things like drugs? Absolutely in the toilet with out a second thought.
Immoral things like porn, trashy books - I would have a heart to heart with my spouse and give him(or her if I was a guy) the oportunity to pitch the stuff himself. If he refused and especially if my child was old enough to find it -I’d pitch it myself. The reaction porbably won’t be pretty but would be willing to take the fall out from my actions especially when I have my children to protect.

What kinds of things are you referring to?

 

[dulcissima]

Pug:

Is it acceptable to throw out something that you absolutely know your spouse does not want thrown out? I don’t mean some left over fast food wrappers, but something they regularly use and want. You both have to live in the house. Maybe kids change the picture…I don’t have any. I could see it leading to the house being a war zone of property fights and an escalating fight for control.

My huband has quite a lot of junk that I would love to just throw out, but that would be not too nice now would it? Now, porn on the other hand, he did have some magazines back when we were first married. I left them alone for a while, but one day decided to toss them out. I never did hear anything from him about that. I guess he never noticed.

 

[Pug]

Black Jaque:

Sure, but does that mean mothers have no influence. The topic isn’t about what fathers/husbands can do, it’s about what wives/mothers can do

Actually, it was a suggestion for moms, in my own backwards way. The mom should get the dad to do it, if she can. I really think that should be the first thing she tries, so it needed to be mentioned. However, I didn’t want to phrase it that way, because it makes it sound like I am assuming he won’t want to do it and that he has abdicated his role. I think she should negotiate to get him to do it, and if that fails, do it herself. Tell the son the straight scoop, or get a grandfather or uncle to do it. Probably best to have it be really short.

You have an excellent point, that if a man knows his mom hated porn, then he may give more credence to his wife when she objects.

 

[miguel]

Black Jaque:

That’s the beauty of being Catholic - we’re not pacifists. We believe in a just war.

 

[manualman]

dulcissima:

Now, porn on the other hand, he did have some magazines back when we were first married. I left them alone for a while, but one day decided to toss them out. I never did hear anything from him about that. I guess he never noticed.

Oh he NOTICED! Believe me, he noticed. Poor guy probably slept poorly for three months wondering where he put those and fearing you would come across them and beat his brains out!

My folks actually did this to me with a fifth of vodka I hid in my bedroom when I was 17. MAN I was terrified of what had happened to that bottle. Never sneaked the stuff into the house again.