MSU professor William Penn pulled from classroom after attack on Republicans

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ishii said:
The study was based on “feelings” - i.e. the esssence of liberal thinking. And in the study, biased was defined as teachers grading students differently because those student held ideologies different from the teachers and voiced there opinions. As I’ve explained, and as you seem to continually not understand, academia has overwhelmingly more left/liberal teachers in the social sciences than conservative ones. And they do not present both sides in the classroom.
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You have to have proof that liberal professors are showing a bias. It isn’t good enough for someone to say that the professor has different views. So what if a particular teacher is voting a certain way. It is only wrong if that teacher is pressuring her students to vote that way and/or failing those who don’t have the same view. I want you to find me a study that says that. You have to prove to me that the majority of professors are failing/pressuring their students to vote a certain way. Having a different view means nothing.
In the case of William Penn, it was proven that he showed a bias. What he did was wrong.
 
ishii said:
Kendra and Brendan, you’re not thinking about the reality of what happens on college campuses. Its true that 18 year olds should be able to think on their own. However, anyone who knows young people knows that they often tend to follow the herd (or the trends). In 2008 it wasn’t “hip” to not be for the hope and change. Many of these “college kids” arrive at college without much foundation or understanding of the issues, etc. so they are basically empty vessels to be filled by the brilliance of those overwhelmingly liberal/left professors. And naturally so many of them are swayed. I have relatives who went to college as Catholics - and had only superficial understanding of politics - and came back raging liberals. Dennis Prager described the left-wing opposition he and David Horowitz encountered at UC Santa Barbara and Emory University when they went to speak at those universities:

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KendraDZ1902 said:
I AM a young person. I’m only 24. I was on a college campus in 2008. Were there people happy that Obama won? Well, duh. There were also people who weren’t happy about it. I remember the day after the election a guy showed up to my history class late. The professor locks the door when class starts and this guy was banging on the door. She opened it and said that class had already started and he was interrupting. The guy said," well my president is black. I don’t need this class." The professor informed him that Obama was everyone’s president and that didn’t mean that her attendance policies had changed.

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robwar said:
Sorry but 24 is still pretty young in my book and to be an authority on all of this because in a limited amount of time in 24 years, I’m sorry but you have still a lot to learn. Liberal biases at the university level has been an ongoing complaint not just in 24 years but much long than that and has been well documented not just at the undergrad level but at the graduate level where promoting the liberal party line becomes even more critical and includes even what professors get tenure. Sigh, kids these days.
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Apparently you forgot what post I was answering. Sigh, old people and forgetfulness:rolleyes: That person basically said that YOUNG adults aren’t capable of having a mind of their own and we are only vessels to be “filled by the brilliance of those overwhelmingly liberal/left professors,” GAG. That person also cited 2008 and what was happening on college campuses. HELLO, I was there. I was a sophomore. Very involved with my campus. If anyone is to know what is going on there, it would be a student, not some old guy who is watching the worst angle on the news. 👍 This young whippersnapper has a mind of her own. As do the majority of the people I know. Remember we only see these old guys a few hours a week. They aren’t going to warp our “empty” minds with too much of that terrible hippie stuff. They do have a job to do and lessons they have to complete. 👍
 
estesbob said:
“Those who are not liberal when they are are young have no heart, those who remain liberal as they mature have no mind”

Usually attributed to Winston Churchill
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I think they call that selling out to the man.
 
estesbob said:
“Those who are not liberal when they are are young have no heart, those who remain liberal as they mature have no mind”

Usually attributed to Winston Churchill
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Funny, I have never voted liberal…hmmmm…I guess I have no heart.
 
Mickey_Finn said:
Hmmm. Kendra was kind enough to share her personal experiences with us. Thanking her would be more appropriate. 😉

ATB
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My point is that someone came on and argued pretty forcefully that according to their experience that they have never seen liberal bias at the college level but their so called expertise is is 24 years of existence and that experience in a university in the south and not based on repeated studies and surveys and complaints that not only some of us have actually experienced but are pointing to like the links another just posted can be called into question. Getting back to the purpose of thread, the only reason MSU probably suspended him is that it was recorded and posted on the internet to hold him accountable. If students complained to the university without it, they would have been ignored which is what I am sure happen through the years with this professor. Thankfully now a days students can hold these guys accountable due to cell phones and the internet.
 
Mickey_Finn said:
I don’t think we helped the Indians any more than the **Human society **helps the pit bulls they “rescue”. As another thought, the Republican party the professor rails against did not exist during the conquest of the America’s. In true conservative fashion they show up after the danger has passed.😉

ATB
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Just curious was it the Human society or the Humane Society?
 
SamH said:
So you are saying liberal democrats didn’t kill all those indians? What about the slaves - did the democrats free them?
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As the Democratic party was only around for the tail end of the conquest of the Americas. (They would appear to your eyes as modern Republicans.)

As only a small portion of the Indians which perished at the hands of European’s actually lived in the United States.

I’d say their portion of the blame is rather small. Remember the bloodiest battles, and atrocities, were seen before, and during the revolutionary war. After the woodland Indians, the plains Indians were little more than an inconvenience.

Slavery in the United States ended (well after most European countries) under the watch of the Republican party. (They would appear to your eyes as modern Democrats)

ATB
 
KendraDZ1902 said:
You have to have proof that liberal professors are showing a bias. It isn’t good enough for someone to say that the professor has different views. So what if a particular teacher is voting a certain way. It is only wrong if that teacher is pressuring her students to vote that way and/or failing those who don’t have the same view. I want you to find me a study that says that. You have to prove to me that the majority of professors are failing/pressuring their students to vote a certain way. Having a different view means nothing.
In the case of William Penn, it was proven that he showed a bias. What he did was wrong.
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Kendra, it’s posts like this and others (such as “there’s no liberal bias in the Greek system so no bias in academia”) that make it seem like you’re obfuscating the issue. Bias doesn’t have to mean the teachers are grading students unfairly. What it does mean is that overall IN GENERAL the ideological breakdown in academia is totally lopsided in favor of the left and this affects which ideas are presented in the classroom. I have repeated this point many times. Also estesbob provided links to a number of articles etc which hopefully will help you understand.

Ishii
 
ishii said:
Kendra, it’s posts like this and others (such as “there’s no liberal bias in the Greek system so no bias in academia”) that make it seem like you’re obfuscating the issue. Bias doesn’t have to mean the teachers are grading students unfairly. What it does mean is that overall IN GENERAL the ideological breakdown in academia is totally lopsided in favor of the left and this affects which ideas are presented in the classroom. I have repeated this point many times. Also estesbob provided links to a number of articles etc which hopefully will help you understand.

Ishii
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I never said “there’s no liberal bias in the Greek system so no bias in academia,” so I’m not sure why you are using parenthesis. I would argue that there may be a conservative bias in the Greek system and people are actually picked on for not sharing those views. I don’t think that the majority of liberal professors are actually picking on their conservative students. Which would be totally wrong. If the professor is doing their job the correct way by teaching her class what is supposed to be taught in said class, I see nothing wrong with how that person votes. If the class deals with Race and Ethnicity in American Politics, I could see where the Democratic party would be discussed more. You couldn’t have a whole semester class that only deals with ethnic conservatives. Or if the class was about Urban Politics, then again, that would be more of a liberal class. Don’t see how that could be shocking. If the class has to deal with Conservatism or Southern Politics, then you shouldn’t have a test on Liberalism. That professor would not be teaching what needed to be taught for that required course.
 
Mickey_Finn said:
…

As only a small portion of the Indians which perished at the hands of European’s actually lived in the United States.

I’d say their portion of the blame is rather small. Remember the bloodiest battles, and atrocities, were seen before, and during the revolutionary war. After the woodland Indians, the plains Indians were little more than an inconvenience.

Slavery in the United States ended (well after most European countries) under the watch of the Republican party. (They would appear to your eyes as modern Democrats)

ATB
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American Indians won their lands by wars and American Indians lost their lands by wars. There’s a saying ‘live by the sword, die by the sword’ and that was the life American Indians had. Whites just did a better job than the American Indians when it came to getting the lands.

But MSU most likely took action against this Professor because it was as 1 poster said, recorded what he had said. Had there just been complaints, then it’s unlikely anything would have happened. College professors can have biases and this teacher did. Public schools have had problems of teachers pushing their agendas on students by giving only 1 sided views, parents complaining, but it does not change.
 
meltzerboy said:
McGovern was a true and principled liberal, while I’m not sure what Carter was and is today.
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Considering that he told the Democrats to tone down the abortion rhetoric and while in office he promoted deregulation of the airline and trucking industries, not to mention appointing Volcker to be Fed chairman, I would say he’s not as liberal as people say he is.
 
ProVobis said:
Considering that he told the Democrats to tone down the abortion rhetoric and while in office he promoted deregulation of the airline and trucking industries, not to mention appointing Volcker to be Fed chairman, I would say he’s not as liberal as people say he is.
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Just a poor and petty administrator no matter what his policies were.
 
JRJOHNSON said:
American Indians won their lands by wars and American Indians lost their lands by wars. There’s a saying ‘live by the sword, die by the sword’ and that was the life American Indians had. Whites just did a better job than the American Indians when it came to getting the lands.

But MSU most likely took action against this Professor because it was as 1 poster said, recorded what he had said. Had there just been complaints, then it’s unlikely anything would have happened. College professors can have biases and this teacher did. Public schools have had problems of teachers pushing their agendas on students by giving only 1 sided views, parents complaining, but it does not change.
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Live by the sword… Was coined by a society rather advanced compared to the near stone age existence of the native Americans. Had the early “pioneers” followed the advice of the good fathers of SJ. Things would have worked out much better for all concerned.

ATB
 
SamH said:
Just a poor and petty administrator no matter what his policies were.
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WOW Sam that"s a little harsh isn’t it? Remember you are talking about a decorated veteran who devoted his life to public service. Also, in retrospect we would have been better of with him in 1972.😉

ATB
 
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