No one is singing!

[Irishgal49]

Looking around while our choir and band were leading the hymns yesterday at Mass, I was struck by how few people were singing! I like to sing, so it’s no problem for me, and I understand that some of the music can be tricky, but even where the customary hymns are given at the customary places, most people just stare straight ahead. Do they feel awkward? I mean, c’mon, lift a joyful voice unto the Lord! Nobody cares if you’re Andrea Bocelli or Sarah Brightman or not, and even the priests are up there singing along half the time. What gives?

We have one guy in our church who sings so loud he drowns out even the organ! Actually he has a really awesome sounding voice so I never get to hear who else is singing.

 

[Irishgal49]

Wow! Thanks for the links. Uh-oh, now it’ll take even longer to stop hearing Cat Stevens.

I hate that song so much!

 

[RobbyS]

I think it comes down to sloth. I believe that more and more Catholics view the Mass as a required process they have to endure every Sunday morning and not the Holy Sacrifice of Jesus Christ to His Father.

They want to get it done as quickly as possible with as little effort as necessary. Ever hear any encouragement from a priest for the faithful to sing? I can’t remember ever hearing that. Singing time is also a prime opportunity to day-dream about breakfast or how to play the first hole at the country club in 46 minutes plus drive time.

In my church, the music director seeks different songs every Sunday. Fewer songs would be better, fewer and singable songs. Most people even with decent voices can’t read music; our choir is small and just provide enough volume to lead, and a litgtle repetition from Sunday to Sunday would help them learn songs.

 

[TrueLight]

We have one guy in our church who sings so loud he drowns out even the organ! Actually he has a really awesome sounding voice so I never get to hear who else is singing.

There is a woman in my church who does that too. I hate to judge but I get the distinct impression she is a show-off.

Yeah, I know. Darned if you do, darned if you don’t.

 

[PiousTemplar]

I don’t sing because
a) the song is too high or low so I have to be uncomfortably out of my register
b) the song is unfamiliar and no aide has been provided, or the hymn number has not even been announced
c) the song is heretical in lyric so I refuse to mouth the words
d) the choir and musicians are so out of sync I can’t follow either one
e) I am in the throes of something like asthma or sinus infection and can’t sing w/o coughing

YOU ALMOST MADE ME CRY IN LAUGHTER!!! LOVE THAT POST!

 

[Cat]

There is a woman in my church who does that too. I hate to judge but I get the distinct impression she is a show-off.

Yeah, I know. Darned if you do, darned if you don’t.

Please try not to think that good musicians are show-offs.

Sometimes it is a curse to have talent because your own people condemn you.

Please don’t. Assume the best of people, and enjoy the gift that the Lord has given her.

 

[Cat]

I don’t want to rain on your parade but just a historical point of interest here: (perhaps this explains some of the hesitation to sing?)

Pope Pius X (Moto Propio on the Restoration of Church Music, November 22, 1903): “The language of the Roman Church is Latin. It is therefore forbidden to sing anything whatever in the vernacular in solemn liturgical functions—much more to sing in the vernacular the variable or common parts of the Mass and Office.”

Pope Pius XI (Officiorum Omnium, 1922): “The Church - precisely because it embraces all nations and is destined to endure until the end of time - of its very nature requires a language which is universal, immutable, and non-vernacular.”

BTW, Pius X was the same Pope who urged more participation and encouraged more frequent communion.

I’m not sure I understand what you are telling us.

Are you saying that all the Masses in the U.S. that use hymns in the vernacular are doing something wrong?

Thanks for clarifying.

 

[SMHW]

Looking around while our choir and band were leading the hymns yesterday at Mass, I was struck by how few people were singing! I like to sing, so it’s no problem for me, and I understand that some of the music can be tricky, but even where the customary hymns are given at the customary places, most people just stare straight ahead. Do they feel awkward? I mean, c’mon, lift a joyful voice unto the Lord! Nobody cares if you’re Andrea Bocelli or Sarah Brightman or not, and even the priests are up there singing along half the time. What gives?

It’s been my experience that the best way to inspire participation by an assembly of reluctant singers is to have a prominent male voice in the mid-tenor range leading the singing. It can be the priest or it can be a cantor.

Most women and men can sing along with a tenor. Soprano voices can scare the men (and many women) away from singing because they are so high. Alto and basso voices don’t usually have that ‘clear as a bell’ quality that inspires people to want to sing along.

I am not discounting the nature of the music itself. (That topic has been covered to death.) I’m referring to the case where the people just don’t seem interested in joining in.

Unfortunately it is not always so easy to find that clear tenor voice.

 

[Rahn]

Thanks for reminding me of that lovely song TrueLight! Cat Stevens is certainly a deeply spiritual human being, and I think we should consider him an honorary Catholic!

You do know that his name is Yusuf Islam and he’s a muslim now…

 

[benedictgal]

On Saturday evening, I accompanied my father to Mass at his parish. Given that I was going to return on Sunday morning to serve as cantor, I figured I took take a breather and just be at Mass and pray.

The young lady who sings at that Mass chose some not so good music, drawing mostly from the 1970. She is a good person, but, does not have any real liturigcal formation. Sadly, this this par for the course throughout our diocese. Like many others, she strums her guitar rather loudly and really forces the music. Very few people sang. Now, in the past, I have offered to help her, but, the only time she took me up on it was almost two years ago during Holy Week. My offer still stands. The only hymn that the faithful sang was “Immaculate Mary” as the recessional.

This morning, I chanted the Entrance Antiphon from the Simple English Propers. For the Gloria, I used the one from “A New Mass for a Congregation.” This Gloria is a straight-through version and easy to sing. Everyone, including the celebrant, sang. We also chanted the Responsorial Psalm, which I took from the Revised Grail Psalter. Since I still could not see very well, I did mess up, but, the faithful managed to help me.

For the offertory, I chose “Shepherd of Souls”. Again, the faithful sang. They also sang the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei from “A Community Mass” by the late Richard Proulx and they chanted the Memorial Acclamation. For Communion, I chanted the Antiphon and then invited the faithful to join me in “Gift of Finest Wheat”. Again, they sang. They even carried the hymn while I received Communion. For the recessional, we sang “To Jesus Christ, Our Sovereign King.”

I might add that we did all of this without accompaniment.

 

[PiousTemplar]

On Saturday evening, I accompanied my father to Mass at his parish. Given that I was going to return on Sunday morning to serve as cantor, I figured I took take a breather and just be at Mass and pray.

The young lady who sings at that Mass chose some not so good music, drawing mostly from the 1970. She is a good person, but, does not have any real liturigcal formation. Sadly, this this par for the course throughout our diocese. Like many others, she strums her guitar rather loudly and really forces the music. Very few people sang. Now, in the past, I have offered to help her, but, the only time she took me up on it was almost two years ago during Holy Week. My offer still stands. The only hymn that the faithful sang was “Immaculate Mary” as the recessional.

This morning, I chanted the Entrance Antiphon from the Simple English Propers. For the Gloria, I used the one from “A New Mass for a Congregation.” This Gloria is a straight-through version and easy to sing. Everyone, including the celebrant, sang. We also chanted the Responsorial Psalm, which I took from the Revised Grail Psalter. Since I still could not see very well, I did mess up, but, the faithful managed to help me.

For the offertory, I chose “Shepherd of Souls”. Again, the faithful sang. They also sang the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei from “A Community Mass” by the late Richard Proulx and they chanted the Memorial Acclamation. For Communion, I chanted the Antiphon and then invited the faithful to join me in “Gift of Finest Wheat”. Again, they sang. They even carried the hymn while I received Communion. For the recessional, we sang “To Jesus Christ, Our Sovereign King.”

I might add that we did all of this without accompaniment.

Wow well done!

 

[Faithdancer]

I hate that song so much!

Really??!! The only songs I generally hate are the ones that are played to death, and weren’t that good in the first place. Like “I Shot the Sheriff!” That song fills me with great dread, as if it would be the elevator music played non-stop in Hell! I’d rather hear Minnie Ripperton over and over!

 

[Faithdancer]

Your town has that many 150-year olds?

When I first moved to our little mountain town, I was told there are 3 general types of people here: old musicians- that’s true enough, it’s the capital of dinosaur rock. The second type are older teachers- I think at least 1/4 of the population are teachers, myself included. And the third type are in the witness protection program!

 

[johnnykins]

I won’t debate those on this forum that contend that you can adequately attend Mass and not participate, I can’t speak to the theology behind that line of thought.

OK

However, from a more down-to-earth standpoint, if you were invited to the White House or the Lodge for dinner, and you spoke only when spoken to and in a formulaic way, ate dinner and then rushed out at the end, you would be thought of as rude. If you wouldn’t do that to the President of the United States, or the Prime Minister of Australia, why is it ok to do that to the King of Kings and Lord of Lords?

You have the wrong comparison. If you started relating to God as you would to the President or PM they would take you away in a straight jacket. “When man speaks to God we call it ‘prayer.’ When God speaks to ma we call it schizophrenia.” The relationship just “ain’t” the same. BTW let’s say we were to accept your comparison, would it be rude to sing badly for the PM? How about out of tune? What of insulting (heretical) lyrics. What if the people putting on the event wanted to insult the PM? What if they threw out all protocol to suit their own ideas? What if they really were supporting the “other party?” What if they deliberately designed things to offend the PM and his supporters? Nah… you got to get the right comparison. Too bad your disputatious comment is non-debatable.

If we move forward on the premise that singing is a good thing at Mass, I’m wondering what the solution is to this. How do we get the parish priests more interested in the music at Mass? How can we get more uplifting, easier to sing songs included?

It’s all over this board - you are just refusing to go there: Chant. Familiar orthodox songs. Singable music. Give the lyrics and 4 part music. Eliminate the dreck.

How are new songs incorporated (how can we make people comfortable, give them the opportunity to learn the words and the melody)? How can we reach out to those that love chant, and those that love CCM? It really comes down to making an effort, to it being important to you enough that you’re willing to join the parish council or the choir to make a difference.

When I see chant as often as a see CCM I’ll give some credence to those in charge really caring about music and not just throwing a bone to we of the great unwashed crowd - or worse, not pushing a pernicious agenda…

I’ve shared this thread with my brother-in-law, who is studying to be a Franciscan priest. He has a wonderful voice and handles the musical aspects of his parish in Sydney.

The most magnificent music ever written for worship was written for the Catholic Church - how often is it ever offered? Chant follows the form of the ancient Jewish Temple - why not just do it?

 

[Faithdancer]

I agree that there is some beautiful Latin choral music that has been written. I’ve choreographed to some of it, i.e. Mozart’s Requiem, which is in my opinion some of the most beautiful and sacred music ever written by anyone. I don’t know much about Gregorian chants, but would love to learn them and chant them in Mass. I don’t agree, however, that the more pop/rock music has any sinister intent behind its use. I think the intent can only be to make Mass more appealing to those who would be alienated by the use of Latin, just because they don’t understand it. Perhaps if the Latin music is re-introduced gradually, as part of a mix of music that also includes the more contemporary hymns, people might learn to be comfortable with it.

 

[RosalieM]

I hate that song so much!

 

[Phemie]

Really??!! The only songs I generally hate are the ones that are played to death, and weren’t that good in the first place. Like “I Shot the Sheriff!” That song fills me with great dread, as if it would be the elevator music played non-stop in Hell! I’d rather hear Minnie Ripperton over and over!

Luv-ing you . . . La la la la la. …

 

[Faithdancer]

Luv-ing you . . . La la la la la. …

Did she even record any other song!? Well, at least it is…sort of…angelic.

 

[wacvet7577]

I think it comes down to sloth. I believe that more and more Catholics view the Mass as a required process they have to endure every Sunday morning and not the Holy Sacrifice of Jesus Christ to His Father.

They want to get it done as quickly as possible with as little effort as necessary. Ever hear any encouragement from a priest for the faithful to sing? I can’t remember ever hearing that. Singing time is also a prime opportunity to day-dream about breakfast or how to play the first hole at the country club in 46 minutes plus drive time.

You’re right about people just going through the process of Mass. You can see this because people won’t say the prayers, won’t sing and they are definitely daydreaming during the sermon! Sometimes they distract me!

 

[Phemie]

It’s all over this board - you are just refusing to go there: Chant. Familiar orthodox songs. Singable music. Give the lyrics and 4 part music.

Giving the lyrics works. Four part music? That only works in parishes where the assembly reads music and I know that in mine few members of the choir do, forget about the assembly. There is an entire population out there for whom a page of musical notation might as well be Cyrillic text. We’ve never taken a music lesson in our lives: it was not taught in school and our parents either did not have the money to give us private lessons or we were simply not interested enough to ask for some.