Minn. health care exchange's rates lowest so far

[RandomRhino]

So happy to hear the good news about Minnesota’s health care exchange! Can’t wait to hear more good news coming out of Obamacare—because clearly, the bill has not destroyed our country and I have the added bonus of knowing my family members actually HAVE insurance now instead of that lifetime limit and pre-existing condition ****.

 

[SamH]

If half the energy spent on pooh-poohing Obamacare and predicting doom/gloom, had been spent instead on implementing a good alternative to expand healthcare coverage during the time conservatives ran things, then maybe we wouldn’t be having this conversation. It is much easier to criticize and oppose than to actually feed the hungry and care for the sick…

None of us has seen the results of the full implementation of Obamacare, but considering the alternative (Romneycare), I’d say we are at least no better or worse off that we would have been had this health care law not been passed.

We had a good alternative that the government destroyed.

 

[MSSheBear]

We had a good alternative that the government destroyed.

By this you mean the pre-Obama care system was good?

 

[SamH]

By this you mean the pre-Obama care system was good?

It saved my son’s life several times. In the near future I foresee policies put in place to prevent a child as young as he was from getting the expensive care that they need to survive.

 

[MSSheBear]

It saved my son’s life several times. In the near future I foresee policies put in place to prevent a child as young as he was from getting the expensive care that they need to survive.

Yes, he was lucky. My elderly mother is probably doomed under Obamacare. She keeps nagging me to get health insurance which I haven’t been able to afford in California for the last ten years. I don’t get it through an employer so I can’t afford it. I have pre-existing condition. Insurance would have cost me about 30% of my net income.

I will be honest with you, I have no intention of going to the doctor with or without insurance because of some, shall we say, issues with the behavior of the medical staff. I worry about getting in an accident and having surprise bill.

I have known other people who also had pre-existing conditions who could not get insurance. Obamacare is already giving me headache so I am not thrilled with it either.

 

[SMGS127]

Yes, he was lucky. My elderly mother is probably doomed under Obamacare. She keeps nagging me to get health insurance which I haven’t been able to afford in California for the last ten years. I don’t get it through an employer so I can’t afford it. I have pre-existing condition. Insurance would have cost me about 30% of my net income.

I will be honest with you, I have no intention of going to the doctor with or without insurance because of some, shall we say, issues with the behavior of the medical staff. I worry about getting in an accident and having surprise bill.

I have known other people who also had pre-existing conditions who could not get insurance. Obamacare is already giving me headache so I am not thrilled with it either.

Wait for the exchanges; it’ll probably be cheaper and easier for you to get insurance once they hit October 1st.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Also, if only conservatives had actually attempted to negotiate at all rather than demand the entire bill be scrapped for tort reform and interstate deregulation, we could have taken out horrible stuff like the birth control requirement before the bill passed. I have no doubt Republicans were only thinking about the 2010 election though so .

Huh?

I remember watching on TV the “negotiations” between Obama and the Repubs. Basically, Obama told the Repubs they had nothing to say about it. I remember, in particular, McCain making a suggestion. Obama only reminded McCain that he lost and Obama won the presidential election. Not only did Obama not listen, he couldn’t even let himself be courteous.

I also remember the failed “Stupak amendment”. The Obama people just rolled over Stupak and those who wanted to keep Obamacare from funding abortion. Not that the Stupak Amendment would have really prevented it, but the Obama forces couldn’t even allow a fellow Democrat to save his political career by adopting an ineffective token provision.

There was never any real negotiation allowed in the Obamacare fiasco. Remember? They wouldn’t even allow Senators to read it until the very last second when nobody had time to read it? I remember the various television pundits struggling mightily to read it before it passed, and I don’t recall a single one saying that he/she actually was able to do it.

Remember Nancy Pelosi announcing that they had to pass it to know what was in it?

A shameful performance, all of it was. Naked political power was the game, and the only game.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Wait for the exchanges; it’ll probably be cheaper and easier for you to get insurance once they hit October 1st.

It might even be free. But “free” doesn’t mean “available”. Some 17 million are going to be added to the Medicaid rolls by Obamacare. It’s hard enough now to get providers to accept Medicaid.

 

[Ridgerunner]

By this you mean the pre-Obama care system was good?

It was far from perfect, but 80% of people were happy with it, polls showed.
-Some people without insurance were illegals.
-Some without insurance were between jobs that had health insurance.
-Some were young people who didn’t think they needed it.
-Some were people who were Medicaid-qualified but who didn’t bother to sign up until they had medical expenses. (Medicaid will pay in arrears)
-Some were people with preexisting conditions who couldn’t afford it.

Nobody knows how many were in any of those groups. But among them, the easiest to sympathize were those last listed who didn’t qualify for Medicaid, whose employers did not have insurance and whose states’ forced placement programs were insufficiently funded to allow for reasonable premiums.

I always believed additional funding for those forced placement programs would have solved the problem of those with preexisting conditions who did not have employers with insurance. Almost all employers had ERISA-qualified health plans. Under ERISA, preexisting conditions could only be disqualified for coverage for that condition alone and only for one year. If one went from one ERISA-qualified plan to another, they had to take the preexisting conditions in coverage immediately.

But Obama and company didn’t do any of that. They preferred to utterly change the healthcare system, institute a lot of taxes, force Catholic employers to cover abortifacients and contraceptives (even orders of nuns who do charitable work), and institute a highly intrusive system that’s built for rationing care.

And Obama himself admits some 30 million won’t have coverage under Obamacare. Who are those people? Are they the same people who couldn’t get coverage before but wanted it? Nobody knows.

 

[SMGS127]

Huh?

I remember watching on TV the “negotiations” between Obama and the Repubs. Basically, Obama told the Repubs they had nothing to say about it. I remember, in particular, McCain making a suggestion. Obama only reminded McCain that he lost and Obama won the presidential election. Not only did Obama not listen, he couldn’t even let himself be courteous.

I also remember the failed “Stupak amendment”. The Obama people just rolled over Stupak and those who wanted to keep Obamacare from funding abortion. Not that the Stupak Amendment would have really prevented it, but the Obama forces couldn’t even allow a fellow Democrat to save his political career by adopting an ineffective token provision.

There was never any real negotiation allowed in the Obamacare fiasco. Remember? They wouldn’t even allow Senators to read it until the very last second when nobody had time to read it? I remember the various television pundits struggling mightily to read it before it passed, and I don’t recall a single one saying that he/she actually was able to do it.

Remember Nancy Pelosi announcing that they had to pass it to know what was in it?

A shameful performance, all of it was. Naked political power was the game, and the only game.

Do you remember the negotiations with Snowe, Grassley, and Enzi that turned sour when FOX News & Republicans basically shuttled conservative “activists” to town hall meetings to shout down lawmakers over a health care bill that didn’t even exist yet? Grassley came out while in negotiations talking about how we were instituting “death panels.” Then, FOX News basically provided free advertising for the Tea Party movement, giving free information on the air on where you could find your local Tea Party/Republican meeting site. All still while there was no health care bill.

How much does that sound like “negotiation” vs. “stalling to try to drive down public opinion?” Ultimately, only Snowe agreed to actually work on the bill with any form of intent, being the only Republican to ever vote for the bill in committee, and by that point Democrats realized they had no hope of actually compromising with Republicans and that they had to write the bill themselves.

The Democrats made a good bill with lots of bad parts, yes. But it was the responsibility of Republicans to actually work to take out the bad parts in exchange for votes, and they completely floundered that responsibility in order to maximize 2010 anger for political gain.

Edit: As for the Stupak Amendment, because of the election of Scott Brown, Democrats could not pass anything through the Senate that was not budget-related. That is why the Democrats had to first pass a completely different health care bill in the House, then pass adjustments, while Democrats had to pass a reconcilation bill that could only adjust budgetary issues in the health care bill in the Senate. If they had tried to pass the Stupak Amendment in the Senate, it would have failed, because Republicans would have never helped them pass the health care bill, even if it meant giving up the pro-life issue.

 

[Holly3278]

I am really not sure what to think about Obamacare. I do like the fact that preexisting conditions are no longer a hindrance to getting health insurance. However, I absolutely do not like the HHS Mandate and I am vehemently opposed to it.

 

[MSSheBear]

It was far from perfect, but 80% of people were happy with it, polls showed.
-Some people without insurance were illegals.
-Some without insurance were between jobs that had health insurance.
-Some were young people who didn’t think they needed it.
-Some were people who were Medicaid-qualified but who didn’t bother to sign up until they had medical expenses. (Medicaid will pay in arrears)
-Some were people with preexisting conditions who couldn’t afford it.

Nobody knows how many were in any of those groups. But among them, the easiest to sympathize were those last listed who didn’t qualify for Medicaid, whose employers did not have insurance and whose states’ forced placement programs were insufficiently funded to allow for reasonable premiums.

I always believed additional funding for those forced placement programs would have solved the problem of those with preexisting conditions who did not have employers with insurance. Almost all employers had ERISA-qualified health plans. Under ERISA, preexisting conditions could only be disqualified for coverage for that condition alone and only for one year. If one went from one ERISA-qualified plan to another, they had to take the preexisting conditions in coverage immediately.

But Obama and company didn’t do any of that. They preferred to utterly change the healthcare system, institute a lot of taxes, force Catholic employers to cover abortifacients and contraceptives (even orders of nuns who do charitable work), and institute a highly intrusive system that’s built for rationing care.

And Obama himself admits some 30 million won’t have coverage under Obamacare. Who are those people? Are they the same people who couldn’t get coverage before but wanted it? Nobody knows.

What was ERISA? I never heard of it. In California we had some insurance program with limited coverage and high premiums that I couldn’t afford. We only have 6 insurance companies and we had a lot of uninsured people.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Do you remember the negotiations with Snowe, Grassley, and Enzi that turned sour when FOX News & Republicans basically shuttled conservative “activists” to town hall meetings to shout down lawmakers over a health care bill that didn’t even exist yet? Grassley came out while in negotiations talking about how we were instituting “death panels.” Then, FOX News basically provided free advertising for the Tea Party movement, giving free information on the air on where you could find your local Tea Party/Republican meeting site. All still while there was no health care bill.

How much does that sound like “negotiation” vs. “stalling to try to drive down public opinion?” Ultimately, only Snowe agreed to actually work on the bill with any form of intent, being the only Republican to ever vote for the bill in committee, and by that point Democrats realized they had no hope of actually compromising with Republicans and that they had to write the bill themselves.

The Democrats made a good bill with lots of bad parts, yes. But it was the responsibility of Republicans to actually work to take out the bad parts in exchange for votes, and they completely floundered that responsibility in order to maximize 2010 anger for political gain.

Edit: As for the Stupak Amendment, because of the election of Scott Brown, Democrats could not pass anything through the Senate that was not budget-related. That is why the Democrats had to first pass a completely different health care bill in the House, then pass adjustments, while Democrats had to pass a reconcilation bill that could only adjust budgetary issues in the health care bill in the Senate. If they had tried to pass the Stupak Amendment in the Senate, it would have failed, because Republicans would have never helped them pass the health care bill, even if it meant giving up the pro-life issue.

I think you have misunderstood everything. Neither Fox nor the Repub party directs Tea Party people. The Repub mainliners, in fact, don’t particularly like them.

The eruptions at Town Hall meetings represented the opposition of citizens to a very bad law that had already passed. Remember? They jumped on those politicians who had already voted for Obamacare. The majority of Americans still don’t want it. Are you blaming the Repubs for that too? I assume you are, since Democrats blame Repubs now for every adverse thing.

Stupak didn’t have the Democrat votes for his amendment, and certainly not the support of Obama. His amendment was dead before Brown was ever elected. The Senate had already passed Obamacare before Brown took office.

It is amazing the excuses Democrats make for Obamacare, and the blame they put on Repubs for the consequences of their own actions alone. Remember? The members of congress hadn’t even read the bill before they passed it. Also remember that Repubs were not even allowed in the committee meetings when the Dems worked on the bill. Remember Pelosi saying they had to pass Obamacare in order to know what’s in it?

Astonishing how Democrats excuse the totalitarian ways of people like Reid, Pelosi and Obama.

 

[Ridgerunner]

What was ERISA? I never heard of it. In California we had some insurance program with limited coverage and high premiums that I couldn’t afford. We only have 6 insurance companies and we had a lot of uninsured people.

It’s the Employee Retirement Income Security Act. It contains a lot of things, but if an employer wants its retirement OR medical plans to be tax deductible, they have to comply with ERISA. One of the ERISA requirements is that preexisting conditions cannot be a disqualifier except for that particular condition and then only for a year. Also, if you go from one plan to another, if they are both ERISA qualified, you can’t be disqualified for preexisting conditions at all in the one you transfer to.

So, for people who had employment based insurance, disqualifying for preexisting conditions didn’t mean much once they had been on any qualified program for a year. They could go from job to job and never be disqualified for preexisting. Virtually all employment based health plans are ERISA qualified.

I don’t know much of anything about California’s healthcare programs.

 

[lcburgundy]

Obamacare takes the worst features of what we already had and amplifies them. This is a governmental redistribution system and power grab and not much else. People still have no reason to shop around or make informed decisions about where to get care or how much of it they want. No price signals means people will use as much of it as they can, and that means rationing, and why, look at that, rationing is overseen by a set of appointed bureaucrats. How convenient.

 

[SamH]

It’s the Employee Retirement Income Security Act. It contains a lot of things, but if an employer wants its retirement OR medical plans to be tax deductible, they have to comply with ERISA. One of the ERISA requirements is that preexisting conditions cannot be a disqualifier except for that particular condition and then only for a year. Also, if you go from one plan to another, if they are both ERISA qualified, you can’t be disqualified for preexisting conditions at all in the one you transfer to.

So, for people who had employment based insurance, disqualifying for preexisting conditions didn’t mean much once they had been on any qualified program for a year. They could go from job to job and never be disqualified for preexisting. Virtually all employment based health plans are ERISA qualified.

I don’t know much of anything about California’s healthcare programs.

Actually a pre existing condition can only be a “uncovered” for 90 days when a person initially joins a group plan - the pre existing condition is covered from day one when moving from group to group. I don’t know if that is part of ERISA or some other law. I’ve been through that with several employees and my son.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Actually a pre existing condition can only be a “uncovered” for 90 days when a person initially joins a group plan - the pre existing condition is covered from day one when moving from group to group. I don’t know if that is part of ERISA or some other law. I’ve been through that with several employees and my son.

I don’t work in that field, so I’ll defer to your knowledge on the 90 day disqualification.

Obamacare is touted for ensuring coverage of preexisting conditions as if they were never covered before (but not for coverage itself, as it will leave 30 million or more uninsured). But the reality for anybody who works is that it was pretty much a non-issue all along EXCEPT for some number of people who do not work for employers who provide coverage and who also did not qualify for medicaid. Nobody knows how many of those there were, but it would have been a lot easier to just aid the funding of the forced placement programs for those people.

 

[MSSheBear]

I don’t work in that field, so I’ll defer to your knowledge on the 90 day disqualification.

Obamacare is touted for ensuring coverage of preexisting conditions as if they were never covered before (but not for coverage itself, as it will leave 30 million or more uninsured). But the reality for anybody who works is that it was pretty much a non-issue all along EXCEPT for some number of people who do not work for employers who provide coverage and who also did not qualify for medicaid. Nobody knows how many of those there were, but it would have been a lot easier to just aid the funding of the forced placement programs for those people.

Thank you for the explanation. Not everyone has employer based health insurance. If you are working solo (an independent contractor) or if you have two part-time jobs you don’t get it.

California had some major medical risk program that had too many applicants and high premiums. I think it is now defunct.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Thank you for the explanation. Not everyone has employer based health insurance. If you are working solo (an independent contractor) or if you have two part-time jobs you don’t get it.

California had some major medical risk program that had too many applicants and high premiums. I think it is now defunct.

A program could have been devised to target specific problems and have cost a lot less and been less disruptive.

I think we’re going to be seeing a lot of part time jobs from now on.

 

[ProVobis]

I also remember the failed “Stupak amendment”. The Obama people just rolled over Stupak and those who wanted to keep Obamacare from funding abortion.

This is not totally true. The Stupak Amendment had 64 Democrats and almost all Republicans passing it in the House. It was only newly-elected Scott Brown (R-Mass) who prevented any further debate on that and everything else the House bill had. So it was either the Christmas Eve Senate version (without the public option, Stupak Amendment, extension of COBRA, etc.) or nothing. There was no way Obama or Pelosi would settle for nothing.