Pope Benedict admits evidence for evolution

[mike_sieber]

For me it really doesn’t matter how God chose to create, but from my limited reading, it seems that evolution - while probable - is not a fact.

There seems to be quite a bit missing from the fossil record, which puts reasonable doubt - for now at least - in some people’s minds.

 

[avflf]

Discoveries relating to evolution are ongoing and numerous. To be sure, ideas and theories will be “tweaked” as we discover more (we are only in the very infancy of such discoveries) but there is so much evidence of creatures adapting to their environment, the best-suited surviving, the less-suited dying off, over millions (yes, millions) of years that we allow ourselves to be dismissed as backwards when we insist it isn’t so.
Blessings!Marie

These discoveries about evolution are limited to the differences in various sub-species for adaptation purposes to a particular environment and/or condition, that’s all. That is known as micro-evolution. Macro-evolution, on the other hand, purports to show evolution from one species to another and it is more in the realm of science fiction than science proper. Most textbooks teaching evolution deliberately give a one sided account of this theory, and I stress Theory, using examples that have been debunked years back, but which are still given as fact.
If we truly do not wish to limit an Omnipotent God I cannot see why He could not do it in the time period presented in Genesis, where “day” from the Chaldean “youm” mean a 24 hour period. In fact, it would be in the realm of probability for Him to create what exists in a millisecond, if we really believe He is all powerful.

 

[edwest2]

Jesus Christ, as God on earth, raised the dead, gave sight to the blind and turned the water into wine, right away. I have no problem believing He could create the world in 6, 24 hour days. This is my evidence.

Once again, He made them male and female not asexual protozoa.

God bless,
Ed

 

[Tiber_Squid]

Perhaps this issue is one of faith vs. reason/science – not proving evolution. The Holy Father is a superb theologian and a brilliant man, but not a scientist. I believe his point is that if science finds evidence for some evolutionary processes acting in the formation of life on earth, that doesn’t necessarily affect our faith. God can use creationism or evolution or whatever.

Based on what God has revealed to us, we should expect to find things rational and able to be explained more and more by science – while at the same time, science never fully explaining everything. Perhaps the most interesting piece is DNA, a very elegant, simple, yet extremely powerful and dense means of encoding the variations of life. God similarly created the entire universe with mathematical precision and the encoding of life’s variation in DNA is the same. I’ve heard those studying encoding technologies say that a 4 character code (the 4 base pairs in DNA that code to our array of characteristics) is the most elegant means of encoding the information. Evolution helps describe some of the variation – although yes, without specific influence by God, purely random mutations in DNA produces accidents, not the varying types of life we see.

When God created life, he got very creative and prolific. From before the existence of time and matter itself, he designed the universe and its contents with the universe and eventually earth and its life becoming more and more complex. God similarly saw fit to evolve over time how we revealed himself and his law to his people. We see in Christ the fullness of God’s creativity–the perfect union of God and his creation–and the fullness of God’s revelation of Himself to mankind.

 

[edwest2]

What? Jesus Christ demonstrated what God could do right in front of people.He didn’t take a crash cart and a team of doctors to raise Lazarus from the dead.

Evolution is being used to promote atheism and moral relativism. It’s all OK if there are no rules and no God to judge.

My brothers and sisters in Christ, God is God.

God bless,
Ed

 

[gwenred]

I remember learning about evolution in college, and asking myself “What is the big deal”? It never seemed opposed to the idea of God as the creator, and it even seemed to follow the same order as the creation stories. All that changed in my mind was that 7 days was not literal but symbolic.

 

[edwest2]

Evolution is being promoted to encourage atheism and moral relativism (it’s all OK, no right and wrong). But the argument can only be presented in 3 ways.

God used evolution.

God who? Evolution did not need God.

Evolution? Creation? What’s the big deal? It doesn’t matter.

Forbidden: God created the Heavens and the Earth, like it says, you know, in the Bible.

I’m sticking with the Bible and not the “mountain of evidence” for that theory. Carbon 14 in diamonds. Polystrate fossil trees going through many layers.

God bless,
Ed

 

[avflf]

Perhaps this issue is one of faith vs. reason/science – not proving evolution. The Holy Father is a superb theologian and a brilliant man, but not a scientist. I believe his point is that if science finds evidence for some evolutionary processes acting in the formation of life on earth, that doesn’t necessarily affect our faith. God can use creationism or evolution or whatever.

Theology - study of religion: the study of religion, especially the Christian faith and God’s relation to the world
As a “superb theologian” I would have expected him to defend the Biblical account and not cave in to this ridiculous theory. But that’s my own opinion

 

[Steve40]

Article Here

The essence of it is that Pope Benedict states that “there is substantial scientific proof of the theory of evolution”, and that claiming that evolution and creationism are incompatible is “absurd”. Furthermore, we need to listen to the Earth and abide by the laws of creation: “This obedience to the voice of the Earth is more important for our future happiness … than the desires of the moment.”

Thoughts? Comments?

The Pope sounds very ignorant on this one. Someone please show me the evidence of evolution. Genetics and evidence on how rock layers are laid down point away from evolution. There is strong evidence that Dinosaurs and Humans co-existed in Texas. I don’t believe the fossil record exists any more. Scientifically with fluid dynamics the rock layers are shown to be laid down simultaneously. There are petrified trees seen projecting through the rock layers. Can the Pope please explain the circular argument of radio dating. In radio dating they assume an initial mass based upon where an item is found in the rock layers. This assumption can inject thousands if not millions of years of error. The Church needs to start talking about the specific scientific evidence and not just make off the cuff statements that the evidence exists. If the Pope looked at Faith and Morals without logic like this he would lead the Church astray. Thank God for the Holy Spirit. Pope Benedict is an ignorant man.

 

[Steve40]

Excellent. And to answer yout questions, yes, it is, and no, we don’t.

Blessings,

Gerry

The Church here is saying that it is OK for truth to contradict truth. It is not OK to say it doesn’t mater what you believe. The meaning of the resulting product is related to the process that brought the resulting product about. As an engineer I can not deny that process has nothing to do with the resulting product. John Paul II explains this very well in the Theology of the Body. How we view pro-creation and the meaning of pro-creation affects how we view the human person. The same is true for original creation. How we view original creation does affect how we view the meaning of being human. Therefore it does matter.

 

[avflf]

Pope Benedict is an ignorant man.

I don’t think he is ignorant and I’m sure he is aware of the fallacies in the Evolutionary Theory. I think it is the case of swimming with the tide and not making waves. Better than anyone else he knows the advantages of being “politically correct”. Saves him from a lot of flack.

 

[dixieagle]

I remember learning about evolution in college, and asking myself “What is the big deal”? It never seemed opposed to the idea of God as the creator, and it even seemed to follow the same order as the creation stories. All that changed in my mind was that 7 days was not literal but symbolic.

This is my feeling exactly. We waste a lot of energy trying to limit God’s creative might and power to what our own little minds can grasp, and often end up looking ignorant and foolish in the process. As someone else has recently posted, it’s the “who” and “why”, rather than the “how” that are the important questions. As Catholic Christians, we already have the answers that matter.

Peace!

 

[edwest2]

Attacking the Pope without knowing what he knows is ignorant. It’s called making an assumption. Do not rely on the secular media to spin any comments made by the Pope to appear to your liking.

The science behind the theory of evolution is being used to promote atheism and moral relativism.

One common tactic is to say that if anyone doesn’t believe God used evolution they are limiting God. Jesus said, With God anything is possible. He showed, as God on earth, that He could raise the dead, give sight to the blind and even command the wind. It is very clear that everything is literally possible with God as Jesus showed this while on earth.

God bless,
Ed

 

[Digitonomy]

"dixieagle:

We waste a lot of energy trying to limit God’s creative might and power to what our own little minds can grasp, and often end up looking ignorant and foolish in the process. As someone else has recently posted, it’s the “who” and “why”, rather than the “how” that are the important questions. As Catholic Christians, we already have the answers that matter.

The science behind the theory of evolution is being used to promote atheism and moral relativism.

One common tactic is to say that if anyone doesn’t believe God used evolution they are limiting God.

Are you suggesting dixieagle is promoting atheism and moral relativism?

 

[Steve40]

Attacking the Pope without knowing what he knows is ignorant. It’s called making an assumption. Do not rely on the secular media to spin any comments made by the Pope to appear to your liking.

The Pope saying that the discussion is absurd is an ignorant statement, even if you believe in evolution because of the information that you know or don’t know. We must admit that the way something is brought about by God is significant to it’s meaning. The Pope sees this clearly when it comes to pro-creation but he totally separates the meaning of being human in the body, from the act of original creation. It is a huge blind spot. When I have a blind spot and I have had many, and probably still do have many, I say I was or am ignorant. The Popes blind spot here makes him ignorant.

 

[Pondero]

I have yet to be convinced of the truth of the theory of Darwinian Evolution. Natural selection and genetic mutation are offered as the causes of it. It may happen at the micro-level but at a higher level it doesn’t make sense to me.

There is much more evidence for the Big Bang theory which credits the universe with a beginning in time. ( 13.5 billion years ago according to cosmologists)

Then, there is the demise of the dinosaurs ( 65 million years ago). There is evidence for that - I believe the time is calculated by use of the radioactive decay of an element Potassium something or other. I can believe that.

Before I comment on what Pope Benedict said, I must first find out what he actually said, and we don’t have that information yet. I will go to the Vatican website and try to find it.

 

[Pondero]

I have found the following on the Vatican website, under the title Communion and Stewardship - Human Persons Created in the Image of God. Paragraph 64. dated 8/05/07

“). In continuity with previous twentieth century papal teaching on evolution (especially Pope Pius XII’s encyclical Humani Generis ), the Holy Father’s message acknowledges that there are “several theories of evolution” that are “materialist, reductionist and spiritualist” and thus incompatible with the Catholic faith. It follows that the message of Pope John Paul II cannot be read as a blanket approbationof all theories of evolution, including those of a neo-Darwinian provenance which explicitly deny to divine providence any truly causal role in the development of life in the universe. Mainly concerned with evolution as it “involves the question of man,” however, Pope John Paul’s message is specifically critical of materialistic theories of human origins and insists on the relevance of philosophy and theology for an adequate understanding of the “ontological leap” to the human which cannot be explained in purely scientific terms. The Church’s interest in evolution thus focuses particularly on “the conception of man” who, as created in the image of God, “cannot be subordinated as a pure means or instrument either to the species or to society.” As a person created in the image of God, he is capable of forming relationships of communion with other persons and with the triune God, as well as of exercising sovereignty and stewardship in the created universe. The implication of these remarks is that theories of evolution and of the origin of the universe possess particular theological interest when they touch on the doctrines of the creation ex nihilo and the creation of man in the image of God.”

Nothing has changed there from the past. Man’s soul did not evolve but was created by God. I still have problems with believing in Darwin’s theory of Evolution.

 

[BaLou]

Article Here

The essence of it is that Pope Benedict states that “there is substantial scientific proof of the theory of evolution”, and that claiming that evolution and creationism are incompatible is “absurd”. Furthermore, we need to listen to the Earth and abide by the laws of creation: “This obedience to the voice of the Earth is more important for our future happiness … than the desires of the moment.”

Thoughts? Comments?

I agree with Pope B16. Evolution is a scientific fact and it’s pretty hard to ignore science.

 

[edwest2]

Evolution is not a fact. Read up and you’ll discover it’s considered a “robust theory.” Also, evolutionists, if you read their statements carefully, only say that this is the best description they have for the development of life. In other words, they could be wrong. An important thing to know.

Next, is astronomy. If you know about the ‘red shift’ and how it indicates that galaxies far away are moving away from us at high speed, just look up how far the Hubble Space Telescope can look into the universe. The numbers indicate that the farthest galaxies are moving away from us at faster than the speed of light.

Archaeologuists have found evidence of interbreeding between neanderthals and ‘modern’ humans. Modern dinosaurs have been found living with their ancestors, And the tree-dwelling supposed ancestor of human beings was found to be living at the time of the ‘modern’ dinosaurs. Also, radium 226 has a half-life of 1600 years, and if you do the math versus the supposed age of the earth and well, there shouldn’t be any radium.

God bless,
Ed

 

[BaLou]

Evolution is not a fact. Read up and you’ll discover it’s considered a “robust theory.” Also, evolutionists, if you read their statements carefully, only say that this is the best description they have for the development of life. In other words, they could be wrong. An important thing to know.

Next, is astronomy. If you know about the ‘red shift’ and how it indicates that galaxies far away are moving away from us at high speed, just look up how far the Hubble Space Telescope can look into the universe. The numbers indicate that the farthest galaxies are moving away from us at faster than the speedof light.

Archaeologuists have found evidence of interbreeding between neanderthals and ‘modern’ humans. Modern dinosaurs have been found living with their ancestors, And the tree-dwelling supposed ancestor of human beings was found to be living at the time of the ‘modern’ dinosaurs. Also, radium 226 has a half-life of 1600 years, and if you do the math versus the supposed age of the earth and well, there sshouldn’t be any radium.

God bless,
Ed

Ed, be that as it may (I’m not convinced what you have said is true).

I still agree with what the Pope had stated.