Must wives love their husbands?

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Defiance might not be necessary. There’s probably another option.
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Defenestration?

😱🤣:crazy_face:
LumineDiei said:
Or does it mean if they don’t agree on something big, he has the final say in it, and in doing so, assumes the responsibility if his decision was the wrong one?
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It’s not even necessarily a matter of resolving disagreement.

My wife expects me to make decisions. She’ll offer her (name removed by moderator)ut sometimes, but she sees it as my duty to do this. It’s not male “privilege”.

(Now, if only I could get her to actually read the tax returns before signing them . . . :roll_eyes:)

hawk
 
PJH_74 said:
Should they? This whole male is the head of the household went out the window 50 years ago and is complete rubbish in this era of dual incomes. We’re supposed to earn money while running a household? Search your soul guys, this it what many of you expect.
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It’s not about money. It’s about the natural realities of most of human history. It’s about which parent is supposed to sacrifice their life to save the family.

Before guns were invented, 99% of the time, the husband was the only one physically strong enough to fend off bandits or wild animals in order to save his family.

So traditionally, when someone/something evades your home, it was the husband’s job to protect his family with his life, while the mother fled with the children.

Now, today, because of guns, a woman can protect her family with a gun. And some women are highly trained in the martial arts too. HOWEVER, in the majority of families, it would still be the husband who dies to protect his family.

When there is a life and death situation: there is no time for debate. One spouse must be automatically in charge and the other must automatically be submissive. Life and death is one of those situations and perhaps the one real situation where debate is not allowed.

Unless the wife is a police woman, solider, martial arts master, trained assassin, etc; chances are the husband will still be (even today) the one who is called to lie down his life to protect his family.

I hope this helps.

God Bless
 
True. In fact many of the churches he wrote to were not Jewish. there was always that Jewish question as to whether a Christian first had to become Jewish (be circumcised) before becoming a Christian. I used Jewish in a more wide scope way of thinking. Of course there were exceptions to my reference.
 
Only reason I asked was because Paul’s teaching on headship in marriage appears in Ephesians.
 
Granted, and your observation is correct. My post was to the effect that marriage in Paul’s time was vastly different than it is today. The upshot was to say that one must understand Paul’s words as they applied to his day, and interpret them as such. I think if there is any one quote in Scripture that holds its own over time, it might be this one. I don’t think anyone could argue that its meaning was more germane to any one particular moment in time.
 
For what it’s worth, Ephesus was a Greek city in what’s modern-day Turkey.

Women in ancient Greece were married by the age of 13 or 14. Their husbands were probably 10, 20, 30 years older than they were.

The best a wife could generally hope for in ancient Greece was philia - type love. The husband generally looked for his eros- type love somewhere else-- prostitutes, courtesans, live-in lovers…

The wives were pretty much housekeepers and child-rearers, but it was hardly the norm for them to be the close companions of their husbands-- mentally, emotionally, physically. They shared the same household, but their lives were lived in two different worlds. Gender was one of the big barriers to the full rights of citizenship, so women lacked full political and civil rights, regardless of how highly-born they may have been.
 
I think it means that she has to consider his wants and needs at least as equal to her own (and sometimes greater) when making decisions.
 
Terrible! I’m sick 🤒

Otherwise, I think it’s okay. I might be a Tenor…
 
And most importantly, are you able to leave your home and belongings behind at a moment’s notice and open a ski lodge in Vermont?
 
I feel as if OP is asking if wives must love their husbands ‘like Christ have loved the Church’? I remember asking this a while back as well. Because it seems as if Paul’s instructions to husbands is nothing ‘new’ or specific to husbands only, as Jesus already told everyone to love each other as he loved us in thr gospels.

If that’s what OP is asking, I don’t know. If OP is asking about love in general…then yea, since the wife vowed to cherish him
 
I don’t know any Tenor arias. The Sopranos usually have all the best songs.
 
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phil19034 said:
It’s not about money. It’s about the natural realities of most of human history. It’s about which parent is supposed to sacrifice their life to save the family.
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Really? Many cultures in the past, including that of the Bible and some still today, was a society where women were virtually owned by their husbands or fathers. There were often multiple wives. Guess who got the beatings? Guess who had the unwanted, virtually rape sexual relations? Guess who was to be submissive even to their immature sons? It not some romanticized man laying his life down for his family, it was that a man had complete control over his household with no questions asked.
 
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PJH_74 said:
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phil19034:
It’s not about money. It’s about the natural realities of most of human history. It’s about which parent is supposed to sacrifice their life to save the family.
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Really? Many cultures in the past, including that of the Bible and some still today, was a society where women were virtually owned by their husbands or fathers. There were often multiple wives. Guess who got the beatings? Guess who had the unwanted, virtually rape sexual relations? Guess who was to be submissive even to their immature sons? It not some romanticized man laying his life down for his family, it was that a man had complete control over his household with no questions asked.
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Straw man.

There is NO DOUBT that some men thought history (esp men with political, military, and financial power) abused women. No one is arguing that.

However, the Bible is the Word of God. God does NOT promote such abuse of women and that is NOT what the St Paul means when he says that women should be submissive to their husbands. St Paul meant it in a way that is STILL applicable today. Not in some way that condoned the mistreatment of women, which is something God NEVER condoned.

God Bless
 
Sure. That’s why it was so radical for Paul to have such symmetrical advice. Not just one way, not just the other way, but submit to one another.
21 Submit to one another out of reverence for Christ.

22 Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 After all, no one ever hated their own body, but they feed and care for their body, just as Christ does the church— 30 for we are members of his body. 31 “For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.” 32 This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church.33 However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.
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LumineDiei said:
I mean, she certainly gets what she would like at the grocery, chooses her own clothes, listens to the kind of music she likes, right?
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Heavens, no! (although I did all the grocery shopping for almost nine years.

She simply thinks that handling major issues is my responsibility.

err, she tends to choose my clothes, too 🤣

hawk
 
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