Moving Out of State--Major Marital Struggle

[StGerardMajella]

Are you sure? Not only work, it would also require my wife to go back to work while I go to school. And food stamps. We’ve done that before, I’d just prefer to avoid going there again.

Plenty of men change career direction without ever having to return to college or go on food stamps. What you need is a good headhunter and some sound career counseling. Many fathers can work a 40-50 hour week at a local business, be home every night, and have their weekends free. Nothing prevents you from doing the same except your own ingenuity and willpower.

At this level of my career, my current job would allow me to have more free time at home than any other job that I know of (other than being an entrepreneur)…as long as I don’t spend all that time traveling to and from work. Is that a negative to my family’s well-being?

You’re an absentee father by choice. And I quote: “In a typical month, I will be home 8-11 days, and completely gone, out of town, for the remainder.” Is it really any wonder as to why your wife would be depressed?

Being an absentee husband and father is not only irresponsible, but it will have long-term repercussions on your marriage and your children.

And I’m supposed to start completely over (which will be an immense financial and time challenge for our young family) because she doesn’t want to move to any one of 7 cities in the US?

It’s a marriage, not a dictatorship. Given your absenteeism as a husband and a father, I can understand why your wife would have a natural reluctance to make a challenging relocation. Your best course of action is to find suitable employment closer to home.

Once I go through all the education and training to find a new job that has me working “normal” hours and stresses me out, will she be happy then?

Again, you don’t need more education and training. You need a good headhunter and a savvy job counselor or career coach. The skills you currently utilize in your career can transfer to other occupations and endeavors.

As far as “job stress”, there are plenty of free resources available to help you to learn more effective coping mechanisms. These are skills that can be learned.

Your wife will be happy when you are home every night, and when you are no longer an absentee father and husband.

Given the current situation, how would I know the answer to that question before it was too late and I’ve already given up everything WE as a FAMILY have been working toward all these years?

You need to make mature, responsible decisions for your family. You are an adult now, and no longer single. The path you are on right now is no longer sustainable. It will end in divorce, and your children will have significant problems as they grow older.

Notice that this poster is in a minority. I think most of the posters on here are sympathetic to the fact that you’re trying to do the best you can for your family, and would not encourage you to chuck up your career to start all over again.

Straight talk is needed. Sometimes the truth hurts. He can thank me ten years from now when my advice saved his marriage.

 

[Xantippe]

Depressed mothers are really bad for children.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2724169/

I’ll pull out a few snips of that:

“Intrusive mothers display a hostile affect, and disrupt the infant’s activity. The infants experience anger, turn away from the mother to limit her intrusiveness and internalize an angry and protective style of coping. Withdrawn mothers are disengaged, unresponsive, affectively flat and do little to support the infant’s activity. The infants are unable to cope or self-regulate this negative state, and **develop passivity, withdrawal and self-regulatory behaviours (eg, looking away or sucking on thumb) **(11,12).”

“In a study by Murray (13), cognitive performance regarding the independent existence of objects was worse for infants of 61 postnatally depressed mothers than the infants of 42 nondepressed mothers, even after adjustment for contextual adversity.”

" It has been documented that an infant’s own negative affect interferes with learning and the ability to process information (17)."

“Depressed mothers generally show less attentiveness and responsiveness to their children’s needs. They are also poor models for negative mood regulation and problem solving.”

With toddlers and preschoolers, “They [children of depressed mothers] were also more likely to respond negatively to friendly approaches, more likely to engage in low-level physical play and less likely to engage in individual creative play than control children (21).”

“Studies on large samples all agree on the negative impact of maternal postpartum depression on a child’s cognitive development. Early experience with insensitive maternal interactions (as in maternal postpartum depression) appears to be predictive of poorer cognitive functioning (22). Boys may be more sensitive than girls to the effects of the mother’s illness.”

On the bright side, a non-depressed father can help. “However, in their study of three- to six-month-old infants, Hossain et al (49) showed that infants of depressed mothers interacted better with their nondepressed fathers who could ‘buffer’ the effects of the mother’s depression on infant interaction behaviour.”

“It has been shown that depresssed mothers make more negative appraisals of their child’s behaviours, feel less confident in their parental efficacy and use maladaptive parenting techniques more often (27,51,52).”

There’s a lot of technical language in that, but basically, depressed mothers are less sensitive and responsive to their children and less effective in dealing with them in ways that can be permanently damaging.

I wouldn’t necessarily drop that information on your wife right now (she may not be able to deal with it), but I think you should have it.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Plenty of men change career direction without ever having to return to college or go on food stamps. What you need is a good headhunter and some sound career counseling. Many fathers can work a 40-50 hour week at a local business, be home every night, and have their weekends free. Nothing prevents you from doing the same except your own ingenuity and willpower.

You’re an absentee father by choice. And I quote: “In a typical month, I will be home 8-11 days, and completely gone, out of town, for the remainder.” Is it really any wonder as to why your wife would be depressed?

Being an absentee husband and father is not only irresponsible, but it will have long-term repercussions on your marriage and your children.

It’s a marriage, not a dictatorship. Given your absenteeism as a husband and a father, I can understand why your wife would have a natural reluctance to make a challenging relocation. Your best course of action is to find suitable employment closer to home.

Again, you don’t need more education and training. You need a good headhunter and a savvy job counselor or career coach. The skills you currently utilize in your career can transfer to other occupations and endeavors.

As far as “job stress”, there are plenty of free resources available to help you to learn more effective coping mechanisms. These are skills that can be learned.

Your wife will be happy when you are home every night, and when you are no longer an absentee father and husband.

You need to make mature, responsible decisions for your family. You are an adult now, and no longer single. The path you are on right now is no longer sustainable. It will end in divorce, and your children will have significant problems as they grow older.

Straight talk is needed. Sometimes the truth hurts. He can thank me ten years from now when my advice saved his marriage.

This is almost word for word what I think.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

We have been in counseling for a few months now and haven’t made progress.

Her doctor diagnosed her with depression of some form and prescribed anti-depressants recently. I don’t know if she is taking them.

Thank you for your prayers.

This is concerning. Your qualifier of “of some form” and not even knowing if she is on medication shows a huge lack of communication.

Stop.

Completely stop your ego driven will. And focus on your wife who is depressed. Close to family and familiar surroundings is probably best for her, but she needs a husband who is there, in sickness. Understanding the problem, helping in the treatment and not being dismissive of her diagnosis like this post comes accross.
This is serious. Very serious.

If you can find a way that your highly specialized job in the travel industry will allow you to be a good husband and father great. But if not it’s the job that sacrifices not the family.

No “dream job” is worth what you are describing. I’d rather be a pizza delivery man and come home to snuggles and kisses than a Elvis impersonator on a cruise ship ( my dream travel job) and come home to an ailing family and marriage.

 

[Aggie414]

I’ve read through the entire thread, and I wanted to post some of my observations.

First, it seems like the OP’s wife agreed with his career choice and made the appropriate sacrifices to allow him to reach this level of success within that career. These choices were not made in a vacuum (at least from what I can glean from OP’s posts). The OP’s wife needs to focus on the fact that her husband and children are her core family and the children need time with their father more than they need occasional time with extended family.

I once knew a couple with three children (this was about 20 years ago). He worked for an international airline – not a pilot – and was given a fantastic opportunity to live in the UK for three years. The wife refused to go because – and I quote – she didn’t want to leave her mommy and daddy. So he passed up on a huge career opportunity because she couldn’t or wouldn’t leave her parents and cleave to her husband. Please note that they had unlimited air travel because of his work for an airline. I lost track of the couple, but it makes me wonder how that makes the husband feel to know that his wife’s parents and their wishes were so much more important than his.

I do recognize the probability of a medical issue with depression that needs to be addressed and that might “solve” a lot of the issues. But to just tell the OP to find another job – especially at this time with the economy the way it is – is foolish. Then he’ll be blasted for not being able to adequately support his family.

 

[Xantippe]

I’ve read through the entire thread, and I wanted to post some of my observations.

First, it seems like the OP’s wife agreed with his career choice and made the appropriate sacrifices to allow him to reach this level of success within that career. These choices were not made in a vacuum (at least from what I can glean from OP’s posts). The OP’s wife needs to focus on the fact that her husband and children are her core family and the children need time with their father more than they need occasional time with extended family.

I once knew a couple with three children (this was about 20 years ago). He worked for an international airline – not a pilot – and was given a fantastic opportunity to live in the UK for three years. The wife refused to go because – and I quote – she didn’t want to leave her mommy and daddy. So he passed up on a huge career opportunity because she couldn’t or wouldn’t leave her parents and cleave to her husband. Please note that they had unlimited air travel because of his work for an airline. I lost track of the couple, but it makes me wonder how that makes the husband feel to know that his wife’s parents and their wishes were so much more important than his.

I do recognize the probability of a medical issue with depression that needs to be addressed and that might “solve” a lot of the issues. But to just tell the OP to find another job – especially at this time with the economy the way it is – is foolish. Then he’ll be blasted for not being able to adequately support his family.

So, how does he go about persuading her to do the thing she doesn’t want to do?

She’s not here. It doesn’t matter what she should or shouldn’t do if we aren’t talking to her.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I’ve read through the entire thread, and I wanted to post some of my observations.

First, it seems like the OP’s wife agreed with his career choice and made the appropriate sacrifices to allow him to reach this level of success within that career. These choices were not made in a vacuum (at least from what I can glean from OP’s posts). The OP’s wife needs to focus on the fact that her husband and children are her core family and the children need time with their father more than they need occasional time with extended family.

I once knew a couple with three children (this was about 20 years ago). He worked for an international airline – not a pilot – and was given a fantastic opportunity to live in the UK for three years. The wife refused to go because – and I quote – she didn’t want to leave her mommy and daddy. So he passed up on a huge career opportunity because she couldn’t or wouldn’t leave her parents and cleave to her husband. Please note that they had unlimited air travel because of his work for an airline. I lost track of the couple, but it makes me wonder how that makes the husband feel to know that his wife’s parents and their wishes were so much more important than his.

I do recognize the probability of a medical issue with depression that needs to be addressed and that might “solve” a lot of the issues. But to just tell the OP to find another job – especially at this time with the economy the way it is – is foolish. Then he’ll be blasted for not being able to adequately support his family.

I understand your points but " in this economy" is not an excuse. Finding a job to support your family is not an impossible task. Actually the very fact that the op has a job in the travel industry, one that lives and dies on the “economy” means things are pretty good!

The op loves his job. If he stays that is why he should stay, not because he couldn’t find another way to put ramen on the table…

But jobs love it when thier employees think it’s real hard to find another job.

We all bring our experiences to the table.

Personally I was in the place of the wife in this situation. My wife had a highly specialized well paying job that she loved. This required us to move away from our home to a horrible place called Indiana. It took two years but my wife completely switched carreers to move us back home. She sacrifices so we (the kids and I) are happy, healthy, and safe. She could have very well defined herself by her job. She was one of the leading scientists in her field. She defined herself as a wife and a mother instead. She did so out of love for us. Sacrificing her ego.

 

[AClaire11]

Is the wife not allowed to change her mind? I don’t know what the best thing to do is, but the fact that she agreed to this years and years ago doesn’t mean she has to stick by that forever. Maybe she really thought she could handle it, and now has realized she can’t. My husband was planning to be career military when we met. Would I never have been allowed to say I could no longer handle frequent moves, the stress of deployments, etc?

I think the top priority now needs to be making sure she is taking her meds and getting the help she needs. And I would also look into alternative careers, just to know your options.

 

[Aggie414]

Circumstances do change and, yes, she has the right to change her mind; but I don’t see that’s what’s happening right now. She’s refusing to discuss ANYTHING related to moving for his job. He made the statement that he’d offered up seeing some of the possible cities they might move to and she was all for it until she realized they might be potential cities to move to. She’s not even willing to give it a discussion, and that’s not right. This is a partnership – the marriage – and he has a right to have this wishes heard and honored the same as she does. By not even giving it a fair discussion, she holds all the cards, and that’s just not fair.

 

[Xantippe]

Circumstances do change and, yes, she has the right to change her mind; but I don’t see that’s what’s happening right now. She’s refusing to discuss ANYTHING related to moving for his job. He made the statement that he’d offered up seeing some of the possible cities they might move to and she was all for it until she realized they might be potential cities to move to. She’s not even willing to give it a discussion, and that’s not right. This is a partnership – the marriage – and he has a right to have this wishes heard and honored the same as she does. By not even giving it a fair discussion, she holds all the cards, and that’s just not fair.

It’s not fair–but how does the OP go about persuading her?

He can’t make her go if she isn’t willing to go.

 

[Aggie414]

It’s not fair–but how does the OP go about persuading her?

He can’t make her go if she isn’t willing to go.

I was responding to the “doesn’t she get to change her mind” posts. Basically he can’t. If she refuses to even discuss it, she holds all the cards and the decision is made. Unfortunately, that also can be very detrimental to a marriage.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

Relocation is daunting even when you are mentally healthy and its your choice. I can understand why someone in this position would be reluctant. I don’t mean this as a personal criticism but she hasn’t been able to rely on you as you are only there part of the month, it’s a huge deal for this woman to move herself away from her support network (it can take years to build up another) and rely one someone she hasn’t been able to plus it sounds like she would still be alone some of the month. It’s a hard sell.

 

[AClaire11]

Circumstances do change and, yes, she has the right to change her mind; but I don’t see that’s what’s happening right now. She’s refusing to discuss ANYTHING related to moving for his job. He made the statement that he’d offered up seeing some of the possible cities they might move to and she was all for it until she realized they might be potential cities to move to. She’s not even willing to give it a discussion, and that’s not right. This is a partnership – the marriage – and he has a right to have this wishes heard and honored the same as she does. By not even giving it a fair discussion, she holds all the cards, and that’s just not fair.

I agree. I’m just addressing those who keep howling about how she agreed to this, like she signed a contract in blood or something. Based on the side of the story we’ve been presented with, I agree that compromise needs to be reached. But I don’t think that will happen until she’s climbed out of the pit of depression.

Also, there’s a big difference between visiting Atlanta as a fun trip and visiting it knowing your husband is going to spend the majority of the time trying to sell you on moving there. I’d ease off on that until she’s in a better place mentally and progress has been made in counseling.

 

[Aggie414]

I agree. I’m just addressing those who keep howling about how she agreed to this, like she signed a contract in blood or something. Based on the side of the story we’ve been presented with, I agree that compromise needs to be reached. But I don’t think that will happen until she’s climbed out of the pit of depression.

Also, there’s a big difference between visiting Atlanta as a fun trip and visiting it knowing your husband is going to spend the majority of the time trying to sell you on moving there. I’d ease off on that until she’s in a better place mentally and progress has been made in counseling.

I can totally agree with your point!

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

The wife is functioning as a single parent much of the month. She also has depression to mount on top of everything. She probably needs comfortable surroundings and external family help just to survive. Now the op wants to plug in more which is great, but his answer is to move her away from the support system and surroundings she knows.

The wife is depressed and overwhelmed, the marriage is stressed and there is disagreement on moving. The tie should always go to the person who doesn’t want to move but this isn’t even a tie.

Op. Your wife needs you to provide her with the support and help now. That probably has to be done close to home.

The depression here is the driving factor. You lose. Stay and get her help and live.

 

[Wings]

The wife is functioning as a single parent much of the month. .

This is a major major factor driving a move. How hard is it to “dig” out of depression in this scenario? Even when it happens, at some point we’ll need to take a “leap of faith” that yes, in spite of the challenges of moving, won’t having Dad at home and involved a great deal more help avoid future depression and overwhelming stress?

On the flip side, I’m functioning as a single person most of the month. Can’t we fix each other’s problem here by being TOGETHER more?

Trying to walk the tightrope of being supportive, being quietly resigned to sleeping in the recliner 70% of the time, and leading this family to what will provide the best environment for all of us over the long haul.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

This is a major major factor driving a move. How hard is it to “dig” out of depression in this scenario? Even when it happens, at some point we’ll need to take a “leap of faith” that yes, in spite of the challenges, won’t having Dad at home and involved a great deal more help avoid future depression and overwhelming stress?

On the flip side, I’m functioning as a single person most of the month. Can’t we fix each other’s problem here by being TOGETHER more?

By all means be together. But do so in the best place for her.

It might help if we knew what your job wAs

Won’t you still be gone as in completely in s different town 1/3 of the month!?

Why is it so hard for you to see things from her perspective. Perhaps like the trip in Rome your view is not her reality. How is putting her in an uncomfortable environment and adding the stress of a move ( a cause of depression in itself) going to help.

I see you getting what you want and getting to play the role of dad more but still being quite absent and risking your marriage and family. Everything seems to be centered around your needs.

 

[Wings]

Won’t you still be gone as in completely in s different town 1/3 of the month!?
.

Yes, as a worst case scenario. Many of my colleagues that live where they work spend their entire month at home. Or home every night with over half the month off. Or they are able to bring family members with them on overnight trips to spend time together.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

See a lawyer. This still looks like the set up of every divorce cliche ever told.

You’ve offered to look multiple cities, but she will only settle for the one a few hours from extended family. A specialist with a job that supports the home can’t just switch career and keep everything afloat. That just isn’t reasonable. A SAHP can move much more easily than a working person in a specific field can just make a switch. If she’s at all in touch with reality, she knows this. Adults have to move for their/their spouse’s career. That’s life, and from the sounds of it, she went into this recognizing that.

She’s telling you in no uncertain terms that she values being within a few hours of her family over living with her husband. She’s choosing to essentially be a single mom rather than allow you to be a part of your kids lives while you support the family. She’s putting you in an impossible position - the job that takes care of your wife and kids, or being a part of your own family.

Next time you’re out of town, send her a long email explaining how hard this has been for you, outline everything you’ve done from counseling to considering multiple cities, and make it clear that you love her and want to be there for your kids every day and are willing to do whatever you can. Will it make a difference? To her, probably not. To a court when you’re being painted as an absentee, aloof father? It’s a start.

I’m not telling you to file anything, but you should start documenting, and talk to a lawyer in your state who can help you do this effectively. I hope your marriage lasts and this is never necessary. But if the worst happens, you’ll be glad you did when it comes time to talk custody.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Yes, as a worst case scenario. Many of my colleagues that live where they work spend their entire month at home. Or home every night with over half the month off. Or they are able to bring family members with them on overnight trips to spend time together.

Does your personality cause you to focus on one thing and refuse to yield. Are you accused of stubbornness when you feel it’s unjustified?