Obama and Romney Hit Final Stretch Part 3

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Tampa_Dave said:
You think Democrats are enthused as they were in 2008? And what do you think of voting trends by independents towards Romney?

While I believe Romney may win the popular vote, I tend to believe Obama will likely prevail in the Electoral College because of my home state (Ohio). I may have to disavow my Buckeye roots if they award the election to Obama.
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As enthusiastic…no…that would be nearly impossible. But they are hardly glum. I think re: the independents that not one vote has been counted.

I’m leaning toward your scenario regarding the outcome.

John
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Oh, because our Church makes an authoritative decision it opens it up for the laity to call the sinners names, judge them from that point on, or any other malicious public activity? I never saw that in the hierarchy of the authoritative Church. We are allowed to discuss them personally as laity?

These things are being done for partisan advancement. I’m sorry, there is no righteousness in political parties. It can only be found through God, and He’s not political.
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People are pointing to the fact that one cannot call themselves a Catholic in good standing on one hand but are publicly supporting unrescricted access to abortion on the other hand.

The laity has a basis to question pro-choice politicians based on the statements of Bishops, Canonon Law and the Catechism.

Also, pointing out support for an intrinsic evil is not being partisan.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Should gloat over another person’s failings, and wish them outside the Church, especially for partisan reasons? Maybe we should at the very least stop confessions from being private? :rolleyes:

Produce the actual withholding the body of Christ from anyone.
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No one is gloating over these peoples failings.

We want these people to be back in full communion with the Church.

Quite simply, they have to go to confession and recant their positions on abortion.

Until then, a Catholic should not vote for them because there is a less evil canidate out there.
 
Tampa_Dave said:
I want the election to proceed. Apathy for Obama is obvious, evidenced by even a NY Times reporter: White House Correspondent Mark Lander took to Twitter yesterday and admitted the number of people attending President Obama’s campaign rallies is less than impressive, especially so close to Election Day. In other examples of Democratic voter apathy, both Cuyahoga County and Hamilton County (Ohio), key Democratic vote sources, are down 15% in early voting. Lets keep election day on schedule.
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I think there is enthusiasm in both camps, though not as much as in 2008 since that was a historic election. However, the enthusiasm is not the right kind: for Democrats, it is an anti-Romney vote; for Republicans, an anti-Obama vote. It is much less a pro-Obama or pro-Romney decision.
 
meltzerboy said:
I think there is enthusiasm in both camps, though not as much as in 2008 since that was a historic election. However, the enthusiasm is not the right kind: for Democrats, it is an anti-Romney vote; for Republicans, an anti-Obama vote. It is much less a pro-Obama or pro-Romney decision.
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Mine is a Paul Ryan vote. It was a good decision on Romney’s part. For me it defines what his presidency will be: conservative social policies, fiscal responsibility, and subsidiarity.
 
ComputerGeek25 said:
People are pointing to the fact that one cannot call themselves a Catholic in good standing on one hand but are publicly supporting unrescricted access to abortion on the other hand.

The laity has a basis to question pro-choice politicians based on the statements of Bishops, Canonon Law and the Catechism.

Also, pointing out support for an intrinsic evil is not being partisan.
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However, the Church has said, through various leaders including the Pope, that it is against Church teaching to vote for a candidate to precisely support an intrinsic evil. Other interpretations are being applied, but lack support from the whole authoritative Church.

The laity has a basis to question pro choice politicians, except those that have changed positions as their political aspirations have changed. That’s what is being espoused on these forums, without consideration that some question a credibility when it’s suspect to their discerning truth among ‘men’. That coercion is for partisan reasons, and against Church teaching that one should not be forced against their conscience.

You say support for an intrinsic evil, in an attempt to blanket the instruction for partisan reasons. I have given example of how the Church views ‘precise support of an intrinsic evil’.
 
ComputerGeek25 said:
No one is gloating over these peoples failings.

We want these people to be back in full communion with the Church.

Quite simply, they have to go to confession and recant their positions on abortion.

Until then, a Catholic should not vote for them because there is a less evil canidate out there.
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One cannot do evil so that good may come of it. It does not say, one can do a little evil so that good may come of it. So, I don’t buy into a ‘lesser of two evils argument.’ I am open to correction from an ‘infallible’ declaration that explicitly binds Catholics to ‘must’.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
One cannot do evil so that good may come of it. It does not say, one can do a little evil so that good may come of it. So, I don’t buy into a ‘lesser of two evils argument.’ I am open to correction from an ‘infallible’ declaration that explicitly binds Catholics to ‘must’.
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The Church allows one to vote for the lesser of two evils.
 
meltzerboy said:
I think there is enthusiasm in both camps, though not as much as in 2008 since that was a historic election. However, the enthusiasm is not the right kind: for Democrats, it is an anti-Romney vote; for Republicans, an anti-Obama vote. It is much less a pro-Obama or pro-Romney decision.
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You’re probably right.🙂 I would have voted for Mickey Mouse if he had the (R) behind his name on the ballot. My vote is just as much ant-Obama as it is pro-Romney.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
However, the Church has said, through various leaders including the Pope, that it is against Church teaching to vote for a candidate to precisely support an intrinsic evil. Other interpretations are being applied, but lack support from the whole authoritative Church.

The laity has a basis to question pro choice politicians, except those that have changed positions as their political aspirations have changed. That’s what is being espoused on these forums, without consideration that some question a credibility when it’s suspect to their discerning truth among ‘men’. That coercion is for partisan reasons, and against Church teaching that one should not be forced against their conscience.

You say support for an intrinsic evil, in an attempt to blanket the instruction for partisan reasons. I have given example of how the Church views ‘precise support of an intrinsic evil’.
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You are misquoting Church teaching and what the Church has taught.

The Bishops and the Popes have been clear on what constitutes an intrinsic evil.

It has been stated by the Bishops that the waging of war, the death penalty and economic issues are left to prudential judgement and take a back seat to abortion, euthenasia, same sex marriage, etc.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
One cannot do evil so that good may come of it. It does not say, one can do a little evil so that good may come of it. So, I don’t buy into a ‘lesser of two evils argument.’ I am open to correction from an ‘infallible’ declaration that explicitly binds Catholics to ‘must’.
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Plenty of Church teaching has been provided, but you have been looking at them through your distored non-partisan, non-Obama supporter supporter glasses. 😉
 
Tampa_Dave said:
That is correct. I spoke with an Opus Dei numerary on Wednesday who confirmed my belief. Romney will save more unborn children.
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Yes, you are correct.

Romney, while not perfect in many regards, will at least work to limit abortion. The Democrats have sold out to the abortion lobby.
 
ComputerGeek25 said:
You are misquoting Church teaching and what the Church has taught.

The Bishops and the Popes have been clear on what constitutes an intrinsic evil.

It has been stated by the Bishops that the waging of war, the death penalty and economic issues are left to prudential judgement and take a back seat to abortion, euthenasia, same sex marriage, etc.
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My bishop (emeritus) is Cardinal Burke. 👍

I have to listen to what he says.
 
Tampa_Dave said:
You are saying Obama could possibly be the “lesser of two evils”? With abortion record, the HHS mandate and his future agenda? Really?
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Unless Romeny is going to drag poor people into the streets and shoot them and then send the aethists to the concentration camps, the choice is clear.
 
ComputerGeek25 said:
Unless Romeny is going to drag poor people into the streets and shoot them and then send the aethists to the concentration camps, the choice is clear.
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I think the Obama camp is running an ad in Ohio with that very scenario…
 
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