Palestinian corpse used for IDF "anatomy lesson'"

[JKirkLVNV]

Lance:

I don’t mean to be rude but if you don’t want to debate on facts then go in peace. Answer questions and stick to the facts and you will find that even if people disagree with you they will respect you. Man I miss Southernrich, he was a liberal but was polite and gave good reasons for his feelings.

In all fairness to liberals, I don’t think John TE is one. Anti-semites aren’t usually considered liberals.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

cestusdei:

John,
Do you see anything in these quotes you disagree with?

I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord’s work. [Adolph Hitler, Speech, Reichstag, 1936]

And the founder of Christianity made no secret indeed of his estimation of the Jewish people. When He found it necessary, He drove those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God. [Adolph Hitler, Mein Kampf, pp.174]

Hello cestusdei I would like to point out that it is obvious that he is absolutely refusing to answer your questions:nope: Which is very disturbing I am not surprised I from his reaction to my uncle and his family escaping from Poland the only survivors in their family aside from his uncle who resides in Isreal.I am praying for him,and I hope he can get over his hate.I do not think he will answer you,and if he does ,I am truly afraid of what he will say if he is honest.God Bless

 

[Norwich]

TheGarg:

The “entire history” of the region goes back a little farther than this century, liberal.

Maybe if your so worried about terrorists, you could help the IRA get the English Terrorists out of Ireland, now there’s a worthy cause.

America drove out the english insurgents, so we know it can be done.

Brilliant piece of evasive nonsense that totally bypasses both the question and subject of the string, almost worthy of an extreme right wing Republican. This string talking about the Palestinian terrorist of the modern period, i.e 20/21st century. So I will repeat my question:

Who were the terrorist in Israel (Palestine) immediately post second world war?

Simple enough, now lets see if anyone has the honesty to acknowledge the truth or hide behind political rhetoric and propoganda.

And let me make myself very very clear:

I condemn ALL acts of violence from ALL people, Palestinian, Israeli, British, Irish, American, whatever, there is no excuse for any form of violence either individual or state sponsered.

I hope that’s clear enough for you.

p.s. If you mention Ireland to me you obviously don’t read the other strings in this forum,or if you do your memory needs attention.

 

[TheGarg]

Norwich:

This string talking about the Palestinian terrorist of the modern period, i.e 20/21st century.

Well, norwich, once again your accusations represent the flaws in your arguements.

This thread is about the “Palestinian corpse used for IDF "anatomy lesson’”, so you wrong on your point about what this thread is about, actually were both kind of off subject.

I’M the one that mentioned something about not knowing their ENTIRE history. and I quote…

TheGarg:
“Whether or not Isreal takes land or not is a different issue…I would have to look at the entire history of the region. you can’t base who is taking what on the regions present day territories.”

By this, I was suggesting that I should consider the “entire” history of the region, since control of the territory dates back thousands of years.
Now, since the countries[Isreal/Palestine] just didn’t “appear” after ww2, the rest of you comments about my history comment are out of place.

Norwich:

And let me make myself very very clear:

I condemn ALL acts of violence from ALL people, Palestinian, Israeli, British, Irish, American, whatever, there is no excuse for any form of violence either individual or state sponsered.

I hope that’s clear enough for you.

Really? All Acts from All People?
Well, I don’t. Unfortunately, in the real world Norwich, there are bad people[ie Terrorists, those that support them, nazis, stalin, robbers, Micheal Moore…], and good people have to sometimes end atrocities with violence. Sometimes that is the only way to get through to people.

Was Jesus unjust or out of line,
“13When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14In the temple courts he found men selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. 15So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. 16To those who sold doves he said, “Get these out of here! How dare you turn my Father’s house into a market!” 17His disciples remembered that it is written: “Zeal for your house will consume me.”**(”#fen-NIV-26103b")] [John 2: 13-17 NASB]

NO…He came, He saw, and He Righteously kicked some evildoer A**!.

I guess its your general, all consuming statements that annoy me Norwich, but luckily, through some righteous violence, you and I have the right to post our own humble opinions freely.

Peace of the Lord be with you!

 

[Norwich]

TheGarg:

Well, norwich, once again your accusations represent the flaws in your arguements.

This thread is about the “Palestinian corpse used for IDF "anatomy lesson’”, so you wrong on your point about what this thread is about, actually were both kind of off subject.

I’M the one that mentioned something about not knowing their ENTIRE history. and I quote…

By this, I was suggesting that I should consider the “entire” history of the region, since control of the territory dates back thousands of years.
Now, since the countries[Isreal/Palestine] just didn’t “appear” after ww2, the rest of you comments about my history comment are out of place.

Really? All Acts from All People?
Well, I don’t. Unfortunately, in the real world Norwich, there are bad people[ie Terrorists, those that support them, nazis, stalin, robbers, Micheal Moore…], and good people have to sometimes end atrocities with violence. Sometimes that is the only way to get through to people.

Was Jesus unjust or out of line,
"13When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14In the temple courts he found men selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. 15So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. 16To those who sold doves he said, “Get these out of here! How dare you turn my Father’s house into a market!” 17His disciples remembered that it is written: “Zeal for your house will consume me.”**(“http:///#fen-NIV-26103b”)] [John 2: 13-17 NASB]

NO…He came, He saw, and He Righteously kicked some evildoer A**!.

I guess its your general, all consuming statements that annoy me Norwich, but luckily, through some righteous violence, you and I have the right to post our own humble opinions freely.

Peace of the Lord be with you!

OK as you like to wear blinkers lets look at the history.

1. The time of Christ. The Jews in Palestine (as it was called that then, not Israel) many of them were classed as terrorists, No?, ask the Romans.
2. The time of the occupation of Palestine (By the Brits before you say anything) 1945 onwards. Many of the Jews were terrorists attacking and killing soldiers and civilians.
3. Now. Probably not terrorists but some of the actions taken in the name of the state may be viewed by some as state sponsered terrorism. (debatable and open to question).
4. Many of the acts caried out be Palestinians in Palestine are terrorism and should be condemned as such.
5. ALL catholics are obliged by Rome and Our Lord Jesus Christ to condemn ALL killing. I’ve yet to find the codacil in the 10 commandments “Thou shalt not kill (unless)” and Pleeeeease don’t come back with the hoary old excuse “the actual translation says Murder” its a cop out used by cafeteria catholics to justify killing.

 

[gilliam]

Norwich:

OK as you like to wear blinkers lets look at the history.

1. The time of Christ. The Jews in Palestine (as it was called that then, not Israel)

Your wrong here. The area was not called Palestine until 132 AD.
The term “Palestine” is believed to be derived from the Philistines, an Aegean people who, in the 12th Century B.C., settled along the Mediterranean coastal plain of what is now Israel and the Gaza Strip. In the second century A.D., the Romans crushed the revolt of Shimon Bar Kokhba (132 AD), during which Jerusalem and Judea were regained. Three years later, in conformity with Roman custom, Jerusalem was “plowed up with a yoke of oxen” and renamed Aelia Capitolina. Judea (the southern portion of what is now called the West Bank) was renamed Palaestina in an attempt to minimize Jewish identification with the land of Israel. The Arabic word “Filastin” is derived from this Latin name.

many of them were classed as terrorists, No?, ask the Romans.

Again, the problems happened after Christ, not at Christ’s time. I don’t think the Romans referred to them as terrorists though. Not sure where you are getting this.

1. ALL catholics are obliged by Rome and Our Lord Jesus Christ to condemn ALL killing. I’ve yet to find the codacil in the 10 commandments “Thou shalt not kill (unless)” and Pleeeeease don’t come back with the hoary old excuse “the actual translation says Murder” its a cop out used by cafeteria catholics to justify killing.

No it is not a cop out, it is the correct translation, part of Natural Law, and Catholic dogma. To say otherwise is to change Catholic teaching for political purposes. The dogma is that thou shalt not murder. Since the PA supports and encourages terrorist attacks (aka murder) we as Catholics cannot support the PA until they change their ways.

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

…we as Catholics cannot support the PA until they change their ways.

Drawing attention to crimes against the Palestinian people, which the US media does it’s best to suppress, does not equate “support for the PA,” as much as you try to establish that straw man argument.

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

…we as Catholics cannot support the PA until they change their ways.

Drawing attention to crimes against the Palestinian people, which the US media does it’s best to suppress, does not equate “support for the PA,” as much as you try to establish that straw man argument and use it to silence anyone who would dare bring attention to the many crimes against the Palestinian people.

Being a voice for victims who are not fairly represented is a very Catholic thing to do. I’m sure you’ll agree, unless, that is, that you don’t feel unborn babies should be represented by others who can speak for them.

I know for certain that using dishonest tactics like straw men in one’s argument is something that Catholics cannot do or support.

 

[gilliam]

John TE:

Drawing attention to crimes against the Palestinian people, which the US media does it’s best to suppress, does not equate “support for the PA,” as much as you try to establish that straw man argument and use it to silence anyone who would dare bring attention to the many crimes against the Palestinian people.

Being a voice for victims who are not fairly represented is a very Catholic thing to do. I’m sure you’ll agree, unless, that is, that you don’t feel unborn babies should be represented by others who can speak for them.

I know for certain that using dishonest tactics like straw men in one’s argument is something that Catholics cannot do or support.

Great, so you don’t support the PA?

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

Great, so you don’t support the PA?

It appears that building straw men is so much a part of your nature that you cannot control it, Gilliam.

Since when is one assumed to be guilty when no evidence of guilt exists? Nowhere have I written anything supportive of terrorism. You are merely attempting to create non-existant associations as a means of minimizing my position.

This is a very easy thing to do. The only “skill” needed is a lack of scruples. If I wanted to play the same game you play, I would simply answer all of you pro-war posts by saying that you support the killing of children.

It would be very easy, but it would also be very dishonest. As a Catholic, I value honesty.

 

[gilliam]

John TE:

It appears that building straw men is so much a part of your nature that you cannot control it, Gilliam.

Since when is one assumed to be guilty when no evidence of guilt exists? Nowhere have I written anything supportive of terrorism. You are merely attempting to create non-existant associations as a means of minimizing my position.

This is a very easy thing to do. The only “skill” needed is a lack of scruples. If I wanted to play the same game you play, I would simply answer all of you pro-war posts by saying that you support the killing of children.

It would be very easy, but it would also be very dishonest. As a Catholic, I value honesty.

I am simply asking a question. Do you support the PA?

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

I am simply asking a question. Do you support the PA?

Did you, Gilliam, stab that child to death who was found in the bathroom at her school near West Point?

One groundless personal inquisition deserves another.

 

[gilliam]

John TE:

One absurd question deserves another.

Did you, Gilliam, stab that child to death who was found in the bathroom at her school near West Point?

Why is it an aburd question. You seem to be supporting the PA. Do you support the PA?

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

You seem to be supporting the PA.

I haven’t written anything that relates to the PA at all.

This association only exists in your dishonest mind.

Somehow you equate the support of Palestinian human rights with support for terrorism. That’s your problem. I’ll leave you to work it out on your own.

 

[gilliam]

John TE:

I haven’t written anything that relates to the PA at all.

This association only exists in your dishonest mind.

Somehow you equate the support of Palestinian human rights with support for terrorism. That’s your problem. I’ll leave you to work it out on your own.

So you don’t support the PA?

 

[John_TE]

gilliam:

So you don’t support the PA?

Since you can’t figure this out, I’ll explain it to you in the clearest way I am able.

If I write something supportive of the PA, then that means I am supportive of the PA. In the absence of any posts from me that support the PA, your inquistion, which is really an attempt to create a false association, is groundless and dishonest.

Further, your attempts to associate support for Palestinian human rights with support for terrorism are detestable.

Using your logic, I could couple this with your mountain of pro-war posts and come to the assumption that you believe that all Arabs are terrorists and that they should be killed in large numbers. Is that what you believe?

 

[cestusdei]

John,
I would like to know what you believe about Jews.

 

[TheGarg]

gilliam:

Your wrong here. The area was not called Palestine until 132 AD.
The term “Palestine” is believed to be derived from the Philistines, an Aegean people who, in the 12th Century B.C., settled along the Mediterranean coastal plain of what is now Israel and the Gaza Strip. In the second century A.D., the Romans crushed the revolt of Shimon Bar Kokhba (132 AD), during which Jerusalem and Judea were regained. Three years later, in conformity with Roman custom, Jerusalem was “plowed up with a yoke of oxen” and renamed Aelia Capitolina. Judea (the southern portion of what is now called the West Bank) was renamed Palaestina in an attempt to minimize Jewish identification with the land of Israel. The Arabic word “Filastin” is derived from this Latin name.

Again, the problems happened after Christ, not at Christ’s time. I don’t think the Romans referred to them as terrorists though. Not sure where you are getting this.

No it is not a cop out, it is the correct translation, part of Natural Law, and Catholic dogma. To say otherwise is to change Catholic teaching for political purposes. The dogma is that thou shalt not murder. Since the PA supports and encourages terrorist attacks (aka murder) we as Catholics cannot support the PA until they change their ways.

gilliam,
thanks for backing me up! Somtimes its hard to shovel all the hoopla that norwich leaves behind in his replies.

Norwich,
Do you see how easily your thoughtless replies are vanquished back to the realm or absurdity where they originated from?
Did you think that puny summation [of thousands of years of history and factors that have played into this fued] up all by yourself in about five minutes?

JohnTE,
I went back and reread your posts and pretty much all of them are supportive fo the PA, by either bashing America, Isreal, or praising the palestininneneeans, who don’t stop hamas from bringing down the wrath of the Israeli army.
I won’t even ask you if you support the PA, I will make the assessment that you do, based on your previous comments. H

Here are a few in case your too prideful to scroll up and read.

]That isn’t likely to happen until Israel stops persecuting Palestinians and stealing their land.

1. Who are you to say who is persecuting who? why take palestines side, why take sides at all, when it is a human problem, since there are deranged people in all societies?

] Israel has failed to prove itself to be just
2. Prove this, beyond the shadow of a doubt, then prove the opposite of Palestine.

]I highly doubt that you would offer the same “good natured” jest if the victim had been Jewish. If you had, the response would have been harsh and immediate.
3. Nice AS*-umption, im sure you have the evidence to back this up as well.

] Drawing attention to crimes against the Palestinian people, which the US media does it’s best to suppress
4. Double slam against US and Isreal.

] Nowhere have I written anything supportive of terrorism.
5. scroll up.

In all your liberal, lets-not-infringe-on-the-rights-of-terrorists, propaganda, how come you haven’t said one damning thing about ‘Hamas’, who’s wreckless, evil actions, seem to be the catalyst for all these atrocities. ??

Peace of the Lord be with you all!

 

[Norwich]

TheGarg:

gilliam,
thanks for backing me up! Somtimes its hard to shovel all the hoopla that norwich leaves behind in his replies.

Norwich,
Do you see how easily your thoughtless replies are vanquished back to the realm or absurdity where they originated from?
Did you think that puny summation [of thousands of years of history and factors that have played into this fued] up all by yourself in about five minutes?

It’s wonderful to listen to all the justification that go on to evade a simple truth.
The reply from your biblical scholar is that Palestine wasn’t called that until 135 years after Christ, Big deal, the fact remains that the Romans reacted to civil disturbances that were aimed at them and their families in exactly the same way that Israel and its Allies have reacted to the Palestinians. Of course they didn’t call them Terrorists, they spoke Latin for crying out loud, but, you can bet they had some expression that summed up the same feelings that are engendered nowadays.

I notice that you’ve conveniently by-passed the problems of PALESTINE immedeately post 1945. I will ask again WHO WERE THE TERRORISTS THEN???

What a brilliant way to escape the consequences of your own actions though, “No God, I didn’t murder him, I simply took this man put a gun against his head and blew his brains all over the wall, but it wasn’t murder, it was a “JUST” war, my President told me!, I didn’t MURDER him, I only KILLED him”. I’ve got a distinct impression you may have a problem with that.

Like everything in this world there are two sides to every story. Palestinian terrorists kill Isreali’s, Israeli settlers steal Palestinian land, The Palestinians have as much difficulty reigning in their hot heads as the Israeli’s have controlling theirs, the only difference appears to be is that one is always in the front of the headlines the others hidden at the back.

If you want all those who you claim are apologists for Palestinian terror to denounce it (something I suspect all of us a fed up of doing, we seem to be saying it with great regularity) how about you denouncing the settlements in occupied areas, how about just denouncing the continued occupation of the occupied territory’s, how about denouncing the building of a wall to split Palestine into two (the last one like that was between East and West Germany, did you agree with that or is there a difference?), how about denouncing the use of a corpse, ANY CORPSE for the purposes this one was put to.

For people who just look at this forum without contributing, to listen to some of the pious semantics that are used to justify a courses of actions totally at odds with the teachings of the Catholic Church must make them wonder what the Church really stands for. I wonder if you know?

 

[gilliam]

John TE:

Since you can’t figure this out, I’ll explain it to you in the clearest way I am able.

If I write something supportive of the PA, then that means I am supportive of the PA. In the absence of any posts from me that support the PA, your inquistion, which is really an attempt to create a false association, is groundless and dishonest.

Further, your attempts to associate support for Palestinian human rights with support for terrorism are detestable.

Using your logic, I could couple this with your mountain of pro-war posts and come to the assumption that you believe that all Arabs are terrorists and that they should be killed in large numbers. Is that what you believe?

You know it really is a simple question that can be answered with a yes or a no. You have yet to answer the question. Do you support the PA?