Have you not read the Encyclical? I highly recommend it. Full of compassionate, Socially just and wise beyond belief content.In the course of heeding Pope Francis’ statement as you urge, perhaps it’s really up to us to read the whole thing and to also read its antecedents in the Papal Social Encyclicals, with which Pope Francis’ statement is otherwise entirely consistent. It’s of no value to focus on one American idiomatic expression and ignore everything else, though it might be more fun for some to do so.
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Run along…I didn’t see any Catholic content in your post so why don’t you spell it out for me.
It seems to me that you don’t understand the American healthcare system or the AMA. What part of no one can be denied access to care don’t you understand? If you walk into a hospital in this country they have to provide medical care to you whether or not you can pay.On come on mate. A bit of reality is required here. There has never been equality of access to Healthcare in America and you know it. Access should be based on health needs whereas in reality its been based on the size of your wallet of if you’re lucky enough to be in a work place plan.
The AMA levels the playing field greatly. This is to be greatly applauded.
Its far from perfect or close to our/European Socially equitable standards but you’re going in the right direction…
Run along where?Run along…
I think he/she means, “I don’t have any catholic content to offer you, just slogans.”Run along where?
If by “Catholic” content you are referring to your comments on the free market and division, greed, etc., I did respond.You’re still missing the Catholic content of my post. Intentionally…?
(my bold italics)I could care less what American civil society does. Well I do but I realise I have no control over it.
I’m speaking from a European, Catholic perspective. To see fellow Catholics in America give such overt support to a*** unregulated free Market ***that brings such division, poverty and greed to daily life. Such things that should be athema to a Catholic’s way of thinking. Is an eye opener…
I’d like to know this too. There is so much regulation now that it’s almost impossible for the average person to open a business. Especially if you want to open one that requires employees.(my bold italics)
Silvio - where is the free-market in America unregulated?
Ishii
“European” and “Catholic” are hardly coextensive terms, just to begin with. Undoubtedly some in Europe are Catholic and some Catholics are Europeans. And undoubtedly, even in Europe, not all Catholic agree on the same things.I could care less what American civil society does. Well I do but I realise I have no control over it.
I’m speaking from a European, Catholic perspective. To see fellow Catholics in America give such overt support to a unregulated free Market that brings such division, poverty and greed to daily life. Such things that should be athema to a Catholic’s way of thinking. Is an eye opener…
I read it long ago. I never said I disagreed with anything but two words that are manifestly a bad (and different) translation.Have you not read the Encyclical? I highly recommend it. Full of compassionate, Socially just and wise beyond belief content.
Here you go…;
vatican.va/holy_father/francesco/apost_exhortations/documents/papa-francesco_esortazione-ap_20131124_evangelii-gaudium_en.html
Is this another thing they just don’t understand over there in Europe? I know there is ignorance of America in Europe, but I thought our economic system was pretty common knowledge among even moderately educated people. I guess I was wrong.I’d like to know this too. There is so much regulation now that it’s almost impossible for the average person to open a business. Especially if you want to open one that requires employees.
Thankfully regulation is coming into most areas of commerce.(my bold italics)
Silvio - where is the free-market in America unregulated?
Ishii
Excellent post, Ridgerunner. One wonders what kind of substantive response you will get. I will not be holding my breath.“European” and “Catholic” are hardly coextensive terms, just to begin with. Undoubtedly some in Europe are Catholic and some Catholics are Europeans. And undoubtedly, even in Europe, not all Catholic agree on the same things.
I doubt you could find one American Catholic in a hundred thousand that “supports an unregulated free market” which, in any event, has not existed here for a century and more. There are lots of regulations on the free markets in America. Many are appreciated by most Americans. Some are not. Virtually every American appreciates the USDA regulation and inspection of food. Most appreciate reasonable regulations relating to the environment. Most appreciate reasonable bank and securities regulation. A very large number, on the other hand, do not appreciate artificially making utility bills “skyrocket” for the sake of an ideology most do not share. Most Americans do not appreciate Obamacare. Most Americans do not appreciate “income leveling” for the sake of income leveling.
Maybe Europe has something to teach us in some ways, but it’s a mighty stretch to claim it does in all ways. Europe more closely regulates abortion than does the U.S. But on the other hand, we do still have children, which native Europeans seem to be giving up. We allow a lot of immigration, even though it sometimes adds to our social problems and healthcare costs. Europe is far less generous in that regard. (Well, I guess France is pretty generous with citizenship if one was born in a former French possession, as I was.) But most European countries certainly aren’t. Did you know that if you’re illegal in France, you get only the healthcare you can pay for up front? Did you know that if you’re illegal in the U.S. you can walk into any emergency room and get treatment, no questions asked, and your children can qualify for medical coverage paid for by the taxpayers? And your parents get a subsidy for you as well. And not to be uncharitable, but we don’t have the antisemitism that seems to be festering anew in much of Europe. And though it’s no picnic for them, our police will heed calls and enforce the law in the worst parts of any city; something the French won’t do in the fetid and festering banlieus.
Europe is Europe and the U.S. is the U.S. We watch your populations about to plummet (when is it expected to halve in Italy? By 2030?) and we wonder whether people don’t have children because they can’t afford them. We wonder whether perhaps it’s due to the simple economic fact that if the government absorbs most of the money you have available for transfers to children, you don’t have enough to transfer to and for the children. IL (income from labor) + IP (income from property) = C (consumption) + T (transfer payments) Maybe there are other reasons, but people only have so much they can transfer to others, whether by voluntary action or by government fiat.
Yes, I realize the countries that profit from North Sea petrodollars do better than does, say, France or Italy or Spain. But the petrodollar folks still don’t have children either. Why? Do they no longer believe in themselves? Do they no longer have intergenerational generosity?
And why is the sharing of prosperity so limited in Europe? Who does the U.S. border? Canada and Mexico. Canada is first world all the way. Even Mexico has a higher GDP per capita than ANY Eastern European country. Why is that? Why doesn’t prosperity spread from Germany to Poland or Slovakia? Does the German (or French, or Swedish) welfare state swallow all?
You be Europe and we’ll be America. And when the Muslims eventually drive the remnant of you out, which they surely will because they have children while native Europeans don’t, America will give you haven then just like it gave my Irish ancestors haven when the Brits made it impossible for them to live there any longer. I expect the Canadians will be welcoming too, just as they were before.
Straight out of your average Neo-Nazi hate speech booklet. Chilling stuff. People with such race hating views give Irish Americans a bad name…“European” and “Catholic” are hardly coextensive terms, just to begin with. Undoubtedly some in Europe are Catholic and some Catholics are Europeans. And undoubtedly, even in Europe, not all Catholic agree on the same things.
I doubt you could find one American Catholic in a hundred thousand that “supports an unregulated free market” which, in any event, has not existed here for a century and more. There are lots of regulations on the free markets in America. Many are appreciated by most Americans. Some are not. Virtually every American appreciates the USDA regulation and inspection of food. Most appreciate reasonable regulations relating to the environment. Most appreciate reasonable bank and securities regulation. A very large number, on the other hand, do not appreciate artificially making utility bills “skyrocket” for the sake of an ideology most do not share. Most Americans do not appreciate Obamacare. Most Americans do not appreciate “income leveling” for the sake of income leveling.
Maybe Europe has something to teach us in some ways, but it’s a mighty stretch to claim it does in all ways. Europe more closely regulates abortion than does the U.S. But on the other hand, we do still have children, which native Europeans seem to be giving up. We allow a lot of immigration, even though it sometimes adds to our social problems and healthcare costs. Europe is far less generous in that regard. (Well, I guess France is pretty generous with citizenship if one was born in a former French possession, as I was.) But most European countries certainly aren’t. Did you know that if you’re illegal in France, you get only the healthcare you can pay for up front? Did you know that if you’re illegal in the U.S. you can walk into any emergency room and get treatment, no questions asked, and your children can qualify for medical coverage paid for by the taxpayers? And your parents get a subsidy for you as well. And not to be uncharitable, but we don’t have the antisemitism that seems to be festering anew in much of Europe. And though it’s no picnic for them, our police will heed calls and enforce the law in the worst parts of any city; something the French won’t do in the fetid and festering banlieus.
Europe is Europe and the U.S. is the U.S. We watch your populations about to plummet (when is it expected to halve in Italy? By 2030?) and we wonder whether people don’t have children because they can’t afford them. We wonder whether perhaps it’s due to the simple economic fact that if the government absorbs most of the money you have available for transfers to children, you don’t have enough to transfer to and for the children. IL (income from labor) + IP (income from property) = C (consumption) + T (transfer payments) Maybe there are other reasons, but people only have so much they can transfer to others, whether by voluntary action or by government fiat.
Yes, I realize the countries that profit from North Sea petrodollars do better than does, say, France or Italy or Spain. But the petrodollar folks still don’t have children either. Why? Do they no longer believe in themselves? Do they no longer have intergenerational generosity?
And why is the sharing of prosperity so limited in Europe? Who does the U.S. border? Canada and Mexico. Canada is first world all the way. Even Mexico has a higher GDP per capita than ANY Eastern European country. Why is that? Why doesn’t prosperity spread from Germany to Poland or Slovakia? Does the German (or French, or Swedish) welfare state swallow all?
You be Europe and we’ll be America. And when the Muslims eventually drive the remnant of you out, which they surely will because they have children while native Europeans don’t, America will give you haven then just like it gave my Irish ancestors haven when the Brits made it impossible for them to live there any longer. I expect the Canadians will be welcoming too, just as they were before.
No, Silvio - you said that unregulated free market in America brings division, poverty, and greed to daily life. Where specifically is that happening in America? Or were you just engaging in hyperbole?Thankfully regulation is coming into most areas of commerce.
Its the longing for deregulation among certain Catholics that I fail to understand or justify as a Social justice advocating Catholic…
So you read it in Italian I take it…?I read it long ago. I never said I disagreed with anything but two words that are manifestly a bad (and different) translation.
But you know, the rest of it is in no way different from the Social Encyclicals that preceded it. And neither it nor they espouse middle class welfare.
Obviously when you have no substantive response, you have to resort to calling names. Now, I have been accused of worshiping mammon, but I think calling someone a neo-Nazi is a bit over the top, don’t you think?Straight out of your average Neo-Nazi hate speech booklet. Chilling stuff. People with such race hating views give Irish Americans a bad name…
Reaganomics along with Thatcherism was the single, most divisive declaration of war on the working man and woman in western History.No, Silvio - you said that unregulated free market in America brings division, poverty, and greed to daily life. Where specifically is that happening in America? Or were you just engaging in hyperbole?
Ishii
He condemns himself by his own supremacist views. I want nothing to do with such an individual and its a stain on Catholicism to freely express such hatred on a Catholic forum…Obviously when you have no substantive response, you have to resort to calling names. Now, I have been accused of worshiping mammon, but I think calling someone a neo-Nazi is a bit over the top, don’t you think?
Ishii
Be specific - when during the Reagan era did America have an unregulated free market?Reaganomics along with Thatcherism was the single, most divisive and declaration of war on the working man and woman in western History.
Both zealots of the Free Market, they combined to bring devestation to communities across their respective countries…
It will take many more decades to undo the damage they inflicted…