Pope Bluntly Faults Church's Focus on Gays and Abortion

[newsmike]

As for homosexuality, that’s another complex human situation. You have decent people with strong sexual desires for the same sex, who don’t feel called to celibacy. Who here doesn’t know an utterly loving and lovable homosexual? Many people have cherished relatives who are so inclined…

As for pedophelia, that’s another complex human situation. You have decent people with strong sexual desires for children, who don’t feel called to normality. Who here doesn’t know an utterly loving and lovable pedophile? Many people have cherished relatives who are so inclined…

Country Girl, I believe the simple edit above illustrates the utter stupidity upon which your opinion is formed. Sorry to be so blunt but when someone quotes fictional sitcom characters they most likely would be unable to detect subtlety in an argument.

 

[Country_Gal]

Why shouldn’t fathers have the right to their children when the mom doesn’t want them? Both parents should have the right to a relationship with their children and both parents ( barring abuse or neglect) should have to approve a child being put up for adoption. Fathers are parents too. Women act like men are just sperm donors that should have no say and no relationship with their kids. I know from personal experience women will leave birth certificates blank and are advised to not tell the fathers they are pregnant with their children when there is no abuse or neglect involved.

Children have a right to a relationship with BOTH parents. And I say this as a woman and mother myself.

I’m saying, as an adoptee myself, that when I was surrendered for adoption, it was much simpler. 1) There was a severe social stigma attached to unwed motherhood 2) Abortion was illegal 3) FOBs could not interfere with the mother’s right to surrender her baby

All those factors encouraged adoption.

Today 1) Little stigma to single motherhood 2) Abortion readily available 3) FOBs can run interference in an adoption

This leaves most women with 2 choices, either keep the baby, or abort. In keeping the baby, you have a child born into a single parent home with all the disadvantages of that, and more strain on the social welfare system. The other obvious choice for women is to abort and hush the whole thing up, and not have to deal with ex-boyfriend and his witch of a mother for the rest of her life.

 

[Julianna]

It was the NYT quoting the Pope’s own interview., I wish this was the case of a media hatchet job, but Pope Francis continues to disturb me more and more every day.

How sad for you.

 

[Country_Gal]

As for pedophelia, that’s another complex human situation. You have decent people with strong sexual desires for children, who don’t feel called to normality. Who here doesn’t know an utterly loving and lovable pedophile? Many people have cherished relatives who are so inclined…

Country Girl, I believe the simple edit above illustrates the utter stupidity upon which your opinion is formed. Sorry to be so blunt but when someone quotes fictional sitcom characters they most likely would be unable to detect subtlety in an argument.

I’d appreciate you not calling me stupid. I actually have an IQ of 146 if you want to know, probably higher than most.

I’m not going to argue with someone hurling insults like that. I’m sure you can exhibit Christian charity and be a light on the hill better than that, and I encourage you to do so.

 

[lovetheworld]

Being gay is not a sin. Judging them is.

Origins of homosexuality are not debatable. Gay people are gay genetically. This has now been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Homosexual inclination is not sin, but homosexual acts are.

Origin of homosexuality is debated.

 

[newsmike]

I’d appreciate you not calling me stupid. I actually have an IQ of 146 if you want to know, probably higher than most.

I’m not going to argue with someone hurling insults like that. I’m sure you can exhibit Christian charity and be a light on the hill better than that, and I encourage you to do so.

With that IQ you should be able to detect that there is a difference between calling you stupid and reffering to your argument as such. - Amy Farrah Fowler

 

[Gricken]

I don’t get why people are freaking out about what the Pope said. The Pope was making a point about how Catholics are living their lives. I can prove his point very quickly. How does most of the world react when they hear “Catholic”? They usually see bigots, old white men, oppressive life styles, and outdated ideologies. Do you see the problem here? None of this shows the church. People in this day and age are Ignorant of the Gospel, and the truths we as Catholics preach. And it is because of this that they have these skewed views of the church. He is not saying issues like Abortion or Same Sex “Marraige” are unimportant. He is saying that many Catholics today fight against those issues, devote all their time to them, and forget why they should be fighting. They lose track of Jesus. Pope Francis is saying that the mission of the Church is to preach the Word of God, of his love for all people, of the salvation of all who believe. Pope Francis is saying that we, as Catholics, have failed to show others the love of God.

And here’s the thing, I think Pope Francis is right. We have failed to do that, today’s culture proves we failed to do that. We got so caught up in screaming about the wrongs of the world today we forgot how to act like Christ.

The Pope is not telling us to forget about the issues in the world today. The Pope is telling us that if we want to be heard we need to show the world the love of God. Only then will we be able to right the wrongs in the world, only then will we be seen as we should, as bringers of truth and love. Unless we remember how to love, our voices will not be heard.

Before the Church came around, there were no hospitals in the Roman Empire, no charity organizations, no schools like you know about today. We Catholics changed the morality of an entire empire by following Jesus’s example. Today not enough people care.

If we want to end Abortion, if we want to make people understand why we think same sex marriage is wrong, we first need to teach the world how to love again.

 

[Cider]

I’m saying, as an adoptee myself, that when I was surrendered for adoption, it was much simpler. 1) There was a severe social stigma attached to unwed motherhood 2) Abortion was illegal 3) FOBs could not interfere with the mother’s right to surrender her baby

All those factors encouraged adoption.

Today 1) Little stigma to single motherhood 2) Abortion readily available 3) FOBs can run interference in an adoption

This leaves most women with 2 choices, either keep the baby, or abort. In keeping the baby, you have a child born into a single parent home with all the disadvantages of that, and more strain on the social welfare system. The other obvious choice for women is to abort and hush the whole thing up, and not have to deal with ex-boyfriend and his witch of a mother for the rest of her life.

Yes I’m well aware of the differences between then and now. My own mother put a child up for adoption and I’m married to an adoptee. Fathers should have every right as parents to block adoption if they want to. You act like there is something wrong with that. It’s too bad that some women are so selfish they would rather kill their child than allow the father to raise him or her when they can’t or won’t. If anything that just shows how unfit they are to be mothers ( again barring abuse or neglect by the father).

 

[lovetheworld]

The world is not black and white.

There is some truth in the Catholic fath, and there is some garbage that needs to be cleaned out… (kinda what the pope is doing).

Your Church does not always speak for Jesus… There are many things it has done over the years that was barbaric - and you know it. I will not get into it, as its futile.

When someone is so hell bent on bring hateful… sometimes the biggest light cannot shine thoguh.

Then do you deny the Truth of the Catholic Faith? Please answer yhe question, because everything I stated is the teaching of the Church.

Once again I will repond in kind. I don’t need to reevaluate my life in accordance to Jesus as I believe all that the Holy Catholic Church believes and teaches. Jesus speaks through His Church. You are not a Christian as you do not accept all of Scripture and deny the teachings of Christ’s Holy Catholic Church.

And, dude, you are a very disrespectful person. Learn some manners and some proper English grammar.

KNK

 

[lovetheworld]

So Jesus didn’t teach love, tolerance, and kindless?

What is inconsistant with my post?

Also, why does it bother so many people on this board that I simply do not judge gay people, nor do I have any ill feelings towards them… Love everyone is how I live. Gays, Christians, Athiests, everything… We are here to love… nothing more.

Seriously… I’m asking kindly, and honestly.

Thank you

your post is not consistent with Catholic teaching.

 

[einna]

Mr. BigBlueCane I think you make pretty good points… However, I think putting an end to abortion should be a priority of the Church.

I understand your wanting to end abortion, but everyone has here as an evil to fight. For you it is abortion, for others it is fighting to prevent women having unwanted pregnancies, others are helping unwanted children get adopted. Just because you feel so strongly about this issue does not make it the most important one.

There are children being raped, beaten, burned, etc. on a daily basis. There are children starving to death all over the world. There are children being killed in wars as we speak. How can anyone say what should be a priority as, I assume, we all sit safely in our homes not facing some of these worst evils ourselves.

This Pope is dealing with all these things from people all over the world. Maybe reminding people about the love of God and His want for us to love each other is what he hopes will stop some of these evil even a little bit. Again I do believe God is working through him even if we don’t see that clearly yet.

 

[Julianna]

I’d appreciate you not calling me stupid. I actually have an IQ of 146 if you want to know, probably higher than most.

I’m not going to argue with someone hurling insults like that. I’m sure you can exhibit Christian charity and be a light on the hill better than that, and I encourage you to do so.

Don’t sweat hon…I for one agree with you. I believe the hardliners are a bit surprised that we have a Pope who is well…human.

 

[Country_Gal]

To feel Homosexual inclinations is disordered. Homosexual acts are sin.

Do you know a lovable Pedophile? Does it make his Pedophilia NOT a disorder?

Ironic coming from a member of a church that institutionally swept child molestation under the hierarchical rug.

Pedophilia is the abuse of power and non-consensual. Homosexuality is a relatively common deviancy from the norm that involves consensual sex.

I used to be quite conservative, although not particularly obsessed, about the issue. I’ve softened my stance after careful consideration, although I still find the gay lobby’s intolerance for opposing points of view problematic.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

The Pope was saying that the Catholic Church spends too much time on the subjects of abortion, atheists and homosexuality. When non Catholics hear the word “Catholic” they automatically think of abortion, gay marriage, and child rapists. It’s a fact. Many think that is all the church is about…about being ANTI-abortion, ANTI-gay, ANTI-this, ANTI-that. We will always be pro-life and anti-gay but God is to judge the sinners…not us. The rules have not changed. Confession is a sacrament. Remember?

The Pope was merely pointing out that the church is beautiful and miraculous and has so much to offer. The Eucharist, grace, miracles, our saints, our prayers, etc. Catholicism is a beautiful gift from God and he wants everyone to know about it.

As far as women go he said they need to have a stronger voice in the church. Women have many gifts to offer and our opinions do matter. He did NOT say women should be Catholic priests. TOMORROW morning he is not going to allow women serve in the priesthood. Perhaps sometime within the next 2000 years that would be a possibility however.

Just my humble opinion.

How? If a priest is In Persona Christi?

 

[Gricken]

The world is not black and white.

There is some truth in the Catholic fath, and there is some garbage that needs to be cleaned out… (kinda what the pope is doing).

Your Church does not always speak for Jesus… There are many things it has done over the years that was barbaric - and you know it. I will not get into it, as its futile.

When someone is so hell bent on bring hateful… sometimes the biggest light cannot shine thoguh.

In comparison to other large groups that have held a lot of power in the past. I’d argue that the number of “barbaric” things you accuse the church of doing is a lot less than most others, and certainly a lot less when you consider how spread out those instances are. Certainly they are not as bad as the atrocities of the nations of the 20th century. If you care to prove me wrong. Please give me examples of things you think are worse.

 

[YoungTradCath]

He is saying that many Catholics today fight against those issues, devote all their time to them, and forget why they should be fighting.

I flatly deny this as true.

 

[einna]

Don’t sweat hon…I for one agree with you. I believe the hardliners are a bit surprised that we have a Pope who is well…human.

So true:thumbsup:

 

[Michael_Mayo]

It was the NYT quoting the Pope’s own interview., I wish this was the case of a media hatchet job, but Pope Francis continues to disturb me more and more every day.

That would be something to reflect upon and do some soul searching

 

[Lormar]

Well, isn’t the whole point that those inside should be better than those outside?

If you’re like them why have the Church – so you can feel excused?

We are all sinners, Weller. The pope has said that - in or out of the Church. Our Lord said that the healthy have no need of a physician, but the sick do. That is why I am in the Church. I am sick.

 

[Country_Gal]

Yes I’m well aware of the differences between then and now. My own mother put a child up for adoption and I’m married to an adoptee. Fathers should have every right as parents to block adoption if they want to. You act like there is something wrong with that. It’s too bad that some women are so selfish they would rather kill their child than allow the father to raise him or her when they can’t or won’t. If anything that just shows how unfit they are to be mothers ( again barring abuse or neglect by the father).

I really disagree with you on that point, and will leave it at that.