My responsibility to tell another Catholic he should not receive Communion?

[ksrmarsh1]

Maybe it is my formerly Protestant tendencies coming out but I am horrified by the “ignore it” answer. One thing my RCIA class has taught me is that many people are hideously badly catechised. If no-one is prepared to ask the questions that no-one knows to ask then it is no wonder that we are stuffed. I may not be responsible for my neighbours responses to the questions asked, BUT if the questions aren’t asked then we partake in their moral culpability. If, on the other hand, our sensitive asking leads to repentance and faith then the whole of heaven will rejoice at a sinner saved.

Amen:thumbsup:

 

[ksrmarsh1]

By contrast, I think it is Protestant tendencies that are driving people to take umbrage at the idea of a man looking after his neighbor. I too am horrified at this kind of rank individualism, and I haven’t got a drop of Protestant in my veins.

Folks, communion is emphatically not about you. It’s certainly not about your feelings.

It’s about Christ – about His real presence in the bread and wine, His grace, His saving sacrifice.

What would drive a person to be so unconcerned about the state of his neighbors, such that even politely introducing the topic sideways in conversation (“do you want to go to confession before mass?”) would provoke such extremes of rage?

This is the body and blood of your Lord, for Heaven’s sake! You’re allowed to be concerned about its disposition, and concerned about the state of the souls of your neighbors who are receiving it, especially when they are attending mass at your invitation. You are, in a real sense, responsible for them. Surely something simple like what I suggested above (“do you want to go to confession before mass?”) isn’t presumptuous.

Well said

 

[ksrmarsh1]

“Do you want to go to Confession before Mass” isn’t what was stated.

“You know you have to go to confession before receiving if you’ve committed any grave sins right?”

“Instruct the ignorant, and
Admonish the sinner.”

“just a reminder, to receive communion as a catholic you need to be free of mortal sin”

The intention in all of these statements is that the speaker KNOWS that the other person has committed a mortal sin and also KNOWS that the person has not gone to Confession.

I don’t tell everyone when I go to Confession, do you? Do all of your friends know the last time you went? Do you tell them what you confessed?

How would all of you feel if someone walked up to you and told you that they thought you needed to go to Confession?

Actually, I would be grateful if someone I respected walked up to me and asked me if I wanted to go to confession. I would know that person loved me and cared about me. Especially if, for instance, I was bragging about doing something the night before that could possibly be considered a mortal sin. Not only would it be his right but also his responsibility as my brother in Christ.

 

[maryjk]

Actually, I would be grateful if someone I respected walked up to me and asked me if I wanted to go to confession. I would know that person loved me and cared about me. Especially if, for instance, I was bragging about doing something the night before that could possibly be considered a mortal sin. Not only would it be his right but also his responsibility as my brother in Christ.

It is not your responsibility to ask me about my sins. Unless you are my confessor, you have no right to know when I last went to Confession.

 

[TrueLight]

It is not your responsibility to ask me about my sins. Unless you are my confessor, you have no right to know when I last went to Confession.

Like some other folks on the board, I’m a little baffled by some of the responses.

In the real world, friends share things. They don’t share some things, and then clam up and become stone faced at a simple question, like when is the last time you went to confession?

I think the problem occurs when folks believe that you have to commit murder or something on that scale to go to confession. In that case one might feel judged if asked when was the last time one went to confession. However, some people go to weekly confession even when all they have are venial sins.

For example, for me, this would be a normal conversation:

Friend: The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. I want to get closer to God but it is such a struggle.

Me: Have you tried frequent confession? How often do you go?

Friend: I try go to every month, but it’s hard for me to get to confession. I went last week.

This type of conversation is very normal for me.

What I wouldn’t do is ask, “well what did you confess?” That is obviously out of line and not to be asked.

 

[Lutgardis]

It is not your responsibility to ask me about my sins. Unless you are my confessor, you have no right to know when I last went to Confession.

Yes. Asking a friend, “Hey, would you like to go to confession before Mass today?” isn’t what was posited here at all. I cannot imagine wanting to attend Mass with one who feels he has the right to quiz me about when I last went to confession because he was “99%” sure he knew something about my life. I would not assume the person who asked such questions was a friend, but an officious busybody who sat himself up as the arbitrator of my spiritual life; and I would run as far away from that person as I could get! I would not go away pondering the love and wisdom of such an intrusion; I would go away wondering how a person, with such a “duty” to “friends” would ever have time to evaluate his own spiritual state! (But on second thought, maybe the inquisitor wouldn’t have all that many “friends”!)

If we do not know the state of a person’s spirituality, we should be charitable and assume the best–not the worst about others.

 

[Rina_Badal]

Yes. Asking a friend, “Hey, would you like to go to confession before Mass today?” isn’t what was posited here at all. I cannot imagine wanting to attend Mass with one who feels he has the right to quiz me about when I last went to confession because he was “99%” sure he knew something about my life. I would not assume the person who asked such questions was a friend, but an officious busybody who sat himself up as the arbitrator of my spiritual life; and I would run as far away from that person as I could get! I would not go away pondering the love and wisdom of such an intrusion; I would go away wondering how a person, with such a “duty” to “friends” would ever have time to evaluate his own spiritual state! (But on second thought, maybe the inquisitor wouldn’t have all that many “friends”!)
If we do not know the state of a person’s spirituality, we should be charitable and assume the best–not the worst about others.

We have a ‘duty’ and a ‘responsibility’ towards one another as brothers and sisters in Christ, not necessarily as close friends, that is what the Church teaches us. How you as an individual or another react to an act of love is completely up to you. It is your choice.
Speaking of percentages, it is not a question of being sure 100% ‘beyond reasonable doubt’ as if we are in a court of Law, but if one has good reason to suspect then ‘duty calls’.
The question at hand is of a very serious nature, receiving the body and blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ! As some already advised, the OP can approach his friend charitably in a normal simple conversation, after all that’s what friends do, they talk!
Peace,
Rina

 

[Lutgardis]

We have a ‘duty’ and a ‘responsibility’ towards one another as brothers and sisters in Christ, not necessarily as close friends, that is what the Church teaches us. How you as an individual or another react to an act of love is completely up to you. It is your choice.
Speaking of percentages, it is not a question of being sure 100% ‘beyond reasonable doubt’ as if we are in a court of Law, but if one has good reason to suspect then ‘duty calls’.
The question at hand is of a very serious nature, receiving the body and blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ! As some already advised, the OP can approach his friend charitably in a normal simple conversation, after all that’s what friends do, they talk!
Peace,
Rina

You’re right that it is up to a person how he receives “an act of love”. That is not the question, here. The question is “whether or not it is an act of love” to assume things about others which we have no right to assume.

 

[maryjk]

We have a ‘duty’ and a ‘responsibility’ towards one another as brothers and sisters in Christ, not necessarily as close friends, that is what the Church teaches us. How you as an individual or another react to an act of love is completely up to you. It is your choice.
Speaking of percentages, it is not a question of being sure 100% ‘beyond reasonable doubt’ as if we are in a court of Law, but if one has good reason to suspect then ‘duty calls’.
The question at hand is of a very serious nature, receiving the body and blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ! As some already advised, the OP can approach his friend charitably in a normal simple conversation, after all that’s what friends do, they talk!
Peace,
Rina

So, how many times have you exercised that duty? In the last week? In the last year?

How many people have you approached, questioning them on the last time they had been to Confession?

Have you been to Confession to confess that you haven’t been fulfilling your duties? Because that is the flip side of a duty.

And, let us remember, this isn’t about a couple of friends talking about Confession. This is one Catholic debating about whether he should question another Catholic.

I am heading to Mass in about 25 minutes and I am bringing a friend who has fallen away from his faith as of late. I doubt he has been to confession. Is it my responsibility to tell him not to receive the Eucharist, or do I leave it up to him since he is Catholic and should probably already know. I don’t want him feeling like I am judging him of his actions?

 

[PaulinVA]

80% of self-identified Catholics don’t go to Mass every week.

As we’ve learned from the lesbian Buddhist incident, a priest can not refuse Holy Communion unless there is obstinate refusal to reform.

So, if the clergy can’t do anything in this case, why do some people believe the laity is obligated to say something?

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Like some other folks on the board, I’m a little baffled by some of the responses.

In the real world, friends share things. They don’t share some things, and then clam up and become stone faced at a simple question, like when is the last time you went to confession?

I think the problem occurs when folks believe that you have to commit murder or something on that scale to go to confession. In that case one might feel judged if asked when was the last time one went to confession. However, some people go to weekly confession even when all they have are venial sins.

For example, for me, this would be a normal conversation:

Friend: The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. I want to get closer to God but it is such a struggle.

Me: Have you tried frequent confession? How often do you go?

Friend: I try go to every month, but it’s hard for me to get to confession. I went last week.

This type of conversation is very normal for me.

What I wouldn’t do is ask, “well what did you confess?” That is obviously out of line and not to be asked.

I think problem you are having is what is the definition of “friend” and the issue of boundaries.

If a friend came up and asked me if I wanted to go with them to confession, that is one thing. If that same person came up and asked me to go with them to confession because they felt I needed it, that is a whole other matter and a big boundary issue.

If that “friend” came up and ask me if I wanted to go to confession with them and I said no as I had other things planned and they responded with “Well you shouldn’t receive the Eucharist until you do go to confession.” Then that is an even bigger issue.

In two of these cases above the individuals do not meet the definition of friend. I think you can figure it out which ones.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

We have a ‘duty’ and a ‘responsibility’ towards one another as brothers and sisters in Christ, not necessarily as close friends, that is what the Church teaches us. How you as an individual or another react to an act of love is completely up to you. It is your choice.
Speaking of percentages, it is not a question of being sure 100% ‘beyond reasonable doubt’ as if we are in a court of Law, but if one has good reason to suspect then ‘duty calls’.
The question at hand is of a very serious nature, receiving the body and blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ! As some already advised, the OP can approach his friend charitably in a normal simple conversation, after all that’s what friends do, they talk!
Peace,
Rina

I asked this before and am still waiting for a response but I will ask you since you state that the Church teaches us.

Where does the Church teach that you have a “duty and responsibility” (so therefore you are sinning when you do not do it) to judge the worthiness of an individual for the reception of the Eucharist?

 

[peace2u2]

There is a large difference between going to Mass with a Protestant versus with a Catholic. With a Protestant, you are always correct in the conclusion that your guest should not receive the Eucharist, because, by definition, a Protestant is not in communion with the Church.

With a Catholic, you have no way of knowing for sure whether or not he or she should receive unless that person confides in you and asks your advice. You should not assume that a confirmed Catholic needs to be “taught” how sin affects one’s readiness to receive the Eucharist.

What happens if you know someone who is a baptised Catholic and their spouse is a Protestant who left the Catholic Church and they married in a civil union and they both attend Catholic services and Protestant services and they both receive the Eucharist at the Catholic Church and the Priest is aware of their situation and they keep going up like it doesn’t matter because they say their marriage is valid in the eyes of God?

Do we just pray for their conversion?

 

[Lutgardis]

What happens if you know someone who is a baptised Catholic and their spouse is a Protestant who left the Catholic Church and they married in a civil union and they both attend Catholic services and Protestant services and they both receive the Eucharist at the Catholic Church and the Priest is aware of their situation and they keep going up like it doesn’t matter because they say their marriage is valid in the eyes of God?

Do we just pray for their conversion?

Insofar as a Catholic going to services with a Protestant spouse, there is absolutely no sin in that. That is what is called loving and being a part of your spouse’s life. Protestants are Christians. That is Church teaching! If a Protestant is going up to receive Holy Communion at Mass and your priest knows about it and does nothing to prevent it, you should relinquish your worry, know that the priest is the responsible party, assume the best, and treat the couple with love and respect.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

What happens if you know someone who is a baptised Catholic and their spouse is a Protestant who left the Catholic Church and they married in a civil union and they both attend Catholic services and Protestant services and they both receive the Eucharist at the Catholic Church and the Priest is aware of their situation and they keep going up like it doesn’t matter because they say their marriage is valid in the eyes of God?

Do we just pray for their conversion?

If the pastor is aware of this, and most likely he is privy to more of the story and background than we are, and allowing it what do you think you could do?

 

[englishredrose]

Normally I don’t share very much about my confessions to anyone.

I did so once because I remembered a previous priest in his sermon on ash wednesday explained that they aren’t being heartless when they do nothing when we are sat there crying in confession. I was embarrassed because I had confession that day with him and I wasn’t crying but my nose was running and snuffly. That was quite some time ago now and only mentioned it because the new priest does it different and I did comment to one friend that at least by sitting in front of me if my nose is running, he’d not see. Totally forgetting he would hear me snuffling as one does with a runny nose. Plus I have shared the last three confessions have had with the new priest because this guy seems to mean action or is it that I share more with him so he knows how to really guide me including the penance. I will never know because its something that aint usually shared and I only said something because of the huge change for me. But normally I haven’t said a word about confession to anyone and wouldn’t expect anyone to prompt me into thinking about going to confession unless its my priest who may feel I be better for doing so or something but I talk to him anyway most of the time within confidentiality and he hasn’t broken it once but certainly wouldn’t really expect anyone to prompt me into going to confession no matter how evil I may have been. I think the priest would just wait for me to make own decision on that even if I had plucked up and told him as I do about stuff anyway.

But there again confession may be much more private in the Anglican Faith rather than RC Faith?

 

[Rina_Badal]

Well, let me try to make my point clear.
1.In response to ‘not my responsibility’ and ‘mind one’s own business’ attitude I referred to a part of His Holiness message for Lent focused on “Let us be concerned for each other, to stir a response in love and good works” (Heb 10:24)
Under the subtitle “Let us be concerned for each other”:** responsibility towards our brothers and sisters **The Pope writes/says, ‘All too often, however, our attitude is just the opposite: an indifference and disinterest born of selfishness and masked as a respect for “privacy”. Today too, the Lord’s voice summons all of us to be concerned for one another. **Even today God asks us to be “guardians” of our brothers and sisters (Gen 4:9). **He adds,’ Today, in general, we are very sensitive to the idea of charity and caring about the physical and material well-being of others, but almost completely silent about our spiritual responsibility towards our brothers and sisters. This was not the case in the early Church or in those communities that are truly mature in faith.
His Holiness also speaks about Fraternal Correction and admonishing sinners which is among the spiritual works of mercy. He says, ‘Christian admonishment, for its part, is never motivated by a spirit of accusation or recrimination. It is always moved by love and mercy, and springs from genuine concern for the good of the other.’
When I spoke about our duty and responsibility towards our brothers and sisters I had the Lent message in mind especially the reference to fraternal correction and the ancient implied call to be our brothers’ guardians. In the NT we have the great commandment ‘Love your neighbour as you love yourself’ MT 22:39.
Fraternal correction is ‘deeply rooted in the Scripture and Tradition’ (Prov 9:8, Levit 19:17, Mt 18:15, Gal 6:1, Eph 5:11, 1 Cor 12:25, James 5:20, 1 Timothy 5:20, 2 Thimothy 4:2 …) It is a demand of charity (Catechism of the Catholic Church 1829)and an obligation (Catholic Encyclopedia)
“Fraternal correction is not the same as judging others, if it’s done in the spirit of charity and with the intention to help our neighbors “walk more uprightly in the Lord’s ways.” We can never condemn others, or consider ourselves morally superiors, but we are obliged as Christians to correct others, and allow ourselves to be corrected” From an article on www.aleteia.org
Capuchin Father Raniero Cantalamessa, the preacher of the Pontifical Household, wrote in a commentary on Matthew 18:15-20, that “there is both active and passive correction. Not only does the duty to correct exist, but also the duty to allow oneself to be corrected. And here is where one sees if one is sufficiently mature to correct others.” aleteia.
2 I still advice the OP, since he has good reasons (and not just ‘assuming’) to think his friend needs to go to confession before receiving the Holy Eucharist, to approach him and talk to him, not accusingly but charitably. A counsel done with love and out of love will surely bear good fruits
Peace,
Rina

 

[Sherry_G]

I was worrying about a friend who I knew was having sex with a man in our area as she had told me so herself, and she would go to receive communion everytime she went to Mass. it really bothered me, so I asked my priest about it in confession, as I did not want to commit a sin of omission by not speaking to her about it, yet did not want to judge her either. i truly wasa worried about her damnation for receiving Jesus in a state of mortal sin. Of course, I did not mention any names or specifics, just asked his advice on what my responsibility should be in the situation. The priest told me to pray for her and leave everything else up to her and God. So, ever since, that is the way I have handled it.

 

[peace2u2]

The priest told me to pray for her and leave everything else up to her and God. So, ever since, that is the way I have handled it.

Good advice. We should just pray and let God do all the heavy lifting. Amen!

 

[OraLabora]

Good advice. We should just pray and let God do all the heavy lifting. Amen!

Agree, wise priest. Fraternal orrection about suitability to receive the Eucharist implies a degree of intimacy that belongs in the confessional.

Again it’s one thing to say “don’t do that” about something immoral or injurious (if it can be done charitably), and quite another to say someone is not in a state to receive.

With our children it’s different, we have a duty to instruct in the faith. With adults, discretion is the better part of valor.