Mormon Questions

[RebeccaJ]

Thank you, everyone.

Now, my follow up question is really simple. It was first posed by another poster on another thread, but her name escapes me at the moment.

Was Heavenly Father committing incest when He had sex with Mary in order to father Jesus?

I concede that Mary had biological parents on earth, but Heavenly Father produced her “intelligence” in heaven, so…

Primary lesson - given to young children:

Show picture 1-1,

https://media.ldscdn.org/images/media-library/gospel-art/old-testament/earth-321127-gallery.jpg

The World. Explain that before we were born on earth we lived in heaven with Heavenly Father. We were spirits there. A spirit is what is inside of us that makes us alive. When we were spirits, we didn’t have flesh and bones like our bodies have now, but we looked the same.

Explain that Heavenly Father is the father of our spirits, and we are his spirit children. We don’t remember living with Heavenly Father before we came to earth, but we know we are his spirit children because we read it in the scriptures.

Show the Bible and read Psalm 82:6, explaining that the most High means Heavenly Father. Emphasize that every person on the earth is a child of Heavenly Father.

…goes on to explain that the children will grow up to be gods one day…

We can be like Heavenly Father

•What is a baby dog called?
•What will that puppy grow up to be?
•What is a baby chicken called?
•What will that chick grow up to be?
Explain that just as animals grow up to be like their parents, we will grow up to be like our parents. Heavenly Father is the father of our spirits, so we can grow to be like him. Heavenly Father is loving, good, and kind, and he wants to help us. When we are loving, good, and kind, we are being like Heavenly Father. Explain that we should try to become more like Heavenly Father every day.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Wow, Rebecca.

What document or book is that taken from?

 

[RebeccaJ]

Wow, Rebecca.

What document or book is that taken from?

Primary One, Lesson 1

It is a lesson manual for teaching three year olds.

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

Are mormons embarressed about the idea of the Heavenly mother? I questioned them as to it and they seemed to have been ignorant or just didn’t want to talk about it.

 

[gazelam]

Are mormons embarressed about the idea of the Heavenly mother? I questioned them as to it and they seemed to have been ignorant or just didn’t want to talk about it.

Pretty much all we know is the existence of Heavenly Mother. Any discussion above and beyond that is speculation.

There is an LDS Hymn titled “O My Father” which is sung from time to time. It includes this snippet about Heavenly Mother…

*In the heav’ns are parents single?
No, the thought makes reason stare;
Truth is reason—truth eternal
Tells me I’ve a mother there.

When I leave this frail existence—
When I lay this mortal by,
Father, mother, may I meet you
In your royal court on high?*

I hope this helps.

 

[debbie_h]

This is also why LDS family services provides adoption services. To get babies from non-LDS parents into as many LDS families as they can. The belief being that this was the plan God had for the child and adoptive parents all along, based on what the unborn spirit of the baby agreed to in a pre-existence.

All kinds of bizarre going on in Mormon thought regarding children and who is the better parent. Like this:

“When a man and woman conceive a child outside of marriage, every effort should be made to encourage them to marry. When the probability of a successful marriage is unlikely due to age or other circumstances, the unmarried parents should be counseled to work with LDS Family Services to place the child for adoption, providing an opportunity for the baby to be sealed to temple-worthy parents. Adoption is an unselfish, loving decision that blesses both the birth parents and the child in this life and in eternity.”

Yep. That’s very much the attitude of these people. A couple years back, there was a real possibility that I may have taken on & adopted my nieces. My parents kept ignoring my offer to take the kids (even though I am married with children, stable job… Etc…) & kept saying to my younger sibling to go to the church family services. Yep! They pretty much said to my face that even though I am very reliable & have no financial issues, I am not good enough to adopt my nieces because I would raise them catholic.

 

[debbie_h]

Are mormons embarressed about the idea of the Heavenly mother? I questioned them as to it and they seemed to have been ignorant or just didn’t want to talk about it.

I wouldn’t say they are embarrassed about her, rather they are taught that she is too sacred to be talked about so God has revealed very little about her.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Yep. That’s very much the attitude of these people. A couple years back, there was a real possibility that I may have taken on & adopted my nieces. My parents kept ignoring my offer to take the kids (even though I am married with children, stable job… Etc…) & kept saying to my younger sibling to go to the church family services. Yep! They pretty much said to my face that even though I am very reliable & have no financial issues, I am not good enough to adopt my nieces because I would raise them catholic.

Sad!

 

[Starrsmother]

All I can say is WOW! And protestants think Catholics believe weird things! WOW!

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Are all of the humans on earth - past, present and future - the children of God the Father and His celestial wife or wives? (Obviously, we all have human parents on a physical level.) If so, please explain (beyond “we are all children of God,” if possible).
Are the spirits of all these people the result of some procreative activity on the part of God the Father and his celestial spouse(s)? If so, please explain.
Were (or are) the spirits of all these people waiting in heaven for a physical body to animate here on earth? If so, do Mormons today have large families in order to accommodate the Father’s need for “bodies” here on earth? (I don’t mean that disrespectfully - just not sure how else to say it.)
Thank you for your responses.

According to Mormon doctrine, we are all the “spirit children” of “Elohim.” And yes, the
Mormon God does have wiVeS, as it is the only way to become a god in celestial glory.

As for HOW, I am not too sure, but if we look at the life Joseph Smith and other
Mormon leaders, we can determine that the act of creating spirit children is “not
that different” from making children on Earth…(giggity).HOWEVER, there is a doctrine suggesting that nothing is created from nothing, that ALL is eternal, and
that even our spirits are made from “spirit matter” or “intelligences” that are by nature (says LDS) eternal.
And Yes, everyone is “waiting in yonder Heavens” for a physical body, which is
why “The Fall” is counted by Mormons to be the “Greatest Blessing Given unto
Man”, for God told Adam and Eve to multiply, even though they didn’t know how
(according to Mormons), and not to eat of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good &
Evil, therefore Adam and Eve had to break one of the commandments, to eat of
the tree to gain knowledge to procreate to fulfill God’s plan.

 

[TexanKnight]

Randy Carson;11214199:

Was Heavenly Father committing incest when He had sex with Mary in order to father Jesus?
QUOTE]

Wow!! What a question!! :bigyikes:The LDS belief of a virgin birth would preclude any such behavior.

whenever I read your posts, it is clear that you either do not know your doctrine or you are trying to mislead people

one or the other…

I hope it is just you are clueless

 

[debbie_h]

Primary lesson - given to young children:

…goes on to explain that the children will grow up to be gods one day…

Oh wow, I remember being taught that & also reading it in the lesson manuals!

 

[Starrsmother]

Oh wow, I remember being taught that & also reading it in the lesson manuals!

All this is really interesting information that I was totally unaware of. It does make you understand where Mitt Romney was coming from a little better though, huh?

 

[SteveVH]

whenever I read your posts, it is clear that you either do not know your doctrine or you are trying to mislead people

one or the other…

I hope it is just you are clueless

It is also important to note that the Post was not from Randy Carson, but rather Gazelam.

Was Heavenly Father committing incest when He had sex with Mary in order to father Jesus?
QUOTE]

Wow!! What a question!! The LDS belief of a virgin birth would preclude any such behavior.

Your quote citations got mixed up somehow. As far as your comments applying to gazelam, you are spot on.

 

[TheIrishman]

I’ve got a question.

If we know what we have to do in order to enter the Celestial Kingdom, WHY (and i emphasize why to make my point) are we obeying the laws of man before God.

Take for example, plural marriage. It has been taught and is a doctrine that plural marriage is a deciding factor in reaching the Celestial Kingdom. And yet, many LDS members shy away from it or try to explain it as something that was once believed but not anymore? As if God made a mistake or something. They’ll answer and say" but we believe in being good citizens and upholding the law". Obeying the law of the land clearly isn’t going to get you into the Celestial Kingdom. Following God’s law will. So it just tickles me sideways when I read and study doctrines that aren’t being practiced that are crucial to salvation! Why does the church put mans laws over Gods?

Also, when an LDS member tries to explain a doctrine to you that the rest of Christianity doesn’t understand, do you find yourself still being confused by the end of the discussion? That’s because there is no cut and dry explanations and if there are, they are regarded as “someones thoughts”. Tickles me sideways!

I apologize for my rant.

 

[Starrsmother]

I’ve got a question.

If we know what we have to do in order to enter the Celestial Kingdom, WHY (and i emphasize why to make my point) are we obeying the laws of man before God.

Take for example, plural marriage. It has been taught and is a doctrine that plural marriage is a deciding factor in reaching the Celestial Kingdom. And yet, many LDS members shy away from it or try to explain it as something that was once believed but not anymore? As if God made a mistake or something. They’ll answer and say" but we believe in being good citizens and upholding the law". Obeying the law of the land clearly isn’t going to get you into the Celestial Kingdom. Following God’s law will. So it just tickles me sideways when I read and study doctrines that aren’t being practiced that are crucial to salvation! Why does the church put mans laws over Gods?

Also, when an LDS member tries to explain a doctrine to you that the rest of Christianity doesn’t understand, do you find yourself still being confused by the end of the discussion? That’s because there is no cut and dry explanations and if there are, they are regarded as “someones thoughts”. Tickles me sideways!

I apologize for my rant.

I’m probably older than you, but I decided long ago never to argue politics with family or religion with Mormons, JW’s or Adventists. The former is because it ends up with a family member angry at you, the latter because it’s a form of what I call “mental masturbation” and in BOTH cases I end up with heartburn! LOL!

 

[gazelam]

I’ve got a question.

If we know what we have to do in order to enter the Celestial Kingdom, WHY (and i emphasize why to make my point) are we obeying the laws of man before God.

Take for example, plural marriage. It has been taught and is a doctrine that plural marriage is a deciding factor in reaching the Celestial Kingdom. And yet, many LDS members shy away from it or try to explain it as something that was once believed but not anymore? As if God made a mistake or something. They’ll answer and say" but we believe in being good citizens and upholding the law". Obeying the law of the land clearly isn’t going to get you into the Celestial Kingdom. Following God’s law will. So it just tickles me sideways when I read and study doctrines that aren’t being practiced that are crucial to salvation! Why does the church put mans laws over Gods?

Also, when an LDS member tries to explain a doctrine to you that the rest of Christianity doesn’t understand, do you find yourself still being confused by the end of the discussion? That’s because there is no cut and dry explanations and if there are, they are regarded as “someones thoughts”. Tickles me sideways!

I apologize for my rant.

For one, I believe you’re confusing reaching the Celestial kingdom with Exaltation.

*D&C 131:1-3

1 In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees;

2 And in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage];

3 And if he does not, he cannot obtain it*

From an LDS perspective, exaltation would consist of reaching the highest of the three heavens/degrees with in the celestial glory. The lower celestial glories can be reached without marriage.

In LDS theology plural marriage is the divine exception and not the divine norm.

From the Book of Mormon Jacob 2:24-30 (verse 30 states the exception)

*24 Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.

25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a righteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.

26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.*

Plural marriage was practiced for a temporary period ending around 1890. Plural marriage in and of itself is not required for exaltation. If the Lord sees fit to command the practice temporarily and a follower refuses to comply he’d be in jeopardy of his exaltation just like he would be for any other commandment he’d refuse to obey. In general, LDS would agree that God’s laws trump man’s laws.

I hope this helps.

 

[SteveVH]

In general, LDS would agree that God’s laws trump man’s laws.

Looking at LDS history, this statement seems 180 degrees in the other direction. It seems that man’s laws trump God’s laws in the areas of polygamy and racial issues. Only after pressure from the government and society in general did the LDS claim another revelation which contradicted the one before.

 

[debbie_h]

All this is really interesting information that I was totally unaware of. It does make you understand where Mitt Romney was coming from a little better though, huh?

Well, I’m from Australia & I barely know anything about that Mitt Romney since I didn’t pay very much attention to the media coverage of the US elections we received here, however though, my parents as would any practicing Mormon were very much interested about it lol.

 

[TexanKnight]

Looking at LDS history, this statement seems 180 degrees in the other direction. It seems that man’s laws trump God’s laws in the areas of polygamy and racial issues. Only after pressure from the government and society in general did the LDS claim another revelation which contradicted the one before.

the lds “god” always bows to pressure. Look at polygamy, blacks holding the priesthood, beliefs on the nature of their god, etc.