Name one Catholic teaching that contradicts Scripture

[AlegreFe]

JesusHasMyHeart:

The thing you are not realizing is that I have many Christian Brothers and sisters and we all think alike but some go to different churches.

You are saying that there is more than one body if you think it is okay to go to more than one church. I know you don’t but you know people that go to different churches. Or do you go to more than one church?

JesusHasMyHeart:

The body of Christ are those who truly know Christ personally 24/7 and of course their is going to be a few bad apples or unconverted or seekers entering any church door, some immature Christian might look at them and think, is that what a Christian is?

The Church is VISIBLE here on earth. Sure there are those Christians who are cradle Protestants who have no idea at all what the Catholic Church really teaches that could be part of His “Mystical Body.” But only God knows their hearts and Catholics should want to reach out to them to tell them the Truth. Then there are those who are not even Christian and don’t know what the Cathoilc Church teaches and don’t even know about Jesus; we have to try to reach out to them too so that they can have the Fullness of Truth. I know I shouldn’t say this but I’ve always wanted to say this to a Protestant who wants to go out and evangelize (Jesus forgive me if this offends you), “Please leave our ignorant Catholics alone! And leave everyone else alone! Don’t fill people’s heads with GARBAGE and stop lying to everyone!!”
There I said it finally. Sorry, but I had to do that.

JesusHasMyHeart:

But even though we go to different parts of the body of Christ, we have sweet fellowship one with another, because we all do need one another.

You don’t go to “different parts of the body of Christ” because that is impossible. What Protestants are doing is creating new Heads of Christ and there is only ONE Head. Christ’s Body is only ONE. Christ is the Head and there is only one Head. You are going to different bodies altogether; and they don’t belong to the One Head. The Church is visible and it’s the Catholic Church that Jesus Christ built on Peter the Rock. Sure Jesus Christ is the Rock but we also have a Rock here on Earth! And that is Peter! Peter’s name was Simon which means grain of Sand or little pebble. Jesus changed Simon’s name to Cephas which means Rock. Then he gave Peter the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven and Jesus gave Him the Power to loose and bind, to forgive sins here on earth.

JesusHasMyHeart:

I’m saved according to the word of God and my relationship with Him personally even though I don’t go to the Catholic church, and I don’t follow the teachings and doctrines of man, Just the Word of God.
I’ve been where you are, I know what its all about, and I see through it also, and see the deception of that which you follow.
Its sad that you reduced Jesus to a piece of bread, the eucharist, almost to the point of idolatry, actually… it is idolatry.
Paul said, my children keep yourselves from idols.

The Word of God is more than just the Written Word. It is also the Word that was passed down orally. We call that Sacred Tradition. We don’t follow traditions of man. That’s what Protestants do.

“Once Saved, Always Saved” is such a FALSE doctrine. That is far from the TRUTH that you want to seek so bad.

Here’s another webpage on Once Saved always Saved.

I don’t want to do anything that would look like “vain glory” because that is not what I am trying to do here. You saw my invitation to visit a Catholic Church. I really do want you to see the Fullness of the Catholic Faith. I will keep praying that God will circumcize your heart. You seem to have this thick crust around your heart, so thick that you cannot see the truth when it is presented to you. Everything is presented here as proof of the Catholic Truths but you do not want to see. I really believe that you do not want to even see the truth for fear of something. You probably don’t even know what it is. But something is buried deep inside of you that you can’t see it. I could be wrong. I sure hope I’m wrong.

It seems as if you just want to be right and you don’t really want the truth. Do you just want to “be right” and not want the TRUTH, the FULL Truth?

 

[Eden]

Nebuchadnezzar:

Jesus has my Heart,

You sure are full of the same ol Protestant cliches about the Catholic church. Question, are you a Mormon? Cause the way you talk about how the Church was corrupt from the beginning sure sounds like the Apostasy Theory they put forth. Jesus tells Peter he is the Rock and upon that rock he will build his Church (not Churches) and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it. Yet within 100 years everything has gone to hell in a handbasket? Except until 300 years later when the Catholic Church gets together and despite being wrong on having lost their salvation for 3 centuries manages to piece together a New Testament that Protestants and Catholics believe is inerrant…Then they go back to their Pagan ways until 1100 years later when God sent his Prophet Luther to right the wrongs of the last 1500 years making a lier out of Christ in the process for saying that the church would not fall into apostasy ?

Well put.

By the way how do Protestants ever confuse You are Peter and on this Rock I will build my Church, for You are Peter and on the confesion of me being the saviour I will build my church?

Don’t tell me about the Greek forms of Rock, Christ didn’t speak Greek he spoke aramaic and there is only one word used at the time for Rock. Besides I believe Matthew wasn’t written in Greek originally was it?

That’s right. We know from Patristic writing that Matthew wrote his Gospel in the ‘Hebrew Dialect’ of Aramaic (Judean Aramaic), and that “everyone” translated it into Greek “as best they could”.

 

[AlegreFe]

JesusHasMyHeart:

How old was Jesus when He was baptized ? Read Matthew3
Now He was dedicated by Simeon at the temple as a Child, but not baptized. It must be an act of ones heart and will to choose, not infant baptism.

Only Protestants “dedicate” their babies. Jewish people back then presented their babies to give them to God and the boys at the time got circumcized at 8 days old to have a covenant with God. It was an outward sign of a promise between them and God. Jesus came to fulfill the laws of the Jewish people so that ALL can be redeemed not just Jews. That fulfillment of that particular covenant of the babies being circumcized is Baptism. So Baptism is most certainly for infants. Don’t you know of scripture that says that whole households were being baptized? What’s to say that there were no infants or children in those households? Since this was a NEW fulfillment of the OLD covenant, none were baptized. So of course you are going to have adults being baptized because they were converts.

JesusHasMyHeart:

Jesus is present everywhere I go, I don’t need to go to a building, He is as close as the air i breathe. He is omnipresent, omnipotent, omniscient.

I don’t disagree with you here. God is present everywhere! AMEN! But Jesus Christ is present with us SUBSTANTIALLY! We have His Body, Blood, Soul & Divinity present with us.

JesusHasMyHeart:

Its pretty arrogant of you to pretend that I have fallen away from faith, I have done the above,25 years ago, and my relationship with Him is much closer and stronger now then it has ever been as a catholic, or any of my so called strong Catholic relatives and friends whom I love dearly, but there faith isn’t #1 in there life, they all still do things that I know are displeasing to the Lord and go to church every Sunday and put in there quota for the week. But live as though Jesus isn’t Lord of ALL their life, 24/7.

I’m sorry you feel that I was arrogant. It was not meant to be that way. I am not pretending anything here either. How much scripture do you read a day? How much praying do you do a day? I bet it’s a lot right? No matter how much scripture you read you will never be filled with the Holy Spirit who is the TRUTH! But I could tell you that till I’m blue in the face and you won’t see it or believe it. So I won’t waste my time. I will keep praying for you though.

JesusHasMyHeart:

I make it a habbit to go into the Calif. missions when I travel, I love the history, but don’t sense the Holy Spirit life, Ive even gone back to my old Catholic church once in a while and am reminded how dead it is, everyone prays w/ there eyes open, barely anyone participates in worship.

The Holy Spirit being there does not depend on you sensing it. Don’t you see that? Okay, dumb question for you. And why do you depend on what others are doing in the church during Mass? What concern is that of yours? You should only worry what YOU are doing in Mass. And so what if people pray with their eyes open, what is wrong with that? I pray all different kinds of ways. With my eyes open or closed. I pray when I wash the dishes. I pray while I drive. I pray when I’m reading the bible; have to have my eyes open when I read. As far as “worship,” Protestants don’t “Worship” God in the way that God put it in His “Word.” The ONLY form of Worship that is pleasing to God takes place in a Catholic Church during the Mass. You don’t look at the people in the Church to see if that is the True Church. You look at the Church’s Deposit of Faith. If you had to look for a church that had ALL righteous people in it, you would be looking forever and never find it. The Catholic Church is a “Hospital for Sinners.” If you’re a sinner and you want to join the Catholic Church, that is a good qualification to start with.

 

[AlegreFe]

JesusHasMyHeart:

and it is all memorized with no deep meaning. They even sing songs at the youth mass that were written by people from my church. The Holy Spirit, Lord and giver of life is missing. My Catholic friends are worldly, when Jesus told us to be in the world but not of it in John 17 when He prayed for us, His true believers.

When you say “deep meaning” don’t you really mean “deep feelings?” That is what Protestants are concerned with; their “feelings.” They look for people to make them “feel” good with their “fellowship.” Nothing wrong with fellowship but don’t go by that either. You can’t depend on people and your feelings. The only one you can depend on is Jesus Christ. You could also depend on Mary, His Mother & ours and all the Saints in Heaven. You can count on them to pray for you. I will say a prayer to Saint Monica for you.

My faith does NOT depend on my “feelings.” The flesh is weak so I cannot go by my feelings. I know that I can trust Jesus no matter how I feel. Please don’t look at the people to try to get something out of what the Church teaches. I know it’s a shame that there are Catholic people that don’t understand the Mass. You are one of those people that just don’t understand what the Mass is really all about. And you don’t understand that the host really is Jesus Christ after the consecration. I know, you’ll tell me that you’ve “been there and done that.” But that doesn’t mean that you “got it” back then either.

The Holy Spirit is Missing?!? :ehh: You are depending on what everyone else is “doing” or “not doing” in the Mass to see if the Holy Spirit is there?!! The Lord, the Giver of Life is right there!!
If your Catholic friends are worldly then pray for them. But don’t look at them as examples of what the Church teaches. And don’t take them with you to the Protestant church either!! Leave them alone!!

 

[AlegreFe]

JesusHasMyHeart:

Alegra,

Have you read Romans 8, that is my life chapter. Only Satan condemns and is called the accuser of the brethren, but I am in Christ, and i have been in your shoes,…

First off, it’s Alegre, not Alegra. And you can call me Sandy. My name is in my signature blend.

I am very well aware of Romans chapter 8. If anything, it’s the Prostestants that are in the flesh and not the Catholics. I say that because they joined a church that was started by a MAN and not Jesus Christ. I seriously think you are in denial about something. I am so sorry for whatever happened in your life.

JesusHasMyHeart:

…but you have not been in mine. Im sending this with a prayer that the Holy Spirit would show you the truth, and soften your heart.

No, I guess I haven’t been in your shoes and believe me, I wouldn’t want to be in your shoes. You seem so bitter and angry and in denial about something. I don’t need all that weight to hold me down.

The Holy Spirit has shown me the Truth! I have Him right here in the Catholic Church. The Truth is Jesus Christ! Why do you think my heart needs softening? I think it’s the other way around; you seem so bitter and you don’t even try to conform to the Truths of the Catholic faith. Whatever can’t “conform” is not soft at all. I’m always asking God to keep softening my heart and to make sure I stay on the right path. Conversion is for everyone and it is an everyday process.

Here is a prayer that I will say for you:

http://onefineart.com/en/artists/daoudcorm/paint3.jpg

“O Victorious Lady!
Thou who has ever such powerful influence
with Thy Divine Son, in conquering
the hardest of hearts, intercede for those
for whom we pray, that their hearts being softened
by the rays of Divine Grace, they may return to the
unity of the True Faith,
through Christ, our Lord.
Amen.”

 

[happygal]

AlegreFe:

The bible is NOT open for interpretation. The bible is only for the church to interpret. The church teaches us Catholics and we pray to the Holy Spirit. We also have our Catechism. Then and only then can Catholics and only Catholics, interpret the bible. I say only Catholics because we are under the guidance of the Catholic Church’s teachings. That is the way Jesus left it. He built His church on Peter the Rock.

20 Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy
of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation 2 Pet 1:20

18 And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this
rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld
shall not prevail against it.
19 I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven.
Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and
whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Matt 16:18-19

Sure Protestants can read the bible. I know and realize that Protestants love the bible and they love Jesus. But they don’t always get the right interpretation. That is why there are so many different denominations. Luther left Peter and he had his followers, they then became scattered like sheep without a shepherd because that’s exactly what they are. I pray for the conversion of all sinners including the ones inside the Catholic Church and myself. Conversion is a life long process and we are called to holiness. Catholics have the assurance of the Church to back them up and guide them in the reading of the bible. Not only that, we have the Mass which is the best “Bible Study” in the world.

Hi There

Is good that you stand firm on what your practise. I’m happy being a protestant by faith and all this while nothing bias again catholic.
Being a christian who practise true christianity is someone who does not give their own perception towards other believers practise. God is the one who give the real truth, not sinner like us.

If catholic are the only one who can interpret the bible, meaning the priest who are trained to do that], then i wonder why they sin? So are u telling me these priest are fake! If every catholic stand firm and proud of their practise, then i believe action speaks louder then words.

In my country there have been a priest (from a renown catholic church back here ) who misused the members offering to financial his housing and his mistress, and because of this nation wide publicise news, the entire catholic community here have to keep a low profile, coz lots of non-believer hates christianity, that’s includes my mum who condemn our religion. Instead of telling who’s practise is true, might as well spend time cutting down all those slander that directly hit towards our religion.

 

[MariaG]

:wave:JesusHasMyHeart,

I see several problems to the many posts.

I was and in fact did just post and erased a bunch of personal testimony. Just let me condense it and say that though “technically” a revert, ie, baptized as an infant in Catholic Church, I was not raised in any way in the Catholic Church. My Christian walk as an adult began on my knees in a Nazarene Church 15 years ago. I alway start Bible reading by praying that God will lead me to all truth.

I am now a born-again, Bible thumpin’, Catholic Christian.

You have made several claims of what the Catholic Church does that are not scriptural. In fact, most of what you claim, are NOT teachings of the Catholic church.

But let us examine SCRIPTURE. Not personal experiences of what you were taught or did, but SCRIPTURE and if you wish to tell us what Catholics believe, the Catechism. But I am entirely comfortable as well as most here responding to you, to use Scripture alone to refute your false claims. (Although I will use the Catechism to refute what you claim is a teaching of the Catholic Church.)

Let’s start here shall we. I have read that many tried to bring this up and the subject jumps all over the place in response.

It is very hard in this forum to carry on intelligent dialogue in the same way we tend to do when we talk. I know it is hard, I talk much the same way you seem to (your posts at least), but it is too difficult to do so in this media. I must discipline myself to get anywhere.

So…

**Scripture. **

Catholic Christian teaching on scripture is that it is God’s inspired word and no new public revelation has occured since the death of the last apostle.

Would that match your current view?

Why don’t you now choose ONE thing about Scripture that you feel the Catholic church teaches that is contradicts scripture?

Please, since this is about scripture, let’s use scripture. I personally prefer one or two verses at a time. Must be a leftover from my Protestant days when we spend 3 hours on one or two verses

And if possible, state as succintly as possible, what exactly Catholic Christians teach that contradicts the Scripture you post.

I truly look forward to a targeted discussion.

And I truly thank you for coming here and trying to “save” us. I do not say this sacastically. If Catholics Christians truly believed some of the things you have posted, we would be going to Hell. It must have been your love of God and the leading of the Holy Spirit that directed you here to this Catholic forum. I pray that you will continue on your witness, while understanding that there are many misconceptions you have about Catholic Christian teachings.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[MariaG]

happygal:

Hi There
If catholic are the only one who can interpret the bible, meaning the priest who are trained to do that], then i wonder why they sin?

It would completely contradict Scripture if a priest could be completely without sin just because he is a priest.

And each individual priest does not have an “infallible” ability to interpret the Bible.

A good way to understand infallibility would be to look to scripture. Remember where Peter was given the dream from God that there were no unclean foods? What did Peter go and preach? He taught the truth as revealed by God. What did Peter go and do? As a sinner, he failed to practice what he knew to be a revealed truth from God, but never changed what he knew the truth to be even when Peter had to be chastized by Paul for not “walking the walk”.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[jim1130]

happygal:

Hi There

If catholic are the only one who can interpret the bible, meaning the priest who are trained to do that], then i wonder why they sin? So are u telling me these priest are fake! If every catholic stand firm and proud of their practise, then i believe action speaks louder then words.

Peace.

This is a common concern: That non-Catholics confuse infallibility with impeccability.

This is a good explanation: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=1445695#post1445695 - post # 416

From Eden:

CHARISM: A charism is a gift freely given by God to a person or community, for the good and service of others in bringing about the Kingdom of God. Religious communities seek to live the charism which is received through their founders as God’s gift to the Church.

www.vocations.ca/What_is_a_vocation/common_terms.php

“Although the individual bishops do not enjoy the prerogative of infallibility, they can nevertheless proclaim Christ’s doctrine infallibly. This is so, even when they are dispersed around the world, provided that while maintaining the bond of unity among themselves and with Peter’s successor, and while teaching authentically on a matter of faith or morals, they concur in a single viewpoint as the one which must be held conclusively. This authority is even more clearly verified when, gathered together in an ecumenical council, they are teachers and judges of faith and morals for the universal Church. Their definitions must then be adhered to with the submission of faith” (Lumen Gentium 25).

Infallibility belongs in a special way to the pope as head of the bishops (Matt. 16:17–19; John 21:15–17). As Vatican II remarked, it is a charism the pope “enjoys in virtue of his office, when, as the supreme shepherd and teacher of all the faithful, who confirms his brethren in their faith (Luke 22:32), he proclaims by a definitive act some doctrine of faith or morals. Therefore his definitions, of themselves, and not from the consent of the Church, are justly held irreformable, for they are pronounced with the assistance of the Holy Spirit, an assistance promised to him in blessed Peter.”

Christ instructed the Church to preach everything he taught (Matt. 28:19–20) and promised the protection of the Holy Spirit to “guide you into all the truth” (John 16:13). That mandate and that promise guarantee the Church will never fall away from his teachings (Matt. 16:18, 1 Tim. 3:15), even if individual Catholics might.

Peace.

 

[JoshuaJ]

Galatians 1:11-12 “But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is** not after man**. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.”

Interesting how the man God had write most of the NT didn’t fall under the apostolic succession doctrine but was taught as it is written in 1John 2:27.

 

[Mickey]

JoshuaJ:

Galatians 1:11-12 “But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is** not after man**. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.”

Interesting how the man God had write most of the NT didn’t fall under the apostolic succession doctrine but was taught as it is written in 1John 2:27.

He was an Apostle! What are you trying to say?

 

[JoshuaJ]

Mickey:

He was an Apostle! What are you trying to say?

Mickey,

Don’t be confused.

Galatians 1:1 “Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead”

Where is apostolic succession?

 

[MariaG]

JoshuaJ:

Mickey,

Don’t be confused.

Galatians 1:1 “Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead”

Where is apostolic succession?

So you somehow are claiming that Paul was teaching a different gospel than that of the rest of the Apostles?

Or that the twelve were not picked by Christ?

Or that the apostles who were picked by Christ did not then give instructions on how to pick those who were to follow?

Not sure exactly what your claim is.

Could you please expand more?

God Bless,
Maria

 

[Image_of_God]

Mary is sinless. Mary is “full of grace” a special term applied only to Mary. Because of her special role as the Mother of God, she must be sinless. She must also be sinless in order for God to entrust her with his divine Son. For there must have been something special about her for the Lord to pick her out of all the other women.

 

[M_Oliver]

So you somehow are claiming that Paul was teaching a different gospel than that of the rest of the Apostles?

Or that the twelve were not picked by Christ?

Or that the apostles who were picked by Christ did not then give instructions on how to pick those who were to follow?

Not sure exactly what your claim is.

Could you please expand more?

God Bless,
Maria

With all due respect HOW do you come to these conclusions based on what he posted?? It says what it says. Is it really necessary to play games when Scripture is so clear. So the Scripture posted disagrees with your “church”. Does that make the poster a liar? No. It makes…

 

[M_Oliver]

Mary is sinless. Mary is “full of grace” a special term applied only to Mary. Because of her special role as the Mother of God, she must be sinless. She must also be sinless in order for God to entrust her with his divine Son. For there must have been something special about her for the Lord to pick her out of all the other women.

Scripture NEVER applies this “special term” to Mary. So who does? Who declares that statement as truth and where is their proof?

You say she MUST be sinless. Why? Just because Christ was sinless? If Mary HAD to be sinless to give birth to Christ then I guess Mary’s mother, grandmother, great grandmother, great great grandmother, great great great grandmother, great great great great grandmother etc. etc. had to be sinless too so that Mary could be born sinless. Is that what you are expecting us to believe?

I’ll bet the catholic answer is no. So if Mary could be sinless having been born of sinners WHY couldn’t Mary be a sinner and give birth to Christ? I’ll answer. SHE COULD because what the Father wants the Father gets. Your “churches” theory DENIES the power of the Creator.

There is ONLY ONE Scripture that says “full of grace” and guess who it is referring to!

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of GRACE AND TRUTH. (John 1:14)

Emphasis mine.

 

[adrift]

There is only one scripture? I guess it depends on the translation used. Douay-Rheims version uses full of grace.

Mary’s parents, grandparents etc. did not carry Jesus in their womb. It is only fitting that a sinless man and our God not be carried by an impure vessel. So your argument falls flat.

 

[M_Oliver]

There is only one scripture? I guess it depends on the translation used. Douay-Rheims version uses full of grace.

Mary’s parents, grandparents etc. did not carry Jesus in their womb. It is only fitting that a sinless man and our God not be carried by an impure vessel. So your argument falls flat.

What chapter and verse? “It is only fitting”?? “Fitting” to who? I’ll answer. The imaginations of the men who make up Christendom and smear the Word to benefit themselves.

 

[adrift]

Ha ha ha

So you can’t anwer. You thought you had a good argument. I

You say she MUST be sinless. Why? Just because Christ was sinless? If Mary HAD to be sinless to give birth to Christ then I guess Mary’s mother, grandmother, great grandmother, great great grandmother, great great great grandmother, great great great great grandmother etc. etc. had to be sinless too so that Mary could be born sinless. Is that what you are expecting us to believe?

I answere you why your reasoning was unsound. Instead of dealing with the reasoning you attack a word not the idea but a word.

Now I will answer you who decided what was fitting God did.

 

[M_Oliver]

Ha ha ha

So you can’t anwer. You thought you had a good argument. I

I answere you why your reasoning was unsound. Instead of dealing with the reasoning you attack a word not the idea but a word.

Now I will answer you who decided what was fitting God did.

Same old stuff from you adrift. You NEVER have Scripture to back up your crazy ideas. You want me to ASSUME that it is FITTING that Mary was sinless so that she could carry Christ. Well my friend that is why you are not on the path to salvation. You subscribe to doctrines that were created by men and have NO basis in Scripture.

God is your ultimate Judge I know but we are commanded to discern the spirits…

Yours is confused.