Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryAtheist8
I have.
It tells me that no women are even allowed to become part of the Church Hierarchy.
That’s not a good example.
MENSA members are all geniuses, but the Catholic Church has both male and female members, and supposedly exists for the benefit of/to help out, both men and women.
Yet only men can be part of the Hierarchy/Leadership.
I admit that we guys have set up a sweet deal for ourselves, but that doesn’t make it fair. And I am sure that if I was a girl I would like it even less:shrug:
Well gee. I AM a woman and I don’t mind.
MENSA members are all geniuses because that was the decision of the organization.
Are you trying to tell us that the Catholic Church does not have the right to delineate its members and their roles? You, a non-Catholic, want to tell us what we may and may not do, believe, and say?
The Church is not simply a secular institution.
As a Catholic, I believe that the Church was instituted and given authority by God Himself.
I do NOT believe, as you apparently do, that the Church is simply a ‘made by men’ group with ‘made by men’ rules.
You’re right in the sense that no purely ‘secular’ group would be an equal comparison.
But say, AA. You know, Catholics are NOT the only people who believe that their Church was founded by God and who believe that the role of the priest or leader is, as given by God, for men only.
There is: The Orthodox Church.
There is: Orthodox Judaism (which of course came from classical Judaism and retains its teachings on male-only priesthood.
There are: ‘The Muslims.
The Amish.
Many fundamental, AKA "Bible believing churches’.
Historically speaking until the very recent times (within the last 40 years or so) we would have seen virtually all Protestant and Jewish groups as well.
So. . .basically your premise is that all of us have somehow gotten it ‘wrong’ all these years and we’re all too greedy (if male) and too stupid (if female) to go along with the ‘modern’ view that priesthood is ONLY a ‘role’ just like any other. . .doctor, lawyer, etc., and that women not only should but MUST have the ‘opportunity’. No matter what we believe, even if we believe that God has spoken to us. . .we cannot possibly be correct because you know better. God --in whom you do not believe–has spoken to YOU and told you, without doubt, that we are all wrong.
God–in whom WE believe–has also either not spoken to us and we’ve been greedy and stupid in making up this whole religion ‘farce’. . .or He has spoken to us but HE’s been wrong, greedy and stupid. . It seems to me that this is what you’re saying. . .although since you don’t believe in God by your own acknowledgement, it seems that you’re basically saying any of us who do believe are greedy men and stupid women who are trying to hang onto some ‘outmoded’ concepts in our outmoded idea about a god anyway, and the sooner we all die off and let people do what they want, the better. . .
Hmmm. Or He’s been right, He has spoken, and we are the ones who are listening and YOU and others have, for one reason or another, been misled.
It seems to me that a God who can rise from the dead and offer His Flesh as food and His blood as drink is far more ‘unbelievable’ than a God who isn’t politically correct and has instituted a male-only priesthood.
Have you ever stopped to consider, in your ‘male-i-tude’, that one reason God might (I say might because it is only one of many theories) have decided on a male-only priesthood was because men, those lordly beings, might really NEED to be more humble and self-sacrificing than most women?
You seem to believe priesthood is all about power and glory. You’re wrong. Being a priest is about humility and service.
Think about it, AA. As a man, historically speaking, for millennia YOU have had all the ‘possibilities’ open to you. You could be anything you want. . you could go and conquer the world, while women stayed home.
Now think about what the priesthood for the majority of men was and is.
Instead of going out and earning big bucks, you either get paid nothing --and work at hard physical labor --or you get paid a pittance, and your time is never your own.
You don’t get to have a girlfriend, a wife, children.
You have to deal calmly and lovingly with people who are hateful, lazy, insulting, nasty, spoiled and stupid. . .and these are the people who actually ACCEPT you as their priest. The ones who DON’T like or accept you are infinitely worse but the first group you are responsible for and you can’t ever run away from them.
Power? Hah. You have to consider everybody first before you. Everybody. That means if anybody at all you deal with wants something you absolutely detest, they get what they want. Some power.
You’re lonely, you’re despised. . . nowadays you mention you’re a priest and people move their children away from you, or scream and snarl about how one of YOU PEOPLE had ‘hurt’ them, their family, their neighbor, and by GOD how can you show your face among DECENT PEOPLE when you and YOUR KIND are filthy raping beasts. . .
And you have to pray for and love these people the way Jesus does. Yeah, that’s the kind of POWER most men would just love to have. . .
