Pope Francis: ‘Evolution … is not inconsistent with the notion of creation’

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The Church doesn’t have a “view” on Evolution. It neither endorses it or opposes it. I personally believe the Earth is 4 billion years old. But I also believe God could have made it out of nothing in 7 days if he had so desired.
It is also possible that He could have created the world yesterday and filled our minds with memories of a time before that, and made the evidence appear that it is 4 billion years old. We could not prove it wasn’t so. But all scientific claims are made under that (unprovable) assumption that what we see and what we remember represent real things. Otherwise we can never know anything scientifically.
 
In relation to apes, how could humans have evolved from them when they are still present on earth today, as a separate species. Why didn’t ‘some’ of the apes not evolve into humans. :rolleyes:

The evolution theory of all other species, horses, etc… all their earlier templates died out millions of years ago - hence why would apes still be here alongside man.
:bigyikes:

This is generally covered in elementary school level evolutionary theory

No scientist anywhere says we evolved from modern apes.

In a nut shell. They say that like apes we are primates and we descend from a common ancestor.

Here is a visual that may help.

http://cdn1.stuff4crafts.com/catalo...f78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/2/0/208333.jpg
 
It is also possible that He could have created the world yesterday and filled our minds with memories of a time before that, and made the evidence appear that it is 4 billion years old. We could not prove it wasn’t so. But all scientific claims are made under that (unprovable) assumption that what we see and what we remember represent real things. Otherwise we can never know anything scientifically.
Yes, that is sometime referred to as “Last Thursdayism,” or, by those that take it more seriously, the “Omphalos Hypothesis.”
 
In relation to apes, how could humans have evolved from them when they are still present on earth today, as a separate species. Why didn’t ‘some’ of the apes not evolve into humans. :rolleyes:

The evolution theory of all other species, horses, etc… all their earlier templates died out millions of years ago - hence why would apes still be here alongside man.
As I understand it, the apes of today aren’t actually the apes we evolved from. They would be the different branches along the same evolutionary chain as humans. You’re trying to argue that I couldn’t be the grandson of my father’s father because my father’s brother has kids alive today.
 
In relation to apes, how could humans have evolved from them when they are still present on earth today, as a separate species. Why didn’t ‘some’ of the apes not evolve into humans. :rolleyes:

The evolution theory of all other species, horses, etc… all their earlier templates died out millions of years ago - hence why would apes still be here alongside man.
We didn’t evolve from any of the present species that we call the “great apes”. What happened was we all shared a common ancestral species several million years in the past, splitting off into the lines which led to the different species we have today. Evolution is less a progression of A to B to C, and more a wide, branching tree:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
In relation to apes, how could humans have evolved from them when they are still present on earth today, as a separate species. Why didn’t ‘some’ of the apes not evolve into humans. :rolleyes:

The evolution theory of all other species, horses, etc… all their earlier templates died out millions of years ago - hence why would apes still be here alongside man.
Theory of evolution doesn’t mean humans evolved from apes, but from our own species which at one time were more on the level of apes, but human nonetheless.

Jim
 
:bigyikes:

This is generally covered in elementary school level evolutionary theory

No scientist anywhere says we evolved from modern apes.
In a nut shell. They say that like apes we are primates and we descend from a common ancestor.

Here is a visual that may help.
Yes, I studied it as a 13 yr old and remember v little now. However this image is normally displayed to indicate the evolution of man with the ape trundling along at the start of the evolution of mankind. Other similar evolution timelines, e.g. the horse, indicate the earlier species died out.

Either way, how can it be proven that man and apes came from a common ancestor, i.e. primates - that in itself seems just as strange.

Like everything else with this area of science, fossil dating,fossil interpretation, ancestral species determination, etc., none of it is provable, it is a theory.

http://www.relativelyinteresting.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/template.jpg

http://s3.amazonaws.com/engrade-myfiles/4040431555446249/Evolution_of_the_horse.png*
 
Like everything else with science, (…) none of it is provable, it is a theory.
There, corrected it for you.

Everything in science is hypothesis or theory (given your usage of the latter, you should by the way read up on the definition of the word in scientific context). Nothing can be definitely “proved” through the scientific method.

However, things can be demonstrated to be probable beyond reasonable doubt. When something is labeled a “theory”, it is as close to “fact” as you can come - we are at that point far beyond reasonable doubt. Evolution is one such theory; rejecting it with the amount of evidence provided in its favor is either ignorant or irrational.

Additionally, there’s a distinction between evolution-as-fact and evolution-as-theory. The evolution of species is an observed fact - the theory of how this happens, however, can change. When one speaks of the Theory of Evolution, one means the latter, not the former. But even though it can change, a paradigm shift seems, at this point, very unprobable. As with any other theory, however, adjustments will happen as new disoveries occur.
 
Angels are pure spirits…they are outside the realm of biology and hence not remotely connected to evolutionary theory.
Oh, so at least we can believe they were “puff” just created. 😉
 
Either way, how can it be proven that man and apes came from a common ancestor, i.e. primates - that in itself seems just as strange.

Like everything else with this area of science, fossil dating,fossil interpretation, ancestral species determination, etc., none of it is provable, it is a theory.
It can be proven (or as Rin would say more accurately, demonstrated to be probable beyond reasonable doubt) quite easily, by genetics; for a particularly striking example:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromosome_2_(human)

If you understand genetics, you will immediately say, wow!

(But then you better know something about centromeres, telomeres etc.)
 
Other scientific beliefs that are merely theories:

Gravity
Thermodynamics
Atomic Theory
Germ Theory
Quantum Theory
Relativity

and so on…
 
Oh, so at least we can believe they were “puff” just created. 😉
Sure…

Our universe was bang created with the words of God.

Our experience shows us that the biological world was not created that way.

I know people who take your position so far that they say, “God made the world look old”. As if he needed to trick us or something.

But alas, this is what happens when people rely on a couple dozen sentences in a religious book meant to teach religious principles for their entire scientific knowledge.
 
There, corrected it for you.

Everything in science is hypothesis or theory (given your usage of the latter, you should by the way read up on the definition of the word in scientific context). Nothing can be definitely “proved” through the scientific method.

However, things can be demonstrated to be probable beyond reasonable doubt. When something is labeled a “theory”, it is as close to “fact” as you can come - we are at that point far beyond reasonable doubt. Evolution is one such theory; rejecting it with the amount of evidence provided in its favor is either ignorant or irrational.

Additionally, there’s a distinction between evolution-as-fact and evolution-as-theory. The evolution of species is an observed fact - the theory of how this happens, however, can change. When one speaks of the Theory of Evolution, one means the latter, not the former. But even though it can change, a paradigm shift seems, at this point, very unprobable. As with any other theory, however, adjustments will happen as new disoveries occur.
Yes, but does evolution fall within the area of a ‘scientific theory’?

*Evolution, fact and theory[edit]
Evolution has been described as “fact and theory”, “fact not theory”, “only a theory, not a fact”, “multiple theories, not fact”, and “neither fact, nor theory”.[2] The disagreements among these statements, however, have more to do with the meaning of words than the substantial issues and these are discussed below.

However, in science, the meaning of theory is more rigorous. A scientific theory is “a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment.”[24] Theories are formed from hypotheses that have been subjected repeatedly to tests of evidence which attempt to disprove or falsify them. In the case of evolution through natural selection, Darwin conceived the hypothesis around 1839, and made a first draft of the concept three years later in 1842. He discussed this widely with many of his intellectual companions, and conducted further research in the background to his other writings and work. After years of development, he finally published his evidence and theory in On the Origin of Species in 1859.[25]

The “theory of evolution” is actually a network of theories that created the research program of biology. Charles Darwin, for example, proposed five separate theories in his original formulation, which included mechanistic explanations for:*

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_as_fact_and_theory

Is evolution far beyond reasonable doubt?

*By Darwin’s own requirements for his theory,the proof beyond reasonable doubt does not exist. Charles Darwin wrote “The Origin of Species” in 1859 and included two chapters concerning the missing evidence he would need in order to prove his theory to be truth. His suggestion was that the future would produce a fossil record with the “Innumerable” transitional species that were required by Darwin himself in order to prove the theory.

It has been over 150 years since Darwin wrote that book and thus birthed evolutionary theory and the Innumerable transitional fossils have never been found.*
 
In case I missed it here’s the same story but from Catholic News Service.
Pope: Evolution, Big Bang do not push aside God, who set it in motion
VATICAN CITY (CNS) – The Big Bang theory and evolution do not eliminate the existence of God, who remains the one who set all of creation into motion, Pope Francis told his own science academy.
And God’s existence does not contradict the discoveries of science, he told members of the Pontifical Academy of Sciences Oct. 27.
“When we read the account of creation in Genesis, we risk thinking that God was a magician, complete with a magic wand, able to do everything. But it is not like that,” he said. “He created living beings and he let them develop according to the internal laws that he gave each one, so that they would develop and reach their full potential.”
Jim
 
I don’t understand why many people of Faith feel so threatened by the theory of evolution. I also don’t understand why so many people criticize those who have doubts about the theory of evolution. How we got here is irrelevant . How we act now that we are here is what is important.
 
I don’t understand why many people of Faith feel so threatened by the theory of evolution. I also don’t understand why so many people criticize those who have doubts about the theory of evolution. How we got here is irrelevant . How we act now that we are here is what is important.
Very good point. I don’t have a problem with people believing young earth creationism. I do defend against and debate with those who seem to think believing in evolution is anti Christian or undermining God.
 
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