Open Thread on Zimmerman Trial

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vz71 said:
It appears there are multiple maps floating around. I was mistaken as to where the truck was parked.
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OR not…



Seems that there are plenty of maps to back my initial contention of a single building between where the beating took place and the vehicle.
 
EmperorNapoleon said:
I believe Zimmerman confronted Martin with the intention to force him back to the mailboxes so he could present a burglary suspect to the police. I believe Zimmerman tried to abduct Martin and, when Martin fought back, Zimmerman shot him. Then fabricated a story about being jumped by a suspicious black kid.
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The evidence does not support this.
 
styrgwillidar said:
It makes it impossible to obtain the details of the actual incident. As EmperorNapolean has done, we can all construct scenarios that comply with our specific biases. We can portray our pre-conceptions on others as he has on Zimmerman. Or biases against carrying a gun.

But bottom line, we do not know who turned it physical. So we are left with our system of justice, which tends to err on the side of not incarcerating folks if there is reasonable doubt they are innocent.

The ruling, whichever way it goes, may comply with the legalities of the situation but it will never answer what actually transpired between the two. Because there is no evidence for that point in time.

I’ve been in too many volunteer groups where the guy in charge became so, not because he wanted to, but because a lot of folks who weren’t willing to do the job (even though they thought it worthwhile) talked them into it. Everybody is supportive of the PTA, booster club, church ministries, and think they are great ideas until you try and get them to be personally involved. And they are all to ready to blame and criticize the folks who are actually willing to put in the time and make the effort.

Zimmerman’s fundamental mistake in all this was caring about his neighbors enough to get involved. I’ll never do it, I’ve learned here that it will be perceived as being a wannabe cop, aggressive, racist, bloodthirsty etc etc.
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I understand your post but not your last sentence. Why do you say that? Would you behave like Zimmerman?
 
kelvinf said:
I understand your post but not your last sentence. Why do you say that? Would you behave like Zimmerman?
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I think we need calm people on Neighborhood watch; not overly vigilant people looking for “suspects” We have a neighborhood Watch and it’s never been a problem. No one is dead at this point from a watch person.

That said (Hopefully)this is an isolated incident; someone being shot while the neighborhood watch was “watching.”
 
rlg94086 said:
I find EmperorNapoleon’s judgment of guilt based on a scenario he fabricated himself absolutely hilarious, and an example of the emotional lengths people go to in these sorts of cases.

You can choose to find that humorous or not…I could care less.
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I think he meant apprehend.
 
kelvinf said:
So no lessons learned from Zimmerman?
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Plenty of lessons. One of which is that, if you decide to help in a neighborhood watch scenario and something goes wrong, people will consider you a “wannabe cop, aggressive, racist, bloodthirsty etc etc.” This is what you confirmed in your response to styrgwillidar by asking if he would behave like Zimmerman. To St Francis’ point made earlier, it is the desire…not just by Americans though…to have a good guy/bad guy scenario in any tragic situation.
 
kelvinf said:
I think he meant apprehend.
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Irrelevant. He fabricated that scenario and called it a “preponderance of evidence.” I believe that is the favored term people use when they make something completely up.
 
rlg94086 said:
Plenty of lessons. One of which is that, if you decide to help in a neighborhood watch scenario and something goes wrong, people will consider you a “wannabe cop, aggressive, racist, bloodthirsty etc etc.” This is what you confirmed in your response to styrgwillidar by asking if he would behave like Zimmerman. To St Francis’ point made earlier, it is the desire…not just by Americans though…to have a good guy/bad guy scenario in any tragic situation.
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So you haven’t learnt that as a neighbourhood watch you should never follow somebody? That you can’t be a neighbourhood watch and carry a gun at the same time? :hmmm:
 
estesbob said:
So why do you believe Zimmerman shot Martin?
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I have always asked myself why he didn’t fight back Trayvon if Trayvon was attacking him as he described. Since I don’t see any reason why a man like Zimmerman with two hands couldn’t fight Trayvon in an ordeal that might have lasted for more than 2 minutes, I tend to go with what the prosecution said: “because he wanted to”.
 
kelvinf said:
I have always asked myself why he didn’t fight back Trayvon if Trayvon was attacking him as he described. Since I don’t see any reason why a man like Zimmerman with two hands couldn’t fight Trayvon in an ordeal that might have lasted for more than 2 minutes, I tend to go with what the prosecution said: “because he wanted to”.
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So you think Zimmerman went out that night to kill a black man?
 
kelvinf said:
I have always asked myself why he didn’t fight back Trayvon if Trayvon was attacking him as he described. Since I don’t see any reason why a man like Zimmerman with two hands couldn’t fight Trayvon in an ordeal that might have lasted for more than 2 minutes, I tend to go with what the prosecution said: “because he wanted to”.
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You know Kelvin, that is what I thought why didn’t he, a much burlier, older and supposedly much more mature man simply struggle and fight back instead of bravely pulling out his gun and shooting him dead, I believe the watchman was some 40 or 50 pounds heavier than the boy.
Peace, Carlan
 
estesbob said:
A nice way of saying he was attacking Zimmerman.
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I believe he was merely defending himself from Zimmerman.
estesbob said:
How does the evidence that Martin was on top of Zimmerman support this?
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You mean the testimony of a man who thought it was a dog mauling? There is conflicting testimony about who was on top. I’ll go with the witness who could actually see it was a person. That places Zimmerman on top of Martin.
 
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