Non-Catholics: Why are you here?

Status
Not open for further replies.
QUOTE]

QUOTE=Frank J;8176230]QUOTE=mathematoons;8114582]I’ve noticed that there are a lot of non-Catholics here, and many of them seem to just want to argue with Church teachings. I can’t help but think they’re here to convert us.
However, I know that not all the non-Catholics are like that–I just can’t figure out why else they spend their time on a Catholic message board. So I thought I’d ask.
What brings you, as a non-Catholic, to Catholic Answers Forums?

I not one for chatting in this chatroom that much so I felt it was a good reason to at least send this one.

I only here to see what you Latins think of Orthodox Christians and to keep up with what you RC are doing or saying to one another. What I’ve seen so far is that RC have hangups when it comes to Orthodox Christians. RC are no angles when it comes to being nice to Orthodox Christians. I’ve seen it in my own life over the year, so please don’t try to tell me other wise.
If you were to ask me how I view Roman Catholic Religion; I look upon them just like Roman Protestant no more or no less like their counter parts the Protestant Religion. You guys are just the others side of the same coin. Hey Pope Paul VI said it best when he was asked about the New Mass and I quote the changes in the Mass was too “ Make it more acceptable to Protestant” I could say it better…

Oh! The Quote in the start of the question (I can’t help but think they’re here to convert us) You don’t any help from us. You guys are doing just great in driving out Catholic who just get sick of what they see in their Church and join and convert to Orthodoxy. About half or the Parish I’m a part of, use to be RC at one time. Keep up the good work……

My friend. Your tone is harsh. Western European White people thought up Protestanism. Jesus, an asian Jew, is the source of Christian thought in the East. Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism trace their roots to the East. To suggest RC as Protestant is derogatory in the sense that 7 sacraments are shared. So because of one little word there was a split and it comes to this. In the scheme of things in Orthodoxy there is the primacy of Constantinople and you agree with that. Constantinople concedes that Rome has primacy as far as the ancient Church is concerned which means that there is a history between us. Bring our dialogues towards unity. In the East you contend with Islam. In the West we contend with Protestant thought. Among us why do we bicker?
 
haha, i’m the farthest thing from being a catholic, I myself believe in the laws of physics and will only follow the laws of physics and nature, I think your ignorant, I see so many Catholics on atheists websites dissing atheists. The thread is called non catholic, are you illiterate?
 
haha, i’m the farthest thing from being a catholic, I myself believe in the laws of physics and will only follow the laws of physics and nature, I think your ignorant, I see so many Catholics on atheists websites dissing atheists. The thread is called non catholic, are you illiterate?
You are a young man with what appears to be an inquisitive mind. It is sad that Catholics are not doing well on the websites you visit. I would suggest that you consider that although what you believe to perceive as a representation as Catholic may not in fact be so. I would stop going to those websites.

Physics is phenomenol as it regards science. It is predictable and the predictability is comforting to the sciene oriented mind. I truly enjoy looking at the attempts that Physics sceintists have made to explain everything by one theory. I recall a venture into the string theory. It is amazing when you consider that everything is in motion. It is marvelous that even though we see and feel solids that they are composed of moving particles and through the laws of physics we have our reality. This is a wonder.

If I were you I would spend more time in the books and your girlfriend. I know she wants you to pray and if it amuses her and you don’t want to do it just make it something simple. You can always pray to know more and understand more about Physics because that is your passion. You stated you wanted 10 kids in some of your posts. I would hold off on that as it would delay your fulfilling your passion of the pursuit of Physics.

I would be careful calling people ignorant. I admit I am ignorant however I do not take kindly to someone calling me ignorant, if you know what I mean pardner. So I would stop posting here as it appears that your intellect is far superior to anyone here, and you are learning nothing of value, your time would be better spent learning the laws of nature and the laws of Physics. I have a doctorate however you know I still don’t know everything. I think you should be spending your time being productive with people that illuminate you and certainly not here. It appears that your brilliant mind is bored, why bother? If you don’t mind I will keep you in my prayers for your continued success in your pursuits.
 
I’m not bored, I just love religious theory. What is you PHD in? I’m currently in the process of getting a PHD in Computer Science. I have read many books on how religion and science can be positively correlated. I myself am not an atheist, I just love studying different religions, I will admit I was a bit harsh in my post, and I apologize for that, it just angers me when I see Catholics on atheists sites, dissing atheists, posting all these scriptures, then on here they complain when people argue with them? I respect Catholics as I respect every religion on Earth (religion that doesn’t harm people)

I myself have a giant theory that correlates religion and science together, and that is why I hang out on catholic websites, atheists websites, etc. I would find it quite closed minded to just listen to physics. If you want I can email you a document I wrote on my theory.

To me family comes before knowledge, I would rather have 10 children then know every single fact on the universe such as, (multi universe theory, quantum theory, anti universes) Family is the best gift the universe can give to me.

And thank you for keeping me in your prayers.
 
haha, i’m the farthest thing from being a catholic, I myself believe in the laws of physics and will only follow the laws of physics and nature, I think your ignorant, I see so many Catholics on atheists websites dissing atheists. The thread is called non catholic, are you illiterate?
I agree with CopticChristian. Not all Catholics can be judged by a few you know of. Do not come on to a Catholic forum and insult us because of your misconception.
 
I suspect that those who call themselves atheists here are not truly atheists. In other words, they are not completely sure, in their own minds, that God does not exist. I say this because a true atheist would have no motivation to try to convert theists to atheism. For an atheist to engage in proselytizing makes no sense to me. If professed atheists would exert themselves to convince others to believe as they do, it seems logical that they would do this because of their own doubt, and the need to feel more secure by recruiting converts to their position.

Christians and Moslems, however evangelize because they believe that God commands them to. Since a true atheist has no God, why would he or she feel compelled to proselytize, except out of doubt or a perverse desire to spend time in useless debate with theists?
 
I suspect that those who call themselves atheists here are not truly atheists. In other words, they are not completely sure, in their own minds, that God does not exist. I say this because a true atheist would have no motivation to try to convert theists to atheism. For an atheist to engage in proselytizing makes no sense to me. If professed atheists would exert themselves to convince others to believe as they do, it seems logical that they would do this because of their own doubt, and the need to feel more secure by recruiting converts to their position.

Christians and Moslems, however evangelize because they believe that God commands them to. Since a true atheist has no God, why would he or she feel compelled to proselytize, except out of doubt or a perverse desire to spend time in useless debate with theists?
I think atheists do proselytize, in a way. They tend to look down their noses at anyone that would believe in what they consider to be ‘myths’ because they see them as uneducated fools. The way they proselytize is by trying to convince believers that their ‘theories’ (theology) are unscientific, illogical and can never be proven. They think that educating them more will make them see the ‘error of their ways’. However, they fail to see the splinter in their own eye, because they can’t prove string theory, or dark matter, or any number of other scientific theories that are just as unprovable as the existence of God. I believe their logic is flawed.
 
haha, i’m the farthest thing from being a catholic, I myself believe in the laws of physics and will only follow the laws of physics and nature, I think your ignorant, I see so many Catholics on atheists websites dissing atheists. The thread is called non catholic, are you illiterate?
I count at least eight grammatical errors in your short post. Before you make accusations of illiteracy against others, you may want to make sure your own writing is error-free.
 
I think atheists do proselytize, in a way. They tend to look down their noses at anyone that would believe in what they consider to be ‘myths’ because they see them as uneducated fools. The way they proselytize is by trying to convince believers that their ‘theories’ (theology) are unscientific, illogical and can never be proven. They think that educating them more will make them see the ‘error of their ways’. However, they fail to see the splinter in their own eye, because they can’t prove string theory, or dark matter, or any number of other scientific theories that are just as unprovable as the existence of God. I believe their logic is flawed.
I totally agree, except that I think the object which is occluding their vision is a beam, not a splinter!
 
Because I am a Protestant attending a Catholic college and have learned an incredible amount in the two years since I transferred. I find many aspects of Catholicism quite appealing, but have some deep-seated questions that I cannot rightly ignore. I usually post a question when I need the perspective of a Catholic on an issue troubling me. And, I might add, I find it amusing to correct certain Catholics’ beliefs about their own faith. As a Theology major at Franciscan University, I find it intriguing (and sometimes awkward) to be in a position of knowing more about Catholicism that some Catholics! That being said, with the number of questions I still have I fear I still have much to learn. 🙂 I know a lot of facts and “proper” doctrine, but there is far more I do not know. I am hungry for knowledge, and more than that, hungry for the truth itself. Beyond anything else, I desire to follow my Lord Jesus Christ, whom we all serve, and am glad to follow where he leads. Therefore, it will be up to him whether I become Catholic. I do not resist it (sometimes I actually think I’m too emotionally biased towards it!), but I cannot allow myself to be dishonest about my misgivings. If my faith is to be solid, I must honestly answer the questions I have, and do justice to the faith I already profess in the Lord Jesus Christ. That, I trust, cannot be dishonorable :).

The peace of our Lord be with you all!🙂
Yours in an interesting story, and you relate it with eloquence. God bless you for your faith, and may the Holy Spirit continue to guide you on your journey!
 
Pacos Pete, the Catholic Catechism teaches that one must confess his or her sins before taking the Eucharist in Mass. Since the Eucharist is central to Mass, your acquaintance went to confession to purify her soul, so that her body would not reject the living body and blood of Jesus Christ.
A soldier I met at Ft Sill, Oklahoma, would party hardy all week. Then he would go to confession every Sunday. One of his Catholic associates was discussing this, he wondered how many times God would forgive him for the same offense.
This soldier’s Catholic associate is uninformed about the nature of God’s forgiveness. God will forgive the soldier an infinite number of times, provided that the soldier’s repentance is sincere, and that he follows the instructions of his confessor, such as praying the Rosary or making another act of true contrition. God expects us to sin repeatedly; he also expects us to try to do better but if we fail again, he is ready to forgive us again. This is the unbounded mercy and generosity of God, in action.
 
Conviction of the truth has been outstanding value of mine so relative to this thread,which continues the interesting dialogue, my motives are individual nonetheless nonthreatening.

The truth will set you free, if you will, paraphrasing a scripture, is subjective to how others respond or react to my pursuit of stated value – truth versus shifting about with humankind’s general varying notions about truth versus evil continues to make each day never boring.

Truth gives purpose and I will not be “pushed off” from my continued quest.
 
I totally agree, except that I think the object which is occluding their vision is a beam, not a splinter!
I was originally going to say “beam”, but I figured saying “splinter” sounded a bit more charitable. But, I believe you are correct in your assessment. 😃
 
I am new here on the forum and I am here to learn what I can about the Catholic faith. I have always felt drawn to the Catholic faith and so here I am.
 
I am new here on the forum and I am here to learn what I can about the Catholic faith. I have always felt drawn to the Catholic faith and so here I am.
I am happy to see people like you look at us in a good way, seeking faith, instead of non-Christians looking at us like we are idiots.

I hope you find what you are looking for.🙂
 
Pacos Pete, the Catholic Catechism teaches that one must confess his or her sins before taking the Eucharist in Mass. Since the Eucharist is central to Mass, your acquaintance went to confession to purify her soul, so that her body would not reject the living body and blood of Jesus Christ.

This soldier’s Catholic associate is uninformed about the nature of God’s forgiveness. God will forgive the soldier an infinite number of times, provided that the soldier’s repentance is sincere, and that he follows the instructions of his confessor, such as praying the Rosary or making another act of true contrition. God expects us to sin repeatedly; he also expects us to try to do better but if we fail again, he is ready to forgive us again. This is the unbounded mercy and generosity of God, in action.
This is what Martin Luther had to say to the Knight Assa von Kram on salvation for soldiers:

WHETHER SOLDIERS, TOO, CAN BE SAVED
To the worshipful and honorable Assa von Kram, knight, my gracious lord and friend, [from] Martin Luther.
Most honorable and dear sir and friend, grace and peace to you in Christ.
When you were in Wittenberg recently—at the time of the electors entry into the city1—we talked about men in military service. In the course of the conversation we discussed many matters involving questions of conscience. As a consequence, you and several others asked me to put my opinion into writing and publish it because many soldiers are offended by their occupation itself. Some soldiers have doubts. Others have so completely given themselves up for lost that they no longer even ask questions about God and throw both their souls and their consciences to the winds. I myself have heard some of them say that if they thought too much about these problems, they would never be able to go to war again. One would think that war was such an absorbing matter that they were unable to think about God and their souls. Actually, however, we ought to think most about God and our souls when we are in danger of death.
I agreed to your request and promised to provide this book in order—to the best of my ability—to give the best advice to these weak, timid, and doubting consciences, and so that those who do not care may be better instructed. For whoever fights with a good and well-instructed conscience can also fight well. This is especially true since a good conscience fills a man’s heart with courage and boldness. And if the heart is bold and courageous, the fist is more powerful, a man and even his horse are more energetic, everything turns out better, and every happening and deed contributes to the victory which God then gives. On the other hand, a timid and insecure conscience makes the heart fearful. It cannot possibly be otherwise: a bad conscience can only make men cowardly and fearful. This is what Moses says to his Jews, “If you are disobedient, God will make your heart fearful; You shall go out one way against your enemies and flee seven ways before them, and you will have no good fortune” [Deut. 28:20, 25]. Then both man and horse are lazy and clumsy; they lack vigor for the attack, and in the end they are defeated. There are indeed some rough and cynical people in service—they are called daredevils and roughnecks—for whom everything happens accidentally, whether they win or lose. The outcome of the battle is the same for them as for those who have good or bad consciences. They are simply part of the army. They are only the shells and not the true core of the army.
Accordingly, I now send you this opinion of mine, given according to the ability that God has granted me, so that you and others who would like to go to war in such a way that you will not lose God’s favor and eternal life may know how to prepare and instruct yourselves. God’s grace be with you. Amen.
In the first place, we must distinguish between an occupation and the man who holds it, between a work and the man who does it. An occupation or a work can be good and right in itself and yet be bad and wrong if the man who does the work is evil or wrong or does not do his work properly. The occupation of a judge is a valuable divine office. This is true both of the office of the trial judge who declares the verdict and the executioner who carries out the sentence.2 But when the office is assumed by one to whom it has not been committed or when one who holds it rightly uses it to gain riches or popularity, then it is no longer right or good. The married state is also precious and godly, but there are many rascals and scoundrels in it. It is the same way with the profession or work of the soldier; in itself it is right and godly, but we must see to it that the persons who are in this profession and who do the work are the right kind of persons, that is, godly and upright, as we shall hear.
In the second place, I want you to understand that here I am not speaking about the righteousness that makes men good in the sight of God. Only faith in Jesus Christ can do that; and it is granted and given us by the grace of God alone, without any works or merits of our own, as I have written and taught so often and so much in other places. Rather, I am speaking here about external righteousness which is to be sought in offices and works. In other words, to put it plainly, I am dealing here with such questions as these: whether the Christian faith, by which we are accounted righteous before God, is compatible with being a soldier, going to war, stabbing and killing, robbing and burning, as military law requires us to do to our enemies in wartime. Is this work sinful or unjust? Should it give us a bad conscience before God? Must a Christian only do good and love, and kill no one, nor do anyone any harm? I say that this office or work, even though it is godly and right, can nevertheless become evil and unjust if the person engaged in it is evil and unjust.
 
Pacos Pete, the Catholic Catechism teaches that one must confess his or her sins before taking the Eucharist in Mass. Since the Eucharist is central to Mass, your acquaintance went to confession to purify her soul, so that her body would not reject the living body and blood of Jesus Christ.

This soldier’s Catholic associate is uninformed about the nature of God’s forgiveness. God will forgive the soldier an infinite number of times, provided that the soldier’s repentance is sincere, and that he follows the instructions of his confessor, such as praying the Rosary or making another act of true contrition. God expects us to sin repeatedly; he also expects us to try to do better but if we fail again, he is ready to forgive us again. This is the unbounded mercy and generosity of God, in action.
Continued:
In the third place, it is not my intention to explain here at length how the occupation and work of a soldier is in itself right and godly because I have written quite enough about that in my book Temporal Authority: To What Extent It Should Be Obeyed.3 Indeed, I might boast here that not since the time of the apostles have the temporal sword and temporal government been so clearly described or so highly praised as by me. Even my enemies must admit this, but the reward, honor, and thanks that I have earned by it are to have my doctrine called seditious and condemned as resistance to rulers.4 God be praised for that! For the very fact that the sword has been instituted by God to punish the evil, protect the good, and preserve peace [Rom. 13:1–4; I Pet. 2:13–14] is powerful and sufficient proof that war and killing along with all the things that accompany wartime and martial law have been instituted by God. What else is war but the punishment of wrong and evil? Why does anyone go to war, except because he desires peace and obedience?
Now slaying and robbing do not seem to be works of love. A simple man therefore does not think it is a Christian thing to do. In truth, however, even this is a work of love. For example, a good doctor sometimes finds so serious and terrible a sickness that he must amputate or destroy a hand, foot, ear, eye, to save the body. Looking at it from the point of view of the organ that he amputates, he appears to be a cruel and merciless man; but looking at it from the point of view of the body, which the doctor wants to save, he is a fine and true man and does a good and Christian work, as far as the work itself is concerned. In the same way, when I think of a soldier fulfilling his office by punishing the wicked, killing the wicked, and creating so much misery, it seems an un-Christian work completely contrary to Christian love. But when I think of how it protects the good and keeps and preserves wife and child, house and farm, property, and honor and peace, then I see how precious and godly this work is; and I observe that it amputates a leg or a hand, so that the whole body may not perish. For if the sword were not on guard to preserve peace, everything in the world would be ruined because of lack of peace. Therefore, such a war is only a very brief lack of peace that prevents an everlasting and immeasurable lack of peace, a small misfortune that prevents a great misfortune.
What men write about war, saying that it is a great plague, is all true. But they should also consider how great the plague is that war prevents. If people were good and wanted to keep peace, war would be the greatest plague on earth. But what are you going to do about the fact that people will not keep the peace, but rob, steal, kill, outrage women and children, and take away property and honor? The small lack of peace called war or the sword must set a limit to this universal, worldwide lack of peace which would destroy everyone.
This is why God honors the sword so highly that he says that he himself has instituted it [Rom. 13:1] and does not want men to say or think that they have invented it or instituted it. For the hand that wields this sword and kills with it is not man’s hand, but God’s; and it is not man, but God, who hangs, tortures, beheads, kills, and fights. All these are God’s works and judgments.
To sum it up, we must, in thinking about a soldier’s office, not concentrate on the killing, burning, striking, hitting, seizing, etc. This is what children with their limited and restricted vision see when they regard a doctor as a sawbones who amputates, but do not see that he does this only to save the whole body. So, too, we must look at the office of the soldier, or the sword, with the eyes of an adult and see why this office slays and acts so cruelly. Then it will prove itself to be an office which, in itself, is godly and as needful and useful to the world as eating and drinking or any other work.
Luther, Martin: Pelikan, Jaroslav Jan (Hrsg.) ; Oswald, Hilton C. (Hrsg.) ; Lehmann, Helmut T. (Hrsg.): Luther’s Works, Vol. 46 : The Christian in Society III. Philadelphia : Fortress Press, 1999, c1967 (Luther’s Works 46), S. 46:93-97
 
I’m addressing this to the least of my brethren of all denominations, some of whom are ordained.

The language of predator/ PT Barnum is not of God. Fact; Pope John Paul revitalized Catholicism with a call to youth who saw a man with a tremendous capacity to love. When they arrive to Church and find themselves surrounded by pig headed rabble rousers & gossips trying to bully/ control others yet have no control of themselves, they’re only going to feel betrayed yet again by religion conscripted for nefarious purposes. The Church making a gang of itself isn’t appreciably different than bloods and crips. Kids can’t grow up until adults do and when the pews become a place to pick up bad habits and not a place to rid themselves of them, people, and kids, become averse to religion.

I’m Catholic. My feet aren’t budging. I’m here to report the troops are flabby and self indulgent loud mouthed Nelly Olsons (male and female alike). Clean up your porches. Lead by example. Don’t lean on lies to puff yourselves up at the expense of all others because you’ll only fall on your face. Every lesson you fail to teach your children will be a hard won lesson in the school of hard knocks. Keeping your head in the sand with kumbaya irrational demands on free society is going to get your kids killed. They need to be fully empowered to defend themselves psychologically and physically before they fly the nest. Every lie you indulge harms yourself, your family, your community, Catholicism, and becomes yet another obstruction for others seeking God. There does not exist a more powerful teaching tool than leading by example. There is no greater defense of your faith than grounding your feet in fully reasoned truth and living it out.

My purpose in this forum is not to convert anyone into any brand at all. In the book of revelations there exist 7 criticisms for the SEVEN churches (not ONE), but there is no mention whatsoever that Churches were competing with one another with smarmy tactics. Modern times it is the Churches resorting to secular marketing tactics making a disgrace of themselves and giving Christianity a bad name. The Churches were compelled to examine themselves and paying close attention to the fruit they were yielding. Modern times they trip over themselves pointing bony fingers away from themselves flinging pooh like monkeys. This is an abysmal example of adulthood that children will emulate making slaves of themselves to outward appearances but being morally bankrupt inside. It’s cultivating false esteem and corrupting values. Spending a century waging war on free society to carry your faith for you but neglecting the investment cultivating values in house is a doomed mission.

The ‘brands’ aren’t the point. GOD is supposed to be the point, and not one soul arguing serve God while you lie to yourselves pandering to the baser elements of a crowd. The nature of your arguments serves as a means to divorce yourselves from humanity believing yourselves righteous when you’re factually the exact opposite.

My purpose in this forum is to remind all of you that personal accountability is your primary job if you’re serious about worship. Without that personal discipline, whatever service to God you believe yourself to be doing becomes a lie you promulgate in service to vainglory/ vanity obscuring the truth of God. Across the board Catholics and Protestants alike. I’ve witnessed self identified Catholics being as hateful as the worst chick tract you’ve ever seen. There’s no excuse for misrepresenting the message of Jesus Christ so horribly in service to your egos. Not principles. Not truth. Men and women have been equally guilty.

The worst offenders are theologians earning their bread instigating strife to distract adept Christians from the work on themselves. Crespo Dollar is repugnant, but so too is father Pfleger. The hatred in the pews running roughshod over the solemn duty of clergy is just as repugnant, but leadership is in dire need of soul searching how their own edicts and justifications have created this situation. The methods of persuasion & careless words you resort to are grievously misleading God’s children.

That is the defense of my faith all too often abused from within, regularly whipping out the bony finger of denial rounding up scapegoats, setting up the righteous law man to disgrace his uniform beating up the wrong man for a crime the accusers committed. That is the defense of my faith on behalf of myself, my brothers in arms, and for folks like Conor. I defend the dignity of Amish and Quakers that false christians declaring themselves righteous would persecute. I defend all these kids drawn like magnets to a loving father in Pope John Paul that are at risk when men persist in the belief that might makes right= manhood.

Get your acts together, folks. These kids need you strong, and you absolutely DO owe them the same nurture that was gifted you by centuries long commitment of religion tempering civilization. Every one of us, not just Christians, but atheists as well, have an obligation to be responsible stewards. Adults need to master adulthood and aspire to be elders offering guidance to those who struggle with moral dilemmas. All of us. No exceptions. An entire congregation showing up to Church as needy baby birds unwilling to think demanding parish priests have all the answers is not practicing Christianity. It’s preying on goodwill & demanding an education through osmosis. Snap out of it. Eyes in the boat sailors.
 
This is what Martin Luther had to say to the Knight Assa von Kram on salvation for soldiers:

WHETHER SOLDIERS, TOO, CAN BE SAVED
To the worshipful and honorable Assa von Kram, knight, my gracious lord and friend, [from] Martin Luther.
Thank you for that. People angry at an unjust mission should never blame the troops. Blame the unjust leadership where it squarely belongs and know that as citizens who empowered said leadership we have a duty to guard the loyalty our troops have to their country from being abused.
 
I’m not sure if I can answer this without becoming overly emotional in my reply or making broad sweeping statements. So, forgive me, but I feel it’s best not to say anything. Plus, I have yet to sift completely through my own thoughts and feelings on the matter and am afraid I couldn’t express myself coherently.
As a former High Church Episcopalian, I will pray for you during your search.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top