Obama Excoriates Republican Obsession With The Term ‘Radical Islam’

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Darryl1958 said:
As it is, it is preposterous to actually believe than anyone who votes Democrat cares even a little about the evangelizing the belief that life begins at the womb. It is simply not credible, and as long as leftist Catholics vote Democrat, nobody really cares about whether or not they actually do believe in the Catholic teaching.
Nobody needs to even court their vote on the issue, because it is already in the bag regardless.
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It is a fact, whether you recognize it or not, that many Catholics who vote for Democratic candidates are, in fact, pro-life. Moreover, many if not most Democrats are moderates politically and fiscally, although the Republican party has moved so far to the right that they seem leftist by comparison. The problem with your analysis is the notion that it is impossible for a pro-life, moderate Democrat to vote for a Democratic candidate. Faced with the prospect of a candidate like Donald Trump, it is very, very possible.

Republicans really don’t care about the unborn except to the extent that saying that they do will win votes. It is possible for a thinking Catholic to conclude that the best way to reduce the number of abortions in this country is to vote for Democratic candidates, even if you think differently about the matter.
 
Michael_Mayo said:
You think Trump will stop it??? Why don’t we give women more choices besides abortion and struggling with pregnancy and motherhoodi? Free prenatal care, child care, food assistance , in short, Life Support so she is less likely to choose abortion in the first place, THAT IS PRO LIFE.
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Not Trump, but Republicans on the local, state level. Republican administrations are typically much more open, accepting of efforts to restrict abortion, on many levels, domestic, international etc. It is a shift in how US policy is applied from the very solid prochoice Democrat agenda, heavily funded by the Planned Parenthood lobby. The Republicans do get the better marks on abortion, no question.
 
adowcday said:
It is a fact, whether you recognize it or not, that many Catholics who vote for Democratic candidates are, in fact, pro-life. Moreover, many if not most Democrats are moderates politically and fiscally, although the Republican party has moved so far to the right that they seem leftist by comparison. The problem with your analysis is the notion that it is impossible for a pro-life, moderate Democrat to vote for a Democratic candidate. Faced with the prospect of a candidate like Donald Trump, it is very, very possible.

Republicans really don’t care about the unborn except to the extent that saying that they do will win votes. It is possible for a thinking Catholic to conclude that the best way to reduce the number of abortions in this country is to vote for Democratic candidates, even if you think differently about the matter.
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Whether or not it is a fact, it is irrelvant as far as facts go.

In the end, the political stance of pro-life Catholics, and pro-choice feminists is indistinguishable.

Donald Trump is just the latest excuse for remaining indistinguishable from the pro-choice crowd. He is no better and no worse than Democrats in his identity politics, which is what makes so many Republicans turn their noses too. He is not too far right. He is too far Democatic.

Pro-life Catholics revealed themselves well enough here with their anger against other Catholics for revealing Obama’s stance on Born Alive.
Obama himself has always been given a free pass by these ‘pro-life’ Catholic Democrats.

It is meaningless to be pro-choice and to not even blanche over an issue like that.

It is simply empty rhetoric to say that Republicans do not care about the unborn. That is nonsense, a slander, and a lie. The welfare state has not been dismantled by Republicans a whit, if that is truly the measure that leftist insist on using as a measure of caring.
The poor are poorer, and the rich richer under 8 years of Obama.

Where’s the so called caring in that?
 
FollowChrist34 said:
Not Trump, but Republicans on the local, state level. Republican administrations are typically much more open, accepting of efforts to restrict abortion, on many levels, domestic, international etc. It is a shift in how US policy is applied from the very solid prochoice Democrat agenda, heavily funded by the Planned Parenthood lobby. The Republicans do get the better marks on abortion, no question.
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There was legislation brought out on the state level by Republicans soon after Obama’s election. It was very mild, but only involved women deciding on abortion being offered the ultrasound of the baby within their womb.

Even this was something that ‘pro-choice’ Catholics on forums such as these railed against.

Pro-life Democrat is an oxymoron.
 
Darryl1958 said:
There was legislation brought out on the state level by Republicans soon after Obama’s election. It was very mild, but only involved women deciding on abortion being offered the ultrasound of the baby within their womb.

Even this was something that ‘pro-choice’ Catholics on forums such as these railed against.

Pro-life Democrat is an oxymoron.
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Exactly - the Democrats will fight things like mandatory ultrasound. Bingo.

The left is quite libertarian on social issues; the right on other stuff. Didn’t some Vatican representative once question whether a Catholic could be libertarian? I seem to remember a thread on that. I am in the NO school on that one. 🙂
 
FollowChrist34 said:
Exactly - the Democrats will fight things like mandatory ultrasound. Bingo.

The left is quite libertarian on social issues; the right on other stuff. Didn’t some Vatican representative once question whether a Catholic could be libertarian? I seem to remember a thread on that. I am in the NO school on that one. 🙂
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From what I recall of the legislation (and it was about seven years ago now, so I could be mistaken), the legislation did not even make the ultra sound mandatory. It only made offering to show the woman choosing the abortion the choice of seeing the ultrasound.

It would seem to me that if people were truly pro-choice, let alone Catholics, this is something that pro-choice Catholic Democrats would have been able to support.
That is just not happening. Catholic ‘pro-life’ Democrats are indistinguishable from pro-abortion Democrats.
 
Darryl1958 said:
From what I recall of the legislation (and it was about seven years ago now, so I could be mistaken), the legislation did not even make the ultra sound mandatory. It only made offering to show the woman choosing the abortion the choice of seeing the ultrasound.

It would seem to me that if people were truly pro-choice, let alone Catholics, this is something that pro-choice Catholic Democrats would have been able to support.
That is just not happening. Catholic ‘pro-life’ Democrats are indistinguishable from pro-abortion Democrats.
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Agree up to a point. I have seen both types - prolife Catholic Democrats and prochoice Catholic Democrats. This phenomenon fascinates me. I always try and figure out which I am dealing with when talking to a Catholic Democrat - usually doesn’t take very long.

And I need to amend my earlier point - the left is libertarian on abortion, authoritarian on where we pee or what we should believe constitutes marriage. (can you be an authoritarian libertarian - I’d say yes!)
 
FollowChrist34 said:
Agree up to a point. I have seen both types - prolife Catholic Democrats and prochoice Catholic Democrats. This phenomenon fascinates me. I always try and figure out which I am dealing with when talking to a Catholic Democrat - usually doesn’t take very long.

And I need to amend my earlier point - the left is libertarian on abortion, authoritarian on where we pee or what we should believe constitutes marriage. (can you be an authoritarian libertarian - I’d say yes!)
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The Dem party is also arch conservative, reactionary really, when it comes to aiding the truly poor. It’s more generous with middle and upper class welfare, particularly when it comes to redistribution within the middle class. But for the truly poor? Nothing at all.

Not that the Repubs are better. The last thing either party did for the truly poor was the EArned Income credit, and that was Reagan’s, lo, these many years past.
 
Ridgerunner said:
The Dem party is also arch conservative, reactionary really, when it comes to aiding the truly poor. It’s more generous with middle and upper class welfare, particularly when it comes to redistribution within the middle class. But for the truly poor? Nothing at all.

Not that the Repubs are better. The last thing either party did for the truly poor was the EArned Income credit, and that was Reagan’s, lo, these many years past.
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The Tea party movement in the Republican party did sweep a congressional election, but it never really took hold. The most that has ever been proposed is to decrease the rate of government spending.
In other words, when it comes to leftist policies of big government spending, it is the difference between tweedle-dum and tweedle-dee when it comes to electing either Dems or Reps.
The only thing that we conclude from that is that so-called pro-life Catholics vote Dem because they believe in what the Dems believe about abortion.

And for environmentalists, those beliefs include shutting down the population of the First World to the maximum extent possible.That has always been the goal of the environmentalist movement.
 
TheAtheist said:
Interestingly enough - Louis Farrakhan of the Nation of Islam completely agrees with your take on things.

youtube.com/watch?v=cu41CPQw0hg

… a Decade ago i though i finally understood Left/Right politics in America.

IN the last 2 years I realized - i think i know absolutely nothing at this point… 🤷
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well, his eyes are opened up to the Clintons. for once, I agree with him.
 
xNoOnex said:
When you focus on “radical Islam”, you often get the mob up in arms and they attack “regular Islam”. Mosques get vandalized, people get assaulted, and you feed groups like ISIS more propaganda. More people are convinced that America isn’t fighting terrorism, but Islam itself, and you get more terrorists. The cycle of violence continues.
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Well, it could be that someone feels psychologically pushed by that, but the fact is that groups like ISIS would come after us no matter what we do.

I think it’s more than fine to call it radical Islam if nothing else to distinguish between other Muslims who do disagree with this.
 
Inisfallen said:
Not that I owe you an explanation, but I registered as a Democrat many years ago because, for all practical purposes, the Democratic primary in New York City was the general election.

I’m not “meh” about abortion. Don’t make uneducated guesses. But I think Donald Trump’s pro-life credentials are (to say the very least) suspect.

I also find most of the Republican platform utterly inconsistent with everything I learned in 13 years of Catholic school, and growing up in a Catholic family.
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Trump’s credentials on what he, ultimately, would do about abortion may not be clear, but it’s either him or the current Democrat front-runner who will be president. Like it or not, that’s what it will come down to.

And if the country keeps on supporting socially liberal nonsense and nominating candidates such as these, I think we are in real danger of losing a culture war to radical Islam.
 
What the occasional and rare hatemonger does against regular Muslims is nothing like what ISIS and Islamists do against regular Muslims.
Professors are thrown out of windows, people like Hirsi Ali and Irshad Manji live under death threats, mosques are bombed on Friday services when filled with people, and regular Muslims are shot and burned alive for not being submissive enough.

Regular Muslims really do not need our protection from someone spraying graffiti on the neighborhood mosque. They do no get radicalized because people say bad things about Islamists, or don’t care much for Islam in general. Just as regular Christians do not get radicalized by atheists sneering at our religion, neither do regular Muslims get radicalized because people don’t like Islam.
Regular Muslims know well enough that the real danger to their health and to their persons does not come from regular Americans, even low-brow blow hards.

The real danger to them has always been from the Islamists. It is the Islamists who are the most powerful force in Islam today, and it is regular, liberal Muslims that are being wiped off the map by the Islamists.
 
SuperLuigi said:
Actually, it has mitigated the damage but hasn’t solved the underlying issue.

Making excuses to vote for pro-choice liberals doesn’t do it either.
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So let us consider other issues as well which do change with each administration.
 
The thing is, abortion is neither even an issue for most Catholics in general, nor a large portion of Catholic posters here.

Or, it is about important to these Catholics as the Jewish question was for the pro-Jewish Germans who voted the Nazis into power.
 
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