Papal Mass in DC (was it me or was the music crazy?)

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RebeccaJ said:
I listen to what is being expressed in the music. Whether a Gregorian chant or guitar’d folk song, the expression is about God. And, I highly doubt God is critiquing the music style.
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God was very specific about how he wanted us to worship him, The Gregorian Chant was not just a passing phase it was instituted for a good reason. You may highly doubt that God was critiquing the music style, it was not however the style that is given to us in Tradition, there is a very valid reason for that. You dissagree I know but the music at DC was not Liturgical in my opinion it was rather abusive to The Liturgy.
 
RebeccaJ said:
I listen to what is being expressed in the music. Whether a Gregorian chant or guitar’d folk song, the expression is about God. And, I highly doubt God is critiquing the music style.
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There is also Christian Rap Music and some very hard core Christian Heavy Metal as well. So, as long as it’s about God, it is appropriate for Mass? Maybe we can put a mosh pit in front of the altar.:rotfl:

God won’t mind I’m sure, as long as the songs are expressing love for him. Those who disagree with this type of music at Mass, are guilty of division and polarization.:rolleyes:

(sigh) When will this lunacy stop?😦
 
Janet and Nordar, you both bring up VERY good points. God DOES care how we worship him. This is rooted in both Scripture and Church Tradition.
 
Ana said:
There is also Christian Rap Music and some very hard core Christian Heavy Metal as well. So, as long as it’s about God, it is appropriate for Mass? Maybe we can put a mosh pit in front of the altar.:rotfl:

God won’t mind I’m sure, as long as the songs are expressing love for him. Those who disagree with this type of music at Mass, are guilty of division and polorization.:rolleyes:

(sigh) When will this lunacy stop?😦
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I think Christian rap and heavy metal were about the only music that was not represented!

OK so people who would like The Liturgy celebrated and given the respect it deserves by not having all the hodge podge music are guilty of division and polorization Got it! Someone should clue the Monks in on this I am sure they will be greatly surprised that they are being divisive and polorizing!

I doubt it will stop! Sadly:(
 
I am watching The Mass at Yankee Stadium and so far the music if very beautifull!🙂
 
Father Burke who is on TV narating says the difference from The Mass at Yankee Stadium and the one at DC is that this one is one of Reverence.🙂 That is the word I was looking for when speaking about the Mass in DC it lacked Reverence to The Liturgy!
 
Yes, let’s take it all to extremes. And no I didn’t advocate removing Tradition. Lighten up.

Gregorian chants weren’t even around until the 10th century. So, any music before then was unacceptable I suppose.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Gregorian chants weren’t even around until the 10th century. So, any music before then was unacceptable I suppose.
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Not quite. Plainchant existed well before Pope Gregory. He is however, credited with codifying it.

The name Gregorian chant points to Gregory the Great (590-604), to whom a pretty constant tradition ascribes a certain final arrangement of the Roman chant. . .
The frequent occurrence in the plain-chant melodies of cadences moulded on the literary cursus shows that they were composed before the middle of the seventh century, when the cursus went out of use.

quoted from New Advent newadvent.org/cathen/06779a.htm
 
wisdom_3_5 said:
Not quite.

The name Gregorian chant points to Gregory the Great (590-604), to whom a pretty constant tradition ascribes a certain final arrangement of the Roman chant. . .
The frequent occurrence in the plain-chant melodies of cadences moulded on the literary cursus shows that they were composed before the middle of the seventh century, when the cursus went out of use.

quoted from New Advent newadvent.org/cathen/06779a.htm
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And? Still gives you 500 years without it. Also, the style of the Gregorian chant evolved, and what is “normal” to your ears today is from the 10th century.

Looking at the list of music, there isn’t anything there that is inappropriate for a Mass. Though, I do agree, the mish-mash of different styles can be hard to process.

I wasn’t at the Mass, I watched it on TV. No one was moshing, doing the samba in the aisles, or rotating hips. It was all done very respectfully, and as far as I have read, in accordance with guidelines from the USCCB.

Can anyone tell me one of the pieces that is so out of line that we should be ringing up the Vatican? I looked up “Plenty Good Room”, the traditional spiritual that is mentioned more than once in this thread. There is nothing against using this piece in a Mass. In fact, the USCCB has a publication where this piece is stated as appropriate for “African American Catholic Worship”.
 
RebeccaJ said:
And? Still gives you 500 years without it. Also, the style of the Gregorian chant evolved, and what is “normal” to your ears today is from the 10th century.

Looking at the list of music, there isn’t anything there that is inappropriate for a Mass. Though, I do agree, the mish-mash of different styles can be hard to process.

I wasn’t at the Mass, I watched it on TV. No one was moshing, doing the samba in the aisles, or rotating hips. It was all done very respectfully, and as far as I have read, in accordance with guidelines from the USCCB.

Can anyone tell me one of the pieces that is so out of line that we should be ringing up the Vatican? I looked up “Plenty Good Room”, the traditional spiritual that is mentioned more than once in this thread. There is nothing against using this piece in a Mass. In fact, the USCCB has a publication where this piece is stated as appropriate for “African American Catholic Worship”.
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Rebecca why don’t you just let it go?

The Mass at Yankee Stadium was just beautifull, The Pope is loved, and he delivered his message, enough said.

Have a Blessed 🙂 day
 
Nordar said:
Rebecca why don’t you just let it go?
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Because y’all are bagging on a sacred Mass. That I thought was beautiful, with the Pope delivering a beautiful message, and yes, he is loved.

Have a Blessed 🙂 day.
 
RebeccaJ said:
There is nothing against using this piece in a Mass. In fact, the USCCB has a publication where this piece is stated as appropriate for “African American Catholic Worship”.
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A lot of inculturation was permitted following Vatican II, but the Holy Father is fighting it in the liturgy now. Not that there can’t be songs that are typical of one culture or another in mass; that was true before all the changes. But there were and are guidelines about the instruments used in mass, so that limits it a bit (those guidelines are not being honored at the moment). And those hymns did not dominate the mass, the core of the mass was and should be sacred music common to all Catholics. Typically they came at the end of mass as a recessional, sometimes at communion, sometimes at the offetory. So that one hymn might be okay–but not that mass.

It is probably right to say that a great many musical selections are similarly approved by the USCCB. They are also permitting the continued use of Extraordinary Ministers and other liturgical abuses prohibited by Redemptionis Sacramentum. The Holy Father is trying to reform these practices and many national churches are resisting his lead. Whose initiative do you want to follow, the Holy Father, or USCCB? (Or the Mexican equivalent, or the Dutch equivalent, etc. etc. etc.) The Church is struggling to regain a reverent liturgy. You could help! At least read what he has written about Sacred Music in the mass. You can just google that and come up with a lot.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Yes, let’s take it all to extremes. And no I didn’t advocate removing Tradition. Lighten up.
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Sorry, YOU were the one that said this:
I listen to what is being expressed in the music. Whether a Gregorian chant or guitar’d folk song, the expression is about God. And, I highly doubt God is critiquing the music style.
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Christian rap music and Christian Heavy Metal are definitely songs expressing and singing about God. So, are they acceptable as part of the Sacred Liturgy? According to your own criteria, they are.

One could argue that the music during the DC Mass was taken to extreme. But now that THAT is acceptable, it is only a baby step to Mosh and Rap music. What is the differance?

And if you don’t think rap and mosh music are acceptable to be used as part of the Liturgy, esp reception of the Most Blessed sacrament, I am VERY interested in hearing why. If you do think those two types of music are acceptable, I am interested in hearing why as well.🙂 Thank you for your (name removed by moderator)ut.
.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Because y’all are bagging on a sacred Mass. That I thought was beautiful, with the Pope delivering a beautiful message, and yes, he is loved.

Have a Blessed 🙂 day.
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Love the Mass, Love the Popes message. HATED the music selections. Glad you thought it was beautiful. Sorry, you are upset that so many people including the POPE and many religous and laity, feel this type of music is innapropriate for the Liturgy. You certainly have a right to your opinion, and I wish that we all agreed on this.🙂

I feel you might want to reconsider your statment that God does not critique from up in Heaven, in light of the point Nordar and Janet made concerning God’s PARTICULAR and DEFINITE preferances concerning worship. If you would like I could post some scripture verses concerning his response when any of those guidelines were ignored. From my perspective, some of the guidelines seem kind of petty, but it is clear in Scripture, it was NOT petty to God.

Peace to you.
 
janet_baker76 said:
Nordar;3582452:
This is good, Fox news! Means a lot of people heard it!

Say, since you’re answering all my questions, who is the salt-and-pepper priest assisting the Holy Father on his right every time?
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I don’t know I was wondering myself who he is!🙂

Yes I am glad it was on Fox Father Burke and another Priest who was on made several refferences to The Revernence of The Mass and how it seemed many people were hesitant to clap because of the Reverence. They also mentioned how DC did not have that kind of Reverence. I was was happy they mentioned that.
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The longer this thread goes on, the more diffused the argument becomes. But now that the visit is ending, we’ve got a better view. The sight of those young seminarians in New York brought tears to my eyes, and Lo! one I recognized from the seminary telecast sang the Gospel beautifully in Yankee Stadium. If these young people are the Church’s future, we’re in good hands.

Our problem is the older generation, the 60s kids with miters who are in the habit of talking down to the faithful, theologically, liturgically, and musically.

Pope Benedict is a learned, humble, and holy man. To watch his mind working in those homilies was a grace in itself. What I learned from this visit is that we are being looked after, that the great shepherd is mindful of His sheep.

By the way, here in western Massachusetts, we have a young priest who is saying a Latin Mass. At first it was every first Sunday in the month, but now it’s every Sunday.
 
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