OK to remove poster from public bulletin board you disagree with, or not?

[Liberalsaved]

You know, I was just thinking; are you allowed to remove other people’s posts on THIS board? Of course not (I’d imagine I’d msyteriously have a blank Subscribed Threads list if that were the case) and public message boards with actual paper should be no exception.

 

[mommyof4]

I think in a democracy, everyone needs to be committed to religious tolerance and freedom of expression, which neccessarily means that it has to include different points of view.

I agree.

 

[Sir_Knight]

But it is not being claimed nor suggested that one go into another’s church or meeting hall. I would NEVER even think of doing such a thing. That is an exaggeration.
However, tracts and magazines left to the public are free game. Likewise, if I leave “Pillar of Truth Pillar of Fire” tracts in a public place, they are subject to the interest or disposal of the people who come after me.
FYI, I was “involved” with the jws for 18 months, about 25 years ago. That experience twisted my brain so much that I renounced religion all together for years afterwards.
When I finally opened my heart a crack, The most good and gracious God led me directly into the arms of the One Holy Catholic Church.
If I can save just one person from my nightmare by tossing heresy to the trash, I will continue to keep on tossing.

It ultimately boils down to the same thing – you are restricting someone’s right to free speech and you are imposing YOUR will on others as to what they can and can not see. If you can impose YOUR will on others, than others SHOULD be allowed to impose THEIR will on YOU.

Right on Brother, preach it! I’m in total agreement. We have to be commited to free expression, even when we don’t agree, that’s the basis for a free country!

Exactly! I may disagree with what someone has to say but I’ll defend their right to say it.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Again, unless a person has been granted rights to a particular public space, what they say has no protection – legal or moral.

I’m not infringing on anybody’s civil rights if I remove a post from a board where there is no rule against it.

People may think that to do so shows that I’m rude and obnoxious, and maybe they would be right. That’s another story, though, is what they think of me and what sort of chain reaction I might cause. To the question of morality, though, it is a non-issue.

Freedom of speech doesn’t mean that one’s words are guaranteed to be shown to any certain number of people before they are removed. Again, that costs money and/or authority.

If I were to post on an unattended board, I have no “right” to expect anybody will actually read it. Freedom of speech doesn’t mean I will have a willing audience. If I wanted to make sure somebody saw my words then I had better stay there and watch them. If I “litter” my words all over town then I take what I get, and so does everyone else who does that – up to and including seeing my works used to line bird cages and/or boost the load of the recycling center.

Alan

 

[shirleytowers]

In the actual thread of controversy, the poster was in a public lobby where posters are NOT supposed to be put up, where there is a mail room for posters and announcements.

Me, I think civil freedoms are not as important as stopping Satan. I would also take down abortion clinic ads, get-yer- embryonic-stem-cell ads, murder for hire ads, and assisted suicide service posters. I know our religious freedoms are important and all, but I would do it anyway. Because you have to stand up to evil.

 

[TimOliv]

In the actual thread of controversy, the poster was in a public lobby where posters are NOT supposed to be put up, where there is a mail room for posters and announcements.

Me, I think civil freedoms are not as important as stopping Satan. I would also take down abortion clinic ads, get-yer- embryonic-stem-cell ads, murder for hire ads, and assisted suicide service posters. I know our religious freedoms are important and all, but I would do it anyway. Because you have to stand up to evil.

Onward, Christian Soldier

 

[Sailboat]

Ah, but this thread is about whether it’s okay to remove a poster from a public bulletin board that is prescribed for the purpose of people advertising what they want. You know, free kittens, rooms for rent, community events, classes at the senor center. Read the title of the thread and you’ll see what THIS thread is about.

For instance, we have on of these outside of our small post office. You also see them at coffee shops, feed stores, laundry mats, college campuses, etc.

How would you guys feel if you put up a poster for a Catholic speaker at your church, and someone ripped it down? Do you think that ripping it down is in the spirit of tolerance and free speech, which are Democratic principles that make our nation great?

 

[Sir_Knight]

Me, I think civil freedoms are not as important as stopping Satan. I would also take down abortion clinic ads, get-yer- embryonic-stem-cell ads, murder for hire ads, and assisted suicide service posters. I know our religious freedoms are important and all, but I would do it anyway. Because you have to stand up to evil.

And there are many who are of the mistaken belief that the Catholic Church is leading it’s members to hell. Would it then be alright for someone to interfer with the things that the Catholic Church does in the interest of “standing up to Satan”?

 

[Sailboat]

And there are many who are of the mistaken belief that the Catholic Church is leading it’s members to hell. Would it then be alright for someone to interfer with the things that the Catholic Church does in the interest of “standing up to Satan”?

Exactly. Jesus said to treat others as we would like to be treated. I think this boils down to obeying his instructions, not taking it upon ourselves to ‘save people’, which I think is an arrogent attitude.

 

[TimOliv]

And there are many who are of the mistaken belief that the Catholic Church is leading it’s members to hell. Would it then be alright for someone to interfer with the things that the Catholic Church does in the interest of “standing up to Satan”?

Well, a valid point, from a secular standpoint. We, as Catholics, don’t need to be concerned with what the Baptists would do. The question is, would we as Catholics be right in doing so. I say yes.

Everyone here seems to love this arguing other religions and “freedom of speech” thing. This is NOT a Civil Liberties discussion, this is a discussion about whether you would be wrong in removing a poster advertising a practice which the church teaches leads people away from God. It has nothing to do with “what would the Baptists, the Mormons or the Unitarians do”

 

[Saul.Tentmaker]

Everyone here seems to love this arguing other religions and “freedom of speech” thing. This is NOT a Civil Liberties discussion, this is a discussion about whether you would be wrong in removing a poster advertising a practice which the church teaches leads people away from God. It has nothing to do with “what would the Baptists, the Mormons or the Unitarians do”

A very good point. And from the standpoint that St. Paul teaches us to respect civil authority, I would not tear down the poster.

From Christ asking us to preach and teach, and the belief that we should encourage preaching the truth more effectively, I would not tear down the poster. I would put one of my own up.

God did not wish us to use power to remove freedom. He does not do this. Rather, He would wish us to use our powers for good: to proclaim His name, right next to that other, evil poster.

If a poster were for a hitman, in understanding that such posters are illegal and that I should respect civil authority, I would tear down such a poster.

And if I truly believed that posting anything contrary to the Catholic faith were wrong, I would seek to establish laws within my land.

Furthermore, I have trouble seeing why those who rip down abortion posters don’t firebomb abortion clinics while no one’s there, or why they don’t break condom dispensers. After all, if law is no issue at all in the face of divine justice, why shouldn’t we?

I don’t like where the argument takes us.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

How would you guys feel if you put up a poster for a Catholic speaker at your church, and someone ripped it down? Do you think that ripping it down is in the spirit of tolerance and free speech, which are Democratic principles that make our nation great?

I would feel disappointed but not surprised, and certainly not worth getting angry over. When I put literature around and leave it unattended I have no reasonable expectation that it will stay put.

At that point I am free to post another copy or not. Maybe it will stay this time; maybe it won’t. It isn’t like the entire plans of the Holy Spirit are thwarted if my Catholic information disappears from some two-bit board in who-knows-where USA.

If I want a piece of paper to do my evangelizing for me, then I can’t ask it to monitor itself to see that it gets treated with respect.

Alan

 

[Sir_Knight]

But Alan, wouldn’t you WANT others to be respectful of YOUR beliefs?

 

[Sir_Knight]

this is a discussion about whether you would be wrong in removing a poster advertising a practice which the church teaches leads people away from God. It has nothing to do with “what would the Baptists, the Mormons or the Unitarians do”

Yes, it does. Many Protestants feel that the Catholic church is “leading people away from God”. It’s the exact same thing.

And as was already pointed out, we are instructed to obey civil authority.

 

[TimOliv]

Yes, it does. Many Protestants feel that the Catholic church is “leading people away from God”. It’s the exact same thing.

And as was already pointed out, we are instructed to obey civil authority.

No it isn’t the exact same thing, because we are not Protestants. And as for obeying civil authority, I revert back to the law of God being above the law of man. And if you wish to know which law of God, try any commandment involving idolatry.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

But Alan, wouldn’t you WANT others to be respectful of YOUR beliefs?

Yes, and in fact I do respect beliefs even when they are in opposition to the Church. Different people have different ways of looking at reality, and actually I am interested in hearing them especially if they are critical of the Church. Often outsiders can point out something that “Catholics” do, and when I hear that I can evaluate whether there is something to it, and if so whether it is something I might respond to. As long as we have “enemies” I like to hear what they say just in case they offer any good chances to improve. After all, that’s what enemies are for – to make us stronger.

All this is a long way to say that I would not likely remove another person’s poster. It’s just that if I wanted to, I would not let the morality of it bother me. If I post my own information upon removing it, yes, my hope is that people will see and respect MY beliefs rather than the one I removed. That’s why it might pay to be discrete in who sees me make the move.

If it sounds like I’m talking around in moral circles, it’s because I am. It’s just like removing something whose effective date has past – as in there never was a date that information was effective.

Alan

 

[shirleytowers]

Okay, yeah, public bulletin board, I’d leave it. But I might post my church raffle ad right on top it, too.

 

[Sir_Knight]

No it isn’t the exact same thing, because we are not Protestants.

I never said that we were. I used them as an example and posed the question of how you would like it if they tried to impose their beliefs on us; the way that you are trying to impose your beliefs on others.

And as for obeying civil authority, I revert back to the law of God being above the law of man.

And as Saul.Tentmaker was kind enough to point out for us, the law of God tells us to obey civil authority so by disobeying civil authority, you are also disobeying the law of God.

And if you wish to know which law of God, try any commandment involving idolatry.

And Protestants ACCUSE Catholics of idolatry all the time – suppose they imposed their [mistaken] beliefs on you with the reason that they are merely making you obey [their understanding of] God’s laws?

 

[Fergal]

We must look to see where the board is situated.

On an ordinary walk way notice board or a board in a shopping mall, we have no right to interfere since it is a public area which is common to all faiths and none.

On a notice board inside the Catholic Church building, however, we have every right to remove any notice that is in conflict with Church teaching or one that has an alternative agenda . This board is common only to those who share a common belief and therefore we have a duty to protect and inform our brothers and sisters in the faith.

What do we do however when good Catholic reading material is removed by a priest and binned? Another days work I think

 

[Caesar]

Fine! I’m sorry I took down the poster! If it makes you feel better they put another one up.