Moving to another pew when someone sits in front of us, a scandal?

[LongingSoul]

I could care less if it is seen rude by others in Mass. But is it scandalous of us to get up and move from pews just when these immodest married couple arrived?

I wouldn’t say ‘scandalous’, especially if you do it discreetly and generously ie. maybe with a smile. But don’t be one of those people who wear indignance in their demeanour and make a show of their decision so that others can see them ‘making a godly stand’. When I’ve noticed people demonstrating that, I feel my piety is more corrupted than by the presence of the immodest offenders.

 

[mommy_k]

That’s what I used to think, but since then I’ve gotten a backbone.

We can’t know why anyone moves to a different seat. The reason could be as simple as going to the restroom and finding someone else in “your” seat when you return. I used to get really bad migraines and perfumes were one of the triggers. If just before Mass started someone wearing perfume sat near me, the migraine would start up and by the end of Mass I’d be very sick. I was too shy, too worried about what people would think, to get up and move.

Lol! Thank you-this is the first time anyone called me shy…and I have been working on this.

What I meant to convey is that it is wise not to bring further attention to a situation others may notice and compound it. Being a witness to others is part of being Catholic. I would sit there and the next mass move …

For health reasons-this is different as I would move too. If another parishoner friend asks why you moved after sitting-you could speak the truth–for your health and so on. If another parishoner friend asked the op why they move after sitting ,it -would be difficult to answer truthfully without bringing negative attention to the other couple. That qualifies as scandal.

We also don’t know why they dress the way they do-they can be poor and not afford proper clothes…so I believe suffering through a mass with this distraction has more spiritual weight then moving.

 

[QuestLove]

I know that my toddler has pulled on my shirt and flashed my bra at least once during Mass. She’s lifted up my skirt once in a parking lot too, though I don’t usually wear skirts without leggings underneath. If you find that repulsive, then by all means take your fragile nerves somewhere less distracting because it ain’t gonna get any better.

She’s going to turn around and smile at you over and over again. She’ll stand on the kneeler and bounce up and down chanting “Gloria, Gloria, Gloria!” . She thinks “Let It Go” is an appropriate offertory hymn as long as you sing “Amen” at the end. She will expect you to shake her hand at the sign of peace, even though she’s had it in her mouth and it’s a tad bit moist. If you decline she will call attention to your fussiness by yelling “Hey! Peace!” and all the little old ladies will give you a look that says, “What’s the matter with you? Shake the adorable little girl’s hand!” If you leave early or have to use the facilities, she will call attention to that as well by shouting, “Bye Bye! Thank you!” And when people walk past after receiving, she will inform each person that goes by, “It is Christ!”. It will be cute at first, but after two or three verses…

Yeah, you might as well get out now while you can.

She sounds cute.
She sounds a lot like my niece.

 

[retire_early]

I like this - if these folks tend to always sit in front of you, then I would simply find another place next time rather than waiting to see if they show up and then move.

We tend to sit all over the place and my kids can be loud and distracting, although we are working on it (always, always working on it…) They do the best if we sit up close. But several times we have arrived at Mass and gone into the pew, only to have the people already present shoot us disgusted looks and move elsewhere. Now, it probably wouldn’t sting nearly so much if they didn’t make it so obvious that we were the reason they were leaving. But it can be the kind of thing that people notice and become sensitive to. I’ve gotten to the point where I realize that I am not doing anything wrong and I am trying to instruct my children on how to behave, so it bothers me less than it used to.

Not every family with children sitting in front area gets disgusted looks, only those (I imagine) that do not make a concerted effort to control their children. Please re-think how you might be better able to learn from feedback. People don’t go to church to hate one another, obviously. If you continually irritate others, please don’t try to adjust yourself to it by ignoring them. There is nothing wrong with leaving children at home who are too unruly for Mass.

 

[LongingSoul]

There is nothing wrong with leaving children at home who are too unruly for Mass.

Some Priests don’t like you to do that and I know from experience. When my 3 were little they were hard to keep still and quiet and one… the middle one… seemed to find it his mission to fight against all restraint in Mass. We made the decision to not bring them for a while and my husband would go to Saturday night mass and then I would go to our normal Sunday morning Mass.

Well father noticed and without mentioning us by name, prefaced his sermon with the need for people to bring their children to Mass as a family and for other parishioners to be understanding and rejoice in the families that came to Mass.

So that was all a bit awkward at the time but it was at least nice to have father on our side!

 

[retire_early]

Perfectly fine to move to another pew. I’m one of those who has taken to sitting up towards the front because I get distracted easily. Also, absolutely have to move for the perfume wearers or those covered with cigarette smoke; otherwise, my sinuses swell shut and asthma kicks in. People (men) used to stand in front of church back in the day and smoke before going in…some areas this was more common. Thank goodness smoking is starting to wane in popularity (heard on the radio today).

Never have heard any priest say from the altar, “turn off your TV’s, cellphones, I-pods, put away the cheerios, crackers, cookies, take the gum out of your mouths, stop whispering and chatting with each other and we’ll begin Mass”, but it might almost be necessary in this day and age of Its-All-About-Me.

 

[kozlosap]

I think that you attend mass to participate in the sacrifice of the mass, not to be so freaking scrupulous about how other parishoners are dressed. Having taught at a huge high school for 35 years, I don’t think you would last one day if you are so obsessed with how others are dressed instead of what is in their hearts. I hope that you are able to find peace and joy in going to mass instead of continual annoyance.

 

[retire_early]

Some Priests don’t like you to do that and I know from experience. When my 3 were little they were hard to keep still and quiet and one… the middle one… seemed to find it his mission to fight against all restraint in Mass. We made the decision to not bring them for a while and my husband would go to Saturday night mass and then I would go to our normal Sunday morning Mass.

Well father noticed and without mentioning us by name, prefaced his sermon with the need for people to bring their children to Mass as a family and for other parishioners to be understanding and rejoice in the families that came to Mass.

So that was all a bit awkward at the time but it was at least nice to have father on our side!

We were lucky growing up in that our parish had mass times at 7, 8, 9, 10:15, and 11:30. With eight children spread out over 20 years, we had family members coming and going to masses: some altar servers, others sleepyheads, some staying home with babies, etc., others preparing the big meals. Rare and somewhat inconvenient to have everyone attending the same Mass. We were only 1/2 mile from church, so walking / riding bikes was an often-used option. Maybe to the priest it seemed extra-holy and Norman Rockwell-ish to see everyone attend as a family, but for practicality, maybe not so much. I never heard that God gave extra points if you showed up for Mass as a team.

 

[pensmama87]

Not every family with children sitting in front area gets disgusted looks, only those (I imagine) that do not make a concerted effort to control their children. Please re-think how you might be better able to learn from feedback. People don’t go to church to hate one another, obviously. If you continually irritate others, please don’t try to adjust yourself to it by ignoring them. There is nothing wrong with leaving children at home who are too unruly for Mass.

It’s only been on a few occasions and it’s well before any shenanigans occur. I have seen the same folks do so to other families, so I know it’s not something in particular about us.

Most people are very friendly and understanding.

 

[EasterJoy]

I think that you attend mass to participate in the sacrifice of the mass, not to be so freaking scrupulous about how other parishoners are dressed. Having taught at a huge high school for 35 years, I don’t think you would last one day if you are so obsessed with how others are dressed instead of what is in their hearts. I hope that you are able to find peace and joy in going to mass instead of continual annoyance.

What is so “freaking scrupulous”–let alone a failure in participation in the Sacrifice of the Mass!–about wanting to move to one of the places in the church that is the least distracting?

Did you say you lasted *35 years *in a high school? Were you this hard on your students who told you they were sensitive to the distractions of others that you felt free to conclude they were “obsessed” if they asked if it was OK to change seats so they could pay attention better? How does a student find “peace and joy” when they have to be afraid to even ask to change seats, lest their teacher become that vehemently annoyed with a request that can be so easily accommodated?

If you do better sitting over there instead of over here, then sit over there. Don’t bully anybody, but sit wherever you think you’ll do best. It is no skin off of anyone else’s nose.

 

[victrolatim]

Many here are being very uncharitable to the original poster. While I understand the idea of being able to tune out, or tolerate some distractions, some people have a very hard time doing so. If they wish to move due to some undue disturbance from the Mass and it is not disturbing the whole church, then do it. There are also health reasons why one may need to do this (asthma, allergies, agoraphobia), so please be kind in your advice.

 

[Allegra]

What bothers me more is the noise from screaming babies and young children. We have FOUR soundproof rooms for parents to take noisy babies and children, and they don’t utilize them as they should…

Maybe you should sit in one.

 

[Allegra]

In the case of the TV, it seemed to be a twenty-ish family member who was being “required” to attend by other family members - who am I to judge? He seemed perfectly normal, but perhaps had a mental condition? I first was completely shocked, but then decided to try to let it go (thankfully, I was able to move far down the pew that time so as not to be distracted by the screen or the situation)!

As for the others, many (way too many) people seem to feel that “showing up” is their only Catholic requirement. Fr’s working on it - and there are a great many who are devout, focused, attendees, but yep, there’s much work to still be done!

I once took my daughter to the “cry room” during a Confirmation Mass and there was a family in there with a laptop, watching “Cars”. It was also at least 90 degrees in there.

 

[EasterJoy]

…What bothers me more is the noise from screaming babies and young children. We have FOUR soundproof rooms for parents to take noisy babies and children, and they don’t utilize them as they should…I can’t ignore an ear-piercing scream that occurs at the consecration…

The “cry rooms” are supposed to be there for the benefit of families that want to use them. They are not intended to be ghettos for families with young children. (*Four *soundproof rooms? That sounds more like solitary confinement, LOL.)

Keep in mind that the words of consecration used to be done too quietly to be heard. You do not have to hear them all in order to participate in the Mass. It is a good thing, but it is not strictly necessary. Maintaining a charitable attitude towards the rest of the baptized is necessary, too, after all. Tough sometimes, but none of us are easy to live with all of the time.

 

[Bonnie]

I once took my daughter to the “cry room” during a Confirmation Mass and there was a family in there with a laptop, watching “Cars”. It was also at least 90 degrees in there.

We had a similar experience once while visiting a parish. It was hot, crowded, and noisy. And that was years before laptops. I ended up out in the hall with my little one.

 

[retire_early]

It’s only been on a few occasions and it’s well before any shenanigans occur. I have seen the same folks do so to other families, so I know it’s not something in particular about us.

Most people are very friendly and understanding.

Oh, okay…thats different. Hmm.m.m.m…perhaps they need new eyeglasses? Sometimes people have a scowling look when they are trying to get their vision in focus, especially older folks, whose eye deterioration seems to increase more rapidly than younger folks.

 

[Kelfa28]

What bothers me more is the noise from screaming babies and young children. We have FOUR soundproof rooms for parents to take noisy babies and children, and they don’t utilize them as they should. I can ignore scantily dressed people at Mass by just not looking at them, but I can’t ignore an ear-piercing scream that occurs at the consecration. And that happens in the church I attend.

Not every family with children sitting in front area gets disgusted looks, only those (I imagine) that do not make a concerted effort to control their children. Please re-think how you might be better able to learn from feedback. People don’t go to church to hate one another, obviously. If you continually irritate others, please don’t try to adjust yourself to it by ignoring them. There is nothing wrong with leaving children at home who are too unruly for Mass.

Oh good! A chance to turn this into a mommy-bashing thread!

That is exactly what I need to know about what goes through the minds of fellow parishioners when I’m at Mass alone with my very young kids.

First, there is no AC in our cry room and it’s small. My girls hate going in there. Most parishioners with noisy kids avoid the cry room in favor of pacing the back of the Church.

Also, some moms aren’t given the luxury of leaving kids at home and swapping Mass times. My husband is in the military and that is all I need to say about that.

Besides…I’m not there to make a show of appearance…I’m there for the Eucharist. Plain and simple.

Just to let one know how it feels to be on the receiving end of people moving pews.

I was 9 months pregnant with a 3 and 1 year old. My husband had been on orders for the past 4 months and couldn’t help. It was 100 degrees out and I elected to go to Mass but stay in the back of the Church.
My girls were playing. Maybe a little distracting, especially if you were single and weren’t around kids often.

I saw two people sitting in front of me and they were constantly turning their heads and staring at me. Then they got up and moved pews,

I was mortified and stopped going to Mass for a couple of weeks.

It took a poster on here and a friend of mine to tell me that I should try again and ignore ignorant people because I was there for the Eucharist and I needed it.

As for the OP.

Find another spot to sit…either way in the front and bring a shawl or use a baby carrier (something you should probably take advantage of anyway for a number of reasons) for modesty while nursing or figure out where this couple frequents sitting and plan to sit at the opposite side of the Church.

Our cry room is small and has no AC.

 

[mommy_k]

I would think it’s a sin for someone to make a parent feel like they are not welcome with their children. I forget how the exact words go-but Jesus said that if anyone stands in the way of leading little ones to Him it is a sin-so this covers the people who give looks and make families feel badly about training their children to behave at mass.
Children learn by practicing—

The people turning around with a disgusted look to see who’s child is crying is more distracting then the crying part for me.

 

[jlc2k2]

Never have heard any priest say from the altar, “turn off your TV’s, cellphones, I-pods, put away the cheerios, crackers, cookies, take the gum out of your mouths, stop whispering and chatting with each other and we’ll begin Mass”, but it might almost be necessary in this day and age of Its-All-About-Me.

I find the Its-All-About-Me comment terribly ironic given that you’ve implied that others should leave their children at home to enhance your Mass experience if the children don’t live up to your behavioral expectations.

And no, I don’t think children should do whatever they want in Mass unchecked but there’s likely a middle ground that doesn’t put an asterisk after “all are welcome”.

 

[pensmama87]

I find the Its-All-About-Me comment terribly ironic given that you’ve implied that others should leave their children at home to enhance your Mass experience if the children don’t live up to your behavioral expectations.

And no, I don’t think children should do whatever they want in Mass unchecked but there’s likely a middle ground that doesn’t put an asterisk after “all are welcome”.

Exactly. I do work hard to teach my children how to behave in Mass. On the few occasions when people have made it clear that they find my family’s presence unconscionable (and thankfully those have been very, very few), I know now that it really does not have anything to do with me or my kids. At first, yes, I was desperate for a “What am I doing wrong?” But I can’t help the attitudes of a few select people. It is not my business to make them change their mind. It is my business to be there at the Mass and to teach my children to love the Lord. So that’s what I focus on.