Occult Items-what should I do with them?

[Reuben_J]

Hi, Rachel. And then there is that aspect - your husband. You have to work it out with him, I mean, talk it out, if possible in a non-threatening manner. Pose the possibility of an even better alternative - life without the occult. I would not know how to do this but you would.

Hope I am not intruding into anything that’s not asked of, and if it is, please ignore the post.

God bless.

 

[Lapey]

I agree. It’s just stuff that has no power. And since it’s just stuff, if it’s bothering her, she should just junk it. No special ceremony or supersticious beliefs about it. Don’t burn it because you think the boogey spirits will come and get you if you simply break the stuff. That’s just more of the mumbo jumbo nonsense that is their beliefs. This stuff should be treated like any other stuff. If you don’t like it anymore, dump it. Simply that and nothing more.

Kalt, do you believe in demonic possession? You know not what you speak. There is no superstition in recognizing demonic spirits, they exist in the bible. Do you think they are extinct like the dinosaurs?

You need to do some research on the truths about spiritual warfare. You will be amazed at the real world living around you that you are oblivious to.

Please do the research.

 

[Lapey]

SACRAMENTAL

Objects or actions that the Church uses after the manner of sacraments, in order to achieve through the merits of the faithful certain effects, mainly of a spiritual nature. They differ from sacraments in not having been instituted by Christ to produce their effect in virtue of the ritual performed. Their efficacy depends not on the rite itself, as in the sacraments, but on the influence of prayerful petition; that of the person who uses them and of the Church in approving their practice. The variety of sacramentals spans the whole range of times and places, words and actions, objects and gestures that, on the Church’s authority, draw not only on the personal dispositions of the individuals but on the merits and prayers of the whole Mystical Body of Christ

---

Okay, ???

Point?

 

[Celtic_Catholic]

I forgot to mention St. Monica in my last post. If your husband is giving you a problem with your conversion, pray to St. Monica. She had a pagan husband and an immoral son and with her prayers and devotion, she converted them both to Christianity.

Don’t get me wrong. I believe everyone should choose their path. But I do know how absolutely horribly difficult it is to have any kind of relationship with a pagan who is constantly bashing Christianity. I have no pagan family members, but I’ve had pagan friends who broke the friendship with me because I’m Christian. And I’ve had close contact with pagans for 15 years on a professional level (I’m a writer) and every one of them bashed Christianity with no regard for my feelings.

I don’t know how your husband is with things but if he’s that way, you need St. Monica.

Christ’s Blessings!

 

[TexCatholic4JMJ]

I have had enough knowledge of friends and relatives who’ve experienced some very scary
happenings where the occult was involved. On "The Abundant Life, a guest with a
lot of experience talked about how even tatooes can have “spirits” attached.
I would definitely speak to a priest who is trained in these matters and follow his
advice. No way would I continue living with them or try doing anything by myself.

 

[kenofken]

Wrap the stuff very carefully in bubble wrap, seal it in a box, and send it to me UPS ground, and I’ll send you some cool Catholic gear I don’t really want (although I haven’t gone so far as to burn it…yet. Got a nice rosewood rosary, a sterling silver St. Theresa medal, and a commemorative souvenir from some 1920s ecclesiastical convention or something which was held in Chicago. Kind of like a prisoner exchange between Israel and the Palestinians. Everyone sheds a burden, nobody’s artifiacts get hurt!

 

[Rachel_1]

Wrap the stuff very carefully in bubble wrap, seal it in a box, and send it to me UPS ground, and I’ll send you some cool Catholic gear I don’t really want (although I haven’t gone so far as to burn it…yet. Got a nice rosewood rosary, a sterling silver St. Theresa medal, and a commemorative souvenir from some 1920s ecclesiastical convention or something which was held in Chicago. Kind of like a prisoner exchange between Israel and the Palestinians. Everyone sheds a burden, nobody’s artifiacts get hurt!

What did I saw in my first post? Sorry, I’m not going to send you my items.

 

[Celtic_Catholic]

What did I saw in my first post? Sorry, I’m not going to send you my items.

*I don’t think kenofken was serious. I think the post was basically saying that he (or she) turned from Catholicism to paganism and to him (or her) the Rosary, Saint statues and whatever else he (or she) has the same meaning to him (or her) as the occult things have to you.

 

[Rachel_1]

Ok, here’s the update.
I spoke with my Priest about it, and I don’t think he got the significance of what I was asking so much. He jokingly said to put it on ebay, then clarified he was joking. Then he just said I could burn it or whatever.
To be fair, I didn’t go into detail as much as I have here though, so maybe that’s why he didn’t seem too concerned. He was there for other paperwork though, and I kind of felt like I didn’t want to take up too much of his time.
I don’t know how to go about asking a ‘second opinion’ from a Priest that knows about this stuff though or even if I should?
Maybe I’ll just figure it out on my own ~shrug~

To answer some other questions, my husband doesn’t seem to practice witchcraft without me (that I’ve seen), When I came home from the hospital and told him I’m not doing it anymore and explained why, he tried a few times to get me to go do a ritual with him and when I refused he just finally dropped it. I haven’t seen him do anything since. He won’t let go of the items that he has though (or mine when I suggested that we get rid of them after coming home from the hospital).
In talking over the last couple months about my conversion, he told me that he still feels “earthy” but is kind of agnostic now. I should mention too that he was baptized in a baptist church when he was like 11 or 12, and he’s had some pretty supernatural experiences himself with God, but he’s choosing to just ‘follow his own path’.
At first when I started going to Church he was super upset, nearly left me over it. Now he’s just like ‘whatever’, and normally he’s accepting, but every time I tell him I need the car to go to Mass he gets upset at me.
He’s agreed to go in with me to have our marriage Blessed by my Priest so I’m not in sin, but he’s trying to give me a hard time about certain aspects of it. For instance tonight when I came in and told him the appointment for us to meet with the Priest and fill out paperwork and stuff, he told me he’s wearing the outfit we got married in into the Church and that his witness will be his satanist friend. He also wants me to wear the same dress we got married in.
The clothes wouldn’t normally be a big deal, but they were made for a wiccan handfasting and they are black/red. I kind of just wanted to wear like normal clothes, and not have a full on wedding again, we can’t really afford that.
I explained to him what it means to be married, how it’s a Sacrament and how if we have any kids, they have to be raised Catholic, he says he’s cool with that. He also said “you do your thing, and I’ll do mine, and we should be happy”.
Now, on the good side of things, he does ask me stuff about what I believe sometimes, so I think God is working on him. I will pray as long as I need to for him. He seems to think that some of the Saints are cool, and sometimes will study them with me too, and he helped me choose the Saint I’ll be using for Confirmation too… so there IS hope

 

[Rachel_1]

*I don’t think kenofken was serious. I think the post was basically saying that he (or she) turned from Catholicism to paganism and to him (or her) the Rosary, Saint statues and whatever else he (or she) has the same meaning to him (or her) as the occult things have to you.

Gotcha. You’d be surprised how many have asked me for the stuff, so I just wasn’t sure.

 

[puzzleannie]

Ok, here’s the update.
I spoke with my Priest about it, and I don’t think he got the significance of what I was asking so much. He jokingly said to put it on ebay, then clarified he was joking. Then he just said I could burn it or whatever.
To be fair, I didn’t go into detail as much as I have here though, so maybe that’s why he didn’t seem too concerned. He was there for other paperwork though, and I kind of felt like I didn’t want to take up too much of his time.

you have to go into detail with the priest who is preparing you, on this issue which is according to your testimony creating multiple problems on many fronts. That is his job. He can’t help you if he does not have all the facts, and if you do not take time to express the depth of your previous involvement, the situation you will be living in with your husband after Easter, and the feelings arising from this issue which are directly related to your conversion process. Please make an appointment with him and tell him it is to discuss a grave problem which is affecting your progress. Your issue is not “what do I do with this stuff” as in artifacts and man made objects, it is “what do I do with the stuff” as in the bad psychic and spiritual “stuff” which has been surrounding you for so long and which has actually been part of your marriage relationship.

 

[Celtic_Catholic]

Ok, here’s the update.
I spoke with my Priest about it, and I don’t think he got the significance of what I was asking so much. He jokingly said to put it on ebay, then clarified he was joking. Then he just said I could burn it or whatever.
To be fair, I didn’t go into detail as much as I have here though, so maybe that’s why he didn’t seem too concerned. He was there for other paperwork though, and I kind of felt like I didn’t want to take up too much of his time.
I don’t know how to go about asking a ‘second opinion’ from a Priest that knows about this stuff though or even if I should?
Maybe I’ll just figure it out on my own ~shrug~

To answer some other questions, my husband doesn’t seem to practice witchcraft without me (that I’ve seen), When I came home from the hospital and told him I’m not doing it anymore and explained why, he tried a few times to get me to go do a ritual with him and when I refused he just finally dropped it. I haven’t seen him do anything since. He won’t let go of the items that he has though (or mine when I suggested that we get rid of them after coming home from the hospital).
In talking over the last couple months about my conversion, he told me that he still feels “earthy” but is kind of agnostic now. I should mention too that he was baptized in a baptist church when he was like 11 or 12, and he’s had some pretty supernatural experiences himself with God, but he’s choosing to just ‘follow his own path’.
At first when I started going to Church he was super upset, nearly left me over it. Now he’s just like ‘whatever’, and normally he’s accepting, but every time I tell him I need the car to go to Mass he gets upset at me.
He’s agreed to go in with me to have our marriage Blessed by my Priest so I’m not in sin, but he’s trying to give me a hard time about certain aspects of it. For instance tonight when I came in and told him the appointment for us to meet with the Priest and fill out paperwork and stuff, he told me he’s wearing the outfit we got married in into the Church and that his witness will be his satanist friend. He also wants me to wear the same dress we got married in.
The clothes wouldn’t normally be a big deal, but they were made for a wiccan handfasting and they are black/red. I kind of just wanted to wear like normal clothes, and not have a full on wedding again, we can’t really afford that.
I explained to him what it means to be married, how it’s a Sacrament and how if we have any kids, they have to be raised Catholic, he says he’s cool with that. He also said “you do your thing, and I’ll do mine, and we should be happy”.
Now, on the good side of things, he does ask me stuff about what I believe sometimes, so I think God is working on him. I will pray as long as I need to for him. He seems to think that some of the Saints are cool, and sometimes will study them with me too, and he helped me choose the Saint I’ll be using for Confirmation too… so there IS hope

*Rachel, if he’s still feeling “earthy” but asking questions about Catholicism, maybe you should have him check out Celtic Catholicism. Since it’s a Celtic religion, it has nature oriented aspects. It’s Catholicism but a raw, very spiritual form of it. It may be a good first step.

 

[kenofken]

Don’t sweat it. I already have enough gear to open a museum. But you’re missing out on a phat rosary! The fact that you’re so upset about this stuff tells me you never really understood Wicca. These tools are just that, tools for focusing and raising energy. They have no inherent power and can only be “charged” with a very little. If there is evil energy in your items, it’s because you put it there, or perhaps were careless enough to let unknown people handle them. It is very easily discharged and cleansed.

It also reveals a deep misunderstanding and insecurity about your new faith. You sell your new god rather short, if you think his power and your soul are threatened by a collection of books and cards and rocks. Don’t sweat it, it’s a very common phenomenon, but you’ll get over it. You’ll have to, if you want to mature in your new faith. I have a friend like that. He didn’t convert from pagan to Catholic. He grew up Catholic, but got real serious about it in his 20s and decided that Dungeons and Dragons was evil (his wife got him started on that kick). Started throwing out his books, which we rescued from the recycling bin. After a few years of that lunacy, he snapped out of it, and guess what? He’s still Catholic, and I would venture to say a damn good one. (and a very good Dungeon Master, as well). Burning books can make you a good facist, but not a good Christian. To do that, you’ll have to suck it up and the tough work of living like Christ.

You’re also going to drive a deep and irreparable rift between you and your husband if you don’t repect his free will. If you want to sell him on the faith, do it by living the example and giving him his space. If he feels like your love is conditioned on him "getting right with Jesus, you’re going to lose him, in spirit if not body. Marriage is based on trust and respect and support, and you can’t have that if you constantly feel like you’re a “mark” for a sales pitch. For all that, I really do wish you well on your new path.

 

[Rachel_1]

Don’t sweat it. I already have enough gear to open a museum. But you’re missing out on a phat rosary! The fact that you’re so upset about this stuff tells me you never really understood Wicca. These tools are just that, tools for focusing and raising energy. They have no inherent power and can only be “charged” with a very little. If there is evil energy in your items, it’s because you put it there, or perhaps were careless enough to let unknown people handle them. It is very easily discharged and cleansed.

Think what you want. It’s not a contest of who knows more ya know
I’ll say this much, I understood Wicca and my tradition that I used to have very well, much more than you give me credit for.

It also reveals a deep misunderstanding and insecurity about your new faith. You sell your new god rather short, if you think his power and your soul are threatened by a collection of books and cards and rocks.

The books, cards etc, are just ‘stuff’, it’s what’s attached to the ‘stuff’ that has me concerned. Also, I don’t believe I’m selling God short by wanting to move forward instead of holding onto the past.

Don’t sweat it, it’s a very common phenomenon, but you’ll get over it. You’ll have to, if you want to mature in your new faith. I have a friend like that. He didn’t convert from pagan to Catholic. He grew up Catholic, but got real serious about it in his 20s and decided that Dungeons and Dragons was evil (his wife got him started on that kick). Started throwing out his books, which we rescued from the recycling bin. After a few years of that lunacy, he snapped out of it, and guess what? He’s still Catholic, and I would venture to say a damn good one. (and a very good Dungeon Master, as well). Burning books can make you a good facist, but not a good Christian. To do that, you’ll have to suck it up and the tough work of living like Christ.

I don’t think I’ll ‘get over it’, as you see below the Catechism is pretty clear on these types of things.

There are a great many kinds of sins. Scripture provides several lists of them. The Letter to the Galatians contrasts the works of the flesh with the fruit of the Spirit: “Now the works of the flesh are plain: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and the like. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things shall not inherit the Kingdom of God.” (CCC 1852)

God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility. (CCC 2115)

All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future. Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone. (CCC 2116)

All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others—even if this were for the sake of restoring their health—are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity. (CCC 2117)

You’re also going to drive a deep and irreparable rift between you and your husband if you don’t repect his free will. If you want to sell him on the faith, do it by living the example and giving him his space. If he feels like your love is conditioned on him "getting right with Jesus, you’re going to lose him, in spirit if not body. Marriage is based on trust and respect and support, and you can’t have that if you constantly feel like you’re a “mark” for a sales pitch. For all that, I really do wish you well on your new path.

I don’t see where you got the idea that my love is conditional on his conversion? Is it because I pray for him daily?
I don’t push my beliefs on him, we talk about it sometimes, and he seems to enjoy looking up stuff on the Saints.
The stuff I want to get out of the house is MY stuff, not his. I’m not touching his stuff at all. Is it because he won’t do rituals without me, and I refuse to do them that you’re saying that?
I just don’t get where you got this last part from at all?
Thanks for your well wishes though!

 

[MaryElizabeth22]

I would recommend getting your house Enthroned. One group that does this is the Alliance of the Two Hearts. Fr. Bing is the Spiritual Director for this group and he is an Exorcist. You can watch some of his talks on YouTube. Here’s the Web site for the Alliance of the Two Hearts in Georgia: allianceoftwoheartsgeorgia.com/

Another priest you may want to contact is Fr. Jose in Florida. stmarymacclenny.com/story.html He may be able to help you or direct you to someone who can help you.

Definately discuss this with a priest, especially an Exorcist. You will also have to discuss this with your husband. I would recommend speaking with an Exorcist first, so you can explain to your husband what you will do with these things and why.

 

[mfbukowski]

SACRAMENTAL
(Emphasis added)
Objects or actions that the Church uses after the manner of sacraments, in order to achieve through the merits of the faithful certain effects, mainly of a spiritual nature. They differ from sacraments in not having been instituted by Christ to produce their effect in virtue of the ritual performed. Their efficacy depends not on the rite itself, as in the sacraments, but on the influence of prayerful petition; that of the person who uses them and of the Church in approving their practice. The variety of sacramentals spans the whole range of times and places, words and actions, objects and gestures that, on the Church’s authority, draw not only on the personal dispositions of the individuals but on the merits and prayers of the whole Mystical Body of Christ

---

Would you please clarify the underlined portion?

I don’t have a clue what that means.

 

[kalt]

Kalt, do you believe in demonic possession? You know not what you speak. There is no superstition in recognizing demonic spirits, they exist in the bible. Do you think they are extinct like the dinosaurs?

You need to do some research on the truths about spiritual warfare. You will be amazed at the real world living around you that you are oblivious to.

Please do the research.

In her update, it’s clear that her priest and I are on the same page on this. It’s just stuff that she believed silly thing about. Her belief in “charged” things doesn’t make those things “charged”.

I knew someone who bought a sword at one of the “Faires” – you know, where men wear tights and women push their breasts up and out of their dresses. rotfl
Anyway, she bought this very expensive sword that was handmade by a man (crook) who convinced her that it was infused with the maker’s (his) spirit, because an artist (arteest) puts his all into his work. In working and shaping the metal, chemical changes occur, and this is when his spirit enters the sword.

There are crooks out there and there are victims. They (sword makers and occult salesmen) are nothing but PT Barnums, looking for the suckers.

“You know not what you speak.” Was that sentence structure supposed to scare me? Was it supposed to sound all biblical and official?

C’mon, people. This stuff is just stuff. I live very close to Salem, MA. I’m well aware of what these con-artists are all about. And I know how people are swept up in the nonsense. No matter how many people believe this nonsense, it’s still nonsense. I have no fear walking through Salem. I’ve been into their stores. They’re an odd bunch, no question. But they and their stuff have no power. The only “power” they have is the power of persuasion (that’s not spelled right, but danged if I can make it right). Once they convince the sucker that they have power, they can convince them that the stuff has power, and they can sell them stuff.

Now, go to the Shrine in DC if you want to be awed.

 

[cheese_sdc]

This stuff is just stuff.

Consider this. Is the chalice “just stuff”? Is holy water “just stuff”? Is a blessed rosary “just stuff”?

No. These things have been blessed and infused with Divine energy by a specific ritual and with specific intent. In the same way, the OP’s items have been infused with a specific energy by use of ritual and intent. I wouldn’t go so far as to say “evil” intent, not without examining the objects in question, but I also wouldn’t say categorically that the energy is “good” either.

In the same way that the Catholic Church tells you to dispose of blessed objects in a reverent manner, these objects need to be disposed of in a similar manner.

Now, go to the Shrine in DC if you want to be awed.

The Grand Canyon did that for me.

 

[Celtic_Catholic]

*Celtic Catholicism is very much like Roman Catholicism in all ways except the things you mentioned. (This is different than modern Celtic Christianity.) Celtic Catholicism isn’t under the Pope because they never were. When it came to be in the First Century, the Celts were isolated from Roman Catholic influence by geographic barriers so it HAD to develop on its own. As for them ordaining women, that’s what the Old Celtic Pagans did as well so that practice went right into their Christian practices.

If you read my post carefully, I said that this could be a first step for him if he’s wishing to turn to Christianity. Because it’s so spiritually Catholic but at the same time familiar to him in the sense of nature respect (and even ordaining women in which most Christian denominations do), this may eventually lead him to understanding the Catholic faith and to Roman Catholicism which is only a leap away.

See, I feel that all Christians are one in Christ, not just Catholics or just Lutherans or just Methodists or so on. If you’re Christian, you’re with Christ period.

 

[Lapey]

In her update, it’s clear that her priest and I are on the same page on this. It’s just stuff that she believed silly thing about. Her belief in “charged” things doesn’t make those things “charged”.

I knew someone who bought a sword at one of the “Faires” – you know, where men wear tights and women push their breasts up and out of their dresses. rotfl
Anyway, she bought this very expensive sword that was handmade by a man (crook) who convinced her that it was infused with the maker’s (his) spirit, because an artist (arteest) puts his all into his work. In working and shaping the metal, chemical changes occur, and this is when his spirit enters the sword.

There are crooks out there and there are victims. They (sword makers and occult salesmen) are nothing but PT Barnums, looking for the suckers.

“You know not what you speak.” Was that sentence structure supposed to scare me? Was it supposed to sound all biblical and official?

C’mon, people. This stuff is just stuff. I live very close to Salem, MA. I’m well aware of what these con-artists are all about. And I know how people are swept up in the nonsense. No matter how many people believe this nonsense, it’s still nonsense. I have no fear walking through Salem. I’ve been into their stores. They’re an odd bunch, no question. But they and their stuff have no power. The only “power” they have is the power of persuasion (that’s not spelled right, but danged if I can make it right). Once they convince the sucker that they have power, they can convince them that the stuff has power, and they can sell them stuff.

Now, go to the Shrine in DC if you want to be awed.

Ok, if you say so. Many believe as you do. No that statement was not meant to scare you, that is not my point. My point was and is simple, the occult is real and when one asks for intervention of the dark side you can possibly get more than you bargain for. These “things” as you put it are as benign and innocent as a honey bee, unless you are allergic. Then that honey bee can be deadly. Nothing more needs to be said really.

I’ll just ask a question, if your Church asks you not to partake in these superstitions and the “calling of deities” then why do it? Just get rid of these items and go on with life. They do not contain the boogie man, but they do bring risk into your spiritual life.

This is my opinion, even though I am not allergic to bee stings, I don’t play around with bees!!!

Sorry if I offended you as it was not my motive. The op has done what she needed to do and is making changes in her life that will bring herself and her family closer to God; isn’t that what is important?

Have a God day folks!
Gary.