Pope Francis to world leaders "open your doors to migrants"

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You may wish to reevaluate that last statement. Both old and new testament writers dealt with poverty and wealth. St. Paul deals with this in several epistles. It has nothing to do with prosperity gospel ideology. There are spiritual and material matters which we must deal with in life, with the spiritual being first. But to attempt to discredit wealth and give a socialist slant to the teachings of Jesus is wrong, as several past Popes have expounded upon.
You’re the one putting a Political slant on a Spiritual idea. There’s more than enough talk of wealth from Christs own words and perspective to understand how meaningless it is, as well as much of what the ~current~ Pope has recently said with regards to it.

The Lords Prayer is not an empty, meaningless ritual to be performed by rote once a week.

We pray for the day,
God’s Will be done,
On Earth as it is in Heaven.
 
Stop the problem?

We Created the problem. The terrorists have been trained and armed by the West. The more we apply force, the worse the problem has become. War is also not in line with Catholic Teachings, nor that of Christ.
I respect that, and do believe that.

But can we simply sit here while the lives of thousands, even millions of innocent people are obliterated while IS/ISIS/ISIL has their way and slowly gains a strong foothold of the Middle East?

The Church does have a “just war” doctrine for a reason, but I doubt we’d be fighting for our religion as much as we’d be fighting to stop the spread of another.
 
I respect that, and do believe that.

But can we simply sit here while the lives of thousands, even millions of innocent people are obliterated while IS/ISIS/ISIL has their way and slowly gains a strong foothold of the Middle East?

The Church does have a “just war” doctrine for a reason, but I doubt we’d be fighting for our religion as much as we’d be fighting to stop the spread of another.
I don’t have an answer for that.

I can’t bear thinking about… that’s not true. I think about it often… what people are going through at the hands of people who have no regard for the sanctity for the human lives they hold as slaves, prisoners and hostages, and there’s nothing ~I~ can do. I ~can~ imagine, because I’ve had my Own experiences that are not dissimilar, although at a more singular, personal level…

With the way things have continued to get worse, with the way the U.S. has handled the middle east, often with a great deal of suspicion as to the Reason for our involvement, especially “Acting Alone” to a degree… I would say it needs to be addressed as a World problem, not just U.S. and close allies…

But how is that going to happen, when the World see’s itself as separate nations and states, always at odds with each other, never being able to agree on anything?

Even Citizens of countries often at odds with each other… the “leaders” provoking us against each other…

I don’t have the answer for this. It’s something everyone has to do, together. The world is a lot smaller, than it used to be, and All I can do for now is keep talking and praying.
 
Prosperity Gospel Heresy

Christ spoke of Spiritual Wealth and poverty.

People get too hung up on the Physical world, and end up denying the Spirit.
It’s not the prosperity gospel, its God’s dominion over the world. God makes people wealthy or poor as he pleases. He does not leave the distribution of wealth only to human or natural causes. The same is true with the distribution of power and talents and motivation. God is the giver of all good gifts, as St. James said.
 
And I ~don’t~ want to make a Political argument out of this.

But look at the way people are treated in the United States. We have more people in prisons per capita than Any Other Country in the world, and Many of them for non-violent offenses while Rapists and Pedophiles go free, even if they “serve a few years” because of the way Victims are treated. Homeless are treated as lazy vagabonds who don’t want to work, when Most Do, and Became homeless for Lack of work or other issues. Problems ignored and swept under the rug ~at home~ but we take notice when it happens overseas? Why?

Not trying to Guilt trip people. I just want people to take Notice and Do something about it.

I talk to people about my Own experiences often enough online. “TMI” people tell me, or Mock me for it, as if it’s easy to speak of things like rape in public, or as if I should just shut my mouth about it, the way I was told “no one will ever believe you, anyways.” As if I don’t get triggered and have flashbacks while doing so. As if it doesn’t hurt. As if it doesn’t Suck living in a homeless shelter, or living on less than $1000 a month because I’m trying to stay out of a mental hospital long enough to actually Heal enough to work a regular job again

People ignore issues we have ~here~ because of Politics and ideologies. Liberals bash on conservatives, and vice versa, arguing Endlessly about Money or Resources and fight over Power, where elections are treated like Sports games, and whoever “wins” gets to look down and mock whoever “loses” and I can’t just turn a blind eye, keep my mouth shut or walk away.

People are not Political pawns. They are God’s Children, and they should be Respected as such.

But for the Grace of God, some don’t suffer the worst of things. For the Grace of God, I’ll keep speaking up for those who can’t.
 
Stop the problem?

We Created the problem. The terrorists have been trained and armed by the West. The more we apply force, the worse the problem has become. War is also not in line with Catholic Teachings, nor that of Christ.
War is not always against the teachings of the Church or Christ. Christ is God and he did and said everything that God did and said in the old testament. He waged war against pagan nations through his people, the Hebrews and Jews. He even had pagan nations wage war against his people when they were unfaithful to his covenant. He helped the Emperor Constantine defeat the Emperor Maxentius and establish Catholic Christendom. He and the Virgin Mary helped Catholic armies defeat armies of heretics and Muslims and pagans.
 
No, what I said is not the prosperity gospel. I don’t claim that God wants everyone to be wealthy, or that faith and positive speech and donations will increase material wealth. I said that it is God who makes people wealthy or poor, and I showed you a scripture passage that said exactly that. It follows that wealth disparity is God’s plan. The wealthy are to give to the poor and thus cover their own sins and earn merit before God, and the poor are there to receive with humility from the wealthy, presenting to them opportunities to do meritorious works of mercy. And poverty is also a means of sanctification.
 
No, what I said is not the prosperity gospel. I don’t claim that God wants everyone to be wealthy, or that faith and positive speech and donations will increase material wealth. I said that it is God who makes people wealthy or poor, and I showed you a scripture passage that said exactly that. It follows that wealth disparity is God’s plan. The wealthy are to give to the poor and thus cover their own sins and earn merit before God, and the poor are there to receive with humility from the wealthy, presenting to them opportunities to do meritorious works of mercy. And poverty is also a means of sanctification.
Are you a Catholic or a Baptist?
 
No, what I said is not the prosperity gospel. I don’t claim that God wants everyone to be wealthy, or that faith and positive speech and donations will increase material wealth. I said that it is God who makes people wealthy or poor, and I showed you a scripture passage that said exactly that. It follows that wealth disparity is God’s plan. The wealthy are to give to the poor and thus cover their own sins and earn merit before God, and the poor are there to receive with humility from the wealthy, presenting to them opportunities to do meritorious works of mercy. And poverty is also a means of sanctification.
I already addressed this. You’re arguing for the sake of arguing. I’m having a conversation and sharing my perspective, not interested in debating theology with you. I hang out in apologetics for that.
 
I already addressed this. You’re arguing for the sake of arguing. I’m having a conversation and sharing my perspective, not interested in debating theology with you.
I’m Catholic. You falsely claimed that what I said is the prosperity gospel.
 
There is no need to do that. I can support my view with scripture and Church doctrine and the writings of saints and the use of reason. And priests do not always agree with scripture and Church doctrine, and their views are not always well thought out.
 
There is no need to do that. I can support my view with scripture and Church doctrine and the writings of saints and the use of reason. And priests do not always agree with scripture and Church doctrine, and their views are not always well thought out.
That ^ as an excellent description of how schisms have been created in the Church. Martin Luther had some valid points, which the Church addressed, but he had some that weren’t, so off he went, leaning into his own knowledge.(Proverbs 3:5) You’re also following in the very footsteps of Calvin, since the Prosperity Theology is based on similar ideas.

I’m quite sure you can dig through the Bible and pull out lines that fit your feelings so that you have the “confidence” to win" any debate, rationalizing and justifying your feelings, that the world is the way you want to see it, rather than accept the world the way it is.

The Bible is a “tool” for learning about God and God’s Will for us on Earth, and everlasting life with Him, after, not a “tool” for “debate” to pick nits out of context to use as sound doctrine. The simple fact is that our bodies are Temporary. Any one of us could die as easily today, in a car crash or some other accident, as tomorrow, or naturally, in a bed at 100+ years old, and living as a Catholic, while being doctrinal incorrect, isn’t the safest road to take. What we have and what we are, belong to God, and much of what we have, we also must Work for. It’s not merely handed to us “because god or faith.”

You puled out some scripture to back up your claim in favor of Prosperity Theology. Have you read all of James 1?
9 Believers in humble circumstances ought to take pride in their high position.

10 But the rich should take pride in their humiliation—since they will pass away like a wild flower.

11 For the sun rises with scorching heat and withers the plant; its blossom falls and its beauty is destroyed. In the same way, the rich will fade away even while they go about their business."

The lowly, sick and poor in the Material world, have High positions in God’s eyes. The Spirit is what makes a difference. Not the empty, soulless, “material” world that too many people see as “Real” rather than a temporary, fleeting, situation that we happen to be in.

What you have comes from God, true enough, since Everything does, including our souls. What you Do with “Matter” while you’re here, is what matters, not how much of it you have, while you’re here.

More from James:
26 Those who consider themselves religious and yet do not keep a tight rein on their tongues deceive themselves, and their religion is worthless.

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

I have a feeling from your previous posts, however, that you will continue to “defend” the position you have chosen, regardless of any other argument or scriptural perspective. I would suggest an honest reading of Matthew, being open to what God wants you to learn from it, rather than seeking tools and weapons to help you “win” arguments and debates.

Again I would suggest you also discuss these things with the Priests at your local parish, because we don’t simply walk in one day, and start preaching at Mass. Many go to college for years, and have multiple degrees, not including the time spent in seminary, and are often quite familiar with the ideas of rational, reasoned, logical debate, and you might find some that would Help you prevent the same sort of circular reasoning and justifications that often come from Earthly desires for things to be true, and find ways to support Other ideas you may have that Could be in line with Christ, the Pope, and Catholic teaching, that could actually provide Solutions to problems in the world.

That is a deeper meaning and understanding of Concupiscence. We may have the Spiritual understanding that “something is wrong with the way of the world” and seek answers, in ourselves and our own study, but if we allow the World, the “material” or the “flesh” to be our guides, we miss the greater Spiritual understandings that can arise from learning as a Church, from the Words spoken by Christ, and with brothers and sisters who have already thought on the things you describe and would like to address, as you would more likely find in Apologetics.

To self-examine in The Spirit, I often find Matthew to be the most help, and in reference to the many sources you might pull from to continue your arguments, I think Matthew 6 is a good place to start:

19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal
.
20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.

21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

If you’re merely here for a logical debate, and care not for the Spirit the Scriptures were given, then I would again suggest the Apologetics forums, under Moral Theology, as people there will be much more likely to understand the Rules of debate, and be more than willing to engage you in such a fashion, than some who might come to the news looking to express and exchange opinion in a less formal fashion.
 
Give me your rapacious, your rapists, your maruading masses…
Uncharitable rhetoric. The U.S. is already financially “owned” by the “rapacious” while rapists are allowed to go free in large part due to victim-blaming, making it even more difficult for others to come forward, and the masses fleeing terror were created by U.S. interference in the politics of other sovereign nations, causing the death, fear, poverty of many innocents.
 
Uncharitable rhetoric. The U.S. is already financially “owned” by the “rapacious” while rapists are allowed to go free in large part due to victim-blaming, making it even more difficult for others to come forward, and the masses fleeing terror were created by U.S. interference in the politics of other sovereign nations, causing the death, fear, poverty of many innocents.
Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t.
However, if it is, it is the same uncharitable rhetoric that you have just engaged in by saying the same about America as a whole.
Do two wrongs make a right? Since there are already problems, does that mean we ought to engage in a policy that will increase the bad?

As far as rapists go, that was more directed toward the international scene, aka Cologne and Europe’s open border policy. The pope was addressing the world, after all, and not just America.
Cologne(and Sweden) is a direct result of open borders. The veritable incidents of jihad rape, and of statistical increases of sexual assault are real enough, and direct results of open borders.

I am not sure if the pope is for open borders, though. Is he?
Are you?
 
Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t.
However, if it is, it is the same uncharitable rhetoric that you have just engaged in by saying the same about America as a whole.
Do two wrongs make a right? Since there are already problems, does that mean we ought to engage in a policy that will increase the bad?

As far as rapists go, that was more directed toward the international scene, aka Cologne and Europe’s open border policy. The pope was addressing the world, after all, and not just America.
Cologne(and Sweden) is a direct result of open borders. The veritable incidents of jihad rape, and of statistical increases of sexual assault are real enough, and direct results of open borders.

I am not sure if the pope is for open borders, though. Is he?
Are you?
You can see it as me lumping people in together, as if to cast blame, rather than seeing that we’re All in this together, and should be taking Responsibility, if you wish, but that’s not what I’m doing.

America as a whole, often turns a blind eye to the problems within it’s own border, and blames minorities and people who have less of a voice, instead of taking responsibility for, and solving the problems. Too often trying to legislate and legalize against things that no free country should. Too often with loud angry voices that appear to be “in charge” and “in control” because of animalistic tendencies towards dominance that are part of being human, until challenged and overcome, allow Reason and Intellect to rule, rather than emotion.

We’d have plenty of jail space for the Real criminals, if we Were to open our borders, if we set the non-violent ones free.

If we were not so emotionally reactive to things and constantly at odds about these things, turning the tables on each other with every vote and every election… if the understandings we have in the Science parts of Psychology were applied properly, rather than all the nonsense money making snake oil schemes that Psychiatry pushes and confuses that issue with…

Yes, there’s a related issue. Its over-complicated because people treat so many things as Separate issues, rather than part of a whole, and rather than see the solutions are built into the problems, themselves.

Homegrown “Christian” terrorists that people will blame on “mental illness” not taking the time to realize that most of those people have serious emotional wounds and other issues that go unaddressed, and improperly treated, because rather than therapeutically addressing the Emotional problems people have, they “treat” people as animals that need to be controlled with force and shut down with medications that often make the problems worse, if one were to read the warning labels, rather than just prescribe, and take, those things indiscriminately, because few dare challenge their “authorities” who supposedly know better, but don’t…
 
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