My religion is better than your religion

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JKirkLVNV said:
Since I am a celibate, your cross is heavier than mine and I acknowledge that and I will remember you and your children in my prayers.

Having a vasectomy is mutilation of the body, the temple of the Holy Spirit, with the intent of thwarting what may be the will of God by preventing the engendering of children. It removes one of two essential components of the marital act, the procreative one. Abstinence is simply not engaging in sexual relations, for a season, and is permitted IN SCRIPTURE (Saint Paul). Even here, however, the Church has said that married couples may not use Natural Family Planning for selfish reasons.

God teaches personal responsibility for sin and for our obligations, one of which is our obligation not to sin against Him.
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For my wife and I sex is now only for fun… she is now sterilized too to cut down on her period lenth. We are enjoying this time… no guilt at all.
 
DelScorcho said:
So you want me to follow a church rule, created by some unnamed man… without qualifying or questioning it?
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Naturally…actually, we want you to convert to Catholicism! If you had a great treasure that gave you immeasureable joy, wouldn’t you want to share that joy? I would invite you to read a couple of books. The first is The Catholic Passion by David Scott. The second is *The Catechism of the Catholic Church. *The latter is enormous and you may prefer to read its companion *Compendium. *Karl Keating also has some wonderful books on what the Church teaches.

Questions are always good, it’s the conclusions that can be dangerous.
 
DelScorcho said:
Fair enough… but to correct a couple statements, I do not feel my vasectomy is “immoral” (actually I’ve told people it is the best medical procedure I ever had), but you seem to. I also do not seek Catholics to bless me.

I simply don’t want to be Catholic and want to impress on you that your church rules do not apply to me… but apparently part of your mission is to try to convert everyone.
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The natural law, of which sexual immorality is a part of, are written by God onto the hearts of all men, and thus are binding on all men. The natural law is not the same as those laws which wouldn’t be binding on those who are non-Catholic, such as Friday penance or the precepts of the Church.

And yes, Christ commissioned the Church to make disciples of all nations, and thus we have a duty to proclaim the truth to all men - and through our proclamation to allow the Holy Spirit to convert the hearts of all men.
 
ChristizkingAO7 said:
because in not having a vasectomy, you have to make the choice not to have sex, by having such a proceedure you are trying to have sex without the opprotunity of having children, sex then becomes something just for pleasure, which is a sin in Gods eyes
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Where does the Bible say that?

(BTW, If sex wasn’t fun, I’d never have done it.)
 
DelScorcho said:
Fair enough… but to correct a couple statements, I do not feel my vasectomy is “immoral” (actually I’ve told people it is the best medical procedure I ever had), but you seem to. I also do not seek Catholics to bless me.
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But, you do seem to be trying to get us to say that this is o.k. - which we cannot do.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Naturally…actually, we want you to convert to Catholicism! If you had a great treasure that gave you immeasureable joy, wouldn’t you want to share that joy? I would invite you to read a couple of books. The first is The Catholic Passion by David Scott. The second is *The Catechism of the Catholic Church. *The latter is enormous and you may prefer to read its companion *Compendium. *Karl Keating also has some wonderful books on what the Church teaches.

Questions are always good, it’s the conclusions that can be dangerous.
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Thank you, I am planning to read up on religion theory for all religions (this is very interesting - but only one aspect). However I like my current religion, I like being sterile, and I would not leave Freemasonry.
 
well for one, you just said that sex is all for fun between you and your wife, right?
 
JKirkLVNV said:
So, with respect, will you answer? By what authority do you say that artificial birth control and vasectomies are not sinful or that they are ok with God?

It’s God’s table, He’ll be the one doing the admitting, not me. I would not, however, say that there is room for everyone…just the ones He permits to sit down. And I am by no means certain beyond all doubt that I will be among them, but I pray by His Mercy to be so.
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Honestly, it never occurred to me that it would even be considered a sin… that’s why I unsuccessfully attempted to qualify the origin of the Catholic churches opposition to it.
 
JMJ_coder said:
The natural law, of which sexual immorality is a part of, are written by God onto the hearts of all men, and thus are binding on all men. The natural law is not the same as those laws which wouldn’t be binding on those who are non-Catholic, such as Friday penance or the precepts of the Church.

And yes, Christ commissioned the Church to make disciples of all nations, and thus we have a duty to proclaim the truth to all men - and through our proclamation to allow the Holy Spirit to convert the hearts of all men.
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I guess the “natural law” that God put into my heart saids, “Only have three kids, it’s all you can handle”.
 
ChristizkingAO7 said:
well for one, you just said that sex is all for fun between you and your wife, right?
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Only for fun now… yep. No issues.

Get the toys, lotions, and creams and go!

I’m going to dress up in my bloody costume now and take the kids Trick or Treating… later.
 
DelScorcho said:
I guess the “natural law” that God put into my heart saids, “Only have three kids, it’s all you can handle”.
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Nope. Due to concupiscence, it’s all too easy for men to murder their conscience and silence the voice of God within themselves. But, that doesn’t absolve them from the evil they commit, anymore than the Nazi’s get a free pass from ‘just following orders’ or because they honestly thought the Jews were sub-human.
 
JMJ_coder said:
Nope. Due to concupiscence, it’s all too easy for men to murder their conscience and silence the voice of God within themselves. But, that doesn’t absolve them from the evil they commit, anymore than the Nazi’s get a free pass from ‘just following orders’ or because they honestly thought the Jews were sub-human.
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I don’t subscribe to your churches man-made church rules… and I have NO guilt about this.

Let’s agree to disagree.

I have to and get my fake blood on…

BTW, I support gay marriage 🙂
 
DelScorcho said:
Only for fun now… yep. No issues.

Get the toys, lotions, and creams and go!

I’m going to dress up in my bloody costume now and take the kids Trick or Treating… later.
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come on bro, thats not even neccesary, you can really see justification in the way your thinkin?
 
SimonArizona said:
It is called the Protestant Fissiparousness (falling apart). Because of Bible-only, everyone is now allowed to interpret the Scriptures after their own fancy. The individual is least qualified to interpret ancient Scripture–so what happens is splintering everytime denominations disagree over what the bible says.

Is the Holy Spirit teaching all men different Bible? Is this a work of the Spirit of Truth who will “lead you into all truth.”

I know the source of the problem; these Christians are using the Bible as the pillar and foundation of the truth, but its not, do you know what the bible says it is?
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Here’s the difference. You have men that are legitimately Spirit-led who are applying something for them across a wider swath, and you have some that care not for the Spirit and just want the ego rush that comes with being both a trend-setter and the one in a position of power.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Well, first of all, do you believe in the doctrine of the Trinity? If you do, then by what authority do you believe in it? It isn’t mentioned in the Bible. It is essentially “a rule made up by the Catholic Church.” Do you believe in the Hypostatic Union, the doctrine that Our Lord was completely God and completely Man? If you do, by what authority do you believe it? This was also not articulated in the Bible and is “a rule made up by the Catholic Church.”
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C’mon, you don’t think that a person reading Scripture under the guidance of the Spirit would be able to discern basic matters of doctrine that know no denomination? In fact, you don’t think that someone reading Scripture from a philosophical angle would be able to discern some of this anyway?
 
That said, I appreciate the irony of what this thread has become from the original post. It’s basically a call for tolerance without hammering on someone and trying to convert them, and looks what it’s become…“you’re wrong, your church was founded by liars, 30000 churches, blah blah blah”.
 
Hajnalcsillag said:
That said, I appreciate the irony of what this thread has become from the original post. It’s basically a call for tolerance without hammering on someone and trying to convert them, and looks what it’s become…“you’re wrong, your church was founded by liars, 30000 churches, blah blah blah”.
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AMEN
 
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