Moving to another pew when someone sits in front of us, a scandal?

[BartholomewB]

I like to sit near the front because I’m getting a bit deaf in my old age. But I’m several inches taller than just about everyone else in the church, so it quite often happens that when I sit down, the people behind me move somewhere else. Am I scandalized, do you ask? Am I offended? Well, no, as a matter of fact, not in the least.

 

[schaeffer]

Being open to life seems like it would extend to welcoming families with kids at Mass.

To the OP. Nope, not scandalous. Do what you need to do. Does seem like the front row might be the best and easiest option.

If it’s truly an issue for it, be honest and address it as best you can at any given time. For now, sounds like the smart way is to move. Maybe in a year or two, you’ll be in a different place about it, or it might continue to be a challenge for many years to come or forever.

I would definitely have to move if people near me were messing with their phones, texting, watching videos. I can’t handle that in movies, meetings, church etc. I know some people MUST use their phone or tablet as a missal, or must be able to receive texts due to emergency, work etc. But it is a distraction to me, and if possible I move elsewhere, not because of them, but because of my own issue.

If that is very upsetting and distracting to them, then that is their issue, as moving to a different pew is not a moral issue. Can’t really call someone out on changing pews.

Another option is to come in later but still before Mass begins and choose a pew behind and next to people you feel comfortable being near to.

 

[UbiCaritas]

I find the Its-All-About-Me comment terribly ironic given that you’ve implied that others should leave their children at home to enhance your Mass experience if the children don’t live up to your behavioral expectations.

And no, I don’t think children should do whatever they want in Mass unchecked but there’s likely a middle ground that doesn’t put an asterisk after “all are welcome”.

Or, as my husband and I put it from our own experiences, there’s a difference between

a) that ghastly, weird family at the church I grew up in who didn’t believe in curbing or correcting, much less disciplining, their many children until they reached seven years old because “until then, they can’t sin and are little angels” with predictable results (think fistfights in the front pew during Mass)

and

b) the family we once sat behind at Mass while we were engaged. A fair number of kids–6-7 or so–and the youngest was an adorable little three-year-old, who was being as good as gold, sitting on the kneeler and paging silently through a kids’ religious book. After several minutes of this, and without warning, the mom snatched her up, smacked her several times, and scolded her in a whisper for being “irreverent.” Why? Apparently she wasn’t kneeling on the kneeler while other people were, even though if she had, she’d have only been able to see the back of the pew in front of her, being so small. This happened twice during that one Mass. I was furious on behalf of the poor kid then, and now that I’m a mom and appreciate rather more just how extraordinarily well-behaved that little girl was, I’d still like nothing more than to administer a smack or two to the mom. And as a side note, I’m pretty sure that particular display was rather more distracting to the people around them than a three-year-old silently looking at pictures in a children’s bible.

 

[UbiCaritas]

And on a lighter note, one of the most “I have no idea what to do in this situation” moments I ever had in Mass was related to DD and, of all things, TV.

Back when DD was a bit quieter and less mobile, we’d usually sit in the same pew as a very sweet lady who sometimes brought her baby, about DD’s age, too. The two babies would smile at each other, and each mom (and, in DD’s case, dad) would help distract both babies and keep them happy during Mass. A win-win for everyone concerned.

Then there was that one week when she didn’t have her son with her, so she smiled even more at DD. Again, no problem, as DD loved it. The problem was during the sermon, when DD began to get a tad restless. I was thinking of going to the back of the church to walk her, when this nice lady pulled out her iPhone, cued up (fortunately muted) Barney videos, and put it in front of DD.

I haven’t the least doubt she meant very well indeed, and I was seriously worried about offending her as she was clearly trying to help, but I was also not going to let DD think that church was a good place for TV-watching. Fortunately, DD cut that Gordian knot by being totally disinterested in TV (as she still is) and expressing that opinion forcefully, so I smiled apologetically, and moved to the back where I could walk her.

 

[CallMeDad]

OP,

As intently as you are watching the family in front of you, rest assured that the family behind you is watching you (unless, I guess, you’re sitting in the last pew).

We generally sit near the front, and many times I’ve run into people in the market who compliment my family or my kids. Often puzzled as I don’t recognize the person, they explain that they’ve seen us in Church and been watching us over the years. Since they’re behind me, I don’t always even recognize them. But they feel like they know my family.

With that in mind, I would be charitable in my decision as to how to react. Maybe start sitting elsewhere. But I would be hesitant to move once they’re seated because it would seem to me (and perhaps others who are watching) uncharitable and may end up reflecting badly on you in the end.

 

[CallMeDad]

I get up from the pew without thinking it twice and move somewhere else where it doesn’t distract me or hubby.

I could care less if it is seen rude by others in Mass.

OP,

Me again. In re-reading your original post, I guess you are placing any duty to act charitably below your imperative in devoting your full attention to the Mass without distraction. I am not sure I agree with that ordering of priorities, but I would (again) recommend simply finding a new permanent seat.

 

[SouthCatholic]

I know that my toddler has pulled on my shirt and flashed my bra at least once during Mass. She’s lifted up my skirt once in a parking lot too, though I don’t usually wear skirts without leggings underneath. If you find that repulsive, then by all means take your fragile nerves somewhere less distracting because it ain’t gonna get any better.

She’s going to turn around and smile at you over and over again. She’ll stand on the kneeler and bounce up and down chanting “Gloria, Gloria, Gloria!” . She thinks “Let It Go” is an appropriate offertory hymn as long as you sing “Amen” at the end. She will expect you to shake her hand at the sign of peace, even though she’s had it in her mouth and it’s a tad bit moist. If you decline she will call attention to your fussiness by yelling “Hey! Peace!” and all the little old ladies will give you a look that says, “What’s the matter with you? Shake the adorable little girl’s hand!” If you leave early or have to use the facilities, she will call attention to that as well by shouting, “Bye Bye! Thank you!” And when people walk past after receiving, she will inform each person that goes by, “It is Christ!”. It will be cute at first, but after two or three verses…

Yeah, you might as well get out now while you can.

:extrahappy: :clapping:

See… I’d have to leave before I got thrown out for busting a gut laughing!

 

[SouthCatholic]

Some Priests don’t like you to do that and I know from experience. When my 3 were little they were hard to keep still and quiet and one… the middle one… seemed to find it his mission to fight against all restraint in Mass. We made the decision to not bring them for a while and my husband would go to Saturday night mass and then I would go to our normal Sunday morning Mass.

Well father noticed and without mentioning us by name, prefaced his sermon with the need for people to bring their children to Mass as a family and for other parishioners to be understanding and rejoice in the families that came to Mass.

So that was all a bit awkward at the time but it was at least nice to have father on our side!

One of our former priests said let them talk during mass… God gave them that voice!

 

[EasterJoy]

Oh good! A chance to turn this into a mommy-bashing thread!

That is exactly what I need to know about what goes through the minds of fellow parishioners when I’m at Mass alone with my very young kids.

First, there is no AC in our cry room and it’s small. My girls hate going in there. Most parishioners with noisy kids avoid the cry room in favor of pacing the back of the Church.

Also, some moms aren’t given the luxury of leaving kids at home and swapping Mass times. My husband is in the military and that is all I need to say about that.

Besides…I’m not there to make a show of appearance…I’m there for the Eucharist. Plain and simple.

Just to let one know how it feels to be on the receiving end of people moving pews.

I was 9 months pregnant with a 3 and 1 year old. My husband had been on orders for the past 4 months and couldn’t help. It was 100 degrees out and I elected to go to Mass but stay in the back of the Church.
My girls were playing. Maybe a little distracting, especially if you were single and weren’t around kids often.

I saw two people sitting in front of me and they were constantly turning their heads and staring at me. Then they got up and moved pews,

I was mortified and stopped going to Mass for a couple of weeks.

It took a poster on here and a friend of mine to tell me that I should try again and ignore ignorant people because I was there for the Eucharist and I needed it.

As for the OP.

Find another spot to sit…either way in the front and bring a shawl or use a baby carrier (something you should probably take advantage of anyway for a number of reasons) for modesty while nursing or figure out where this couple frequents sitting and plan to sit at the opposite side of the Church.

Our cry room is small and has no AC.

We have to accommodate each other, I think. It is hard not to take it personally if someone doesn’t want to sit near you, but it is best to let it go and chalk it up to a need they have that isn’t our worry, just as we want them to do for us. Parents and teachers often sit their charges far from each other so that both can benefit from whatever activity they’re sharing without distracting anyone else or either disrupting the focus of the other. Much of the time, providing a bit of physical separation works so well that no other “discipline” is necessary. I don’t think there is anything wrong with concluding that we don’t necessarily ever outgrown the usefulness of that solution. We just have to be humble enough to choose it for ourselves when no one is there to force us to do it.

 

[SilverLight]

Hi all,

I’m such a person that if people that are dressed immodestly for Mass sits in front of us where we can see them, I get up from the pew without thinking it twice and move somewhere else where it doesn’t distract me or hubby. I do not want to give the devil the pleasure of tempting me by watching the immodest or by not paying attention to Mass for being annoyed.

I could care less if it is seen rude by others in Mass. But is it scandalous of us to get up and move from pews just when these immodest married couple arrived?

It is not just the wife who wears short dresses and her undergarments are marked, and her child grabs her and pulls her dress up a few times , but the husband too wears very tight shirts and very tight khaki pants that accentuate his butt. It is not only annoying to have this couple in sight, but also repulsive.

Thoughts?

How someone dresses is not my problem and I am not distracted by such things because it is not a problem. I dress in a nice way that would be seen a acceptable by many people. I find it bad to judge people just on how they dress also I would feel like a jerk.

If I was married and strong in said marriage why would such things distract me?

 

[LaughingBoy1503]

Hi all,

I’m such a person that if people that are dressed immodestly for Mass sits in front of us where we can see them, I get up from the pew without thinking it twice and move somewhere else where it doesn’t distract me or hubby. I do not want to give the devil the pleasure of tempting me by watching the immodest or by not paying attention to Mass for being annoyed.

I could care less if it is seen rude by others in Mass. But is it scandalous of us to get up and move from pews just when these immodest married couple arrived?

It is not just the wife who wears short dresses and her undergarments are marked, and her child grabs her and pulls her dress up a few times , but the husband too wears very tight shirts and very tight khaki pants that accentuate his butt. It is not only annoying to have this couple in sight, but also repulsive.

Thoughts?

No, not scandal. Sit away from where this couple sits. If I was getting flashes of a woman’s undergarments right in front of me at Mass, I would probably not move but try to make it a point not to look in that direction. Though I guess, it would be best to move, especially if this was a very attractive woman. If it was very bad, I might move. If this was a weekly thing, I would most certainly find another regular spot, away from where that was visible, when I go to Mass.

There are times where people will be talking through most the Mass, that annoys me a lot. I do not think I have ever moved because of it though. I do not think I understand what “Her undergarments are marked” means

 

[m_crane]

I don’t mean this to sound preachy, it’s just the way I reasoned it out for myself based on your question and I thought I’d share…
Do we offend our brother at mass with distractions?

I can think of many distractions caused by my brother.
-smells like bad breath, body odor, strong perfume.
-sights like too tight or too thin or too little fabric in our wardrobe choices.
-noises like whispers, coughs, gum cracking, sneezing, blowing our noses

I’m definitely guilty of some of these ,maybe all. I’m human, I’m fallen. We are all human and we are all fallen.

Your brother probably does not mean to offend you .He’s is there at Mass to get healed . His conditions (weaknesses and short comings)are different from yours but you are there for the same reason. So if something your brother does distracts you then you can move. There’s no offense in that.

 

[Graceful_Lamb]

I would say just sit in a different pew the next time you go to Mass, instead of having to move after you get there.

We went to Mass a couple of weeks ago with my two step-granddaughters. The oldest (almost 10), loudly commented when a family decided to sit in front of us as Mass was starting. She commented about she could no longer see since people were now sitting right in front of us. I had to tell her to be quiet. LOL As time went on, she couldn’t see and she was interested in seeing everything that went on (it was her 2nd time to Mass and yes, she is baptized RC). She asked me why didn’t we sit in the front row.

I told her that the next time she comes to church with us, we could sit up front, if that is what she wanted.

 

[Graceful_Lamb]

I know that my toddler has pulled on my shirt and flashed my bra at least once during Mass. She’s lifted up my skirt once in a parking lot too, though I don’t usually wear skirts without leggings underneath. If you find that repulsive, then by all means take your fragile nerves somewhere less distracting because it ain’t gonna get any better.

She’s going to turn around and smile at you over and over again. She’ll stand on the kneeler and bounce up and down chanting “Gloria, Gloria, Gloria!” . She thinks “Let It Go” is an appropriate offertory hymn as long as you sing “Amen” at the end. She will expect you to shake her hand at the sign of peace, even though she’s had it in her mouth and it’s a tad bit moist. If you decline she will call attention to your fussiness by yelling “Hey! Peace!” and all the little old ladies will give you a look that says, “What’s the matter with you? Shake the adorable little girl’s hand!” If you leave early or have to use the facilities, she will call attention to that as well by shouting, “Bye Bye! Thank you!” And when people walk past after receiving, she will inform each person that goes by, “It is Christ!”. It will be cute at first, but after two or three verses…

Yeah, you might as well get out now while you can.

That sounds super dicey. Also, sounds super cute, too! I would be laughing!

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I must say as a guy weighing in on this I sympathize with the OP. When I was in high school it was a banner day to see a bra strap. (It was not really that long ago.) But now, even at Mass, I am ashamed to say that I have committed mortal sin just moments before I ingest the Body and Blood of our Lord. Geesh! The things people wear these days, the things they show, the thongs I have seen at Mass! The sheer amount of skin I have seen! And lusted after. Sitting in the pew, before our Lord.

I should have gotten up and moved.

Perhaps you could all think about how I could be looking at you as you sit in front of me and bend over.

I am serious. I must confess, I have fallen. And some others have helped me on my fall…

 

[retire_early]

I find the Its-All-About-Me comment terribly ironic given that you’ve implied that others should leave their children at home to enhance your Mass experience if the children don’t live up to your behavioral expectations.

And no, I don’t think children should do whatever they want in Mass unchecked but there’s likely a middle ground that doesn’t put an asterisk after “all are welcome”.

I think my expectations are keep it down to a low roar, as are most peoples’. I stand by my statement that people don’t* have *to bring fussy, tired, not-to-be-placated children to Mass. If they do, then people are going to be distracted and looking at them and moving to different pews. Its natural.

Anyway, you’ve now convinced me, by your reply. that you would not welcome me to Mass. Guess its time for me to stay home, huh?

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I think my expectations are keep it down to a low roar, as are most peoples’. I stand by my statement that people don’t* have *to bring fussy, tired, not-to-be-placated children to Mass. If they do, then people are going to be distracted and looking at them and moving to different pews. Its natural.

Anyway, you’ve now convinced me, by your reply. that you would not welcome me to Mass. Guess its time for me to stay home, huh?

Not home, but have you considered utilizing a special room separated from the rest of the people?

No, you wouldn’t like that I’m betting. So, who should be separated in the situations you describe. Who should be told they are not welcome?

 

[retire_early]

Oh good! A chance to turn this into a mommy-bashing thread! …

Exaggeration does not become you. :nope:

 

[CatholicSheila]

Many here are being very uncharitable to the original poster. While I understand the idea of being able to tune out, or tolerate some distractions, some people have a very hard time doing so. If they wish to move due to some undue disturbance from the Mass and it is not disturbing the whole church, then do it. There are also health reasons why one may need to do this (asthma, allergies, agoraphobia), so please be kind in your advice.

Many people seem to think it is ok for the OP to be uncharitable to the people they are trying to avoid. People annoy us. People are going to do things and say things we don’t approve of. It’s part of living in a community. Getting up and moving when x couple sits in front may not be scandalous but it is unkind. If someone did that to me every time I went to church I would be very hurt. Given I suffer from fairly severe social anxiety my response to such treatment would be to stop attending.

If moving is a once off then I would have no issue. Reading the OP it doesn’t sound like this is the case. It reads to me that moving is something they do at least somewhat regularly and always to the same couple. A better response would simply be to move to a different section of the Church.

 

[jlc2k2]

I think my expectations are keep it down to a low roar, as are most peoples’. I stand by my statement that people don’t* have *to bring fussy, tired, not-to-be-placated children to Mass. If they do, then people are going to be distracted and looking at them and moving to different pews. Its natural.

Anyway, you’ve now convinced me, by your reply. that you would not welcome me to Mass. Guess its time for me to stay home, huh?

How so? At what point did I say that you were not welcome? I have no problem with people at Mass who cause some distraction or who are disturbed by distractions. I merely pointed out that you speak about the horrors of the all-about-me people in Mass but how is telling Pensmama that she should leave her child at home because the child would distract you not making it about you? It just seems like a double standard to me.

And I have no problem with people who want to leave their children at home or use the nursery or use the cry room doing so. My problem is pushing it on people who don’t want to.