No Muslims Allowed

[Path_Finder]

Looked real Muslim? Please link for me the site that provides you with the official Muslim dress and grooming guidelines. I assume the site also has a set for Catholics. Wouldn’t want to not look like a “real Catholic.”

:hey_bud: You might see if you can find any pictures of ISIS fighters online as for the thick beards, as for those robes and caps, asking to see that is similar to asking if Veils were or are ever worn to Catholic Mass. Rather common really.

You didn’t like the example of the Skinheads but it follows the same premise. We don’t know how these Muslims were dressed, yet, they obviously stood out to this lady who alleges she has also received death threats per email from people angry that she posted some verses in the Koran.

Also, how many of the Muslim extremists who carried out terrorist attacks in the US or Europe fit your description?

That’s not my problem, you are saying I put a spin on mentioning Neo-Nazis, I’m only saying perhaps these men she turned away also stood out.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Are you sure that God is not on their mind when they slaughter the infidels? Does it even matter? We’re talking about hundreds of years of Christian conquest, colonization and occupation of these lands.

First, thanks for assuming us vets and those still serving as soldiers are just a bunch of bloodthirsty animals. Second, and speaking from personal experience, God is on a lot of people’s minds when rounds are coming their way or they have to send rounds down range. Usually it’s “God please don’t let me die” or “God please don’t let me accidently shoot a kid.” The “I wants to kill a bunch of infidels” types are usually weeded out of the military prior to actually making it into a combat zone.

 

[Path_Finder]

Are you sure that God is not on their mind when they slaughter the infidels? Does it even matter? We’re talking about hundreds of years of Christian conquest, colonization and occupation of these lands.

The Moors in Portugal and Spain for 600 years doesn’t count? :nope:

But I guess you are right, from Morocco to Malaysia and Indonesia, what a great distance, the system was spread peacefully, never through Muslim conquest, colonization and occupation nor was a head ever severed. :sad_yes:

 

[Havard]

First, thanks for assuming us vets and those still serving as soldiers are just a bunch of bloodthirsty animals. Second, and speaking from personal experience, God is on a lot of people’s minds when rounds are coming their way or they have to send rounds down range. Usually it’s “God please don’t let me die” or “God please don’t let me accidently shoot a kid.” The “I wants to kill a bunch of infidels” types are usually weeded out of the military prior to actually making it into a combat zone.

Thank you for your service.

It makes me sick that people are quick to think of U.S. soldiers are bloodthirsty. My uncle never wanted to kill anyone. After the horrors he experienced in Nam, he was spat on when he came home. He took his life because of PTSD.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

:hey_bud: You might see if you can find any pictures of ISIS fighters online as for the thick beards, as for those robes and caps, asking to see that is similar to asking if Veils were or are ever worn to Catholic Mass. Rather common really.

You didn’t like the example of the Skinheads but it follows the same premise. We don’t know how these Muslims were dressed, yet, they obviously stood out to this lady who alleges she has also received death threats per email from people angry that she posted some verses in the Koran.

That’s not my problem, you are saying I put a spin on mentioning Neo-Nazis, I’m only saying perhaps these men she turned away also stood out.

1. The two examples of dress don’t actually follow the same premise.
   -Beard (groomed/not groomed), robes, hat/turban- Pretty much the standard everyday wear for 100s of millions if not billions of men around the world regardless of their faith. upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f9/Sikh_wearing_turban.jpg Muslim terrorist right? Bet you I can find some Catholic and Orthodox clergy and laymen wearing robes and hats and having beards.
   -heavily tattooed white supremacist skinhead- Notice how you didn’t just say- “heavily tattooed white guys with shaved heads”? The usage of “white supremacist skinhead” means that their clothing/grooming clearly indicates that they are white supremacist skinheads. The only way this is comparable to a guy with a beard (groomed/ungroomed) wearing robes and a hat is if one takes the illogical step in concluding that all men who have a beard and wear robes and a hat are Muslims and are terrorists. As I illustrate in the photo linked above, this idea wouldn’t go over too well in the Sikh community.
2. I’m not the one who mentioned spin, you did. To quote- “Well, to put a spin on this,…”
3. What the Muslim extremists who undertook terrorist attacks in the US or the West wore is your problem because your entire argument is based on a particular sub-group being able to be identified solely on what they wore/groomed themselves. Assuming for the sake of argument your position that there is a particular mode of dress we can use to identify safety risks, we would have to conclude (off the evidence of prior attacks, failed attacks, and ongoing investigations) that Muslims in the US or the West who have a beard (groomed/ungroomed) and wear robes and turbans as everyday wear aren’t actually a threat to safety.

 

[Path_Finder]

As for whatever the video was, I have no sound, I can’t comment on it.

However, accusing Christianity of occupying, colonizing, etc. seems a bit over the top.

Rome was invaded, there is a very complex history to all of this.

 

[Path_Finder]

1. The two examples of dress don’t actually follow the same premise.
   -Beard (groomed/not groomed), robes, hat/turban- Pretty much the standard everyday wear for 100s of millions if not billions of men around the world regardless of their faith. upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f9/Sikh_wearing_turban.jpg Muslim terrorist right?

I don’t think I need to read this. Did you see this story:

Politico magazine implies George Wallace was a Republican in article on Civil Rights.

Again, if you are hunting for some sort of way to bring some sort of prejudice, discrimination in to the topic and project it on other people, I can’t help you.

Now, you said I put a “spin” on mentioning the Neo-Nazis as being heavily tattooed, now, please submit your evidence that these alleged Muslims that went to the gun range had nothing distinguishing them as being Muslims except having the ringtone of “Allahu Akbar”. This is the topic. Not projecting on other people the uncharitable idea that they are being discriminatory.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

As for whatever the video was, I have no sound, I can’t comment on it.

However, accusing Christianity of occupying, colonizing, etc. seems a bit over the top.

Rome was invaded, there is a very complex history to all of this.

The video was a portion of a Protestant church service at a military base (I assume it was overseas) showing soldiers (for some reason I keep thinking they are Marines) singing and praising (apologizes to my Protestant brothers, but I don’t know how else to describe it) in uniform. Apparently we are supposed to conclude that going to church in uniform of course means the military service you are in is some sort of God based religious military order/organization.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

I don’t think I need to read this. Did you see this story:

Politico magazine implies George Wallace was a Republican in article on Civil Rights.

Again, if you are hunting for some sort of way to bring some sort of prejudice, discrimination in to the topic and project it on other people, I can’t help you.

Now, you said I put a “spin” on mentioning the Neo-Nazis as being heavily tattooed, now, please submit your evidence that these alleged Muslims that went to the gun range had nothing distinguishing them as being Muslims except having the ringtone of “Allahu Akbar”. This is the topic. Not projecting on other people the uncharitable idea that they are being discriminatory.

I’m not hunting for anything, I’m just tearing apart your position. Let’s look at the two descriptions you provide-
-“It’s possible these guys looked real Muslim, what if they had thick beards, were wearing the hat and robes and had the “Allahu Akbar” ringtone?”
and
-“Well, to put a spin on this, if some heavily tattooed white supremacist skinhead types came to a gun range I owned, whether the law allowed it or not, I would turn them away.” [Notice once again who is wishing to put a “spin” on things.]

On the one hand we have a generic description of a mode of dress and grooming (beard, robes, hat) that is the norm for 100s of millions of Muslim and Non-Muslim men across the world, the norm for a sub-group of the US population that includes Muslims and Non-Muslims, and in no way provides any evidence or support for the conclusion that these men belong to a violent sub-group of the population driven by hate and the active usage of violence;

and on the other hand we have a rather specific description of a mode of dress and grooming that forces one to conclude that these men do belong to a violent sub-group of the population that is driven by hate and the active usage of violence.

So, pretty much apples and oranges. An actual apples to apples comparison would be-
-guy with a beard wearing robes and a hat with the Allah Akbar ringtone with
-white guy with a shaved head and a bunch of tattoos with a Dixie ringtone

As for the link, how exactly does that have anything to do with this topic?

 

[Path_Finder]

Okay, let’s say Ms. Morgan I believe posted quotes from Mein Kampf because it alarmed her, she receives death threats in email over this and soon after, 2 people who look like skinheads with Neo-Nazi tattoos or clothes on. Would one feel alarmed, Yes they would and that’s not mentioning the additional that supposedly, customers were being scared away or felt alarmed.

I find in this same forum one image of how two Rebels could look:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=912084

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Take away the guns and other military garb, the face covering on one, if they are dressed in this way, again with the robes or cap too and come in days after I received threats for posting verses of the Koran on my website, yes, I might feel alarmed. This is possibly more about fear and security and safety than anything else.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Okay, let’s say Ms. Morgan I believe posted quotes from Mein Kampf because it alarmed her, she receives death threats in email over this and soon after, 2 people who look like skinheads with Neo-Nazi tattoos or clothes on. Would one feel alarmed, Yes they would and that’s not mentioning the additional that supposedly, customers were being scared away or felt alarmed.

I find in this same forum one image of how two Rebels could look:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=912084

http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/M...sis_iraq_shakir_waheib_jc_140718_16x9_992.jpg

Take away the guns and other military garb, the face covering on one, if they are dressed in this way, again with the robes or cap too and come in days after I received threats for posting verses of the Koran on my website, yes, I might feel alarmed. This is possibly more about fear and security and safety than anything else.

Let me start off by pointing out that those two individuals aren’t actually wearing robes. What they are wearing are long jackets, pants, and military boots.

 

[Path_Finder]

OldCatholicGuy:

I thank you for your service as well. The wars have done much harm to all. Only the dead have seen the end of war.

 

[qui_est_ce]

First, thanks for assuming us vets and those still serving as soldiers are just a bunch of bloodthirsty animals. Second, and speaking from personal experience, God is on a lot of people’s minds when rounds are coming their way or they have to send rounds down range. Usually it’s “God please don’t let me die” or “God please don’t let me accidently shoot a kid.” The “I wants to kill a bunch of infidels” types are usually weeded out of the military prior to actually making it into a combat zone.

 

[grotto]

---

I can handle rejection - no need for small violins. I am fairly comfortable that my patronage of a business is welcome and if there was a problem with that, I would take my business elsewhere. Got a problem with that?

 

[EmperorNapoleon]

:nope: Sometimes I wonder if the next step in this country will be red crescent patches.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

First, thanks for assuming us vets and those still serving as soldiers are just a bunch of bloodthirsty animals. Second, and speaking from personal experience, God is on a lot of people’s minds when rounds are coming their way or they have to send rounds down range. Usually it’s “God please don’t let me die” or “God please don’t let me accidently shoot a kid.” The “I wants to kill a bunch of infidels” types are usually weeded out of the military prior to actually making it into a combat zone.

We’re talking about an organization of trained killers, right? What am I supposed to think, you’re all cute and fluffy?

Come on, man.

Do you think I would say any of this to your face?
Path Finders:

The Moors in Portugal and Spain for 600 years doesn’t count?

But I guess you are right, from Morocco to Malaysia and Indonesia, what a great distance, the system was spread peacefully, never through Muslim conquest, colonization and occupation nor was a head ever severed.

I’m trying to figure out what the Moorish occupation of the Iberian peninsula has to do with the British colonizing a different area centuries later, the U.S. and Russia instigating shadow wars there, then the U.S. bombing and invading the region multiple times after that. As soon as you figure out the connection, let me know.

 

[jimmy]

Hopefully action is taken to fine this woman or force her to change her discriminatory business practices.

Yeah, let’s get em. They have no right to be so mean and do business differently than everyone else. They should be put out of business and have their reputations destroyed and then they should be forced to undergo sensitivity training. Yeah, let’s stick it to em.

 

[TEPO]

:nope: Sometimes I wonder if the next step in this country will be red crescent patches.

You mean like the Jews had to do? Well, i guess that would depend on whether people are born Islamic or if it’s something ‘learned’. Jews are born Jews.

…But the things we learn and upbold as ideologies are in competition. Evolution takes place and the future depends on whether or not this or that gets weeded out. There has never been a time where all things imaginable can live in harmony… We always have to choose. Always. I dont see any signs that Catholicism is bad for modern times. But Islam…? I dont know.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

We’re talking about an organization of trained killers, right? What am I supposed to think, you’re all cute and fluffy?

Come on, man.

Do you think I would say any of this to your face?
.

Actually, what you are talking about is an organization whose primary duty is to a)safeguard it’s nations interests and b)fulfill what military actions its secular civilian government can lawfully demand of it; with just one aspect of this organization being that its members are trained to take human life.

As for what you should think, since you asked I’ll be more than happy to tell you. First, you should think that you might want to get some clue as to the military in general and the US military specifically prior to trying to use a video to prove your point. Second, you should ensure that said video actually proves your point or even address it.

I hate to break it to you, but a video of US soldiers exercising their Constitutional right to religious freedom in a place and manner as allowed for by law and military regulations doesn’t actually prove that the US military is somehow Christian, let alone some sort of neo-religious military order used by Christianity against non-Christians. What it does prove is that a soldier’s right to practice his faith/belief system is protected under US law and military regulations.

As for saying any of this to my face- if you can’t say something to someone’s face, you shouldn’t be saying it at all. A person saying something behind someone’s back that they wouldn’t say to the other person’s face shows that the person speaking either lacks moral courage and integrity or knows what they are saying is unjust.

 

[TEPO]

How about a ‘Western Edition’ of the Koran…? Just like the King James edition is a little different than the St. josephs edition.

…Just omit the parts in the West that talk bad about peoples and other religions. That would mean sending a message out that these things are no longer acceptable in modern Western world -since people tend to act on it. Maybe it will help.

…the radicals would be bamboozled.