Missing Sunday Mass - Mortal Sin, Venial Sin, or no sin at all?

[jmcrae]

WOW! The responses to this question really surprise me!

My father was a pretty serous guy. He hosted a weekly Sunday dinner, and he expected everyone to be there. BUT, if every once in a while someone couldn’t make it, he never would have thrown them out of the family. He understood that sometimes, things happen. He loved his children enough to sympathize with them rather than blame them (the sabbath is made for man, rather than man being made for the sabbath).

HOWEVER, if someone didn’t show up and told him the reason was that they were sick and tired of feeling obligated, and that they weren’t going to ever come again because they didn’t like him and didn’t believe he had any right to insist that he attend, my father probably would have thrown him out (for a while, until he came to his senses).

Am I really reading this correctly - that people think that someone who doesn’t go to Mass because they hate God is less culpable than someone who succumbs to human weakness?

That doesn’t sound like a loving father. A loving father wouldn’t say, “come, enjoy my company and my hospitality. It is open to you, every week. But woe unto you if you can’t make it. You will then be cast into the outer darkness, regardless of whether you love me or not.”

This is the error of thinking that Mass is “supper with God.”

The Mass is the Holy Sacrifice of Thanksgiving. It is our means of worship. In the first three Commandments, we are required to worship God once a week. In the New Testament, the day of worship was changed to Sundays because of Christ’s Resurrection.

Praying to God is good, but it isn’t worship. Thinking about God is also good, and so is reading about God in holy literature, particularly the Bible, but none of these things are worship.

Only the Mass is worship. Nothing else. It is for our own good that God requires us to attend Mass every Sunday - illness excusing, and obviously lack of ability to get there in one piece also excusing.

PS: I am also detecting the error of thinking that love is a feeling. No. Love is an action. It is the action of a mother who changes her baby’s diaper once every two hours whether she feels like it or not. It is the action of a man who goes to work every day of the week to support his family even when he can’t stand to face his boss or his customers one more day. We go to Mass every Sunday for the same reason that mother changes her child’s diaper over and over and over again, and for the same reason that that man goes out to work day after day after day - because it’s just what we do; that’s all.

 

[jmcrae]

I missed Sunday mass this past week as well. So much is going on in my life right now that I am in a very bad place emotionally. I struggled to shower and get dressed which I accomplished with much frustration for a number of reasons. When I was finally able to get out the door I realized that I would be late for Mass and only drove have the distance and gave up. I was so depressed ( again because of a number of things going on in my life right now and for the past two months) that I just couldn’t bear not only being late and calling attention to myself in this small community but because I just could not go through all of that “peace be with you” interaction. I just couldn’t do it.

Depression is an illness, just like having a bad cold. Please be very kind to yourself, and get well soon! Enlist the help of a medical professional if it seems to be lasting a long time, and don’t worry about Mass, until you are well enough to deal with things.

 

[HolySpirit08]

Thank you so much for your kindness and understanding, Jmcrea and Abigail. This isn’t an ongoing thing, thankfully. I am in a lot of physical pain due to arthritis and have suffered a lot of loss in the past two months and life changes and in the past two years. The constant and increasing physical pain makes everything else so difficult to tollerate especially when the same challenges happend over and over day in and day out. If I had pushed myself to go to the vigil mass on Saturday afternoon (early evening) I wouldn’t have missed the morning mass. Mornings are very, very difficult for me.

Now I’m stressing about having to go to Confession on Saturday evening in order to receive Communion. I’ll say a daily rosary and I’ll be fine I’m sure.

God bless.

 

[Abigail]

You are looking at it as if God was a machine. If you do a then b happens, so plan to do c and it will all be better.

Well, doesn’t the Church teach that if we (a) sin mortally then (b) we are cut off from the grace of God, and if we (c) repent and confess we will be forgiven?

“God does love us, but when we commit a sin and excuse ourselves by saying we were planning on going to confession later, we are saying we don’t love God as much as what we want to do.”

Well, EVERYTIME we sin we are saying we don’t love God as much as what we want to do – that’s what sin is. EVERYONE sins. While it is true that humans might not want to be friends with people who sinned against them all the time, God assures us that he will forgive us through the sacrament of reconciliation. I’m not sure your concept of presumption is correct - please provide some citations.

 

[jmcrae]

Well, doesn’t the Church teach that if we (a) sin mortally then (b) we are cut off from the grace of God, and if we (c) repent and confess we will be forgiven?

We aren’t supposed to plan this out, though. That’s where the sin of presumption comes in - where someone says to himself, “I will commit this mortal sin, and then I will go to Confession and be forgiven of my sin.”

No. We don’t get to do that. because already there is no contrition and no sorrow for the sin that you are about to commit (because if you were truly sorrowful and contrite, you would simply not commit the sin, in the first place).

If you are thinking about Confession before you are about to commit a sin, that is the time to stop yourself from committing it, and go ahead and do the right thing, instead.

Well, EVERYTIME we sin we are saying we don’t love God as much as what we want to do – that’s what sin is. EVERYONE sins. While it is true that humans might not want to be friends with people who sinned against them all the time, God assures us that he will forgive us through the sacrament of reconciliation.

When there is true sorrow and true contrition, yes. But not when the Confessional is being used as an actual part of a premeditated plan to commit sin. That’s worse than mortal sin.

I’m not sure your concept of presumption is correct - please provide some citations.

**Baltimore Catechism #3

Q. 1182. Which are the sins against hope?
A. The sins against hope are presumption and despair.

Q. 1183. What is presumption?
A. Presumption is a rash expectation of salvation without making proper use of the necessary means to obtain it.

Q. 1184. How may we be guilty of presumption?
A. We may be guilty of presumption:

1.(1) By putting off confession when in a state of mortal sin; 2.(2) By delaying the amendment of our lives and repentance for past sins; 3.(3) By being indifferent about the number of times we yield to any temptation after we have once yielded and broken our resolution to resist it; 4.(4) By thinking we can avoid sin without avoiding its near occasion; 5.(5) By relying too much on ourselves and neglecting to follow the advice of our confessor in regard to the sins we confess.**

Given the above, and given this:

**Q. 773. Is a person who is determined to avoid the sin, but who is unwilling to give up its near occasion when it is possible to do so, rightly disposed for confession?
A. A person who is determined to avoid the sin, but who is unwilling to give up its near occasion when it is possible to do so, is not rightly disposed for confession, and he will not be absolved if he makes known to the priest the true state of his conscience.
**

• do you believe that it is possible for someone who is thinking of going to Confession while not even being determined to avoid the sin itself (since in the above example, the person was at least resolved to avoid the sin itself) to expect to be absolved of the sin?

 

[Abigail]

OK. My head is in a serious twist here.

As Catholics, we know that we all sin. There is no way we can make it through life without sin. We also know that when we sin we have to go to confession – that if we don’t go to confession we cut ourselves off from God.

It seems like what you’re saying is that on those unavoidable occasions when we sin, we must completely forget about confession…that if we think about going to confession after we have sinned that we have added another sin…

Mary didn’t WANT to sin…she wanted to go to Mass. She wanted to overcome her temptation, but couldn’t. Acknowledging her failure, her first thought was to avail herself of God’s grace through confession. Do I understand you correctly that this makes her MORE culpable, rather than less?

 

[hamburglar]

OK. My head is in a serious twist here.

As Catholics, we know that we all sin. There is no way we can make it through life without sin. We also know that when we sin we have to go to confession – that if we don’t go to confession we cut ourselves off from God.

It seems like what you’re saying is that on those unavoidable occasions when we sin, we must completely forget about confession…that if we think about going to confession after we have sinned that we have added another sin…

Mary didn’t WANT to sin…she wanted to go to Mass. She wanted to overcome her temptation, but couldn’t. Acknowledging her failure, her first thought was to avail herself of God’s grace through confession. Do I understand you correctly that this makes her MORE culpable, rather than less?

If Mary thinks “I probably shouldn’t sin, but I will do it this one time because I can just go to Confession” then the additional sin of presumption is committed. If Mary sins and then has contrition and plans to go to Confession, then only the one sin is committed and she to be applauded for having contrition and the desire to bring herself back to communion with God.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

SpiritofTruth - I don’t understand your last post.

If I believed I were justified for missing Mass, died, and was asked the reason, I would give the reason. If I was wrong I would humbly beg forgiveness. In my example, I would say I had not gone to Mass because of the heat. Are you suggesting that I wished to be separated from God because of that decision, or that God would send me to Hell because of it?

HolySpirit08 - I understand what you are saying completely. Intellectually, we know that the Mass is the source and summit of our faith, and a great gift. However, it is sometimes not easy for us to see or experience that. The way many Masses are conducted now (a lot of interaction between parishioners, an emphasis on joyfulness, uplifting songs) can be very hard on people who are suffering emotionally and who feel alienated. And, yes, I know it’s not all about “feelings.” There are those who will claim we “shouldn’t” find Mass to be a trial or an unpleasant experience, but the fact is that some do. It is a very virtuous thing for them to overcome the temptation to avoid Mass…I am not so sure it is a MORTAL sin if every once in a while they fail.

Oh, it’s absolutely a trial for me due to chronic pain; I often need help standing at the right times, can’t kneel, and yet look like I should be able to.

Yet I go because I know it’s an obligation. I wish I felt physically as good as some of you, so I could approach Mass from a different perspective. Much of the time the happy stuff passes me by.

 

[Sheeniac]

Oh, it’s absolutely a trial for me due to chronic pain; I often need help standing at the right times, can’t kneel, and yet look like I should be able to.

Yet I go because I know it’s an obligation. I wish I felt physically as good as some of you, so I could approach Mass from a different perspective. Much of the time the happy stuff passes me by.

I wonder if your priest knew of your condition of chronic pain, if he wouldn’t excuse you from Mass. This is not to say you would never go, but on really bad days you could miss it without sin.

As far as the happy stuff, if you drop by the Trad Catholic forum, or the Liturgy & Sacraments forum, many people experience a grinding woe during Mass. So you’re not alone in suffering, albeit of a different kind.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

I wonder if your priest knew of your condition of chronic pain, if he wouldn’t excuse you from Mass. This is not to say you would never go, but on really bad days you could miss it without sin.

As far as the happy stuff, if you drop by the Trad Catholic forum, or the Liturgy & Sacraments forum, many people experience a grinding woe during Mass. So you’re not alone in suffering, albeit of a different kind.

I think I’ve skipped Mass a total of four times since BEFORE swimming the Tiber. Once I was traveling back home (my BIL was gravely ill and we were visiting him in another state) and a couple of times I was sick and contagious. I did go to Confession regarding these and the priest not only gave me absolution but assured me if you’re too sick to go out it’s not a sin to skip Mass. Other priests on EWTN have confirmed this. But I still WANT to go as much as possible.

Thank God for the Vigil Mass—usually I’m better later on in the day.

 

[Abigail]

Hamburgler,

jmcrae quotes the Baltimore Catechism re: presumption. I don’t see how Mary is guilty of presumption based on this exerpt.

"Q. 1184. How may we be guilty of presumption?
A. We may be guilty of presumption:

(1) By putting off confession when in a state of mortal sin;

Mary didn’t put off confession

(2) By delaying the amendment of our lives and repentance for past sins;

She repented of her sin even before she committed it. There’s no indication she intended to give in to this weakness intentionally in the future.

(3) By being indifferent about the number of times we yield to any temptation after we have once yielded and broken our resolution to resist it;

This wasn’t a regular thing with Mary - in fact it was a very irregular thing, and she was almost always able to overcome her temptation to skip Mass.

(4) By thinking we can avoid sin without avoiding its near occasion;

This doesn’t seem to apply, unless wanting to stay in a warm bed is a near occasion of sin, and if it is I don’t see how any of us can avoid it

(5) By relying too much on ourselves and neglecting to follow the advice of our confessor in regard to the sins we confess.

This wouldn’t seem to apply in Mary’s case – this isn’t a situation where she is ignoring her priests recommendations on how to overcome this sin. She rarely gives in to the temptation to skip mass.

 

[Becks]

It’s not for me to decide whether Mary sinned. I can’t know what’s in her heart and, therefore, what her level of culpability is. I can only know my own. If I had done what Mary did, I would’ve committed a mortal sin and I would go to confession for it.

I realize fully that I just avoided your hypothetical - and typically I hate it when people avoid hypotheticals - but I did so for a good reason. You say that all this is too hard and there’s no way to really know, but I disagree. When I am talking about myself - and not a fictional Mary - I know what is in my heart. I know why I ended up not going to Mass and whether my reasons were real or just rationalizations I was using to try to make myself feel better.

 

[jmcrae]

This wouldn’t seem to apply in Mary’s case – this isn’t a situation where she is ignoring her priests recommendations on how to overcome this sin. She rarely gives in to the temptation to skip mass.

What seems to be going on in this case is that Mary is saying to herself, “It’s okay if I miss Mass, because I can just go to Confession next Saturday before attending next Sunday’s Mass.”

To me, this attitude seems to be even worse than the attitude of “Well, I don’t want to miss Mass because that would be a sin, but I really want to sleep in another ten minutes instead of getting my shower and being ready to go in plenty of time to get there.” This is the “sin of presumption” in the definition where the person doesn’t avoid the near occasion of sin (ie: doesn’t make the effort to ensure that she’s ready to go to Mass at the appointed time) - instead, we see Mary deliberately sleeping in and deliberately missing Mass while thinking, “It’s okay - I can just go to Confession.”

If the first one is “bad” where the person isn’t intending to miss Mass, but accidentally misses Mass because of not being ready - this one is defined as “presumption” in the Baltimore Catechism - then what can we call the second one? Because, clearly, the second one is worse, is it not?

 

[holy_moly]

Mary loves God, prays daily, obeys the Church, and has been going to Mass regularly for 50 years. She has studied the catechism and believes she has an informed conscience. She lives in a rural area, and the closest parish is over 30 minutes away. It is a struggle for her to go because the Mass is early, and she dislikes the music, but she tries to do it with a good will.

Sunday morning, Mary is tired and irritable, but not “sick” enough that she wouldn’t go to work. She just can’t face the early rising, the long drive on bad roads, and the chaotic atmosphere at the Church. She loves God, and doesn’t intend to stop going to Mass. She just needs a day off, and doesn’t have the mental strength to make the necessary sacrifice. She decides to skip Mass, and to confess before receiving Holy Communion.

Has Mary sinned mortally? She knew she was obligated to go to Mass, she could have gone, and decided not to go. That seems to fit the formula of grave matter + sufficient knowledge and reflection + full consent of the will.
Is succumbing to human weakness the equivalent of intentionally rejecting God, or does the desire not to sin (although overcome by weakness) vitiate full consent?
Does her decision completely cut her off from God and his grace?

Has Mary sinned venially? What if Mary concluded, based on what she had studied, that her sin was venial because she wasn’t refusing to go to Mass because she was defying Church authority or because she didn’t want to worship God. She continues to go to Mass and receive Holy Communion for the rest of her life.
Does Mary’s belief that her sin is venial make it so?
If not, is her continued practice of the faith void of all grace?

Or, has Mary not sinned at all? What if Mary considered the above and couldn’t come to a conclusion? She just wasn’t sure whether skipping Mass under the circumstances is a mortal or venial sin, or a sin at all. Perhaps she was so tired she really was “sick.” Maybe driving while “tired” is something she shouldn’t do. It was early in the morning when she was trying to make her decision, and she wasn’t completely awake. She thought she might be making excuses for herself, but her priest had told her, “Mary, you tend to be scrupulous. If you aren’t sure something is a mortal in, it isn’t.” She isn’t sure.

There’s something disturbing to me about having to go through these mental gymnastics to answer a basic question, and coming up with answers that range from serious mortal sin to no sin at all. PLEASE help me get a better understanding of the underlying principles here. If sin is not determined by intent, it would be possible to sin by mistake, which I understand is not possible. But if the only element is intent, how can there be sin in the objective sense?

PLEASE provide citations in support of your arguments.

Thanks in advance.

Speaking from experience, I vote mortal as evidenced by the knowledge that she neede to receive absolution before receiving the Blessed Sacrement…

Shalom,

Jim

 

[Holly3278]

It’s a mortal sin to miss Sunday Mass unless one has a grave reason to do so.

 

[slyboots]

All I know is that tomorrow I will be at mass. I missed last week truly not realizing that it was a mortal sin.
But that brings up a question. Since I did not realize it was a mortal sin, does it make it not a mortal sin previously? I know now so to miss because of no reasons would be a mortal sin.

 

[Abigail]

Thanks for all the replies.

I would like to focus this in a little, as it seems we have gotten off the track a bit.

The question I am exploring is: Is giving in to an unwelcome temptation the same as knowingly and intentionally disobeying God?

Is refusing to worship God because you hate God and refuse to obey His Church the same as wanting to go to Mass but just being too tired?

Obviously, I believe there is a difference between these two things. I believe intention DOES matter. I believe someone who hates and rejects God is in a more precarious position than someone who is trying to do the right thing but occasionally fails.

To me, that is the difference between mortal and venial sin. One cuts the person off from God because they themselves choose to distance themselves from God. The other weakens the relationship, but does not destroy it, because the person continues to love God and want to please Him.

 

[holy_moly]

OK. My head is in a serious twist here.

As Catholics, we know that we all sin. There is no way we can make it through life without sin. We also know that when we sin we have to go to confession – that if we don’t go to confession we cut ourselves off from God.

It seems like what you’re saying is that on those unavoidable occasions when we sin, we must completely forget about confession…that if we think about going to confession after we have sinned that we have added another sin…

Mary didn’t WANT to sin…she wanted to go to Mass. She wanted to overcome her temptation, but couldn’t. Acknowledging her failure, her first thought was to avail herself of God’s grace through confession. Do I understand you correctly that this makes her MORE culpable, rather than less?

Abigail, are you ‘Mary?’

 

[LilyM]

Thanks for all the replies.

I would like to focus this in a little, as it seems we have gotten off the track a bit.

The question I am exploring is: Is giving in to an unwelcome temptation the same as knowingly and intentionally disobeying God?

Is refusing to worship God because you hate God and refuse to obey His Church the same as wanting to go to Mass but just being too tired?

Obviously, I believe there is a difference between these two things. I believe intention DOES matter. I believe someone who hates and rejects God is in a more precarious position than someone who is trying to do the right thing but occasionally fails.

To me, that is the difference between mortal and venial sin. One cuts the person off from God because they themselves choose to distance themselves from God. The other weakens the relationship, but does not destroy it, because the person continues to love God and want to please Him.

Someone who fails to obey God by going to Mass DOES quite genuinely hate and reject Him!! They DO choose to distance themselves from God in that serious way that destroys the relationship.

To fail to go to Mass when one is capable of going, is a complete failure in obedience to God - namely a total failure in obedience to the third of His ten commandments - which is serious. God Himself indicated (and Jesus reemphasised to the rich young man) that these ten were very important, so major failure to obey any of them is necessarily a grave offence. And that’s what failure to go to Mass when one is capable constitutes.

Didn’t Jesus say ‘if you love me you will keep my commands’? How then can you say that someone who fails spectacularly to keep one of the biggest of His commands - the Ten - when they are well able to keep it - truly loves Him? And how can someone who shows such spectacular failure in their love for Him NOT be in grave or mortal sin?

 

[Abigail]

holy moly wrote “Abigail, are you Mary?”

Not this week!