S
sueipetros
Guest
St Felicity: Protestants and Catholics use the same words, but use them differently. Protestants look the word salvation and see it as something that happens during this mortal life to man if he believes–Catholics look at the word salvation and view it as the gift of Christ (freely given at Calvary) but culminating for the individual mortal man at a future event upon his death.
Sueipetros: We believe in the already…but not yet. It is an assurrance fulfilled but yet to come and is reflected again in the same chapter of Romans 8 and in 2 Cor. 4. It’s the same as God’s promise of a bodily resurrection. It was already given to Jesus, Lazarus and those raised during the cricifixion. (more places too but I must rest tonight). We are promised in our belief salvation and a ressurection, unless we purposefully turn apostate.
Romans 8:
23And even we Christians, although we have the Holy Spirit within us as a foretaste of future glory, also groan to be released from pain and suffering. We, too, wait anxiously for that day when God will give us our full rights as his children, including the new bodies he has promised us. 24Now that we are saved, we eagerly look forward to this freedom. For if you already have something, you don’t need to hope for it. 25But if we look forward to something
we don’t have yet, we must wait patiently and confidently.
2 Cor. 4:
13But we continue to preach because we have the same kind of faith the psalmist had when he said, “I believed in God, and so I speak.” 14We know that the same God who raised our Lord Jesus will also raise us with Jesus and present us to himself along with you. 15All of these things are for your benefit. And as God’s grace brings more and more people to Christ, there will be great thanksgiving, and God will receive more and more glory.
16That is why we never give up. Though our bodies are dying, our spirits arebeing renewed every day. 17For our present troubles are quite small and won’t last very long. Yet they produce for us an immeasurably great glory that will last forever! 18So we don’t look at the troubles we can see right now; rather, we look forward to what we have not yet seen. For the troubles we see will soon be over, but the joys to come will last forever.
**St Felicity: …**I must persist in accepting the gift moment by moment and persevere until the end.
Sueipetros: This is a way of saying you belive in faith and grace and shifting into reverse and working for what is freely given once at the moment of belief. Granted faith is a journey but once grace is given it needs to be accepted no more than once or it becomes your work and not grace.
Galations 5:
1So Christ has really set us free. Now make sure that you stay free, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law (Rules and Regulations, rituals…my emphasis in parens).
2Listen! I, Paul, tell you this: If you are counting on circumcision (symbolic rituals…my emphosis in parens) to make you right with God, then Christ cannot help you. 3I’ll say it again. If you are trying to find favor with God by being circumcised, you must obey all of the regulations in the whole law of Moses. 4For if you are trying to make yourselves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God’s grace. (In other words you’ll never attain salvation, you haven’t yet begun, you’re still attempting to work under the old system of rules and regulations. You’re still trying to pay for what was free and expunging God’s promise through simple faith.)
5But we who live by the Spirit eagerly wait to receive everything promised to us who are right with God through faith. 6For when we place our faith in Christ Jesus, it makes no difference to God whether we are circumcised or not circumcised. What is important is faith expressing itself in love. (The love spoken of is not the love through our works but the love expressed in Christ’s sacrifice.)
**St Felicity: **I understand you like this translation–I find it really difficult because I am not familiar with it–I can converse using the KJV.
Sueipetros: I will break out the old study bible and CD for the KJV. I like the underlying text. The textus receptus used for the KJV is not edited as is the Nestle/Aland, Wescott/Hort Critical text used in the newer translations. I search between the two and check the greek for cuts, but the modern tongue is easier for others to follow and give the word life.
I will respond to your stream of verses soon. I believe the hopes and the ends are contextually stilted, but that’s my opinion.
God bless you!!!
Sueipetros: We believe in the already…but not yet. It is an assurrance fulfilled but yet to come and is reflected again in the same chapter of Romans 8 and in 2 Cor. 4. It’s the same as God’s promise of a bodily resurrection. It was already given to Jesus, Lazarus and those raised during the cricifixion. (more places too but I must rest tonight). We are promised in our belief salvation and a ressurection, unless we purposefully turn apostate.
Romans 8:
23And even we Christians, although we have the Holy Spirit within us as a foretaste of future glory, also groan to be released from pain and suffering. We, too, wait anxiously for that day when God will give us our full rights as his children, including the new bodies he has promised us. 24Now that we are saved, we eagerly look forward to this freedom. For if you already have something, you don’t need to hope for it. 25But if we look forward to something
we don’t have yet, we must wait patiently and confidently.
2 Cor. 4:
13But we continue to preach because we have the same kind of faith the psalmist had when he said, “I believed in God, and so I speak.” 14We know that the same God who raised our Lord Jesus will also raise us with Jesus and present us to himself along with you. 15All of these things are for your benefit. And as God’s grace brings more and more people to Christ, there will be great thanksgiving, and God will receive more and more glory.
16That is why we never give up. Though our bodies are dying, our spirits arebeing renewed every day. 17For our present troubles are quite small and won’t last very long. Yet they produce for us an immeasurably great glory that will last forever! 18So we don’t look at the troubles we can see right now; rather, we look forward to what we have not yet seen. For the troubles we see will soon be over, but the joys to come will last forever.
**St Felicity: …**I must persist in accepting the gift moment by moment and persevere until the end.
Sueipetros: This is a way of saying you belive in faith and grace and shifting into reverse and working for what is freely given once at the moment of belief. Granted faith is a journey but once grace is given it needs to be accepted no more than once or it becomes your work and not grace.
Galations 5:
1So Christ has really set us free. Now make sure that you stay free, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law (Rules and Regulations, rituals…my emphasis in parens).
2Listen! I, Paul, tell you this: If you are counting on circumcision (symbolic rituals…my emphosis in parens) to make you right with God, then Christ cannot help you. 3I’ll say it again. If you are trying to find favor with God by being circumcised, you must obey all of the regulations in the whole law of Moses. 4For if you are trying to make yourselves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God’s grace. (In other words you’ll never attain salvation, you haven’t yet begun, you’re still attempting to work under the old system of rules and regulations. You’re still trying to pay for what was free and expunging God’s promise through simple faith.)
5But we who live by the Spirit eagerly wait to receive everything promised to us who are right with God through faith. 6For when we place our faith in Christ Jesus, it makes no difference to God whether we are circumcised or not circumcised. What is important is faith expressing itself in love. (The love spoken of is not the love through our works but the love expressed in Christ’s sacrifice.)
**St Felicity: **I understand you like this translation–I find it really difficult because I am not familiar with it–I can converse using the KJV.
Sueipetros: I will break out the old study bible and CD for the KJV. I like the underlying text. The textus receptus used for the KJV is not edited as is the Nestle/Aland, Wescott/Hort Critical text used in the newer translations. I search between the two and check the greek for cuts, but the modern tongue is easier for others to follow and give the word life.
I will respond to your stream of verses soon. I believe the hopes and the ends are contextually stilted, but that’s my opinion.
God bless you!!!
You did say…New Living Translation…oops.
**